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1. NA Annual was loving beautiful. Like holy poo poo make that team do a Strange mini or something. 2. NA was awesome. We FINALLY get the fight and a pleasant reveal regarding Strange only for him to say gently caress it I did something as worse. I can't wait for the repercussions from it.
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Jun 26, 2014 02:21
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Gushing so much over all the NA awesomeness we got this week. The annual was BEAUTIFUL, it just conveyed that crazy magic astral plane demon psychedelic nonsense perfectly instead of the usual spreads of Strange firing magic lasers against other magic lasers artwork that we get. Blood magic Strange doing the Black Priest split consciousness stuff in the annual, and him holding the priest mask at the end of NA, doesn't spell good things.
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Jun 26, 2014 04:17
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I certainly didn't expect Norn to end up being Not Timothy Hunter. And yea, that Annual. More of that, please!
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Jun 26, 2014 04:37
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A bit late to be saying this, but I find it funny how Hickman, in only one issue, painted a far more interesting picture of an Ultron-ruled future than Bendis did in a ten-issue event book with tons of leadup and tie-ins.
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Jun 26, 2014 04:37
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Fred is on posted:A bit late to be saying this, but I find it funny how Hickman, in only one issue, painted a far more interesting picture of an Ultron-ruled future than Bendis did in a ten-issue event book with tons of leadup and tie-ins. Well, Bendis took the easy route and pretty much just did "Terminator but with less Holocaust imagery."
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Jun 26, 2014 05:33
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To be fair, Hickman has just been killing it lately. Bendis in his prime had as cool of ideas as this poo poo, he just takes way too long to do anything with them and has no idea what to do when he gets around to them. Just hope we don't get 6 years of Hickman on Avengers and eventually he's just phoning it in. Also please write a Strange book mr hickman. your dr strangerman has been the best. what a fantastic week for new avengers
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Jun 26, 2014 06:12
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Holy poo poo that annual. I want every single page blown up to poster-size and then fill my house with that art. I wish he'd successfully performed the operation though, it was just so predictable. It juxtaposed beautifully with his victory over the super-demon , though. As for NA, it seems that the Great Society was way above the Illuminati's power level (I didn't expect the Hulk to get laid out like a wimp by Sun God), but it turns out the Illuminati's secret weapon wasn't a Hulk, it was a Strange!
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Jun 26, 2014 06:58
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Were the Illuminati Bendis' idea? I always liked the concept and it's a pity we had to wait so many years before someone made great use of them. Hickman's work is amazing. The Annual was quite good as well; what else does Barbiere do? The art was amazing as well.
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Jun 26, 2014 06:58
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radlum posted:Were the Illuminati Bendis' idea? I always liked the concept and it's a pity we had to wait so many years before someone made great use of them. Hickman's work is amazing. The Annual was quite good as well; what else does Barbiere do? The art was amazing as well. Illuminati was the best thing Bendis ever came up with. Even now when I read back, there's some Bendis speak but for the most part the issues are tight, the storyline is well plotted and the dialogue makes sense for each character. It seems like the only story he didn't conclude was the Beyonder plot, and in some of the cases like Marvel Boy or The Hood getting the Infinity Gauntlet he just plain hosed up, but I think as a lead in to Secret Invasion/Civil War, it's great stuff. Also I loved how much better the fake JLA was then the Illuminati; that's always been one of my issues when people say things like "Hyperion is a superman clone" obviously the power set is the same, but Thor and Hyperion are still really only "Gods" in comparison to the earth level super heroes and even then they're far less powerful than a lot of "Cosmic Level" characters. Sun God took some shots from Hulk but obviously wasn't really much more than distracted. Norn and Panther were evenly matched just like you'd expect Batman and Black Panther to be. I'm pretty sure Iron Man has a speedster in his rogue's gallery but even guys like Quicksilver are far less fast than Flash so it makes sense that given he's essentially limited by the speed of light on his equipment he couldn't deal with someone faster than it. I'm not a DC fan but I like that the relative scale of power levels was shown in such a nice comparison. Hickman wrote himself a solid out there by having their world's "sorcerer" not actually be trained in the art itself.
