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Oh, yeah, late war Romania can do that too.
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Jun 11, 2014 00:24
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You amateurs are just scratching the surface of bad minor powers for Early War. You still haven't mentioned the Early War only Greeks (both infantry and mechanized), Norwegians, and Finnish lists. You could also play an obscure list from a larger power like a British Sudanese defense force rifle company, most of those are terrible and not worth considering if you ever want to win. As far as the competitiveness of the Early War lists the French are probably the most competitive followed by the Italians if you want to include them. Be aware that getting the correct models for some of these minor powers can be difficult to impossible as they are produced in small quantities, not bought in depth by stores, then cycled out of regular production for long periods of time or indefinitely. Early War in general suffers from an issue of tanks being too cheap and artillery being too expensive (often laughably so). In a competitive situation be prepared for huge numbers of tanks and anti tank guns to flood the field. In a private game, anything goes. Edit: I forgot to mention that I have a bunch of Early War Polish stuff that I'm positive I'll never build. If you are interested let me know. Conan the Librarian fucked around with this message at 04:43 on Jun 11, 2014 |
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Jun 11, 2014 04:35
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Conan the Librarian posted:You amateurs are just scratching the surface of bad minor powers for Early War. You still haven't mentioned the Early War only Greeks (both infantry and mechanized), Norwegians, and Finnish lists. You could also play an obscure list from a larger power like a British Sudanese defense force rifle company, most of those are terrible and not worth considering if you ever want to win. I don't know. I mean, Italian Fucileri is a garbage conscript blob with almost nothing to recommend it, though Carri is definitely pretty good. Infantry blob units should probably have some kind of universal special rule to help them because the ones that aren't Russian are god-awful.
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Jun 11, 2014 05:02
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I still have yet to play Flames because of my dumb hangup with painting everything, but don't Romanians get both Eastern Legions and discounted troops because you (literally) roll the dice on their ratings with Peasant Army?
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Jun 11, 2014 05:17
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moths posted:I still have yet to play Flames because of my dumb hangup with painting everything, but don't Romanians get both Eastern Legions and discounted troops because you (literally) roll the dice on their ratings with Peasant Army? Romanians can buy infantry in big blobs, yes, and their everything is a bit discounted for having variable ratings but not enough for it to hugely matter. Reluctant infantry blobs are just asking to spend most of the game pinned and worthless, and in mid war they're very likely to be reluctant. Even in late war they'll still be reluctant quite often, and you have to deploy first before rolling for their quality.
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Jun 11, 2014 05:20
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The late war list for Poles isn't very good but it's hella cool.
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Jun 11, 2014 10:27
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Panzeh posted:I don't know. I mean, Italian Fucileri is a garbage conscript blob with almost nothing to recommend it, though Carri is definitely pretty good. Infantry blob units should probably have some kind of universal special rule to help them because the ones that aren't Russian are god-awful. If you're going Italian infantry, go Bersaglieri. Only real reason to go Fucileri is for odd-ball stuff like the Semovente 47/32, or if you want an Italian fortified company. Tanks can be over-powering in EW if you aren't taking anti-tank weapons. I played a 2000 point Italian armored list vs. two 1000 point infantry lists and just MG'd the hell out of everyone. Having dual-hull mounted MGs is nice.
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Jun 11, 2014 12:00
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Is there a F0W book that has lists for both Axis and Allies in Normandy? Is Fortress Europe the book i want? basically, a friend and I want to pick it up, he's thinking of playing Americans and I'm going to be Germans. I'm thinking we'll start small, with just straight infantry at first to get used to the game.
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Jun 12, 2014 14:50
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No, Fortress Europe is outdated. You can still use the lists of course, if both sides are taking it from the same book, but you want the D-Day compilation with Overlord and Atlantik Wall.
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Jun 12, 2014 14:59
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Otherwise, you can start out with just using the easyarmy.com versions, and then get the books later. Just use the national special rules in the rulebook.
