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Vitamin P posted:Meredith would have ordered it sooner or later anyway. Better to throw the Templars/Chantry on a confused defensive so the mages have the best chance in their rebellion. Nah, that's bullshit. Every single mage in Kirkwall is either a Blood Mage, an abomination or a loving idiot. There's that one quest with a bunch of escaped mages in a cave. Their so-called leader turned to blood magic for some reason, and once you kill him another mage chick begs you not to turn them to the templars, lest they all get turned into tranquil. That's fair enough, being tranquil sucks! Her proposal? You should totally kill the templar officer that's pursuing them, which turns out to be maybe one of the only reasonable people in the Free Marches! And if you actually let them go, she turns out to be a blood mage! What a tweest! I mean, if we have to go by the general state of Kirkwall and its mages, Meredith's iron fisted approach is more than justified up to the point when the red lyrium causes her to COMPLETELY lose her poo poo. Even Orsino is a complete gently caress-up who dabbled in necromancy! He had a great deal of fun exchanging letters with the SERIAL MURDERING NECROMANCER THAT KILLED HAWKE'S MOM 'CAUSE HE LOOKED LIKE HIS GIRLFRIEND, kinda sorta. Where do you think he learned how to conjure a loving harverster? Also: "Templars are at our gates! They wish to kill us because they think we make use of forbidden magic! Better use fobidden magic to desecrate my fellow mage's bodies and souls to turn into an undead abomination, and lose any kind of moral high ground or sympathy I might ever had!" Good job you colossal fucker, no wonder this place is full of blood mages. 
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Jun 29, 2014 17:02
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Brumaldo posted:Nah, that's bullshit. Yeah her name is Grace. She was banging the leader of their little group that was intent on escaping, and all she cared about was vengeance for his death. That lady is an rear end in a top hat. And yeah Orsino is smooth as butter, but he is not a good person. Dude is all about the advancement of magical theory and does not really care where it comes from.
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Jun 29, 2014 17:06
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Brumaldo posted:Nah, that's bullshit. Unfortunately, if this is the guy I'm thinking of, he's a rapist.
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Jun 29, 2014 17:07
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Open Source Idiom posted:Unfortunately, if this is the guy I'm thinking of, he's a rapist. What? No. He's talking about the red headed, reserved Templar who is constantly trying to smooth over tensions and make things better for mages for the entire game. His daughter was a mage. Until a Mage murders him. I believe it's Grace who does it in fact. gently caress that lady.
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Jun 29, 2014 17:08
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Captain Oblivious posted:What? No. He's talking about the red headed, reserved Templar who is constantly trying to smooth over tensions and make things better for mages for the entire game. His daughter was a mage. They guy that Grace asks you to kill (in Act 1) isn't Thrask. It's another Templar from the Starkhaven Circle who's implied to have raped the other mage dude they're travelling with. Which you can only find out about in a hidden, optional conversation at the Gallows, way later.
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Jun 29, 2014 17:09
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Open Source Idiom posted:They guy that Grace asks you to kill (in Act 1) isn't Thrask. It's another guy from the Starkhaven Circle who's implied to have raped the other dude they're travelling with. Yes and no. As I recall it, the guy from the Starkhaven Circle hasn't arrived yet. Thrask has. He's the one who sends you in to try and defuse things peacefully before Starkhaven guy arrives. She tries to have you kill both of them.
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Jun 29, 2014 17:10
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Open Source Idiom posted:They guy that Grace asks you to kill (in Act 1) isn't Thrask. It's another Templar from the Starkhaven Circle who's implied to have raped the other mage dude they're travelling with. I dunno dude, it's been so long. I think that maybe Thrask gives you the quest to track the fugitives down? The only thing I remember is that the guy waiting outside the cave seemed pretty chill. If you're right that only compounds the fact that everyone in the Free Marches is an rear end in a top hat and I wish DA2 had a Qunari ending, with Hawke screaming at the top of his lungs that he wants to leave this shithole forever.
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Jun 29, 2014 17:14
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Yeah, no, Captain Oblivious is right -- Grace asks you to kill Thrask. Given all that, the Starkhaven Circle sounds like it deserved to burn down. Everyone we see from there is loving crazy (except maybe Alaric), which sort of puts paid to the idea that the Kirkwall Circle is some kind of extreme outlier. le sigh.
