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Arghy
Nov 15, 2012

Dryb posted:

What kind of refueling stations are you using? Gas Mining Stations or Resupply ships (or something else I am forgetting)? When a system is available for refueling, a little gas-pump looking symbol will appear over it in the galaxy map. Also make sure the gas matches the reactors' needs.

You can refuel before finishing the mission, I believe when you cancel or un-queue something you get the money back, although I'm not sure how this works with the constructor already being loaded with the correct materials. I have also found an energy collector on it will help it's fuel usage; it will not use fuel during the construction phase, at least.

I love making specific 'fortress' gas mining stations at far away systems -- this does require your constructors to not be automated, so they don't make multiples of the upkeep-heavy things, though. I guess you could quickly mark it obsolete after you build it where you want.

It was all caslon gas giants and basically mining stations souped up with extra shields and enough weapons to fend off multiple pirate cruisers. It says that you only get half your money back when you cancel something but i'm wondering if you pay for new stations up front or when you start building?

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Gwyrgyn Blood
Dec 17, 2002

As much as I like this game, I think the fleet automation stuff is going to drive me to shelve it for a while. Maybe someone has some tips for this stuff but it's just driving me nuts...

- Automated fleets prioritize refueling and repairing over everything else. Set a fleet to defend a sector, oh but a couple of ships are low on fuel? Guess they'll just ignore a pirate ship raiding a planet nearby until everyone is fully fueled up.

- Compounded with the above, fleets only ever seem to act as a single unit. Meaning, they won't split up even if it would be radically more efficient to do so. In the above case, I would expect the fleet that needs refueling to remain refueling while the rest of the fleet continues mopping up pirates. Another example, a large fleet may choose an odd place to refuel, I assume, because it will only choose to refuel at a location which has enough Casion/Hydrogen to refuel the entire fleet. All together I suppose, means that the most efficient way to handle automation is to keep your fleets in somewhat small numbers. Which is not good.

- Automated fleets are crazy unresponsive. Like, they take forever to actually respond to something happening nearby. Additionally, if an enemy fleet is on a vector to attack another system, the defending fleet doesn't try to get there ahead of time to intercept them. Or at least not that I've ever noticed.


- Attack Stance is a whole different animal, it just doesn't work right at all from what I can tell. You set say, a target planet, set to attack stance, set range to sector or such, turn on automation. Maybe that fleet will pick up some number of troops, then fly to that planet and attempt to conquer it, fail, and then just cancel the target. The range setting doesn't seem to do anything at all? I was under the impression this was suppose to be a way to order a fleet to attack an entire area (the red circle), and refuel/repair at their home base when needed. But it doesn't seem to do this at all.


- Ships in a system will just attack all enemies there, regardless of stance or automation or anything. I believe this is tied to the ship behaviors, which you can adjust in the design menu or as a global option, but there doesn't seem to be any way to tag a single fleet to 'not attack this thing because I want to board it' or 'stop loving warping around the system and stay in place where I tell you to'.

- The fleet GUI straight up breaks once you get enough ships in it since there's no scroll bar and the ships just flow off the bottom. Another reason to use small fleets I guess.

- Sometimes, despite all your best efforts, a fleet will just straight up decide to ignore certain orders. Turned automation off, right click to attack a planet. Ship cancels the order after a few seconds and goes to refuel, and they're already like 75% full. I'm assuming this is something to do with the fact that that fleet didn't have any troops so couldn't assault the planet. But ... why completely change the order and do something totally unrelated? It's nonsense.


All in all, it's extremely frustrating trying to wage any sort of offense or defense because of the combination of horrible GUI, unresponsiveness of automation, and your fleet sometimes doing erratic things you never told them to with no explanation. I feel like I could probably work around some of this with enough experience trying to figure out the game's logic, but a lot of it probably not.

lizurcainnon
May 5, 2008

Gwyrgyn Blood posted:

As much as I like this game, I think the fleet automation stuff is going to drive me to shelve it for a while. Maybe someone has some tips for this stuff but it's just driving me nuts...

- Automated fleets prioritize refueling and repairing over everything else. Set a fleet to defend a sector, oh but a couple of ships are low on fuel? Guess they'll just ignore a pirate ship raiding a planet nearby until everyone is fully fueled up.

