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Sephiroth_IRA posted:The thing is I'd rather them vote for Ron Paul/Gary Johnson/Straight Libertarian than Republican and Libertarians tend to do just that. Careful here they might get into bitcoin and ruin that dude's job.
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Jul 14, 2014 13:55
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sleepingbuddha posted:This sounds more like schizophrenia than typical conservatism. Or are the two starting to converge? Starting?
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Jul 14, 2014 13:56
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gradenko_2000 posted:I can kind of understand this as if you're already leaning conservative then you might well read A People's History and still conclude that the Democrats are the bad guys leaning? that's like saying a plank leans flat on the floor. Given, a good segment of the book details the period of the country's history where the Democratic Party was the party of white Southerners defending slavery but there's plenty of text about the broader 20th century New Deal-Civil Rights Act realignment (the one you usually think of as happening around 1964 - it was more multigenerational with minorities voting D as early as the 30s) and the overall focus on the labor/civil equality struggle really makes me wonder what someone went into the book thinking if they came out thinking Romney specifically was worth a vote.
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Jul 14, 2014 14:09
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Maybe they didn't actually finish it, got about 3/4ths of the way through and said "well gosh, this reinforces my idea that the dems are the bad guys" and then gave the book back with out even reading into the 1960s+ ?
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Jul 14, 2014 16:23
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Yeah, it's a favorite argument of Republicans to act like history ends in 1964 so that they can smear Democrats as the REAL racists.
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Jul 14, 2014 16:28
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Here's a pretty interesting article I found on the Democratic primary losses of "progressive" candidates in Illinois and Maryland.quote:The Illinois tenth saw such a proxy fight in late March, in a little watched Congressional primary in Illinois between a Democratic moderate, Brett Schneider, and a self-described progressive and former Obama campaign organizer, Ilya Sheyman. Schneider, backed by the party establishment and officials such as Minority Whip Steny Hoyer, defeated the 25 year old Sheyman, who had the backing of online liberal groups like DFA, the Progressive Change Campaign Committee, Moveon, and various labor unions. Ilya lost by eight points after what looked like a substantial double lead in the polls, in a 62% blue district. quote:One, the internet Democrats who emerged in the post-Bush era simply do not know how to turn out votes, and they need to acknowledge and deal with this weakness. It’s clear that there is a market for liberal-ish donors who want to support a political infrastructure that can compete in elections, and there is a media infrastructure available to communicate a message. But the current crop of organizers, while entrepreneurial in some cases (PCCC) and heirs to the work of other innovators (CWA, Moveon), has not cracked the code. There’s an operational element here. Many operational problems came from really bad targeting and messaging that did not work. Organizers need to acknowledge this, change leadership in some cases, and funders need to reorganize priorities around clear political accomplishments. Additionally, political reporters should stop relying on the word of DC internet groups as the voice of “the left”. If you can’t turn out your members to vote, then they aren’t really your members. The rest of the thing is here: http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2014/07/summer-rerun-left-slice-democrats-getting-crushed.html
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Jul 14, 2014 16:35
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The conservative uproar over immigrant/refugee children from Central America continues to be amusing. "Obama ship these kids back to their home countries!  ""That's what we're doing, but there are so goddamn many of them we need more funds to speed up/change the process" "If we give you money to do it how do we know you just won't ask for more? gently caress you Obama, if we don't ship those kids back now they'll just keep coming!" "OK, any ideas? Wanna repeal/modify that 2008 law that is affecting the way we handle Central American kids?" *crickets* "gently caress YOU OBAMA"
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Jul 14, 2014 16:47
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OAquinas posted:OK, this I have to inquire about. Don't feel the need to divulge overly identifying info, but what did Obama personally do to the guy? Run over his cat? His brother is this guy. Not that I don't agree with what Obama did, but "he personally fired my brother from one of the most powerful jobs in the military" is a pretty legit personal reason to hate Obama EDIT: Also just to be clear I'm not one of those people who thinks Obama is awesome and perfect, he has lots of flaws and is a massive disappointment, but he pretty much went on national media and talked about how bad his boss is and his boss is the loving president. Totally get why my boss would be mad after that, but Obama was completely justified. Shame Boy fucked around with this message at 17:16 on Jul 14, 2014 |
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Jul 14, 2014 16:55
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Shageletic posted:Here's a pretty interesting article I found on the Democratic primary losses of "progressive" candidates in Illinois and Maryland.
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Jul 14, 2014 17:01
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Parallel Paraplegic posted:His brother is this guy. "He fired my brother for conduct unbecoming of his position" would be harder to accept, I guess.
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Jul 14, 2014 17:14
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Parallel Paraplegic posted:His brother is this guy. McChrystal totally and royally deserved his shitcanning. Talking poo poo about the president in front of a reporter that you think you're all buddy buddy with is just shockingly retarded coming from a general.