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Jun 29, 2014 17:19
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Just finished my fist run through DA2 as a magey mage. Anders is kind of a tool. Like, really dumb. There's no way to stop that, huh? You can't just be, like, that's loving retarded. Merill's thing was freaking silly, though. The way you guys talked about it made it seem like she'd have to kill her clan to do her stuff. Instead, the Keeper takes the fall for it, then the clan kinda just decides to try to murder you. Seriously. All of them. They had a little pow-wow and decided that if the Keeper goes up and doesn't come back, we're all going to bumrush the most powerful man in the region. Yes, even the lady from the alienage who's son I saved from becoming a horrible demon. Why not? Actually, probably my biggest complaint about the story was just how much violence just kinda pops up out of nowhere, especially near the end. Trying to help out the mages literally just leads to me killing, like, 100 mages and templars who are on my side. No chance to talk them down or anything. Well, actually, when you finally get a chance to talk them down, one of the mages go all blood mage abomination cause she totally wants to kill you for no reason, then all the other people decide to help her? What the gently caress. The abomination just killed the Templar that's leading this little rebellion, better help her out trying to kill the guy that publicly supported your cause! Then after Anders pulls out his stupid card, Orsino loses his poo poo. You agree to help him, you end up literally just killing everyone, cause Orsino goes all blood mage abomination for no reason. I used my terrible magic to kill wave after wave of templars. To say all hope is lost is incredibly dumb! The templars are almost entirely reasonable in comparison. When Meredith finally shows that's she's actually bat poo poo looney, the Templars recognize it and stop. Edit: I'm pretty sure I'm just always going to kill Grace from now on. That bitch is a problem. bobtheconqueror fucked around with this message at 17:25 on Jun 29, 2014 |
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Jun 29, 2014 17:20
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Opposing Farce posted:Maybe. I think what I'm taking away here is how character concept can impact the way I experience the story in an RPG. I usually don't go into these games playing a character whose sense of morality and values are significantly different from my own, but in DA2 I did, and as a result I ended up not hating a character I objectively have good reason to hate. It's giving me something to chew on, at least. I went into the game with a pro mage rogue, but since I kind of wanted to take my mage in that direction in origins, but couldn't due to not wanting to piss off Wynne and Leliana, I wasn't too upset with Anders. My crazy mage probably would have helped, but suggested we blow up the templars instead. And she totally could have found a way to do that. Although in the quest where you help Anders collect his ingredients, he really needs to shut up about it being gross. Why can't he be the one touching the poo? If you get Mark of the Assassin, Hawke's digging around in poop there too. Why does Hawke handle feces so much? Bored fucked around with this message at 17:28 on Jun 29, 2014 |
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Jun 29, 2014 17:21
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bobtheconqueror posted:
Kill all mages.
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Jun 29, 2014 17:27
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You know who was a real cool dude? That templar in Origins investigating the mysterious goings on at the Alienage orphanage. Poor fucker didn't deserve a pitchfork in the back. I kinda wish more encounters with spirits and demons had been portrayed like that. The quest had some great presentation to it (even if it was super buggy).
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Jun 29, 2014 17:42
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paragon1 posted:You know who was a real cool dude? That templar in Origins investigating the mysterious goings on at the Alienage orphanage. Poor fucker didn't deserve a pitchfork in the back. I kinda wish more encounters with spirits and demons had been portrayed like that. The quest had some great presentation to it (even if it was super buggy). Man I put that guy in a bubble right before the cutscene and he still died. I felt even worse because when the quest is over, there's no talk of it at all.
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Jun 29, 2014 18:06
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It really feels like there should have been a prompt to notify the Denerim Chantry or something.
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Jun 29, 2014 18:15
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paragon1 posted:It really feels like there should have been a prompt to notify the Denerim Chantry or something. It's a super super late game sidequest so I'm guessing it didn't get a whole lot of attention.
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Jun 29, 2014 18:26
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So Kirkwall is just a smoldering pile ashes by Inquisition, right?
