I still really like the Transformers movies

The Something Awful Forums > The Finer Arts > Cinema Discusso > I still really like the Transformers movies

Marshal Radisic: Oct 9, 2012

Milky Moor posted:

Yeah, she's interesting because you can just see her fitting in as Lockdown's lieutenant or something or a representative of the Creators as part of the story. It's also important to note that, according to the artist, they were thinking of including her at some point - hence all the other versions of her face, I guess - and then didn't. Too many evil robots? Maybe, but it's something to think about that Hasbro has not only suddenly found out that the fans want more female-gendered Transformers and that it's odd that the cynical marketing part of the film didn't just leap on that. So, they don't include any female Transformers but, over the course of the series, the robots have gone from 'they have male voices' to exhibiting male characteristics like facial hair. Robot gender isn't remaining nebulous, it's becoming more and more pronounced.

Which is odd.

It's getting to the stage where I think it's fairly clear that except for Arcee (who has exactly two lines in ROTF and maybe twenty seconds total of screen time) and the Isabel Lucas robot that the films are deliberately excluding female action heroes. And, to me, that's interesting because if the Transformer films really were a cynical 'built by boardroom' merchandising film series, you'd surely see some female characters to try and cash-in on that part of the market, especially when you can tell that the creative team is looking at recent TF media for inspiration. The Autobots Reunite track is very reminiscent of the main theme from the Transformers: Prime series and Hound is, basically, a character from that series named Bulkhead. Given that films are always decried as misogynistic, it's odd that no one has gone 'Let's take the easy way out and show that we're not with a kick-butt female hero' because that is what so many other blockbusters do.

I just find it strange.

Well, thanks to Terry's analysis and my own viewing of Pain & Gain, I've started to see Michael Bay as a filmmaker who's very interested in masculinity and how it is defined and broadcasted in modern American culture. Looking at all these movies, I'm starting to see the typical Michael Bay character as a man who intensely insecure in his masculinity, often believing he has abilities that society is not recognizing. (I can't say if this is a privileged "society owes me!" thing or as example of victimization by an indifferent society.) However, to solve this problem, the man tries to solve his problem by changing his branding, by projecting an image of himself as the man he wants to be (and to be seen as) in the hope that if he changes the package, he'll change the man inside. Needless to say, this never works, and only results in pain and misery for all.

Most everyone in these Transformers movies seem to follow this basic archetype, as did most everyone in Pain & Gain. However there was one exception in the latter movie: Ed Harris' detective character. He had the image of a man who "made it", but wasn't concerned with maintaining his image. He defined himself through his abilities as a detective and as man who loved his wife. In fact, it's a sign of how unnarcissistic his character was that he was willing to give up his great passion to please his wife, his other passion. I think the closest the Transformers movies come to his character are Malkovich's CEO and Megatron before his murder.

So with this interpretation, you could see why female transformers would be downplayed. The transformers are being built up as personifications of the unchecked ravenous American male id, so adding female ones would change all that symbolism completely. That being said, the forces acting on men are acting just as much on women, and there's probably parallels to be found for these sorts of masculine behaviors in women. Bay did experiment a bit with this with his female characters in Pain & Gain, but if I had to hazard a guess, I would think he recognized that it would be a long time, if ever, that he could create a version of Arcee as grotesque as Optimus Prime and have the audience accept it.

# ? Jul 13, 2014 19:53

Adbot: ADBOT LOVES YOU

# ? May 9, 2024 21:43

HUNDU THE BEAST GOD: Sep 14, 2007; everything is yours

Lord Krangdar posted:

What's a series where you actually could come in on the fourth consecutive film (like, not including reboots or whatever) and reasonably expect to understand the bulk of what's going on?

Not that there aren't any, I just can't think of any right now.

Land Of The Dead.

# ? Jul 13, 2014 21:06

Lord Krangdar: Oct 24, 2007; These are the secrets of death we teach.

The stories of those Dead films are not consecutive, though, right?

Marshal Radisic posted:

Well, thanks to Terry's analysis and my own viewing of Pain & Gain, I've started to see Michael Bay as a filmmaker who's very interested in masculinity and how it is defined and broadcasted in modern American culture. Looking at all these movies, I'm starting to see the typical Michael Bay character as a man who intensely insecure in his masculinity, often believing he has abilities that society is not recognizing. (I can't say if this is a privileged "society owes me!" thing or as example of victimization by an indifferent society.) However, to solve this problem, the man tries to solve his problem by changing his branding, by projecting an image of himself as the man he wants to be (and to be seen as) in the hope that if he changes the package, he'll change the man inside. Needless to say, this never works, and only results in pain and misery for all.

