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ungulateman
Apr 18, 2012

pretentious fuckwit who isn't half as literate or insightful or clever as he thinks he is

Korak posted:

No offense but how are they contributing "massively" if they're not regularly attending GPs and large events? That's sort of why there's a need for Judges. Judges are really nice to have at FNM but usually not required in the same manner as a GP / SCG / States event needs them.

One of my university friends is an L3 judge who (AFAIK) has only attended one GP in the last year, but he's responsible for organising what amounts to the entire local scene at the university and has got more people into the game than any number of $50,000 grand prizes. These are the people Wizards needs to keep the lifeblood of the game flowing.

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BaronVonVaderham
Jul 31, 2011

All hail the queen!
God drat it internet......



:getin:

Ciprian Maricon
Feb 27, 2006



Korak posted:

No offense but how are they contributing "massively" if they're not regularly attending GPs and large events? That's sort of why there's a need for Judges. Judges are really nice to have at FNM but usually not required in the same manner as a GP / SCG / States event needs them.

You do know that set compensation exists only for GPs right? Judges working all of those other events don't get any Foils, and compensation isn't mandatory so people get anything from store credit and lunch to a smile and a thank you. It's important for the Program to recognize and reward active Judges who aren't making it to GPs because as the program continues to grow, the number of Judges working GPs becomes a smaller and smaller percentage of the community.

This weekend alone there are 50 SCG and TCG Player tournaments throughout the country (and that's only counting TCG player states as one single event, despite the fact that its 50 semi-independently organized tournaments) and that's pretty normal for a weekend. That's also not counting other local level stuff run at Comp REL, GPT's, the local Legacy event for some duals etc. etc. etc.

I've personally worked a lot of Comp REL. 9 States Champs in two years, plenty of IQ's, and more GPTs than I would care to rememer and have never once been selected to staff a GP. I also play as often as I Judge, there are guys in my area with more experience, who work more regularly, and who haven't even made it to a Judge Conference let alone worked a GP.

Grand Prix are a drop in the bucket as far as the work Judges do, and there are large numbers of Judges working consistently every weekend to run events and improve the community that have never and might never work at a GP. That's not to disparage the dudes and gals working GPs, they are great, probably the best, but they are the most experienced and the most capable Judges available, not the majority.

Ciprian Maricon fucked around with this message at 03:40 on Jul 29, 2014

Count Bleck
Apr 5, 2010

DISPEL MAGIC!

BaronVonVaderham posted:

God drat it internet......



:getin:

Oh good. I needed another reason to hate this card.

Starving Autist
Oct 20, 2007

by Ralp

Sleep of Bronze posted:

That's a really neat article: thanks for posting it. I was still very much under the impression that the occasional 41/61 for mana ratios was accepted. Interesting that computer testing doesn't bear that out.

The computer simulation is done on an ultra-dumbed-down version of the game, so I'd take it with a grain of salt. Note that none of the examples of successful decks with more than the minimum number of cards mentioned in that article were aggro decks, which are what his program is testing with.

Fuzzy Mammal
Aug 15, 2001

Lipstick Apathy

AATREK CURES KIDS posted:

Most of your post is true, but the point about combo decks is not and I'd strongly advise against any Bauble in most combo decks. I'll quote my primer on Breakfast Burrito:

I think that concern is usually overstated and the advice is certainly up for debate.

I agree it's inappropriate for a combo like burrito which needs to see a rather large set of independent things in its open, such as a burrito, X amount of rituals, a producer to kickstart the rituals, and not too many dead draws.

Take scapeshift on the other hand. You're not going to mull a hand based on whether or not it has scapeshift. You need several turns to play your lands anyway so you are happy to go without it and start digging. Any card's effect in a deck of 52 is 13% more dense, which is pretty significant.

Obviously this isn't talking about the other side effects like losing life, getting to peek with probe and so on...

Ultima66
Sep 2, 2008

Ableist Kinkshamer posted:

The computer simulation is done on an ultra-dumbed-down version of the game, so I'd take it with a grain of salt. Note that none of the examples of successful decks with more than the minimum number of cards mentioned in that article were aggro decks, which are what his program is testing with.

It is possible to conclude using thorough statistical analysis and rigorous simulation on a particular deck that a larger deck is slightly more optimal in terms of mana ratios and casting spells on time while getting minimally flooded.

No one who plays a 41 card limited deck has ever done this, because they're doing it because they are being idiots.

E: or they have determined the format is so hosed that their only path to victory is to deck out after their opponent, and neither player has a way to shuffle cards back/mill.