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Jun 29, 2014 18:43
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Crabtree posted:So Kirkwall is just a smoldering pile ashes by Inquisition, right? Who knows. They don't really get into what happens with the power vacuum there, although one of the cheevos makes me think Hawke can become viscount.
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Jun 29, 2014 19:58
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Geostomp posted:Because it was pointless slaughter of innocent people to make a point and it was the absolute worst possible thing he could ever do to mages as a whole by implicating them in his personal vengeance. The fact that he lied to make you support him doing this and had the gall to get self-righteous about it "proving" his preconceptions only made it worse. That + the fact that if you've maxed out your friendship meter than he gives you a little speech about how "I'll take the blame and no one will blame you, that's why I lied!" Anyone else remember how DA2 starts out? Cassandra blaming Hawke for blowing up the Chantry. She only mentions Anders once in the entire interview. gently caress you, Anders. gently caress you so hard for turning into the victim blaming rear end in a top hat you accuse everyone else of being.
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Jun 29, 2014 19:59
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HIJK posted:That + the fact that if you've maxed out your friendship meter than he gives you a little speech about how "I'll take the blame and no one will blame you, that's why I lied!" Hmm, if you execute Anders it's hardly possible for him to blame Hawke for blowing up the chantry. But of course, if he is dead it's much more likely that Hawke, the most prominent survivor, is blamed for the mess. There are good reasons to hate Anders but I think you are wrong in this instance.
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Jun 29, 2014 20:03
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Torrannor posted:Hmm, if you execute Anders it's hardly possible for him to blame Hawke for blowing up the chantry. But of course, if he is dead it's much more likely that Hawke, the most prominent survivor, is blamed for the mess. There are good reasons to hate Anders but I think you are wrong in this instance. I usually let Anders live because killing him is too much trouble. Sadly, I need a healer. Hawke being blamed for being the most prominent survivor is exactly what I mean though. Hawke was either tricked or didn't do poo poo, and he still gets Kirkwall hung around his neck, after Anders explicitly promises that exact thing won't happen. It's not Anders fault that people will believe what they'll believe. It is his fault that he actually thought he could get away with something as naive as "no one will blame Hawke for this." It renders his entire reasoning hollow as a full-on friend or a romance. That's not protecting Hawke and Anders is a liar and a hypocrite for spouting those lines. Edit: This is the thing about DA2 and Anders' character that rankles me the most so take it as you will. When I say "victim blaming" I mean that Anders doese exactly what he accuses of everyone else of doing and annihilates a specific group in Kirkwall and then blames them for their own demise after going to great lengths to orchestrate it. HIJK fucked around with this message at 20:15 on Jun 29, 2014 |
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Jun 29, 2014 20:12
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And he's only able to orchestrate it because no one allowed to stop him until its far too late. Anders isn't even a capable bomber, he's just a plot dependent mule.
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Jun 29, 2014 20:52
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I kept Anders alive because "god loving drat it you shithead, you made this mess, you WILL help me clean it up".
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Jun 29, 2014 22:26
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Open Source Idiom posted:They guy that Grace asks you to kill (in Act 1) isn't Thrask. It's another Templar from the Starkhaven Circle who's implied to have raped the other mage dude they're travelling with. Actually, having replayed that quest yesterday, I can confirm the dialogue option is literally "I'll kill Thrask," though I don't think that's ever actually an option because the other guy intervenes. You can kill the other guy, though, and if you don't, he just disappears, possibly going back to Starkhaven.
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Jun 29, 2014 22:28
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Open Source Idiom posted:Speaking of, Isabella's another character that the game tries to defy typical Bioware arcs with. Bioware characters are meant to become better people over the course of their arcs, but, if anything, Isabella's morality backslides over the course of the game. Just goes to show you can't trust those drat negros, thanks Bioware!
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Jun 29, 2014 22:50
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Alouicious posted:Just goes to show you can't trust those drat negros, thanks Bioware! I always thought that Isabella was latino. I guess with the cartoony style of DA2, she could really be anything.