Most everyone in these Transformers movies seem to follow this basic archetype, as did most everyone in Pain & Gain. However there was one exception in the latter movie: Ed Harris' detective character. He had the image of a man who "made it", but wasn't concerned with maintaining his image. He defined himself through his abilities as a detective and as man who loved his wife. In fact, it's a sign of how unnarcissistic his character was that he was willing to give up his great passion to please his wife, his other passion. I think the closest the Transformers movies come to his character are Malkovich's CEO and Megatron before his murder.

So with this interpretation, you could see why female transformers would be downplayed. The transformers are being built up as personifications of the unchecked ravenous American male id, so adding female ones would change all that symbolism completely. That being said, the forces acting on men are acting just as much on women, and there's probably parallels to be found for these sorts of masculine behaviors in women. Bay did experiment a bit with this with his female characters in Pain & Gain, but if I had to hazard a guess, I would think he recognized that it would be a long time, if ever, that he could create a version of Arcee as grotesque as Optimus Prime and have the audience accept it.

Some good insights here.

In the first film Mikaela Banes isn't too far off from a woman character fitting the first pattern you describe there, and Maggie Madsen is sorta the opposite (though neither is fully explored, as the masculinity themes still dominate all five films). To quote from earlier in the thread (emphasis mine):

SuperMechagodzilla posted:

There's some important tension between form and content to factor in, I think.

The form of Bernie Mac's scenes in part 1 is 'just goofy comedy', but the presentation is unsettling. Like, just the basic image of Bolivia's cousin(?) going blind from the clown makeup melting into his eyes. It's awful.

This comes into play later, in the gratuitous scene where Bumblebee upgrades himself. Mikaela asks, paraphrased, 'if Bee can look like anything, why'd he choose to look like a piece of crap?' The obvious counterpoint is that people like Bobby Bolivia have no choice. Then, think of who's saying this; Mikaela's a car thief, from a broken home, who puts a ton of effort into her outwards appearance - in an unspoken effort to secure an upper-class boyfriend. The idea that Bee would look 'trashy' on purpose is bizarre to her. She's pressured to fit in and 'marry up.'

This is the context in which the twins 'try to look badass', and in which Megatron adopts his Mad Max truck form. It's all appearance, but one is clearly more authentic.

Lord Krangdar fucked around with this message at 21:46 on Jul 13, 2014

# ? Jul 13, 2014 21:30

vseslav.botkin: Feb 18, 2007; Professor

Michael Bay on Armageddon:

Michael Bay posted:

It's supposed to be a joke. It's about making fun of the system.

Oh my god.

# ? Jul 13, 2014 21:37

HUNDU THE BEAST GOD: Sep 14, 2007; everything is yours

Lord Krangdar posted:

The stories of those Dead films are not consecutive, though, right?

Yeah, they share none of the same characters. Probably what I like about them is that there is no chronology or continuity at all.

# ? Jul 13, 2014 21:40

Gatts: Jan 2, 2001; Goodnight Moon; Nap Ghost

Is Michael Bay carrying the spirit of Verhoven? Is Transformers akin to Robot op or Starship Troopers as misunderstood initially at large only to be appreciated later?

He needs to direct Arnold. I can't imagine the carnage and themes explored.

# ? Jul 13, 2014 23:22

Tuxedo Catfish: Mar 17, 2007; You've got guts! Come to my village, I'll buy you lunch.

I think Bay has a much more ambivalent relationship to his subject matter than Verhoeven does. Starship Troopers is a film relentlessly mocking fascism because Verhoeven hates fascism with all his heart and humor is the most effective and disarming weapon he could use against it.

Bay's more like Zack Snyder, or Hideaki Anno -- he recognizes flaws in something he loves and is willing to explore those flaws even if the results are kind of damning. But he's not willing to back down from enjoying it. That's why all of those directors' work so often seems contradictory, or even hypocritical. It's about self-aware entanglement, not ironic distance.

# ? Jul 13, 2014 23:37

Tuxedo Catfish: Mar 17, 2007; You've got guts! Come to my village, I'll buy you lunch.

I haven't seen Pain and Gain yet but The Rock is a perfect example of this. It's about Nicholas Cage transforming from a nerdy chemist into a literal action hero, which is presented as good and correct and saves his life and that of thousands of people, but at the same time his role model is a bitter old man who destroyed his own family and spent most of his life in prison -- played by an actor who famously portrayed James Bond. And then the villains are former Marines led by a frustrated, impotent father figure.

