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Does activating the Chain Veil before any Planeswalker loyalty abilities have been used work? It seems like it should, since the phrasing seems to create a 'special' activation that remains active on them, that would still let you use a normal one. So you could either do: Elspeth +1 Chain Veil Elspeth +1 or Chain Veil Elspeth +1 Elspeth +1 however, it seems like multiple chain activations would not stack with each other before clearing out the effect by 'using' the special activation, which would necessarily be the second activation of the planeswalker. So you could get some feelbads from doing some Ral-zarek untapping/chain veiling before using up the other planeswalker special activations.
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Jul 2, 2014 16:26
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Elspeth +1: 6-7 Chain Veil Elspeth -7 Seems pretty awful.
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Jul 2, 2014 16:30
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Devor posted:Does activating the Chain Veil before any Planeswalker loyalty abilities have been used work? It seems like it should, since the phrasing seems to create a 'special' activation that remains active on them, that would still let you use a normal one. "For each planeswalker you control, you may activate one of its loyalty abilities once this turn as though none of its loyalty abilities had been activated this turn." I think for each planeswalker it's creating a special activation you get to use once, at any point during the turn. So I think you have to use your "regular" activation before you use the special one, but you can use both after activating the Veil; you don't have to have used one before you use its ability.
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Jul 2, 2014 16:39
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Entropic posted:Tokens are functionally a super type already, I'm not sure what the point of making it official would be. Wouldn't it mean rewording every token-making card ever to say "token creature" instead of "creature token"? And for what? Token artifact.
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Jul 2, 2014 16:54
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jscolon2.0 posted:Token artifact. 
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Jul 2, 2014 17:01
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Veyrall posted:To wit How is this different from token creatures and how does writing token on it in the supertype spot actually change anything other than being a bit of reminder text?
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Jul 2, 2014 17:10
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neetengie posted:Chalice only counters stuff that gets cast, not copies, Ascension is not casting a spell, just placing a copy, and 1R is still 1R, even though Electromancer reduced the cost for you, the CMC is still 1R. Yo, CMC is never color-distinguished. The CMC of pyretic ritual would be 2.
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Jul 2, 2014 17:12
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Veyrall posted:To wit Man I just want to play with the Kaboomist but it just feels so bad. 
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Jul 2, 2014 17:21
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Entropic posted:How is this different from token creatures and how does writing token on it in the supertype spot actually change anything other than being a bit of reminder text? Im not sure I get you. It's different from a token creature because it's an artifact and not a creature. Token on there does appear to just be a bit of reminder text, though.
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Jul 2, 2014 17:21
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Can you get double uses out of your land mines with the new red legendary?
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Jul 2, 2014 17:23
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Vomax posted:Can you get double uses out of your land mines with the new red legendary?
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Jul 2, 2014 17:23
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LightReaper posted:Negative, as the sacrifice is part of the cost. The new red legendary guy, who can copy artifact activated abilities, can absolutely copy the land mine's activation. And it seems like labeling them Token is to help the kitchen table crowd realize that these aren't spells.
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Jul 2, 2014 17:26
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LightReaper posted:Negative, as the sacrifice is part of the cost. You (generally) don't pay the cost of copied spells or abilities. Otherwise storm would never work :P There is probably some exception but I don't know of it.
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Jul 2, 2014 17:41
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LightReaper posted:Negative, as the sacrifice is part of the cost. Yes, you can. Once you successfully place the mine ability on the stack, the triggered ability of the Oggre will go ahead and kick off. You do not need to pay costs again for a copied spell, and so you do not need to sacrifice the mine again. You are likely thinking about how you cannot copy a permanent if it has been scarified as part of a cost, which is correct, but in this case you are not copying the mine itself, you are copying the ability on the stack. It is also not being cast, it is simply placed on the stack.
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Jul 2, 2014 17:50
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 Pretty sure this is Pulse Tracker sliver.
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Jul 2, 2014 18:05
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Bugsy posted:
"Whenever a Sliver you control attacks, defending player loses 1 life."
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Jul 2, 2014 18:06
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Count Bleck posted:Man I just want to play with the Kaboomist but it just feels so bad. fwiw I think if you're red in Limited anyway you play that guy.
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Jul 2, 2014 18:09
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ScarletBrother posted:"Whenever a Sliver you control attacks, defending player loses 1 life." How sane. It should have been "Slivers you control have "Whenever a Sliver you control attacks, defending player loses 1 life."", to just be completely nuts. 
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Jul 2, 2014 18:16
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The Chain Veil with Nissa and Ral Zarek goes infinite, taps all your opponents' permanents, and then gives you an army of 4/4 tramplers and an extra turn to use them. I'd absolutely love to see janky-as-hell RUG Superfriends do work in Standard.Elyv posted:fwiw I think if you're red in Limited anyway you play that guy. I agree, I think the deciding factor is that you get at least 1 land mine even if you lose the first flip.
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Jul 2, 2014 18:17
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I like how spanish slivers are framentados
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Jul 2, 2014 18:19
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AATREK CURES KIDS posted:The Chain Veil with Nissa and Ral Zarek goes infinite, taps all your opponents' permanents, and then gives you an army of 4/4 tramplers and an extra turn to use them. I'd absolutely love to see janky-as-hell RUG Superfriends do work in Standard. Hey, you have a 1/32 chance of not getting any extra turns, assuming you don't run extra untap permanent effects aside from the single copy of Ral Zarek in play.