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Jun 29, 2014 23:01
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CottonWolf posted:I always thought that Isabella was latino. I guess with the cartoony style of DA2, she could really be anything. She's Rivaini, and no Rivaini character who's shown up in Dragon Age so far (so basically just Duncan and Isabela) can be trusted
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Jun 29, 2014 23:06
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Alouicious posted:Just goes to show you can't trust those drat  If playing Black Flag has taught me anything, it is that people with boats are assholes by nature... Myself included. Now excuse me while I go back to raiding ships just for giggles, purely so that I can dump their valuables into a store for money that I have no use for. 
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Jun 29, 2014 23:06
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Alouicious posted:She's Rivaini, and no Rivaini character who's shown up in Dragon Age so far (so basically just Duncan and Isabela) can be trusted I'm with Generic. I think she gets her dickheadedness from the pirate. Plus, the very few people you meet from Rivain barely mention their nationality.
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Jun 29, 2014 23:11
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No lie, I'd snap up a Dragon Age sequel set in Rivain. Has a pretty cool history, and the hedgewitch community sounds pretty chill. Pre-Chantry annihilation, anyway.
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Jun 29, 2014 23:15
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This I wanted I wanted the conversation options to be when you're forced to choose a side at the end of DA2: 1. Help the mages. 2. Help the templars. 3.  Then I choose 3 and the credits roll. RPG of the decade.
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Jun 30, 2014 02:32
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comatose posted:This I wanted I wanted the conversation options to be when you're forced to choose a side at the end of DA2: gently caress yes.
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Jun 30, 2014 02:43
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The devs Fallout: New Vegas were half-jokingly considering an ending where you just gently caress off from the Mojave without finishing the story at all.
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Jun 30, 2014 02:44
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StashAugustine posted:The devs Fallout: New Vegas were half-jokingly considering an ending where you just gently caress off from the Mojave without finishing the story at all. Why not go through with it? In that game, you're just some courier that ended up in over their heads and attacked for being an unwitting pawn. After you find out what was really going on, possibly get your revenge, and deliver the package, there's not much reason for you specifically to stick around for the war. You could just pack up, head home, and let the Mojave sort itself out while you disappear back into anonymity. Hawke at very least actually lived in Kirkwall. The Courier was just passing through.
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Jun 30, 2014 02:47
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They probably didn't implement it because people would stumble on the option by accident and end the game early with no prior save to load so they could carry on as normal, and then they'd complain online.
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Jun 30, 2014 02:52
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I think in Storm of Zehir you could just go into the menu at any time and go, whelp I'm done adventuring, I retire. And then the credits roll.
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Jun 30, 2014 03:11
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comatose posted:This I wanted I wanted the conversation options to be when you're forced to choose a side at the end of DA2: Heh.    (source - DeviantArt warning) Sometimes the internet produces good entertainment.
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Jun 30, 2014 07:53
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HIJK posted:Heh. Those last 2 images are a left 4 dead machinima or cartoon I once saw, ad verbatim. It involved Zoey saying "gently caress you" to all infected, telling the Boomer he's cool, and loving off. EDIT: Thumbs up and all. I'd try to find it but ehh.
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Jun 30, 2014 09:18
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HIJK posted:Sometimes the internet produces good entertainment. Oh god, why do I remember that stupid movie. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hTOKJTRHMdw Everybody forgets the burger to the face.
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Jun 30, 2014 10:29
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DA2 ending was loving terrible, and whoever has decided that regardless of your choice you need those final boss battles should get fired. When I found out I can talk my way out of Planescape: Torment final battle, W2 final battle or quite some fights in F:NV I felt good about the story. In DA2 it's more like: "But we've developed this cool fight, it has moving statues! Who wouldn't want to fight it?!?"
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Jun 30, 2014 11:00
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Scorchy posted:I think in Storm of Zehir you could just go into the menu at any time and go, whelp I'm done adventuring, I retire. And then the credits roll. The Yaeger guys originally had an option in the menu of Spec Ops that was just "Call for Evac." Clicking it would have Walker ask for evac, and depending on how far into the game you were, he'd be varying states of mentally well. If you left right after you finished your actual objective, he'd be fine for example. It got focus tested out because everyone kept bitching that the $60 FPS could be beaten in 30 minutes if they evacced after completing the actual objective. Also apparently more then a few people hit it by accident because most gamers are intellectually on par with two year olds.
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Jun 30, 2014 11:15
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