There are two ways to look at this -- the charitable one, where you might say that it's about threading the eye of the needle and finding a form of masculinity that's righteous and protective and all the other good traits associated with maleness without the bad ones just as openly on display, or the uncharitable one where you argue that the movie just wants to revel in explosions and one-liners and killing bad people because they're bad while somehow absolving itself of the toxicity it knows is present in that narrative.

(To be clear, in the case of The Rock I'd definitely say it's the former. Transformers is harder to parse, though.)

Tuxedo Catfish fucked around with this message at 00:06 on Jul 14, 2014

# ? Jul 13, 2014 23:55

Assepoester: Jul 18, 2004; Can't post for 10 years!; Melman v2

JediTalentAgent posted:

Maybe the Autobots are 'modern' good guys.

Brutal, bitter, self-centered, hypocritical, insulting and trash-talking. They're our modern video game heroes. The only thing missing is likely Bumblebee 'beebagging' a fallen enemy.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6XXa-ONFxNY

Close enough?

# ? Jul 14, 2014 00:03

Happy Noodle Boy: Jul 3, 2002

Regardless of your opinion of Bay, The Rock has one of the better written/directed openings of any movie. In 3 minutes bay introduces the villains and tells you exactly why he's doing what he's going to do while the credits are still rolling and in 3 more minutes it introduces the threat and how deadly it is.

# ? Jul 14, 2014 00:42

Lord Krangdar: Oct 24, 2007; These are the secrets of death we teach.

Tuxedo Catfish posted:

I think Bay has a much more ambivalent relationship to his subject matter than Verhoeven does. Starship Troopers is a film relentlessly mocking fascism because Verhoeven hates fascism with all his heart and humor is the most effective and disarming weapon he could use against it.

Bay's more like Zack Snyder, or Hideaki Anno -- he recognizes flaws in something he loves and is willing to explore those flaws even if the results are kind of damning. But he's not willing to back down from enjoying it. That's why all of those directors' work so often seems contradictory, or even hypocritical. It's about self-aware entanglement, not ironic distance.

I don't really disagree with what you're saying, but I still want to note the difference betwen loving watching or filming something as fiction and just straight-up loving it. Like David Lynch loves making films about "women in trouble", doesn't mean he's actually pro- women in trouble, right?

I'd like to think we all understand that difference, but then you get Film Critic Hulk writing a recent article unironically calling Bay a sociopath because of what he depicts in his movies.

:ughh:

But yeah, the way I see these films is not far off from Starship Troopers as satire, yet Bay himself is not really comparable to Verhoeven. Verhoeven approached Starship Troopers as a satire all along and will say so outright, there's really no ambiguity there.

Lord Krangdar fucked around with this message at 00:53 on Jul 14, 2014

# ? Jul 14, 2014 00:45

Arquinsiel: Jun 1, 2006; "There is no such thing as society. There are individual men and women, and there are families. And no government can do anything except through people, and people must look to themselves first."

God Bless Margaret Thatcher
God Bless England
RIP My Iron Lady

Neurolimal posted:

I actually skipped the first 30 or so pages of the thread because I wanted to talk about my experience watching Transformers 4. Sorry if this really bothers you, I'm sure she put plenty of effort into it and is probably an engaging read for people who enjoy that interpretation. Maybe if I had actually enjoyed this film I'd even go read it myself, but I didn't, so I wont.
So long as it is not the "wrong" perspective.

"I am posting in a thread about a person's opinion on a franchise and do not want to read that thread. Here is why that opinion is wrong".

Great move there buddy.

Lord Krangdar posted:

But yeah, the way I see these films is not far off from Starship Troopers as satire, yet Bay himself is not really comparable to Verhoeven. Verhoeven approached Starship Troopers as a satire all along and will say so outright, there's really no ambiguity there.

To be fair to the source material there, it'd be hard not to approach it as a satire given how Heinlein's body of work is pretty much him taking an idea and mocking it.

# ? Jul 14, 2014 02:39

DoctorWhat: Nov 18, 2011; A little privacy, please?

Arquinsiel posted:

"I am posting in a thread about a person's opinion on a franchise and do not want to read that thread. Here is why that opinion is wrong".

Great move there buddy.
To be fair to the source material there, it'd be hard not to approach it as a satire given how Heinlein's body of work is pretty much him taking an idea and mocking it.

Starship Troopers is not the source material for Starship Troopers.