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Jun 26, 2014 09:59
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Leper Residue posted:To be fair, Hickman has just been killing it lately. Bendis in his prime had as cool of ideas as this poo poo, he just takes way too long to do anything with them and has no idea what to do when he gets around to them. I'd be really surprised if Hickman let things drag out. Going by his Secret Warriors and FF runs, the guy clearly functions from the outset with a beginning and an ending in mind. To be fair, I wouldn't have thought Bendis had overstaid his welcome on Avengers if he had ended things with his first NA run, I still think it's a great run that got a bit long in the tooth in some of the latter arcs, but it worked and had a great ending. My biggest gripe is with his subsequent Avengers and New Avengers volumes.
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Jun 26, 2014 10:02
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Yeah Hickman said in a reddit AMA that his run ends May '15.
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Jun 26, 2014 15:27
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I think I remember Strange discussing delving into the book shown in this week's NA issue earlier (and discussing the cost of doing so), but can't remember the issue/scene. Anyone recall where that was shown?
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Jun 26, 2014 15:34
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NA #13, the blood bible.
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Jun 26, 2014 15:45
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I went back and double-checked, looks like the scene with Wong and the Blood Bible I was thinking of was actually in NA #12: 
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Jun 26, 2014 16:05
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Fred is on posted:A bit late to be saying this, but I find it funny how Hickman, in only one issue, painted a far more interesting picture of an Ultron-ruled future than Bendis did in a ten-issue event book with tons of leadup and tie-ins. And that was it. It feels like the idea just never got off the drawing board and he never really gave Hitch (I think?) anything to work with. I didn't really care for Hickman's Ultron-future thing, but it is certainly leagues and leagues more impactful than everything Bendis ever did with Ultron - and it does this without showing Ultron, which kinda disproves that Bendis' one big clear mistake is not really having Ultron in AoU, a theory I've seen thrown around. But then NA was just amazing this week. At best, you're a curator.
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Jun 26, 2014 22:09
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NA and the Annual ruled a whole lot. How does Strange come back from this? Poor guy. Meanwhile, in the jam-packed Uncanny Avengers, Kang turns on the Avengers to the surprise of no one at all!
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Jun 26, 2014 22:53
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Madrox posted:I went back and double-checked, looks like the scene with Wong and the Blood Bible I was thinking of was actually in NA #12: Wrong book. What Strange summoned/did refers to another back which was shown all the way back in NA#4. Wong calls the book with the C'Thulu looking thing Blu'dakorr which is the title of NA#20. It actually even goes and sets up the failed deal for Godhood as touching the book "stains the soul". What I'm really curious is that when Strange presents his solution says it has roughly the same cost as the other plans involved, all of which meant one of the illuminati staying behind and/or dying.  EDIT: Actually I think the Blood Bible IS the Blu'dakorr so we're both right.
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Jun 26, 2014 23:08
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Man, I just cannot take any comic seriously that uses "aaieee" as a scream and the blame falls squarely on it being Seanbaby's stock scream for his parody comics.
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Jun 26, 2014 23:13
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Oh no Harry Potter!
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Jun 27, 2014 11:50
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Happy Noodle Boy posted:Wrong book. What Strange summoned/did refers to another back which was shown all the way back in NA#4. Wong calls the book with the C'Thulu looking thing Blu'dakorr which is the title of NA#20. It actually even goes and sets up the failed deal for Godhood as touching the book "stains the soul". What I'm really curious is that when Strange presents his solution says it has roughly the same cost as the other plans involved, all of which meant one of the illuminati staying behind and/or dying. Thanks! I knew there was something prior to what I posted, just couldn't dig it up. It was bugging the crap out of me. I think the cost of using spells from the book being the lives of men, ties back into what the Norn has been doing by sacrificing his alternate/future selves to draw power. I think that (or some version of it) is also what Strange uses in the annual. Strange splits himself. The demon there responds: "The Muntu Splitting of the Self. Such magic... What have you sacrificed for this power." Strange answers: "I have... Given... ALL." Madrox fucked around with this message at 12:07 on Jun 27, 2014 |
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Jun 27, 2014 11:55
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SynthOrange posted:Oh no Harry Potter!