- Compounded with the above, fleets only ever seem to act as a single unit. Meaning, they won't split up even if it would be radically more efficient to do so. In the above case, I would expect the fleet that needs refueling to remain refueling while the rest of the fleet continues mopping up pirates. Another example, a large fleet may choose an odd place to refuel, I assume, because it will only choose to refuel at a location which has enough Casion/Hydrogen to refuel the entire fleet. All together I suppose, means that the most efficient way to handle automation is to keep your fleets in somewhat small numbers. Which is not good.


The point of fleets IS for a group of ships to act as a single unit. If you want ships to act independently, then leave them independent. Therefore, as a single unit, a fleet only has as much fuel as the ship in it with the lowest amount of fuel. Solutions would be to address the issue through ship design by ensuring all parts of the fleet have similar endurance. Perhaps your stations/bases just don't carry the reserve fuel to handle the fleet sizes you're using, so if you don't want smaller fleets, try increasing the cargo capacity of your stations and resupply ships instead.

quote:

- Automated fleets are crazy unresponsive. Like, they take forever to actually respond to something happening nearby. Additionally, if an enemy fleet is on a vector to attack another system, the defending fleet doesn't try to get there ahead of time to intercept them. Or at least not that I've ever noticed.


- Attack Stance is a whole different animal, it just doesn't work right at all from what I can tell. You set say, a target planet, set to attack stance, set range to sector or such, turn on automation. Maybe that fleet will pick up some number of troops, then fly to that planet and attempt to conquer it, fail, and then just cancel the target. The range setting doesn't seem to do anything at all? I was under the impression this was suppose to be a way to order a fleet to attack an entire area (the red circle), and refuel/repair at their home base when needed. But it doesn't seem to do this at all.


- Ships in a system will just attack all enemies there, regardless of stance or automation or anything. I believe this is tied to the ship behaviors, which you can adjust in the design menu or as a global option, but there doesn't seem to be any way to tag a single fleet to 'not attack this thing because I want to board it' or 'stop loving warping around the system and stay in place where I tell you to'.

- The fleet GUI straight up breaks once you get enough ships in it since there's no scroll bar and the ships just flow off the bottom. Another reason to use small fleets I guess.

- Sometimes, despite all your best efforts, a fleet will just straight up decide to ignore certain orders. Turned automation off, right click to attack a planet. Ship cancels the order after a few seconds and goes to refuel, and they're already like 75% full. I'm assuming this is something to do with the fact that that fleet didn't have any troops so couldn't assault the planet. But ... why completely change the order and do something totally unrelated? It's nonsense.


All in all, it's extremely frustrating trying to wage any sort of offense or defense because of the combination of horrible GUI, unresponsiveness of automation, and your fleet sometimes doing erratic things you never told them to with no explanation. I feel like I could probably work around some of this with enough experience trying to figure out the game's logic, but a lot of it probably not.



This is what I've done in general to compensate for some of the AI issues:
1) increase sensor coverage: take over design of the private gas and/or regular mining station, add a long range sensor to it, and one or two more energy collectors. Find some of these bases along your borders, and as far out from your borders as you can manage, and click the upgrade button on them. There's definitely some lag time in responsiveness, so this can buy a bit more reaction time. You can return the design to automated after, or just leave it at manual upgrade and new stations built after will also be sensor platforms; usually the private sector can easily handle the minor extra cost.

2) "speedbump" fleets. These smaller-sized fleets sit in systems and handle the small stuff, and when a large fleet comes, they get in the way to buy more time for reinforcements to arrive.

3) make dedicated troop ships and dedicated invasion fleets composed of only them. This makes it significanly easier to manage the logistics of assaulting a planet. Ignore the "consider adding troop modules" advice on destroyers-and-up in the design screen, that way lies madness in micromanagement, and "fleet has 1000 troop capacity, but can't load a single armored unit because no one ship has 200 space available".

4) turn off automation on fleets. With the default behavior even without automation on being to patrol a whole system, the small fleets will take care of the "everyday" issues, you can then manage a smaller number of large "core" fleets to carry out your critical offensive and defensive needs.