Deckit
Sep 1, 2012

Ultima66 posted:

It is possible to conclude using thorough statistical analysis and rigorous simulation on a particular deck that a larger deck is slightly more optimal in terms of mana ratios and casting spells on time while getting minimally flooded.

No one who plays a 41 card limited deck has ever done this, because they're doing it because they are being idiots.

E: or they have determined the format is so hosed that their only path to victory is to deck out after their opponent, and neither player has a way to shuffle cards back/mill.

That's how I won two conspiracy drafts so far. Making a 60 card deck and letting everyone else run out of cards. Reito Lanterns SNIPED.

Lottery of Babylon
Apr 25, 2012

STRAIGHT TROPIN'

Deckit posted:

That's how I won two conspiracy drafts so far. Making a 60 card deck and letting everyone else run out of cards. Reito Lanterns SNIPED.

Worldknit is great.

Olothreutes
Mar 31, 2007

I won my conspiracy drafts because all my friends never learned to not let me draft all the token making cards and every echoing courage I see. Also backup plan is fantastic.

Lets Pickle
Jul 9, 2007

Lottery of Babylon posted:

Worldknit is great.

As long as you want to make a hilarious deck and don't mind not actually winning.

Elyv
Jun 14, 2013



I've only drafted Conspiracy once. I got all the card advantage(6th or 7th pick FoF :getin: ) and took over the game and decked myself

otoh I got a foil brainstorm so in the end I was the real winner anyway.

Orange Fluffy Sheep
Jul 26, 2008

Bad EXP received

BaronVonVaderham posted:

God drat it internet......



:getin:

Well his expression certainly is unreadable.

vOv
Feb 8, 2014

Lets Pickle posted:

As long as you want to make a hilarious deck and don't mind not actually winning.

Unless you draft that one thing that lets you get rid of draft cards you don't want fairly early on. That's what we call 'living the dream'

A big flaming stink
Apr 26, 2010

A big flaming stink posted:

look i know that a 5/5 for two mana sounds like a really good deal to you but 2 drops in modern affinity have a much higher standard. Arcbound ravager and cranial plating are much, much stronger than a measly 5/5.


Gotta say, when I'm wrong, I'm wrong. I haven't misevaluated a card this badly since boros reckoner.

I brought affinity to the weekly modern tournament at my store and ensoul artifact absolutely wrecked face. I played r/g tron, ad nauseum angel's grace, merfolk, and UWR geist, then merfolk again for top 8. I beat all of them except geist (which is piloted by one of the best players in my store). it did a ton of work in pretty much every matchup. More than once i got a 5/5 indestructible swinging in on turn 2.

Now to play about ten million games in preparation for the modern premier IQ on sunday.

A big flaming stink fucked around with this message at 07:00 on Jul 29, 2014

Archenteron
Nov 3, 2006

:marc:

Deckit posted:

That's how I won two conspiracy drafts so far. Making a 60 card deck and letting everyone else run out of cards. Reito Lanterns SNIPED.

Lottery of Babylon posted:

Worldknit is great.

True fact, I had 2-3 cards left in my deck in a conspiracy game when I won against a Reito Lantern deck. I had 60+ cards and Worldknit, and so much card draw. Know how I won? Double Parlay cards when Reito Lantern deck was at 1 card in deck and tapped out.

mbt
Aug 13, 2012

I'm trying to run the stupid enter the infinite / possibility storm / borborygmos deck in standard.
If I try to combo out and get countered, I have 0 cards in library. I cast an additional thopter that sees no cards in my library with possibility storm, so it stays in my library. Question: Can they counter that spell (in this case thopter) if possibility storm couldn't find a card to turn it into?

A big flaming stink
Apr 26, 2010

Mortimer posted:

I'm trying to run the stupid enter the infinite / possibility storm / borborygmos deck in standard.
If I try to combo out and get countered, I have 0 cards in library. I cast an additional thopter that sees no cards in my library with possibility storm, so it stays in my library. Question: Can they counter that spell (in this case thopter) if possibility storm couldn't find a card to turn it into?

yep, they can counter the spell on the stack in response to the exile trigger, which will kick it off the stack into the graveyard.

of course that raises the question of how they can cast a counterspell with possibility storm out

Dungeon Ecology
Feb 9, 2011

A big flaming stink posted:

yep, they can counter the spell on the stack in response to the exile trigger, which will kick it off the stack into the graveyard.

of course that raises the question of how they can cast a counterspell with possibility storm out

Yeah, if you know the deck, and are about to lose to it, you ditch every instant in your hand looking for a counterspell.

atelier morgan
Mar 11, 2003

super-scientific, ultra-gay

Lipstick Apathy

Elyv posted:

I've only drafted Conspiracy once. I got all the card advantage(6th or 7th pick FoF :getin: ) and took over the game and decked myself

otoh I got a foil brainstorm so in the end I was the real winner anyway.