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Jun 12, 2014 15:08
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Beardless posted:Is there a F0W book that has lists for both Axis and Allies in Normandy? Is Fortress Europe the book i want? basically, a friend and I want to pick it up, he's thinking of playing Americans and I'm going to be Germans. I'm thinking we'll start small, with just straight infantry at first to get used to the game. Starting small is good, though it should be pointed out that infantry are probably the most complex part of the game. If you really want to start with FoW "lite" just start with vehicles only. This way you have no assault phase to worry about. As for Italians, yeah I agree that their list quality is very uneven. I was just putting out a relative ranking of the best lists of the different nationalities. Plenty of bad French lists too if you want to look for them. I've heard good arguments for changing the variable troop quality rules so that you roll before you deploy your platoons. The argument goes that a commander would know who their best and worst troops are and would take that into account when placing his troops. Changing this would probably make all variable quality lists more competitive, which right now they're not.
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Jun 13, 2014 05:26
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Conan the Librarian posted:Starting small is good, though it should be pointed out that infantry are probably the most complex part of the game. If you really want to start with FoW "lite" just start with vehicles only. This way you have no assault phase to worry about. I think BF's reasoning for rolling after you deploy is that the quality of the troops is such a huge variance and unknown that the commander doesn't have a true accounting of their skill until after the fighting starts. The commander has a general sense that some troops are better than others (Bersaglieri vs. Fucilleri), but only a select few are proven (Parachudisti). Which, I don't know how accurate that is in the big scheme of things as the Bersaglieri were apparently fighting Libyans for years before the war, but somehow can't apply that to fighting the Commonwealth. Also, picked up a copy of Remagen. I'm a little disappointed, I thought the Super Pershing would be a one-off upgrade to a platoon, not a single tank platoon by itself. Probably figured running a platoon of 5 Pershings, with one of them upgraded to a Super Pershing would be overkill. Otherwise, SS Panzerfaust Rifle/MG troops are going to be insane, and very tempting to run Otto Carius with his favorite unit. Do Jagdtigers get Tiger Ace Skills?
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Jun 13, 2014 11:59
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I don't know about Early war (its by far the least popular period, even after Vietnam and the still-born FoaN), but Italians are mean motherfuckers in Mid-war. The late-war lists look serviceable enough as well. Very good Axis minor to choose since they are available in all three periods, their basic equipment doesn't change and they get a good amount of German support. Anybody who thinks they are a joke has never had their rear end handed to them by a competent Italian player.
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Jun 13, 2014 15:19
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I went in on Romanians a while back for the flexibility and opportunity to model like five nation's worth of AFVs at once. FoW is died here before I even got a first game, so it's more of an extended hobby project now.
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Jun 13, 2014 16:02
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Numlock posted:I don't know about Early war (its by far the least popular period, even after Vietnam and the still-born FoaN), but Italians are mean motherfuckers in Mid-war. The late-war lists look serviceable enough as well. I hope I didn't come across as complaining about my Italians. I have had by far the most success with them than any other army that I can legit field. LW is awesome because I can fill out the force chart for less than 2000 points, making it an army almost impossible to table. My only gripe with LW Italians is lack of air support in the Fortress Italy book. E: EW Italians are even meaner than Mid, just the tanks are rated as slow.
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Jun 13, 2014 18:44
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YF19pilot posted:I hope I didn't come across as complaining about my Italians. I didn't mean it that way ether.
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Jun 13, 2014 21:40
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I've been thinking about getting into some kind of WW2 historical game. Bolt action and flames or war both look neat, but bolt action models seem stupid expensive compared to other historicals I've see. Pegasus Miniatures seem to be priced nicely, and I can get them locally, but I have no idea if the scale would effect things. http://pegasushobbies.net/catalog/Peg.-Plastic-Model-Kits-Tanks-&-Vehicles/c7_20/index.html?page=2 Anyone know better models that'd work and/or a game that'd work better at that scale?
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Jun 15, 2014 16:34
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Pegasus stuff is in 1/72, which is about 1/3 the size of 28mm Bolt Action or Warhammer. That said, they're great figures, infinitely cheaper, true-scale proportioned, and they line up with the ground scale better. (Ie: Weapon ranges are closer to what they actually would be.) And you can base your figures on pennies, which is fantastic. The plastic can be bendy at times, which can be frustrating. I recommend checking out Plastic Soldier Review for a very comprehensive list of what's out there at this scale. If you really want to stick in 28mm, I recommend Wargames Factory's WW2 line. They make true-scale Americans, Germans, and Russians in 28mm and you get about 30 figures with bases in a $21 box.