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Jul 14, 2014 17:16
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Evil Fluffy posted:"He fired my brother for conduct unbecoming of his position" would be harder to accept, I guess. Yeah I'm not saying he's right, just that he has a personal grudge rather than "oh no, liberals!"
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Jul 14, 2014 17:17
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Truly shocking that someone is irrationally defending their family members.
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Jul 14, 2014 17:23
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Raskolnikov38 posted:McChrystal totally and royally deserved his shitcanning. Talking poo poo about the president in front of a reporter that you think you're all buddy buddy with is just shockingly retarded coming from a general. "You didn't say it was off the record. That's like Journalism 101."
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Jul 14, 2014 17:39
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BUSH 2112 posted:"You didn't say it was off the record. That's like Journalism 101." That's one of my favorite parts of Hastings' book. "WHAT DO YOU MEAN YOU DIDN'T SAY IT WAS OFF THE RECORD," McChrystal's staff freaking out after the article is published is hilarious.
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Jul 14, 2014 17:55
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Raskolnikov38 posted:That's one of my favorite parts of Hastings' book. "WHAT DO YOU MEAN YOU DIDN'T SAY IT WAS OFF THE RECORD," McChrystal's staff freaking out after the article is published is hilarious. I couldn't find a youtube clip but this scene from Thick of It nails it. http://www.bbcamerica.com/the-thick-of-it/videos/episode-2-sneak-peek/
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Jul 14, 2014 17:58
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I think "off the record" is one of those myths perpetuated by an institution, like "Undercover cops have to tell you they are cops if you ask them" in order to put people at ease.
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Jul 14, 2014 17:59
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zoux posted:I think "off the record" is one of those myths perpetuated by an institution, like "Undercover cops have to tell you they are cops if you ask them" in order to put people at ease.
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Jul 14, 2014 18:02
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Monkey Fracas posted:The conservative uproar over immigrant/refugee children from Central America continues to be amusing. They do want to repeal the law and fast track the deportations. They just like to have Obama squirm, don't want to be easily painted as supporting child sex trafficking, and also likely are fighting behind the scenes to attach riders to hobble Obama's current immigration enforcement actions which fall short of their ideal "deport everyone with brown skin or a Spanish/Portuguese accent" strategy.
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Jul 14, 2014 18:25
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zoux posted:I think "off the record" is one of those myths perpetuated by an institution, like "Undercover cops have to tell you they are cops if you ask them" in order to put people at ease. Can't speak for all news institutions, but when I worked as a reporter "off the record" was for things I was curious about but not really the subject of the story/interview. The journalist gets to offer off-the-record discussion, but it's not something an official can demand. It's also not complicated and probably something you should know if you deal with the press at all ever, which makes that whole saga even more baffling/hilarious.
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Jul 14, 2014 18:28
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Malmesbury Monster posted:Can't speak for all news institutions, but when I worked as a reporter "off the record" was for things I was curious about but not really the subject of the story/interview. The journalist gets to offer off-the-record discussion, but it's not something an official can demand. It's also not complicated and probably something you should know if you deal with the press at all ever, which makes that whole saga even more baffling/hilarious. I know what it's for but people think it's a magical incantation that prevents a reporter from revealing knowledge.
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Jul 14, 2014 18:32
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zoux posted:I think "off the record" is one of those myths perpetuated by an institution, like "Undercover cops have to tell you they are cops if you ask them" in order to put people at ease. It is. There's no legal "off the record" recourse and if anything a reporter telling you any comments would be off the record is all the more reason to just the gently caress up. A friend who's worked in PR for a decade or so tells people "Off the record is bullshit, and anyone saying your comments are off the record only means it until you say something interesting". Anyone believing "off the record" isn't just a way to trick idiots into saying something they shouldn't is wrong.
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Jul 14, 2014 18:35
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http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/ppp-poll-john-kasich-ed-fitzgerald-dead-heatquote:Ohio Gov. John Kasich (R) is essentially tied with Democratic challenger Ed FitzGerald in a head-to-head matchup, according to a new Public Policy Polling survey.
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Jul 14, 2014 18:38
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Malmesbury Monster posted:Can't speak for all news institutions, but when I worked as a reporter "off the record" was for things I was curious about but not really the subject of the story/interview. The journalist gets to offer off-the-record discussion, but it's not something an official can demand. It's also not complicated and probably something you should know if you deal with the press at all ever, which makes that whole saga even more baffling/hilarious. How many journalists deliberately offer "off the record" with the intent of, you know, recording it? It's the same with police, really. I don't know what kind of police officer I'm dealing with. I don't know what kind of journalist I'm dealing with. I just flat out don't know so if somebody is asking me questions it's best to just assume that every single thing I say will be recorded for eternity and used against me.
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Jul 14, 2014 18:38
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I always figured the TV Drama style "Okay but off the record what are the administration's plans for X" was bullshit that nobody sensible would actually believe was off the record, and certainly anyone who thinks it's some sort of binding thing is way off base, but a good working relationship with a reporter might allow you to say things 'off the record' not for reporting directly, but in order to put give the reporter the scent of something. Unless the story got really huge, they wouldn't reveal you were a source because it would jeopardize future news from you.
