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I'd like to be a fly on the wall for that part of the interview. Makes you wonder if anyone would just straight up answer bribery.
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Jul 4, 2014 08:56
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Of course they would, it's called lobbying. --- Also this is amusing, http://www.smh.com.au/world/japan-cracks-down-on-cute-mascots-20140703-zsv00.html about time. Kenishi fucked around with this message at 10:46 on Jul 4, 2014 |
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Jul 4, 2014 10:43
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Even if they got the government to stop protecting Japanese farming, wouldn't strong social aversions keep Japan from buying foreign rice anyway?
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Jul 4, 2014 10:54
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Samurai Sanders posted:Even if they got the government to stop protecting Japanese farming, wouldn't strong social aversions keep Japan from buying foreign rice anyway? Social aversions aren't going to mean much when one rice is half price and you're poor as gently caress. Osaka has literal ghetto neighborhoods full of homeless peope subsiding on unstable day jobs (if at all), you think they're going to care? http://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2014/03/24/national/nations-biggest-slum-cannot-be-found-on-maps-or-at-osaka-film-fest/ And all the young freeters etc. Millions of poors in japan.
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Jul 4, 2014 11:07
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Samurai Sanders posted:Even if they got the government to stop protecting Japanese farming, wouldn't strong social aversions keep Japan from buying foreign rice anyway? Japan's food prices are pretty insane. There's no way the Japanese government would ever relax the rice tariffs because they know their rice farming economy would evaporate. It's pretty similar to how heavily corn is subsidized in the US and not supporting farmers is a common attack ad against democrats.
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Jul 4, 2014 11:19
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pentyne posted:Japan's food prices are pretty insane. There's no way the Japanese government would ever relax the rice tariffs because they know their rice farming economy would evaporate. It's pretty similar to how heavily corn is subsidized in the US and not supporting farmers is a common attack ad against democrats. America's level of subsidies aren't on the same planet (or galaxy). http://japan-101.com/government/rice_trade_policy.htm Also, the "Japanese consumers won't like foreign rice" argument is sort of amazing, not because it's 100% false, but because it goes directly against the idea that enormous subsidies are needed to sustain domestic rice production.
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Jul 4, 2014 11:51
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dilbertschalter posted:Also, the "Japanese consumers won't like foreign rice" argument is sort of amazing, not because it's 100% false, but because it goes directly against the idea that enormous subsidies are needed to sustain domestic rice production. Say word, son.
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Jul 4, 2014 12:02
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I remember an old guy telling me once that he didn't go to Chikara Meshi because they use Chinese rice. I would assume that he probably eats a shitload of import rice without realizing it anyway.
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Jul 4, 2014 13:16
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dilbertschalter posted:Also, the "Japanese consumers won't like foreign rice" argument is sort of amazing, not because it's 100% false, but because it goes directly against the idea that enormous subsidies are needed to sustain domestic rice production.
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Jul 4, 2014 18:16
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The only way that argument could make any sense is if it was some kind of nihonjinron "foreign rice will make Japanese people sick" thing based on public health.
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Jul 4, 2014 22:05
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Bloodnose posted:The only way that argument could make any sense is if it was some kind of nihonjinron "foreign rice will make Japanese people sick" thing based on public health. Japanese rice has seven gods, which is why you shouldn't leave any on your plate, as it angers them. Do you mean to tell me that foreign rice has the correct seven gods? Please.
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Jul 4, 2014 22:58
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Bloodnose posted:The only way that argument could make any sense is if it was some kind of nihonjinron "foreign rice will make Japanese people sick" thing based on public health. The only real argument that makes sense, is that they need to protect their local food production webs, as if they start importing more food, they lose even more of their food independence. It seems to be tied into the collective self defense stuff, in that if the sea trade routes are blocked/affected by a conflict, they need to be able to do something about it, or they will all starve.
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Jul 4, 2014 23:12
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Can't they just stockpile whale meat?
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Jul 5, 2014 06:52
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They already do. Most of what gets brought in by the research boats ends up staying in deep freeze, since there's not much of a market for it. Something like 15-25% of the annual tonnage gets dumped unsold.