5) leave larger numbers of certain ships out of fleets. The AI uses escorts and frigates to guard ships and stations. I never put escorts in fleets, and less than half of the frigates I build go into fleets.

Basically, do everything you can to limit what you need to manage. Treat fleets as a single "ship" whose components are individual ships. Damaged components should only be an urgent concern if it prevents the ship from doing its job, and it's the same with a fleet. More ships in the fleet than can be displayed in the UI? Only a concern if there's a mission-critical issue with a ship not shown, and if that's the case then either the fleet has reached a state where it needs to be sent back for repair/resupply, or your fleet composition needs to be reconsidered. If managing a fleet regularly becomes an urgent problem (i.e. it can't do its job) because of just one or two ships not shown in the 32 in the UI, then that's a serious fleet composition issue. If the problem is as simple as one ship with enough damage that it can't fully power it's hyperdrive and the whole fleet is slowed down by it, go to the ship menu, military ship dropdown, sort by fleet, find the damaged ship in that fleet (one of the ones in red, indicating component damage), select the ship and tell it to leave the fleet.

One tip for ease of putting a fleet together, or ordering replacements for a fleet: don't build via the Build Order (F9) screen because this'll scatter the construction over your stations. Go to a specific station and queue the ships there. Immediately afterwards, go to the ships and bases screen, military ship dropdown - if it's already sorted by some other method, click on the Empire column to turn off sorting, then close and reopen the ships and bases screen - scroll down to the bottom and all the newly queued up ships should be grouped there so you can quickly assign them all to a fleet. Obviously if you're putting together a massive fleet, you'll want to consider breaking it up over a couple of nearby systems/stations so you don't run into construction yard or resource availibility issues.

Gwyrgyn Blood
Dec 17, 2002

Thanks, I'll give a few of those things a spin and see how it works out. I was trying to take care of things like defense over a large region using automation but it doesn't seem practical to do that, or at least not with a single larger fleet. The problem is it's extremely micro heavy to worry about keeping defensive fleets out protecting mining stations where you don't have planets/bases and such. Maybe the right combination of non-automated fleets guarding systems and a small automated fleet for picking off small groups of pirates/fleets over a large region would work best.

I think if you set a fleet to simply 'patrol this planet' it should guard the whole system and also refuel as needed right?

I've also found that it really helps to name your fleets something like, 0a-1st and 0d-2nd to indicate 'offensive' and 'defensive' fleets you care to manage. That way they float to the top of the list and other fleets float to the bottom.


Another dumb question, I want to design my own ships but have them automatically update with new tech. So I set Ship Design to Fully Automated, and make sure it says Automatic/Automatic in the design menu. But for some reason they still don't auto upgrade? The default ones auto upgrade just fine, I'm just not sure why my custom ones don't.

bobtheconqueror
May 10, 2005
Having ship designs be fully automated means that, eventually, the design AI is just gonna overwrite your designs with stock ones. I don't much care for it. I think the automatic setting is actually for ship upgrades. Automated ships will attempt to retrofit to the latest designs automatically with that setting, maybe? Haven't screwed around with that much.

As to your fleet woes, I actually try to maintain a fairly large force of automated escorts and frigates to serve as defensive forces, with a few big ol' fleets to deal with heavier stuff. I actually stole an earlier poster's idea to set up defensive escorts as tacklers with tractor beams and warp inhibitors and my defense frigates as longer range bruisers. I've noticed that escorts and frigates will defend independent colonies from pirates, which is kinda cool.

Nektu
Jul 4, 2007

FUKKEN FUUUUUUCK
Cybernetic Crumb

Gwyrgyn Blood posted:

Thanks, I'll give a few of those things a spin and see how it works out. I was trying to take care of things like defense over a large region using automation but it doesn't seem practical to do that, or at least not with a single larger fleet. The problem is it's extremely micro heavy to worry about keeping defensive fleets out protecting mining stations where you don't have planets/bases and such. Maybe the right combination of non-automated fleets guarding systems and a small automated fleet for picking off small groups of pirates/fleets over a large region would work best.
Just imagine your automated units as a "real" military or private sector and suddenly all that dumb and inefficient poo poo makes perfect sense.