# ? Jul 14, 2014 02:41

Lord Krangdar: Oct 24, 2007; These are the secrets of death we teach.

According to Wikipedia Verhoeven never even read the full novel. And yeah, his film was mostly just named after the book after the script had already been written.

# ? Jul 14, 2014 02:43

Tuxedo Catfish: Mar 17, 2007; You've got guts! Come to my village, I'll buy you lunch.

Also the book isn't a satire of anything; according to Heinlein's own statements he wrote the book to defend his political views and drum up support for the United States' nuclear weapons testing program.

# ? Jul 14, 2014 02:45

Arquinsiel: Jun 1, 2006; "There is no such thing as society. There are individual men and women, and there are families. And no government can do anything except through people, and people must look to themselves first."

God Bless Margaret Thatcher
God Bless England
RIP My Iron Lady

^^^^
Have you a link to that? I've never come across it before and would be interested to see what he says about it.

DoctorWhat posted:

Starship Troopers is not the source material for Starship Troopers.

I dunno, the book is like the movie turned up to eleven in places. There are shades of 1984 hinted at in how the Human/Bug/Skinny relationships shift depending on what the situation on the frontline is. I've seen a thread on classic sci-fi discussion promised in the 40k threads when this comes up, but it never happens. I don't know if it's a derail appropriate for this thread or not though, given how it's a work which provokes pretty much the same level of differing opinion as the Transformers movies do.

# ? Jul 14, 2014 02:50

Bugblatter: Aug 4, 2003

According to Ed Neumeier, he started writing Starship Troopers as an entirely new franchise that was to be just a dumb summer movie, in contrast to the satyrical RoboCop, but partway through a friend told him his premise was similar to a novel and he might be wary of copyright issues.

So Ed Neumeier purchased rights to ST for a fairly low price just to cover his rear end, and started skimming through to lift names here and there. Along the way he realized, "my god the politics of this story are atrocious. I have to destroy this." And thus, he reworked his screenplay into the film we have today.

And yeah, neither he or Verhoeven read the entire novel. However, their opinion of what they did read was quit low.

# ? Jul 14, 2014 03:42

henpod: Mar 7, 2008; Sir, we have located the Bioweapon.; College Slice

Is there a thread for talking about this dumb movie and the robots fighting, or is this the only one where we discuss Bay's intentions when that guy was under the enemy's scrotum in the second movie.

# ? Jul 14, 2014 16:28

Sprecherscrow: Dec 20, 2009

henpod posted:

Is there a thread for talking about this dumb movie and the robots fighting, or is this the only one where we discuss Bay's intentions when that guy was under the enemy's scrotum in the second movie.

This thread was about Terry finishing her write up of the first three movies, so the latter I guess.

# ? Jul 14, 2014 16:33

Tuxedo Catfish: Mar 17, 2007; You've got guts! Come to my village, I'll buy you lunch.

Arquinsiel posted:

^^^^
Have you a link to that? I've never come across it before and would be interested to see what he says about it.

Should be in one of the essays in The New Worlds of Robert Heinlein: Expanded Universe.

# ? Jul 14, 2014 16:37

Arquinsiel: Jun 1, 2006; "There is no such thing as society. There are individual men and women, and there are families. And no government can do anything except through people, and people must look to themselves first."

God Bless Margaret Thatcher
God Bless England
RIP My Iron Lady

Tuxedo Catfish posted:

Should be in one of the essays in The New Worlds of Robert Heinlein: Expanded Universe.

Thanks. I'll stick it into the next Amazon order.

# ? Jul 14, 2014 16:39

The MSJ: May 17, 2010

henpod posted:

Is there a thread for talking about this dumb movie and the robots fighting, or is this the only one where we discuss Bay's intentions when that guy was under the enemy's scrotum in the second movie.

This is the only Transformers thread active in CD, the only other one is the BSS Transformers thread and maybe another one but it's in GBS (I haven't checked).

# ? Jul 15, 2014 01:51

Deep State of Mind: Jul 30, 2006; "It was a busy day. I do not remember it all. In the morning, I thought I had lost my wallet. Then we went swimming and either overthrew a government or started a pro-American radio station. I can't really remember."; Fun Shoe

The movies are definitely having an impact on the new market

Qingdao hoarder spends [$32,000] on Transformers collection

# ? Jul 17, 2014 03:03

The Baumann: Jun 2, 2013; En Garde, Fuckboy

Bloodnose posted:

The movies are definitely having an impact on the new market

Dudes been working on this for more than a decade, I don't know if the movies had anything to do with it. It probably will has some effect on new people starting collections though.