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Jul 2, 2014 18:28
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AATREK CURES KIDS posted:The Chain Veil with Nissa and Ral Zarek goes infinite, taps all your opponents' permanents, and then gives you an army of 4/4 tramplers and an extra turn to use them. I'd absolutely love to see janky-as-hell RUG Superfriends do work in Standard. They haven't put out the release notes yet, but Riki Hayashi seems pretty sure that its doesn't go infinite. https://twitter.com/mtgRikipedia/status/484208247210274816 What is infinite, is Sage of Hours + Ajani Mentor of Heros + Chain Veil.
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Jul 2, 2014 18:32
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so they basically were bullshitting us when they said they were going back to the traditional sliver look then
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Jul 2, 2014 18:48
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A big flaming stink posted:so they basically were bullshitting us when they said they were going back to the traditional sliver look then They said they were going to do both or some other kind of bullshit half measure.
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Jul 2, 2014 18:52
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Serperoth posted:How sane. It should have been "Slivers you control have "Whenever a Sliver you control attacks, defending player loses 1 life."", to just be completely nuts. Is this the first sliver that doesn't actually grant its ability to other slivers?
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Jul 2, 2014 18:56
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jassi007 posted:Is this the first sliver that doesn't actually grant its ability to other slivers? Nope. Brood Sliver is the first one alphabetically to not do that.
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Jul 2, 2014 18:58
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LordSaturn posted:Nope. Brood Sliver is the first one alphabetically to not do that. Cool. I'm not slivers guy, they're neat but I don't go gaga for them. Saprolings on the other hand, oh yeah baby fungus...
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Jul 2, 2014 18:59
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A big flaming stink posted:so they basically were bullshitting us when they said they were going back to the traditional sliver look then Pretty that was just extrapolation people made with the sliver hive art.
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Jul 2, 2014 19:01
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Zoness posted:Pretty that was just extrapolation people made with the sliver hive art. No, Maro I think said it.
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Jul 2, 2014 19:04
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AATREK CURES KIDS posted:I agree, I think the deciding factor is that you get at least 1 land mine even if you lose the first flip. Yeah, I think if it only gets you one it's overcosted but not egregiously so, and if it gets you two you're happy with it, and anything extra is gravy. (Also the expected number of Land mines is basically two per Kaboomist(it would be actually 2 but there are a finite number of turns in a Magic game; it's close enough that it doesn't matter, though))
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Jul 2, 2014 19:06
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Doug Beyer said that they were going to 'compromise', essentially:quote:Based on player feedback, we generally pulled back from the M14 look and aimed the M15 slivers less humanoid and more bestial. But there’s individual variation. Some look entirely retro, as on M15’s Sliver Hive. Some are more humanoid, using the ”rearrangeable plates” concept from M14’s design. Some split the difference, lying somewhere between the M14 look and the old look, carving out some new space. You’ll see what I’m talking about when more of M15 has been previewed. But overall M15 represents a visual shift away from the look of M14’s slivers.
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Jul 2, 2014 19:06
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Goddammit, the new site's archive is garbage.
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Jul 2, 2014 19:21
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That, plus the rest of it.
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Jul 2, 2014 19:22
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Here's the sliver mention in Making Magic. Thanks to google.quote:So when the Slivers returned in Magic 2014 without a five-color Sliver, a lot of players wrote in asking where it was. In addition, R&D wanted to make sure the Sliver-lovers got a few new Slivers to add to their existing Sliver decks, so the Magic 2015 design team included an uncommon cycle plus a new five-color Sliver that Gavin Verhey will be previewing tomorrow. http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/days-core-part-2-2014-06-30
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Jul 2, 2014 19:24
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Entropic posted:Tokens are functionally a super type already, I'm not sure what the point of making it official would be. Wouldn't it mean rewording every token-making card ever to say "token creature" instead of "creature token"? And for what? I think it's more a for-clarity's-sake change, riding the heels of Pack Rat. I've seen so many arguments about Pack Rat because it's both a token and a copy (usually stupid ones).
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Jul 2, 2014 19:35
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Chain Veil + Ral Zarek + Xenagos, the Reveler w/4 creatures out = infinite Planeswalker activations? Yeah I know it's a pretty lovely combo but at least with RZ's ultimate you can basically take infinite turns.
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Jul 2, 2014 19:38
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qbert posted:Chain Veil + Ral Zarek + Xenagos, the Reveler w/4 creatures out = infinite Planeswalker activations?
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Jul 2, 2014 19:43
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Snacksmaniac posted:That, plus the rest of it. I'm still baffled by the changes. Sure, the old site hadn't been updated in a long time but it wasn't like I looked at it and wondered how I stumbled onto a geocities page. I'm glad they went with 8am pacific over midnight pacific time for updates but I'd still rather have midnight eastern because I want my spoiler fix as early as possible. But everything else is the hottest garbage.
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Jul 2, 2014 19:45
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It's probably not an infinite combo but three PW activations per turn is pretty good.
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Jul 2, 2014 19:47
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qbert posted:Chain Veil + Ral Zarek + Xenagos, the Reveler w/4 creatures out = infinite Planeswalker activations? I wouldn't call tapping down my opponents entire field then dropping an additional Satyr and swinging all in a completely lovely combo.
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Jul 2, 2014 19:48
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