And every destroyed mining base just means that you will stimulate your private sector when you rebuild it.

Arghy
Nov 15, 2012

Jesus democracy feels like cheating, 200k in the bank and i'm making a shitton of money with 30 military ships already out. Fast escorts with tractor beams def rock, they can push away bigger stronger ships and hold weak ones while your bigger ships wail on them.

Phlegmish
Jul 2, 2011



I played a Gizurean Democracy last game, I remember at one point during my racial cycle some of my planets had 80% population growth. The only downside was that literally everyone hated me, except the cheerful space lizards for some reason (I forget what they're called).

So, has anyone ever encountered this bug when trying to save:



As I've said before, I think I have a decent computer memory-wise, so I don't know what gives. I was playing a 400 star, 8x8 game so it wasn't a ludicrously big galaxy either. Any ideas on how to solve it? I used the Task Manager to change the game's priority to High and played for a bit without any problems, but I have no idea if it's actually helping.

Goncyn
May 20, 2005
headlight on a northbound train

Phlegmish posted:

So, has anyone ever encountered this bug when trying to save:

If you look in Task Manager, what does it say for "available" under the memory heading? If it's near zero, you are actually running out of memory; if not, there is some other kind of problem. Make sure you have the latest version of the .NET Framework installed.

edit: removed hardware comment under peer pressure; see below

Goncyn fucked around with this message at 20:33 on Jun 30, 2014

Gwyrgyn Blood
Dec 17, 2002

No I'm pretty sure an Out Of Memory Exception is the game making GBS threads itself because it's really badly coded, not a problem with his hardware.

Sorry, not trying to be a jerk, just saying that trying to pass the problem on to his hardware configuration error is pretty ludicrous given that this game is both notoriously badly coded and notorious about throwing OutOfMemoryExceptions. Not to mention I don't think it's even possible for that type of exception to get thrown due to hardware issues like bad RAM, it's definitely a software problem either with the game or something else running.

Gwyrgyn Blood fucked around with this message at 19:08 on Jun 30, 2014

MagnumOpus
Dec 7, 2006

Phlegmish posted:

So, has anyone ever encountered this bug when trying to save:



I've had this happen during autosave when I've left the game on overnight. Very much most likely just your garden variety OOM exception for a game as loosely coded as this one so I wouldn't put your rig under suspicion.

Goncyn
May 20, 2005
headlight on a northbound train
I'm not trying to pass the problem along to his hardware configuration. That stack trace indicates that there wasn't enough memory available to start a new thread. Either the process was out of address space, or the OS was out of memory, or there's a bug in the framework, or a hardware problem caused something weird to happen, in decreasing order of likelihood.

Phlegmish
Jul 2, 2011



I figured maybe it was a virtual memory issue, so I went to take a look at my C: drive and it only had about 15 GB of free space left. So I 1) freed some space on C:, 2) reinstalled the game on my huge secondary drive and 3) increased the virtual memory swap file size and set it to use both drives. I haven't had any memory-related crashes since then, but I don't know what the actual solution was or if it's even been solved for good. It does seem that the problem may have been on my end.

Arghy
Nov 15, 2012

Hey so in my game i just found the way of darkness government type but i'm currently rocking democracy and the blue hot aliens love me because their utopian--is it worth changing to way of darkness and what will that cause? Second theres 3 neutral colonies in systems i own, do i just build troop ships and invade them or is there another way?

I found the world destroyer project and i'm letting another race build most of it but i'm tempted to just scrap it once i finish it because i want to build a massive fleet and roll over the entire galaxy.

Gwyrgyn Blood
Dec 17, 2002

If you go into the Empire Summary screen you can see the exact bonuses of changing to Way of Darkness. You'll also lose some colony development level but it's not real significant from what I recall. And yeah, you'll be the natural enemy to anyone with Way of the Ancients, Democracy, Republic, or Utopian Paradise, you'll specifically go from +12 -> -16 with your Utopian Paradise friends, which is fairly significant. The biases are all listed in governmentBiases.txt (use Notepad++ to read it correctly).