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Jul 5, 2014 06:55
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Bloodnose posted:Can't they just stockpile whale meat? I think the figures are around 50-60% of their food gets imported, so food independence is a pretty big issue. Most of it could be solved by allowing some/most of the farms to be consolidated into corporate type farms (which most other countries are doing) and reap the improved yields etc. But that ends a way of life for a lot of the old people, so likely to not come into play until enough of them have died off. They have never killed enough whales to cover up that shortfall. And you just have to look at night time photos of the area to see why the Japanese government will never let go of the Senkaku's and the Dokdo/Takeshima claims (you can see Korean, Chinese and Taiwanese fishing boats pressing up against the EEZ limits). Maintaining the fishing grounds that they will need in the event of trade disruption is pretty important (but looks really selfish from the perspectives of the countries struggling to feed their populations).
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Jul 5, 2014 23:47
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Everything about this is kind of stupid. Not totally destitute? No welfare. Not a citizen? No welfare. Forced to pay for it anyways? Too bad. Law says foreigners can't get welfare but we issued a directive in 1954 that somehow overrides the law? This is Japan. Local bureaucrats allowed to use their own discretion on a case by case basis to override both the law and that directive if they so wish? Again, this is Japan. http://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2014/07/18/national/social-issues/top-court-rules-non-japanese-residents-ineligible-welfare-benefits/ quote:Top court rules non-Japanese residents ineligible for welfare benefits Sheep fucked around with this message at 15:42 on Jul 18, 2014 |
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Jul 18, 2014 15:37
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Man that pisses me off in so many ways. And I know that leading reason why they ruled this was probably because the plaintiff was Chinese.
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Jul 18, 2014 17:29
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Kenishi posted:Man that pisses me off in so many ways. And I know that leading reason why they ruled this was probably because the plaintiff was Chinese. Are you being a racist, or just being a Japanese? I can't tell.
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Jul 18, 2014 17:47
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I think he means that the judges probably ruled against this because they are discriminatory against Chinese. I can definitely believe that; I bet the situation would have been different if the plaintiff was from one of Japan's preferred countries.
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Jul 18, 2014 17:50
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According to the story, the plaintiff was from Japan, born and raised. And 82 years ago there wasn't even a PRC to be a citizen of. I wonder what passport she carries.
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Jul 18, 2014 19:07
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Most likely she is one of those ethnically non-Japanese people whose Japanese citizenship was stripped in 1954, making it all the more a slap in the face. Also I love the rationale behind it all - allowing foreigners to receive welfare would amount to charity - and how they just ignore the fact that they're basically making GBS threads all over zainichi with this, to say nothing of all the rest of us who are forced to pay for welfare but can't use it. Edit: the original ruling from 2010 from a now-defunct MDN link http://mdn.mainichi.jp/mdnnews/national/news/20101018p2a00m0na013000c.html: quote:OITA — The Oita District Court ruled on Oct. 18 that foreigners with the right to permanent residence but without Japanese citizenship are not entitled to welfare benefits, rejecting the claims of a 78-year-old Chinese woman who sued after being denied benefits by the Oita city government. Sheep fucked around with this message at 19:17 on Jul 18, 2014 |
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Jul 18, 2014 19:10
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Here's another article on the issue. Not much extra, but there was a rather jaw dropping quote from a conservative professor. quote:"The state cannot provide benefits to all the poor people who come to Japan," said Yoichi Shimada, a professor of international relations at Fukui Prefectural University. Oh, yes. I'm sure she choose to remain Chinese.
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Jul 25, 2014 09:18
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So, this is based on the idea that (legal) immigrants to Japan aren't contributing anything to taxes and so on, or what? I don't really get it, other than the usual racism.