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Jun 15, 2014 16:46
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YF19pilot posted:I think BF's reasoning for rolling after you deploy is that the quality of the troops is such a huge variance and unknown that the commander doesn't have a true accounting of their skill until after the fighting starts. The commander has a general sense that some troops are better than others (Bersaglieri vs. Fucilleri), but only a select few are proven (Parachudisti). Which, I don't know how accurate that is in the big scheme of things as the Bersaglieri were apparently fighting Libyans for years before the war, but somehow can't apply that to fighting the Commonwealth. Hey, since you have the book, can you let me know how up-armoring Shermans works? I noticed in the FAQ they retconned Abrams' Thunderbolt VII to lose Smooth Ride, to match the Uparmored E8s in Bridge at Remagen, but since that effectively makes them M4A3 (76)s with Wide Tracks, I was wondering if the process effected other M4 variants.
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Jun 15, 2014 17:21
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If you want to play Historicals on the cheap, get the Bolt Action rules and use 1/72 scale figures and models, they are plentiful, there's a ton of different manufacturers and stuff available, and it's obscenely cheap, compared to most miniatures stuff. And it's not like you really need a TON of models. I would have done this if I needed to buy two forces, or if I wasn't buying everything I needed at 40% off at the local store. Just use the same scales as the book uses, they'll probably seem less abstracted that way.
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Jun 15, 2014 17:27
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Acebuckeye13 posted:Hey, since you have the book, can you let me know how up-armoring Shermans works? I noticed in the FAQ they retconned Abrams' Thunderbolt VII to lose Smooth Ride, to match the Uparmored E8s in Bridge at Remagen, but since that effectively makes them M4A3 (76)s with Wide Tracks, I was wondering if the process effected other M4 variants. All uparmored tanks also lose Detroit's Finest. Uparmored tanks are only available for the M4A3(late), M4A3(76mm), and M4A3E8, which makes their stats 8/5/1 instead of 7/4/1. So yeah, an uparmored E8 is basically just an uparmored A3(76) with wide tracks. Uparmored E8 is only 5 points more than uparmored A3(76) vs. regular E8 being 10 points more than standard A3(76). You can have up to three M4A1(76), A3(76), E8, Uparmored A3(76), Uparmored E8 in each platoon, rather than just two in BG&G. Can still only have one jumbo per HQ or platoon, but now have the option of a 76mm Jumbo. Basic platoon is 5 M4A3(late) which you can upgrade all to be uparmored A3(late), or downgrade to M4/M4A1 or M4A3. You can only upgrade one M4A3(late) in your company to a M4A3(105) or M4A3(105)HVSS. You can take an assault gun platoon if you want more than just one. Hope this helps, let me know if you need me to clarify anything.
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Jun 15, 2014 18:17
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YF19pilot posted:All uparmored tanks also lose Detroit's Finest. Uparmored tanks are only available for the M4A3(late), M4A3(76mm), and M4A3E8, which makes their stats 8/5/1 instead of 7/4/1. So yeah, an uparmored E8 is basically just an uparmored A3(76) with wide tracks. Uparmored E8 is only 5 points more than uparmored A3(76) vs. regular E8 being 10 points more than standard A3(76). You can have up to three M4A1(76), A3(76), E8, Uparmored A3(76), Uparmored E8 in each platoon, rather than just two in BG&G. Can still only have one jumbo per HQ or platoon, but now have the option of a 76mm Jumbo. That makes sense. Since there's the option for a 76mm Jumbo, is it now possible to have 4 76mm guns in a single platoon? Edit: I can see it now. HQ Uparmored E8, 2iC Jumbo 76, Platoon Leader Uparmored E8, 2 regular E8s, a Jumbo 76mm and a bog-standard M4A1 as a meat shield for good measure. I can see the future, and it is glorious. Also, does the M4A3 105mm HVSS get anything special like Smooth Ride? Acebuckeye13 fucked around with this message at 19:35 on Jun 15, 2014 |
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Jun 15, 2014 19:29
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moths posted:Pegasus stuff is in 1/72, which is about 1/3 the size of 28mm Bolt Action or Warhammer. That said, they're great figures, infinitely cheaper, true-scale proportioned, and they line up with the ground scale better. (Ie: Weapon ranges are closer to what they actually would be.) And you can base your figures on pennies, which is fantastic. The plastic can be bendy at times, which can be frustrating. I'm bad at scaling, so, how would 1/48 scale tanks look beside the 28mm infantry? Dumb? Another question then: are bolt action tanks the same scale as the infantry? Edit: This video answered the question. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=22qU7a27CEU Saalkin fucked around with this message at 19:56 on Jun 15, 2014 |
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Jun 15, 2014 19:48
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_scale_model_sizes
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Jun 15, 2014 19:54
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Acebuckeye13 posted:That makes sense. Since there's the option for a 76mm Jumbo, is it now possible to have 4 76mm guns in a single platoon? Yes, you can have 4 76mm guns in one platoon, and you can have one platoon with 4 76mms and 1 105mm. M4A3(105)HVSS does not get Smooth Ride, perhaps BF felt it wouldn't apply with a ROF 1 weapon. It and the regular M4A3(105) retain Detroit's finest.