On the other hand, Way of Darkness has no penalties at all and is super good if you're planning on just constantly being at war, low maintinance, basically no war weariness, fast recruitment, fast research, fast growth. As long as you aren't too worried about making a few enemies, it's basically a no-brainer to switch to it.


For Neutral colonies, just send a Colony ship there to colonize it.


1.9.5.5 patch is out: http://steamcommunity.com/games/261470/announcements/detail/1859174592036304889

Nektu
Jul 4, 2007

FUKKEN FUUUUUUCK
Cybernetic Crumb

Gwyrgyn Blood posted:

For Neutral colonies, just send a Colony ship there to colonize it.
Or some troop transports.


Edit: vvvv :shobon:

Every time I play bugs I just recreate starship troopers over and over.

Nektu fucked around with this message at 21:48 on Jul 1, 2014

Gyrotica
Nov 26, 2012

Grafted to machines your builders did not understand.

Nektu posted:

Or some troop transports.

Other races tend to get uppity if you do this, since it's considered 'aggressive'.

Arghy
Nov 15, 2012

Yeah i figure beef up my military some more, a few mutual defense pacts then swap over to way of darkness and then use troop transports to nab those 3 colonies.

Gwyrgyn Blood
Dec 17, 2002

I think the in-game help also says changing governments can cause civil war in some cases, but I haven't seen it myself. Maybe it's based on happiness rating?

MagnumOpus
Dec 7, 2006

Gwyrgyn Blood posted:

I think the in-game help also says changing governments can cause civil war in some cases, but I haven't seen it myself. Maybe it's based on happiness rating?

I've never seen a civil war, but changing governments does cause a hit to colony Culture ratings.

TheCosmicMuffet
Jun 21, 2009

by Shine

MagnumOpus posted:

I've never seen a civil war, but changing governments does cause a hit to colony Culture ratings.

Multiple civil wars can be caused by destroying all the planets of other races in a methodical effort to purify the galaxy.

You can end up staring at half of your empire as if it were a new, foreign power.

It's pretty great.

I don't know about the changing governments thing, though.

MagnumOpus
Dec 7, 2006

Interesting. I've never been on the controlling end of a Planet Destroyer to see that happen.

The modding guide lists a Civil War action that can be triggered with Events but I haven't tested it out yet.

Leif.
Mar 27, 2005

Son of the Defender
Formerly Diplomaticus/SWATJester
Just picked up this game. Is there a good newbie guide out there? Anything I should specifically be aware of in the beginning? I typically like to play 4x's defensively, and expand slowly but make my empire as diplomatically, espionage, and research oriented as possible, until I really get the feel of the game and can take a more aggressive playstyle. Is that viable in this game?

Bloodly
Nov 3, 2008

Not as strong as you'd expect.

TheCosmicMuffet posted:

Multiple civil wars can be caused by destroying all the planets of other races in a methodical effort to purify the galaxy.

You can end up staring at half of your empire as if it were a new, foreign power.

It's pretty great.

I don't know about the changing governments thing, though.

If an empire gets really unhappy, and large, parts will break off if things don't change real quick. This is why changing a government can end up forcing that sort of thing. It happened to me a long time ago in normal Distant Worlds-another faction had changed my government from Paradise to....monarchy or something, all of a sudden half the empire broke off as an independent empire.

Bohemian Nights
Jul 14, 2006

When I wake up,
I look into the mirror
I can see a clearer, vision
I should start living today
Clapping Larry
In one of my games, I had a major power that was always at war with someone over the course of several decades and had a terrible reputation due to planetary bombardments and constant aggression. Eventually, their war weariness and reputation got the better off them, and their 80 worlds or so ended up split three ways, with two new factions emerging, with two new different lead races. It's a neat feature when it happens to other people.

Gwyrgyn Blood
Dec 17, 2002

Leif. posted:

Just picked up this game. Is there a good newbie guide out there? Anything I should specifically be aware of in the beginning? I typically like to play 4x's defensively, and expand slowly but make my empire as diplomatically, espionage, and research oriented as possible, until I really get the feel of the game and can take a more aggressive playstyle. Is that viable in this game?