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Jul 25, 2014 09:26
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Wittgen posted:Here's another article on the issue. Not much extra, but there was a rather jaw dropping quote from a conservative professor. That, plus the fact that for the vast majority of foreign residents their residence in the country is conditional upon their ability to remain employed (and thus ineligible for welfare), zainichi, the few other permanent residents, and Japanese dependents excepting. Apart from the hilariously small number of refugees that have ever been admitted into Japan I imagine you could count the number of non-zainichi permanent residents who have applied for welfare in any given year on a single hand. Also Japan going bust isn't going to be because of foreigners claiming welfare, it's going to be because of the terrible economic policy that Japan has had for the last 30 years. But hey gently caress it let's build more empty condos and pave more rivers! Samurai Sanders posted:So, this is based on the idea that (legal) immigrants to Japan aren't contributing anything to taxes and so on, or what? I don't really get it, other than the usual racism. Pretty much "gently caress you got mine, give us your money then gently caress off back to your own country" racism and not a whole lot else, it appears. The fact that they're denying permanent residents is just... I don't even know. It's not surprising in the slightest but it sure is disheartening. Sheep fucked around with this message at 12:37 on Jul 25, 2014 |
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Jul 25, 2014 12:28
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Wittgen posted:Oh, yes. I'm sure she choose to remain Chinese. To play devils advocate; yeah she probably did. Someone like her who had lived in Japan for that long probably could have gotten citizenship with a minimum of hassle.
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Jul 26, 2014 03:24
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LimburgLimbo posted:To play devils advocate; yeah she probably did. Someone like her who had lived in Japan for that long probably could have gotten citizenship with a minimum of hassle. Oh? I was under the impression that there Chinese Japanese and Korean Japanese who were second or third generation but not citizens because racism makes it really hard. Am I misinformed? I'm not really sure where to go to find out about the realities of Japanese immigration policies. Any information would be appreciated.
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Jul 26, 2014 03:31
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Wittgen posted:Oh? I was under the impression that there Chinese Japanese and Korean Japanese who were second or third generation but not citizens because racism makes it really hard. Am I misinformed? I'm not really sure where to go to find out about the realities of Japanese immigration policies. Any information would be appreciated. You can become a Japanese citizen if you 'become Japanese,' which lots of people aren't really keen on.
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Jul 26, 2014 08:36
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The idea of being forced to give up any citizenship(s) that they had previously is not exactly the most appealing thing. I've got dual citizenship (New Zealand and Japan), and I've been asked repeatedly if I have "chosen" which citizenship to retain. I've refused to answer, because if they're expecting me to give up my NZ citizenship (where I live) or my Japanese citizenship (where I was born and where my mother is from), then they can gently caress right off. Apparently I can retain both anyway, since I was already a dual citizen before 1985 when the law was enacted.
edogawa rando fucked around with this message at 08:43 on Jul 26, 2014 |
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Jul 26, 2014 08:39
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dilbertschalter posted:You can become a Japanese citizen if you 'become Japanese,' which lots of people aren't really keen on. To add to this, no amount of holding the right paperwork really matters in a lot of situations in Japan. To lots and lots of Japanese people, if you don't have two Japanese parents and grow up in Japan then you aren't, ya know, really Japanese. This matters in both social contexts and in official contexts because lots of things on many levels are left up to the local bureaucrats or the people who process the paperwork. I've taught Brazilian/Japanese teenagers who are half who have lived their entire lives in Japan, speaks Japanese natively, and are about to graduate from a Japanese high school who are forced to take the Japanese Proficiency Test just because of their nationality. For someone who's a native speaker that's not a high bar to clear, but it takes time and costs money. Japan has quite a lot of on paper rules that get bent or ignored if the person in charge of the situation decides they're not important, and for some reason they're not considered as important when the person being dealt with is Japanese. Often they're also not important when the person is a foreigner either, but if the person in charge gets a bug up their rear end about it then there's quite a lot of roadblocks that can be thrown up. In this case of welfare benefits, the local bureaucrat decided he had a problem with foreigners getting welfare, and so he decided to hide behind the legal equivalent of "it doesn't say anywhere in the rulebook that a donkey can't kick field goals." Smaller versions of this happen every day in Japan. For most foreigners in Japan it's just very minor annoyances, and it really doesn't affect things very much. It sucks that in this case it means a person can't get money out of a system they've paid into. It's certainly an extreme case, but this sort of situation isn't really unheard of, unfortunately. The most common thing foreigners have trouble with in this vein is trying to collect unemployment benefits they're entitled to. I really think her being Chinese plays a big part in this. I can't imagine they'd take this all the way into court if this person had been white. They might have denied initially, but they'd have probably given in sooner or later just to make the problem go away. Fighting this thing out in court takes a special kind of animosity that I think really only racism can explain. ErIog fucked around with this message at 09:39 on Jul 26, 2014 |
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Jul 26, 2014 09:34
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I'm from the U.S. so my kid's dual citizenship thing is pretty cut and dried (just give up Japanese citizenship).