# ? Jul 17, 2014 03:27

Deep State of Mind: Jul 30, 2006; "It was a busy day. I do not remember it all. In the morning, I thought I had lost my wallet. Then we went swimming and either overthrew a government or started a pro-American radio station. I can't really remember."; Fun Shoe

Huh I guess yeah. Wikipedia says the first movie was only in 2007. Feels like it was so much longer ago than that.

# ? Jul 17, 2014 05:42

DoctorWhat: Nov 18, 2011; A little privacy, please?

Bloodnose posted:

The movies are definitely having an impact on the new market

Qingdao hoarder spends [$32,000] on Transformers collection

It's distressing how many of those figures in the blurry distance I can instantly recognize, wow.

# ? Jul 17, 2014 05:44

Dystram: May 30, 2013; by Ralp

JediTalentAgent posted:

Maybe the Autobots are 'modern' good guys.

Brutal, bitter, self-centered, hypocritical, insulting and trash-talking. They're our modern video game heroes. The only thing missing is likely Bumblebee 'beebagging' a fallen enemy.

Man, that's just sad. Seeing heroes from a show I loved as a kid, who were fairly noble and good characters, turned into evil joke characters.

# ? Jul 17, 2014 05:48

computer parts: Nov 18, 2010; PLEASE CLAP

Dystram posted:

Man, that's just sad. Seeing heroes from a show I loved as a kid, who were fairly noble and good characters, turned into evil joke characters.

Yes, quite noble.

# ? Jul 17, 2014 06:11

The MSJ: May 17, 2010

computer parts posted:

Yes, quite noble.

A reminder that the late Casey Kasem quit Transformers because of this.

# ? Jul 17, 2014 06:17

JediTalentAgent: Jun 5, 2005; Hey, look. Look, if- if you screw me on this, I shall become more powerful than you can possibly imagine, you rat bastard!

But would people consider that a good example of the spirit of the old Transformers cartoon as a whole, or an uncommon bad creative misstep?

Maybe it's just me, but it feels almost like the latter, while the Bay films sort of revel in their mean-spiritedness as a whole.

# ? Jul 17, 2014 06:26

Lord Krangdar: Oct 24, 2007; These are the secrets of death we teach.

JediTalentAgent posted:

the Bay films sort of revel in their mean-spiritedness as a whole.

"I wanted to rub the human face in its own vomit and force it to look in the mirror."

- J.G. Ballard (on writing his novel Crash)

# ? Jul 17, 2014 06:38

SuperMechagodzilla: Jun 9, 2007; NEWT REBORN

Tuxedo Catfish posted:

I think Bay has a much more ambivalent relationship to his subject matter than Verhoeven does. Starship Troopers is a film relentlessly mocking fascism because Verhoeven hates fascism with all his heart and humor is the most effective and disarming weapon he could use against it.

Bay's more like Zack Snyder, or Hideaki Anno -- he recognizes flaws in something he loves and is willing to explore those flaws even if the results are kind of damning. But he's not willing to back down from enjoying it. That's why all of those directors' work so often seems contradictory, or even hypocritical. It's about self-aware entanglement, not ironic distance.

I think the pointless destruction of the grain elevator is key. Bay loves farmers, pickup trucks, men who work hard to feed the world, etc.

But, of course, Cade is not a farmer. He dresses as a farmer, but he simply is not. He repairs old garbage 8-track players, and hopes to become the next Steve Jobs.

The obsolescence theme is undeniable. Optimus fears becoming obsolete. Bumblebee fears becoming obsolete. Cade fears becoming obsolete. On top of the scene with 8-track player, you have the old projector and the bullshit about how digital IMAX 3D is superior/inferior to how things were in 'the good ol' days'. There are numerous jokes about how young people hate the elderly (see the otherwise throwaway scene where the Chinese grandmas block a hallway). The main theme is dinosaurs dying out, or making one last stand, etc. etc. The gag with the Beats By Dre pill is instantly dated. It's destined to be tossed aside by some kid who doesn't even know what it is, with an exaggerated shattering noise.

In contrast to all this, being a farmer is no fad. It's eternal, and universal. That, I believe, is what Bay truly respects.

SuperMechagodzilla fucked around with this message at 09:30 on Jul 17, 2014

# ? Jul 17, 2014 09:28

Vintersorg: Mar 3, 2004; President of
the Brendan Fraser
Fan Club

DoctorWhat posted:

It's distressing how many of those figures in the blurry distance I can instantly recognize, wow.