A good place to start is to make a custom game with these settings:

Custom Game as Standard Empire ->
Galaxy Screen: Expansion = Prewarp, Pirates = Very Few, Pirate Strength = Very Weak, Pirates do not Respawn = yes
Your Empire Screen: Tech Level = Prewarp
Victory Conditions Screen: Disable 'Shadow Story Events'

You'll have a ton of time at the beginning to get a feel on how it works with a pre-warp start.

I'd recommend for starters, go into the Empire Policy screen, set Research, Ship Design, and Taxes to 'Fully Automated', and everything else either to 'Suggest' where possible, or 'Manual' where not. Don't worry about the Research being automated, you can manually override it as you see fit. The first thing you need to build is a Space Port, then a couple of Exploration Ships to go out and explore the system. You'll want to build at least an Energy Research Base too, once you get a chance. Your first goal as a Pre-warp empire is to discover Warp technology (it will be in a site in your starting system), then research it ASAP. Meanwhile, build a Construction ship or two, and start setting up mining stations on sources of key materials.

Key materials to be on the look out for are: Steel, Lead, Iron, Gold, Chromium, Polymer, Carbon Fibre, Silicon, and Hydrogen. These are needed to build basic components for everything, so having a good supply is important. Casion you will need too, for fuel.

If you don't have it, I highly recommend at least using the Das Chrome mod, as it will color Resources by their necessity.
Light Grey = Critical Resources, the ones mentioned above
Dark Grey = Less important Resources, but needed for weapons and higher end engines/shields.
Orange = Luxury Resources, stuff to make your people happy.
Yellow = Bonus Resources, these give your colonies huge bonuses if you have them. Very rare.


As far as playing a defensive + research oriented game, yeah you can do this, just make sure you pick a race and government that's well suited for it! You can't just turtle in your home system of course, but you can definitely do well by avoiding war and expanding and researching. Just be ready in case some of your neighbors decide they don't like you!

PittTheElder
Feb 13, 2012

:geno: Yes, it's like a lava lamp.

Does playing with Age of Shadows off mean you never have The Ancients and Shakturi in your game? I was surprised when I didn't see them at all.

Demiurge4
Aug 10, 2011

PittTheElder posted:

Does playing with Age of Shadows off mean you never have The Ancients and Shakturi in your game? I was surprised when I didn't see them at all.

That storyline is tied with Return of the Shakturi which came with the first expansion I believe. The Age of Shadows is just the storyline that goes with starting pre-warp. Like having to find hyperdrive tech in some ruins in your home system.

Kilroy
Oct 1, 2000

Gwyrgyn Blood posted:

I'd recommend for starters, go into the Empire Policy screen, set Research, Ship Design, and Taxes to 'Fully Automated'
Just to add, if you're going to do this, to also change the default tax policy as well. I go with <200k=none, 200K-2M=none, >2M=low to start. The default seems to be high, for the highest tier.

Keeping taxes low early on is essential, as it can mean the difference between a population of 4 billion, and one of 8 billion, after a decade or so. Naturally the larger your population, the larger your economy and tax base.

PittTheElder
Feb 13, 2012

:geno: Yes, it's like a lava lamp.

Demiurge4 posted:

That storyline is tied with Return of the Shakturi which came with the first expansion I believe. The Age of Shadows is just the storyline that goes with starting pre-warp. Like having to find hyperdrive tech in some ruins in your home system.

Hmm, that seemed to happen even with Shadows off. The only think I noticed was different was that no pirates jumped on top of my home world in the first few moments.

Kilroy posted:

Just to add, if you're going to do this, to also change the default tax policy as well. I go with <200k=none, 200K-2M=none, >2M=low to start. The default seems to be high, for the highest tier.

Keeping taxes low early on is essential, as it can mean the difference between a population of 4 billion, and one of 8 billion, after a decade or so. Naturally the larger your population, the larger your economy and tax base.

Seconding this. I've only had one successful game so far, but that one was the one where I actually committed to keeping taxes as low as possible, and boy did it ever pay off.

MagnumOpus
Dec 7, 2006

PittTheElder posted:

Does playing with Age of Shadows off mean you never have The Ancients and Shakturi in your game? I was surprised when I didn't see them at all.