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Jun 15, 2014 20:28
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My oldest bought some told soldiers "for me", so we're playing his very first wargame. E: And he won, mostly by summoning a brotherly earthquake. 
3 Action Economist fucked around with this message at 21:59 on Jun 15, 2014 |
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Jun 15, 2014 21:38
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Double post! In case you ever have a four year old, here are the rules we used: Roll 1d6 for initiative. Movement. Shooting. The pencil is how far each soldier moves. The ruler is how far each soldier shoots. 4+ kills the target. Some advanced rules for next time: Soldiers behind cover need a 5+ (for the fence) or 6+ (the wall) to hit. Advanced weapon rules (which I probably won't use since the green guys have all the bazookas and flamethrowers, the grey guys get a single man with a shotgun). Some sort of CTF scenario.
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Jun 16, 2014 12:56
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Saalkin posted:I'm bad at scaling, so, how would 1/48 scale tanks look beside the 28mm infantry? Dumb? I'm doing 1:48 scale vehicles for my German WW2 force in our local Chain of Command project. For me, 1/48 plastic kits seem to be cheaper, better detailed and more fun to put together than resin kits. The main disadvantage I see is that there are fewer available options. But since CoC seems to be better for small scale skirmishes than Bolt Action, I think I'll do well with just a few armoured cars and a random tank or two, at least to begin with.
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Jun 16, 2014 13:01
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Another drunken FoW game under the belt (including a hell of a hangover today). I played my Canadians as usual, my friend borrowed my 21. Panzerdivision Grenadiers. Playing Hasty Attack, he defended. My Typhoon did gently caress all this game, and I got really sloppy later on when positioning my Shermans and AT-guns. Only lost a single 25 pdr. but I still called it when I lost all my Sherman tanks and AT-guns. Gorgeous table though. I bought two new limited edition GF9 buildings that I got to try out, and I put static grass on everything:      Also, regarding the scattered reserves rule, if I undertand this correctly the book says to roll for either one of the two corners or the back table edge. So if you roll a 3-4 you get to place your reserves at any point on the back line? And if you get either 1-2 or 5-6 you must arrive within 16" of one of the corners, does that include 16" along the side edge? Because if we did play it correctly, that would mean scattered reserves aren't such a huge handicap as I thought before. Fish and Chimps fucked around with this message at 18:10 on Jun 16, 2014 |
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Jun 16, 2014 18:06
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TheBlobThing posted:Another drunken FoW game under the belt (including a hell of a hangover today). I played my Canadians as usual, my friend borrowed my 21. Panzerdivision Grenadiers. Playing Hasty Attack, he defended. My Typhoon did gently caress all this game, and I got really sloppy later on when positioning my Shermans and AT-guns. Only lost a single 25 pdr. but I still called it when I lost all my Sherman tanks and AT-guns. Gorgeous table though. I bought two new limited edition GF9 buildings that I got to try out, and I put static grass on everything: That terrain is so dense.  gently caress "two forests and two hills gaming" forever. 
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Jun 16, 2014 18:58
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Indolent Bastard posted:That terrain is so dense. To be fair, some games accomodate terrain a lot better than others, and one of FoW's strengths is that it plays well both with a few pieces of felt for terrain as well as with a loaded board, unlike other games.
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Jun 16, 2014 19:20
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Panzeh posted:To be fair, some games accomodate terrain a lot better than others, and one of FoW's strengths is that it plays well both with a few pieces of felt for terrain as well as with a loaded board, unlike other games. I get that, but playing "Run pell mell at the gunline and hope you are alive by the time you get there" is incredibly boring. I tend to react to more terrain as a plus in most instances.