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Jul 26, 2014 09:35
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I don't expect to ever live in Japan, nor do I plan to leave New Zealand in the first place.
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Jul 26, 2014 09:42
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Stringent posted:I'm from the U.S. so my kid's dual citizenship thing is pretty cut and dried (just give up Japanese citizenship). 
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Jul 26, 2014 10:21
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Giving up his U.S. citizenship for Japanese citizenship is something for after he's turned 40, is still a virgin, and is in love with an anime/AKB48 tie in marketing campaign figure.
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Jul 26, 2014 10:26
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Wittgen posted:Oh? I was under the impression that there Chinese Japanese and Korean Japanese who were second or third generation but not citizens because racism makes it really hard. Am I misinformed? I'm not really sure where to go to find out about the realities of Japanese immigration policies. Any information would be appreciated. Nah. If you're Zainichi you can usually get citizenship no problem unless you have a criminal record etc. The issues are that 1) becoming a Japanese citizen means you have to in some way throw away your cultural heritage, and 2) people should be treated well regardless of ethnic background or citizenship in the first place, and therefore becoming Japanese or not should ceteris paribus not be an issue. I think the plight of Zainichi is fairly often exaggerated/misunderstood in western media. Which in no way legitimizes or excuses the very real discrimination that they face in some circumstances, or the racist trash you find from the uyoku, but Zainichi don't have it as bad as some would portray.
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Jul 26, 2014 11:09
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LimburgLimbo posted:The issues are that 1) becoming a Japanese citizen means you have to in some way throw away your cultural heritage, What exactly does this entail?
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Jul 26, 2014 11:24
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Charlz Guybon posted:What exactly does this entail? If you become a naturalized Japanese citizen then you must renounce your previous citizenships. This could require the person file as a foreigner in order to even go back to visit family and acquaintances back in their home country, and has the impact of somewhat isolating that person within Japan culturally. He exaggerated it a little bit, but it's accurate. So in the case of these welfare benefits that district court is saying you have to become a citizen, which entails renouncing the old citizenship, in order to receive benefits that have already been earned by having lived in Japan and participated in the economy for the requisite amount of time.
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Jul 26, 2014 15:38
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Do you have to abandon your old name and choose a Japanese one a well? I knew an ethnic Korean with a Japanese name, but I don't know if she was forced to do that or chose to do it herself. Also I've heard stories of them coming into your house and checking your refrigerator for Japanese food and stuff, but those are just urban legends...right?
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Jul 26, 2014 17:11
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Just to note, a lot of countries don't allow multiple citizenship, though Japan is rare among liberal democracies.
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Jul 26, 2014 17:14
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The nice fellow at the consulate made sure he stressed to my wife, in Japanese of course, that she make sure our infant daughter picked the right citizenship. My wife assured him that she would pick the right one. ( )But in reality, it is really not that difficult to maintain both citizenships. You just don't tell Japan about it. My daughter will just politely ignore their demands, until they either change the law eventual or revoke hers, which is unlikely. We know numerous Japanese citizens that have gotten Canadian citizenship and are just hoping that Japan doesn't find out.
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Jul 26, 2014 18:19
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ocrumsprug posted:
This makes complete sense having lived and married here. Japan is the most apathetic place I can ever imagine existing.
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Jul 26, 2014 18:54
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