To play without The Ancients and Shakturi you want to select "Custom Game", and on the last setup page before launching the game you want to un-check "Enable Return of the Shakturi story events and victory conditions".

PittTheElder
Feb 13, 2012

:geno: Yes, it's like a lava lamp.

MagnumOpus posted:

To play without The Ancients and Shakturi you want to select "Custom Game", and on the last setup page before launching the game you want to un-check "Enable Return of the Shakturi story events and victory conditions".

Fair enough. I was just surprised they didn't show up in my game where I'm pretty sure I did have that checked. I guess sometimes not all the story line stuff fires, which is really not a bad idea.

Stevefin
Sep 30, 2013

Gwyrgyn Blood posted:


If you don't have it, I highly recommend at least using the Das Chrome mod, as it will color Resources by their necessity.
Light Grey = Critical Resources, the ones mentioned above
Dark Grey = Less important Resources, but needed for weapons and higher end engines/shields.
Orange = Luxury Resources, stuff to make your people happy.
Yellow = Bonus Resources, these give your colonies huge bonuses if you have them. Very rare.


I would pick that mode if it was not for those two factors, I looked at the mod example between colours and I could not tell the difference in the two greys

MagnumOpus
Dec 7, 2006

PittTheElder posted:

Fair enough. I was just surprised they didn't show up in my game where I'm pretty sure I did have that checked. I guess sometimes not all the story line stuff fires, which is really not a bad idea.

The events are triggered by research levels so if you didn't get far enough into the tech tress you wouldn't have seen them.

It's also possible that (storyline spoilers) they were there and you didn't even know it because they first show up as the Etrukah Refugees before revealing their true nature.

Gwyrgyn Blood
Dec 17, 2002

Stevefin posted:

I would pick that mode if it was not for those two factors, I looked at the mod example between colours and I could not tell the difference in the two greys

Not sure what example screenshot you looked at but they are very different shades of grey in the game. It's very easy to tell the difference between the two.



The ones on the right side are the different colors for resources.

Leif.
Mar 27, 2005

Son of the Defender
Formerly Diplomaticus/SWATJester
Ended up going on a custom game, with all the DLC/expansions enabled because why not. Bought info from the first pirates I met, which led me to a system with the Silver Mist. I got the gently caress out but I feel like I probably just unleashed some poo poo I shouldn't have. Should I be super worried about that? Second bit of info I bought from the pirates put me in connection with the Ancients. What can I do with them? I want their government form, but they won't trade or negotiate with me or anything, and they're too far away for my current tech level to actually reach. They like me though because I'm a Securan Utopia.

Gwyrgyn Blood
Dec 17, 2002

Kilroy posted:

Just to add, if you're going to do this, to also change the default tax policy as well. I go with <200k=none, 200K-2M=none, >2M=low to start. The default seems to be high, for the highest tier.

Keeping taxes low early on is essential, as it can mean the difference between a population of 4 billion, and one of 8 billion, after a decade or so. Naturally the larger your population, the larger your economy and tax base.

Yeah I forgot to mention this, even after the patch change the happiness rating really effects population growth significantly.

For example with a starter Human planet:

2466M population starting
0% Taxes = +20 Happiness = 14% Growth = 2802M Population after 1 year
25% Taxes = +3 Happiness = 3% Growth = 2553M Population after 1 year

You can take a guess as to the effect of this over a long period of time.


It's not exactly a linear effect though, one planet I have, for example:

0% Taxes = +51 Happiness = 15% Growth
5% Taxes = +47 Happiness = 13% Growth
10% Taxes = +43 Happiness = 11% Growth
15% Taxes = +39 Happiness = 10% Growth
20% Taxes = +35 Happiness = 6% Growth
25% Taxes = +30 Happiness = 4% Growth
50% Taxes = +7 Happiness = 3% Growth
60% Taxes = -2 Happiness = 3% Growth

So there's a very obvious sharp bump there once you get to 15% or below. I'm not clear if that's entirely based around the Tax Rate or if the Happiness factors in as well, amplifying the effect of low taxes. Either way, low taxes = big population growth. If a planet is full, tax those bastards.