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Jun 16, 2014 19:24
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Colonial Air Force posted:My oldest bought some told soldiers "for me", so we're playing his very first wargame.  You deserved it tbh, the F-117 is so OP fancy bringing it against a newbie
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Jun 16, 2014 19:28
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Indolent Bastard posted:I get that, but playing "Run pell mell at the gunline and hope you are alive by the time you get there" is incredibly boring. I tend to react to more terrain as a plus in most instances. Warhammer fantasy, by virtue of the inflexibility of the way units work simply can't really accomodate heavy tables very well without getting weird. Also, BS based gunlines in warhammer fantasy pay a massive premium for their units that often don't accomplish a whole lot. There's maybe one or two good gunlines in that game.
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Jun 16, 2014 19:33
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NTRabbit posted:
We actually didn't use the aircraft because I couldn't think of a good way to incorporate them. Maybe something like Axis & Allies does. Also he chose the helicopter, I gave him the option!  Panzeh posted:Warhammer fantasy, by virtue of the inflexibility of the way units work simply can't really accomodate heavy tables very well without getting weird. Also, BS based gunlines in warhammer fantasy pay a massive premium for their units that often don't accomplish a whole lot. There's maybe one or two good gunlines in that game. They're completely different eras of battle, though. WWII/modern tactics require cover. Big blocks of pikemen require open fields.
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Jun 16, 2014 20:43
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Warlord has a rather impressive La Haye Sainte set out, is there any chance the farmhouse will be made available separately? It's basically everything I want for WW2 terrain in a box.
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Jun 20, 2014 14:18
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I put up some thoughts again on my progress with Bolt Action. I signed up to be a Sarge, basically their version of press ganger or street team. I demo the game and if I do enough I get 25% off orders with Warlord. I wouldn't do it just for the discount, I really want to get friends into the game. You also get a demo assault on Normandy kit. http://freshcoastgaming.blogspot.com/2014/06/bolt-action-promoted-to-sarge.html?m=1
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Jun 21, 2014 04:59
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Cross posting from the Oath thread, as there are far to many WWII posts in here. Have some Napoleonic Redcoats! As my light box is to small, time to break out the new (and still creased) grass mat!  There are my men, but as they are a little small (6mm) lets have a closer look, and provide some counts so I can prove everyone is present and correct. (You might just want to trust me on this one)  In the forground, the riflemen are 4 to a base with 12 bases total (6 shown here) behind them the line infantry, 16 to a base with 15 bases (one at the back with leftover figures on it.) 240 men in line formation, 48 in skirmish  Here we see the Generals and artillery - Artillery is 4 men and cannon to a base, and there are four of them. Generals are either 2 to a base or 3 to a base depending on whether they are Division or Corps Commanders. you can also see the spare cav I had mounted up on round bases to act as command point markers. Artillery, 16 men, 4 guns, 9 generals, 6 spare horsemen  Left flank, and we can see four bases of Hussars, 6 to a base. 24 men  Right flank, in the same configuration the light Dragoons. 24 men  Behind them, 6 to base are nine bases of Heavy dragoons. 54 men Total = 425 plucky men. This is my first attempt at painting 6mm since I was 8 and slapping they right colour paint on Epic figures then using to much superglue to stick them down. I'm happy with how they tuned out, and I learned a few things. 1) PVA glue sticks a lot better than I remember. when sticking them to sticks to paint, don't use to much or it will be a nightmare to get them off. 2) Check your figure types, Hussars and Dragoons look very similar without any paint on, and its annoying trying to paint smoothly when you have to keep checking which strip you are one. 3) I hate flags.
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Jun 21, 2014 18:14
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Holy poo poo, man. How do you do all this stuff? Your LPs alone would bring me to my knees.
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Jun 21, 2014 18:31
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Grey Hunter posted:2) Check your figure types, Hussars and Dragoons look very similar without any paint on, and its annoying trying to paint smoothly when you have to keep checking which strip you are one. When I was painting Flames of War, I'd use a sharpie to label the bottom of the Popsicle stick with what each stick was. I'd imagine this would help with your issue here pretty handily.
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Jun 21, 2014 18:58
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