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Jul 14, 2014 18:39
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ToxicSlurpee posted:How many journalists deliberately offer "off the record" with the intent of, you know, recording it? It's the same with police, really. I don't know what kind of police officer I'm dealing with. I don't know what kind of journalist I'm dealing with. I just flat out don't know so if somebody is asking me questions it's best to just assume that every single thing I say will be recorded for eternity and used against me. It depends. If you reveal "off the record" stuff, you're totally burned with the source. So it's a calculus of balancing just how juicy the OTR thing was vs. your relationship and access with the person.
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Jul 14, 2014 18:39
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zoux posted:I think "off the record" is one of those myths perpetuated by an institution, like "Undercover cops have to tell you they are cops if you ask them" in order to put people at ease. The thing is, respecting a person's right to say their statements are "Off the record" is what gets reporters those statements in the first place. If a journalist reported tomorrow that Bill O'Reily told him off the record that he secretly hates black people and wants them back in chains, it would be a tremendous scoop-but then that journalist would pretty much have to give up on reporting, since none of their sources would ever trust him again not to source their quotes back to them. So, not really a myth, per-say, but more common sense I'd argue. e:f,b
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Jul 14, 2014 18:46
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Mister Adequate posted:I always figured the TV Drama style "Okay but off the record what are the administration's plans for X" was bullshit that nobody sensible would actually believe was off the record, and certainly anyone who thinks it's some sort of binding thing is way off base, but a good working relationship with a reporter might allow you to say things 'off the record' not for reporting directly, but in order to put give the reporter the scent of something. Unless the story got really huge, they wouldn't reveal you were a source because it would jeopardize future news from you. You might very well think that, but of course I couldn't possibly comment.
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Jul 14, 2014 18:47
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 Kasich in a dead heat with the worst Democratic candidate in recent history.
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Jul 14, 2014 18:51
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Doctor Butts posted:
Terry McAuliffe quit and moved to Ohio?
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Jul 14, 2014 18:52
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Raskolnikov38 posted:Terry McAuliffe quit and moved to Ohio? Was there a job guarantee?
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Jul 14, 2014 18:54
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Raskolnikov38 posted:Terry McAuliffe quit and moved to Ohio? And was replaced by Martha Coakley?
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Jul 14, 2014 18:57
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ToxicSlurpee posted:How many journalists deliberately offer "off the record" with the intent of, you know, recording it? It's the same with police, really. I don't know what kind of police officer I'm dealing with. I don't know what kind of journalist I'm dealing with. I just flat out don't know so if somebody is asking me questions it's best to just assume that every single thing I say will be recorded for eternity and used against me. There's a huge difference between journalist tells source conversation is off the record and source tells journalist conversation is off the record then drops bombshell before journalist can react. "Off the record" is a type of relationship a responsible journalist can dole out trading on their credibility, but it's not some 5th amendment type thing where you can just invoke it by yourself.
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Jul 14, 2014 18:59
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Doctor Butts posted:
Why is he the worst?
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Jul 14, 2014 19:00
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The Ape of Naples posted:I couldn't find a youtube clip but this scene from Thick of It nails it.  Good, can't even begin to say how glad I'll be if Kasich is gone.
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Jul 14, 2014 19:07
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DynamicSloth posted:There's a huge difference between journalist tells source conversation is off the record and source tells journalist conversation is off the record then drops bombshell before journalist can react. Really, off the record is a bad way of saying that the question or conversation isn't relevant or important to the story being written, though I have no doubt there are unethical journalists who use it to trip rookie officials. There's no "off the record" button, just the journalist letting the source know that this isn't material they're planning on using. If the source doesn't want something to be printed, they probably shouldn't say it, because after that it's in the journalist's court.
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Jul 14, 2014 19:11
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Dystram posted:Why is he the worst? Day late and a dollar short with this "Win Tax" proposal that, while it sounded sort of cool, was actually not that great an idea. Then he did really crappy background checks on his running mate(s), and at least one failed to pay their taxes. Seems to do everything for publicity first. The guy got a huge upshot from Lakewood mayor to Cuyahoga County Executive, but he's almost Mandel'ing it to a Governorship.
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Jul 14, 2014 19:17
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Much more than Kasich I want to see that attorney general go down after all his fuckery in the 2012 election, namely "why should our voting procedures cater to black people  ".
Jerry Manderbilt fucked around with this message at 19:38 on Jul 14, 2014 |
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Jul 14, 2014 19:22
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Dystram posted:Why is he the worst? He's a Democrat involved in state politics in a purple state, all of them are the worst.
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Jul 14, 2014 19:28
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Raskolnikov38 posted:Terry McAuliffe quit and moved to Ohio?  What I'm trying to say is that I hope Ken Cuccinelli decides to start campaigning for Kasich.
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Jul 14, 2014 19:30
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