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Jun 27, 2014 12:49
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After this issue of New Avengers, I'm done with Hickman's Avengers. I just can't stand it anymore. The idea of a moral quandary doesn't work so well in fiction when I know that the writer created the quandary. I just have no interest in seeing them slaughter another team of heroes. The justification for keeping things secret was stupid when it started and the longer it has gone on, the less I care about the eventual reveal. The story is clearly the story of a group of people who started doing things in secret for the right reasons and how it eventually went off the rails, I just don't think its really a story I want in the Avengers. Uncanny Avengers on the other hand keeps being amusing and great, with Kang's shocking yet inevitable betrayal.
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Jun 27, 2014 17:42
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Dr.Magnificent posted:I just can't stand it anymore. The idea of a moral quandary doesn't work so well in fiction when I know that the writer created the quandary. What? So, any fiction with a moral quandary then? That must keep you away from a staggering amount of novels, movies, and a lot of other media.
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Jun 27, 2014 17:50
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Dr.Magnificent posted:. The story is clearly the story of a group of people who started doing things in secret for the right reasons and how it eventually went off the rails, I just don't think its really a story I want in the Avengers. I am pretty sure that it can't be any clearer then when they had Steve say that to them in the third issue. You also know that it is planned out and the rest of the Avengers are not going to be very very pissed off. We have seen a little of it, but I expect that poo poo will be going down at the end of his run.
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Jun 27, 2014 17:54
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Dr.Magnificent posted:The idea of a moral quandary doesn't work so well in fiction when I know that the writer created the quandary.
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Jun 27, 2014 19:22
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Yeah I have no idea what he's trying to say there. Of course the writer creates the quandary. He's the one writing the story!
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Jun 27, 2014 19:26
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I can't stand fiction where the author makes up a story. What's the point? EDIT: Are you trying to say you aren't as interested in it because you can't relate to it? Like there would never be a point in your life where you would have to decide if you are gonna blow up some other Earth? Senor Candle fucked around with this message at 20:19 on Jun 27, 2014 |
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Jun 27, 2014 20:16
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What I think he's trying to say is that moral quandaries can feel contrived or frustrating when it seems like the writer is forcing all the pieces that make the situation so inescapably gray, whether those pieces fit or not. The whole ethical dilemma these characters face can be..."unsatisfying," I guess?...when the heroes were set up to fail by circumstances outside their control, whether in-text or out-of-text. It's like the end of Man of Steel where Superman is forced to kill Zod and people are like "Well what else was Zac Snyder supposed to have him do?" which ignores that Zac Snyder constructed the situation that led to Superman having to kill Zod in the first place. It's also the old "Why doesn't Batman just kill the Joker????" nugget that writers like to play with (idiotically) every once in a while. I can see shades of this in Hickman's New Avengers, but then I don't think it's that big a deal because it pales in comparison to stuff some other writers have put out...Bendis, just for instance. Every single thing Bendis writes seems to fall headlong into this problem. On the contrary I think Hickman has set up this specific dilemma of the Incursions pretty well. Maybe too well. I just don't want him to have to end up writing an easy way out like using the power of friendship and teamwork or something. 
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Jun 27, 2014 20:56
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So I was totally down with Marvel vs. DC 2: Non-copyright infringement boogaloo, but the end totally lost me. So Doc Strange can't sell his soul but can go Black Priest mode because he... saw a doodle of Cthulhu in his Blood Bible book? And why did
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Jun 27, 2014 21:52
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TwoPair posted:So I was totally down with Marvel vs. DC 2: Non-copyright infringement boogaloo, but the end totally lost me. So Doc Strange can't sell his soul but can go Black Priest mode because he... saw a doodle of Cthulhu in his Blood Bible book? And why did The Norn wasn't actually a Sorcerer Supreme, he was just a guy that had a bunch of magic items and knew how to activate them. So when Strange used the words of the Black Priests he was able to see that the Norn didn't actually command any magic power. Sort of like imagine a wizard is fighting a rogue with a ton of magic items, the Wizard might think the Rogue is a magician until he realizes that the Rogue isn't casting the spells, he's just using the magic items to do what they've been designed/enchanted to do.
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Jun 27, 2014 22:26
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He didn't use the words of the black priests. He used the words of like, whatever the term for lovecraftian horrors from beyond the veil are called in Marvel. When the Norn used the words of the black priests they weren't in english. At least that was my take. That could be the beginning of it, or it could imply he went a different way. Maybe Hickman is going to really surprise us by the end. Also as an aside it is specifically stated the Norn used at least half his strength blowing up that planet.