TheCosmicMuffet
Jun 21, 2009

by Shine

MagnumOpus posted:

To play without The Ancients and Shakturi you want to select "Custom Game", and on the last setup page before launching the game you want to un-check "Enable Return of the Shakturi story events and victory conditions".

Listen man. Can I just...

Can I just point out that you loving, like, right there, spoilered 'ancients and shakturi', and then went on to describe an option that said 'enable return of shakturi story events and victory conditions'?

Seriously, if I had a wish, I'd wish that the concept of 'spoilering' were relegated to the graveyard of time. What cool thing has anyone ever enjoyed that got 'worse' because you knew what happened? The span of human history is riddled with stories and characters whose arc is already known; it's the performance or the instance that's the interesting part!

I don't know. Distant worlds just seems to be a microcosm of this phenomenon. It's *never* that there's a story event. It's that it's a rich galaxy full of weird interactions and cool mysteries that comes under this classic matchup of ancient races who're stoking a latent hostility.

The idea that some race would approach me and bequeath a powerful fleet of superships to repel galactic invaders isn't a spoiler--it seems like a bullet-point.

Dirk the Average
Feb 7, 2012

"This may have been a mistake."

Gwyrgyn Blood posted:

Yeah I forgot to mention this, even after the patch change the happiness rating really effects population growth significantly.

For example with a starter Human planet:

2466M population starting
0% Taxes = +20 Happiness = 14% Growth = 2802M Population after 1 year
25% Taxes = +3 Happiness = 3% Growth = 2553M Population after 1 year

You can take a guess as to the effect of this over a long period of time.


It's not exactly a linear effect though, one planet I have, for example:

0% Taxes = +51 Happiness = 15% Growth
5% Taxes = +47 Happiness = 13% Growth
10% Taxes = +43 Happiness = 11% Growth
15% Taxes = +39 Happiness = 10% Growth
20% Taxes = +35 Happiness = 6% Growth
25% Taxes = +30 Happiness = 4% Growth
50% Taxes = +7 Happiness = 3% Growth
60% Taxes = -2 Happiness = 3% Growth

So there's a very obvious sharp bump there once you get to 15% or below. I'm not clear if that's entirely based around the Tax Rate or if the Happiness factors in as well, amplifying the effect of low taxes. Either way, low taxes = big population growth. If a planet is full, tax those bastards.

Is there some sort of mod or automated setting that will handle this crap for me? I really don't fancy having to go through every planet to check if they're maxed out so that I can turn on taxes.

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PittTheElder
Feb 13, 2012

:geno: Yes, it's like a lava lamp.

MagnumOpus posted:

The events are triggered by research levels so if you didn't get far enough into the tech tress you wouldn't have seen them.

It's also possible that (storyline spoilers) they were there and you didn't even know it because they first show up as the Etrukah Refugees before revealing their true nature.

Well I've played through a game and saw all the discovered briefings on the topic, and also have been reading Grey Hunter's fantastic A Thousand Years of Misrule Let's Play (which anybody who's learning this game should read, if only for the hilarity of how badly he's getting worked), so I know all about the 'secret' identity of the Etrukah. But my one game lacked both The Ancient Guardians and the Etrukah. I guess it's possible they just hadn't shown up yet, but I was pretty far down the tech tree, I was rolling Titan Beams and size 600 ships and the final tier hyper drive. I'm guessing that I would have found at least the Ancient Guardians, since I had the whole galaxy explored. But no matter, I'm in a new game now, and Utopia is just next door, so this should be a fun ride.

Dirk the Average posted:

Is there some sort of mod or automated setting that will handle this crap for me? I really don't fancy having to go through every planet to check if they're maxed out so that I can turn on taxes.

You should be able to set it all from a glance from the colony overview screen. You can micromanage your first planet, because it'll be the only one you have, and mine maxed out in pop as I was just settling my third colony. I basically just leave every other colony at zero, and raise my max pop capital tax rate as necessary. Once other worlds start cracking into very high population numbers, I can raise taxes there if needed.

PittTheElder fucked around with this message at 07:01 on Jul 3, 2014

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