Which Optimus and Megatron is that in the bottom pictures? Those look super accurate aside from the masterpiece series to the old show.

# ? Jul 17, 2014 15:05

Hemingway To Go!: Nov 10, 2008; im stupider then dog shit, i dont give a shit, and i dont give a fuck, and i will never shut the fuck up, and i'll always Respect my enemys.
- ernest hemingway

They made a new smaller masterpiece optimus, that's probably him
The Megatron is a third party figure. As is the ultra magnus on the other side of the pic (That was, incidentially, the third party figure to my knowledge)

# ? Jul 17, 2014 15:10

Gatts: Jan 2, 2001; Goodnight Moon; Nap Ghost

Bloodnose posted:

The movies are definitely having an impact on the new market

Qingdao hoarder spends [$32,000] on Transformers collection

His girlfriend is quietly having the spirit sucked out of her body as she contemplates the future. Maybe they're married. It is too late. Doomed.

# ? Jul 17, 2014 15:53

Deep State of Mind: Jul 30, 2006; "It was a busy day. I do not remember it all. In the morning, I thought I had lost my wallet. Then we went swimming and either overthrew a government or started a pro-American radio station. I can't really remember."; Fun Shoe

The article indeed refers to her as his wife. She's in it for the long haul. With the entire first generation cast of Transformers.

# ? Jul 17, 2014 15:56

VAGENDA OF MANOCIDE: Aug 1, 2004; whoa, what just happened here?; College Slice

I actually ended up picking up the Voyager Optimus figure and it owns bones. It's roughly in-scale to the DOTM Voyager Megatron in robot form. :getin:

VAGENDA OF MANOCIDE fucked around with this message at 16:16 on Jul 17, 2014

# ? Jul 17, 2014 16:13

Neurolimal: Nov 3, 2012

quote:

"I am posting in a thread about a person's opinion on a franchise and do not want to read that thread. Here is why that opinion is wrong".

Great move there buddy.

I'm kind of curious why you chose to move part of my last response to the first response like that, and also why you skimmed over the response where I admitted that it's a bit harsh of me to do this, but am doing so because there isn't another CineD transformers thread. I'l be generous and assume a lack of reading comprehension.

Bloodnose posted:

The movies are definitely having an impact on the new market

Qingdao hoarder spends [$32,000] on Transformers collection

I wonder if he has any of the crazy expensive Fansproject kits that make some of the dinkier toys look way more badass:

This was like, $100 dollars when it came out (probably more expensive now, since it's a niche fan store for a hobby known for crazy scalpers), split between two $50 upgrade packs, not counting the base robot as well.

# ? Jul 17, 2014 16:25

DoctorWhat: Nov 18, 2011; A little privacy, please?

Neurolimal posted:

I'm kind of curious why you chose to move part of my last response to the first response like that, and also why you skimmed over the response where I admitted that it's a bit harsh of me to do this, but am doing so because there isn't another CineD transformers thread. I'l be generous and assume a lack of reading comprehension.

I wonder if he has any of the crazy expensive Fansproject kits that make some of the dinkier toys look way more badass:

This was like, $100 dollars when it came out (probably more expensive now, since it's a niche fan store for a hobby known for crazy scalpers), split between two $50 upgrade packs, not counting the base robot as well.

Well I can see numerous third-party figures in there, including City Commander and Hedgemon, so probably!

# ? Jul 17, 2014 17:13

Adbot: ADBOT LOVES YOU

# ? May 9, 2024 21:43

Arquinsiel: Jun 1, 2006; "There is no such thing as society. There are individual men and women, and there are families. And no government can do anything except through people, and people must look to themselves first."

God Bless Margaret Thatcher
God Bless England
RIP My Iron Lady

Neurolimal posted:

I'm kind of curious why you chose to move part of my last response to the first response like that, and also why you skimmed over the response where I admitted that it's a bit harsh of me to do this, but am doing so because there isn't another CineD transformers thread. I'l be generous and assume a lack of reading comprehension.

It's more than a bit harsh, it's rude and also nullifies your argument since you've admitted you haven't even read the thing you are arguing against. You are basically those reviewers who had their article ready to go trashing the movie a month ahead of time, except lazier. At least most people who ignore a thread and post at the end make it through the OP.

# ? Jul 17, 2014 17:27

The Something Awful Forums > The Finer Arts > Cinema Discusso > I still really like the Transformers movies

«‹›86 »