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Jun 27, 2014 22:38
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Spiderdrake posted:He didn't use the words of the black priests. He used the words of like, whatever the term for lovecraftian horrors from beyond the veil are called in Marvel. When the Norn used the words of the black priests they weren't in english. Words of Power are Words of Power, no matter the language. That's the worrying part. His failed deal would have effectively made him a god, at the cost of his soul. The alternative, abandoning his soul to the powers of the Blood Bible, pretty much is going to turn him into the opposite, a devil, or lovecraftian horror, and isn't that what the Black Priests are in the end? It's like we saw in the previous Avengers arc with the proto-Mapmakers. Design principles essentially led to the same end result. Strange now has the mask, the words of power, and (as we saw in the annual) the ability to split into numerous selves. hope and vaseline fucked around with this message at 22:48 on Jun 27, 2014 |
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Jun 27, 2014 22:44
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I just recall that scene where he came back from that other realm, and we were all lead to believe he gave up his whole soul. He spoke some other language to Namor, so now I'm wondering why he did that if he came back as himself.
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Jun 28, 2014 00:04
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IUG posted:I just recall that scene where he came back from that other realm, and we were all lead to believe he gave up his whole soul. He spoke some other language to Namor, so now I'm wondering why he did that if he came back as himself. Strange tries to sell his soul, fails, resorts to blood bible, is now black magic scary as poo poo strange, comes back, Namor seems him, speaks a word of power which is now his language. We're only getting the phonetic interpretation cause Hickman wants us to know that they are the same thing.
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Jun 28, 2014 01:07
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You know the twist is probably going to be that the bomb the Illuminati left on earth is actually set to blow up their earth if they fail.
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Jun 28, 2014 05:09
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hope and vaseline posted:Strange tries to sell his soul, fails, resorts to blood bible, is now black magic scary as poo poo strange, comes back, Namor seems him, speaks a word of power which is now his language. We're only getting the phonetic interpretation cause Hickman wants us to know that they are the same thing. I think he still sold part of his soul. I think they were powering him up and too SOME of it away. Also, the Norn is totally a kid.
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Jun 28, 2014 07:53
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I wasn't sure if I understood why they wouldn't sell Strange god power, is his soul compromised cause he hosed with the blood bible? Or is that a mystery yet to be revealed?
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Jun 28, 2014 08:49
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Buddington posted:I wasn't sure if I understood why they wouldn't sell Strange god power, is his soul compromised cause he hosed with the blood bible? Or is that a mystery yet to be revealed? His soul is stained because of the blood bible, yes.
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Jun 28, 2014 15:09
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Madrox posted:What? So, any fiction with a moral quandary then? That must keep you away from a staggering amount of novels, movies, and a lot of other media. Ok this was poorly worded on my part. It doesn't feel earned. They go directly to murdering Earths as an acceptable option from the get go. And we all know its a truly bad idea, and will go wrong. I'm supposed to feel tension as it builds to the climax, but I'm just finding it boring and time wasting. I'm not saying Hickman is a bad writer or even that the run is bad, just that I'm not enjoying it. I'll give it another try when its finished, maybe I'll enjoy it more when its a complete work, that did happen with Hickman's Fantastic Four run.
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Jun 29, 2014 01:50
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Dr.Magnificent posted:Ok this was poorly worded on my part. It doesn't feel earned. They go directly to murdering Earths as an acceptable option from the get go. And we all know its a truly bad idea, and will go wrong. I'm supposed to feel tension as it builds to the climax, but I'm just finding it boring and time wasting. I'm not saying Hickman is a bad writer or even that the run is bad, just that I'm not enjoying it. I'll give it another try when its finished, maybe I'll enjoy it more when its a complete work, that did happen with Hickman's Fantastic Four run. Except they're not? They're exhausting every possibility until they have to do it. This is the first instance where they'll actually be destroying a populated earth. Yes they've built an arsenal, and just the act of doing it implies deafeatism, but they are trying, but the odds are kind of stacked. hope and vaseline fucked around with this message at 01:59 on Jun 29, 2014 |
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Jun 29, 2014 01:55
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