I won a conspiracy draft where I had 4 Compulsive Research with the 1 mana cheaper and copy on cast conspiracies. The last turn my surviving opponent had one out in his deck: a Brainstorm he could point at me to deck me :v:

JerryLee
Feb 4, 2005

THE RESERVED LIST! THE RESERVED LIST! I CANNOT SHUT UP ABOUT THE RESERVED LIST!

UberJew posted:

I won a conspiracy draft where I had 4 Compulsive Research with the 1 mana cheaper and copy on cast conspiracies. The last turn my surviving opponent had one out in his deck: a Brainstorm he could point at me to deck me :v:

What was it that would have allowed him to point the Brainstorm at you? (For all I know there is such a card kicking around in Conspiracy.)

mbt
Aug 13, 2012

Dungeon Ecology posted:

Yeah, if you know the deck, and are about to lose to it, you ditch every instant in your hand looking for a counterspell.

In my practice runs more often then not it ends up with control players casting counterspells that turn into azorius charms, and sphinx's and syncopates for 0 :smaug:
The real answer is if you're losing to this absolute joke of a deck you should cast det sphere / banishing light. Either one will get possibility storm'd into each other, which means you'll still exile the poz storm.

Right now I've got the grixis control version with izzet charms and hero's downfalls, but I'm thinking a delay deck with fogs instead of heavy red might be the right answer. Basically maze's end with a funnier wincon.

atelier morgan
Mar 11, 2003

super-scientific, ultra-gay

Lipstick Apathy

JerryLee posted:

What was it that would have allowed him to point the Brainstorm at you? (For all I know there is such a card kicking around in Conspiracy.)

I think I just mistyped and it was a compulsive research in his deck as well.

Dungeon Ecology
Feb 9, 2011

Mortimer posted:

In my practice runs more often then not it ends up with control players casting counterspells that turn into azorius charms, and sphinx's and syncopates for 0 :smaug:
The real answer is if you're losing to this absolute joke of a deck you should cast det sphere / banishing light. Either one will get possibility storm'd into each other, which means you'll still exile the poz storm.

Right now I've got the grixis control version with izzet charms and hero's downfalls, but I'm thinking a delay deck with fogs instead of heavy red might be the right answer. Basically maze's end with a funnier wincon.

I played against a pretty sweet version last night. Rather than go for the Borborygmos/Enter the Infinite combo, it utilized Possibility Storm alongside Courser of Kruphix, Eidolon of Blossoms and Mana Bloom :psyduck: to repeatedly draw cards and gain life. The top end had Primeval Bounty and it would just spam +1/+1 counters and 3/3s and life, for mad beatdown.

Lobsterpillar
Feb 4, 2014

Elyv posted:

I've only drafted Conspiracy once. I got all the card advantage(6th or 7th pick FoF :getin: ) and took over the game and decked myself

otoh I got a foil brainstorm so in the end I was the real winner anyway.

At the mirrodin Besieged prerelease I decked myself in one game by going 'gently caress yeah I can cast Jin-Gitaxias at the end of your turn - oh poo poo I have 10 cards left in my library' and the second game (against the same person) I cast Jin-Gitaxias with 'only' three turns worth of draws.

Angry Grimace
Jul 29, 2010

ACTUALLY IT IS VERY GOOD THAT THE SHOW IS BAD AND ANYONE WHO DOESN'T REALIZE WHY THAT'S GOOD IS AN IDIOT. JUST ENJOY THE BAD SHOW INSTEAD OF THINKING.
Playing Modern U/B Faeries on MTGO, and I don't quite understand why Bitterblossom was ever banned. I mean, its a fun card, but its not doing anything insanely broken as far as I can tell. Was there some sort of interaction that made it really broken? Or was it because all of the Faerie cards were in standard at the same time?

JerryLee
Feb 4, 2005

THE RESERVED LIST! THE RESERVED LIST! I CANNOT SHUT UP ABOUT THE RESERVED LIST!

Angry Grimace posted:

Playing Modern U/B Faeries on MTGO, and I don't quite understand why Bitterblossom was ever banned. I mean, its a fun card, but its not doing anything insanely broken as far as I can tell. Was there some sort of interaction that made it really broken? Or was it because all of the Faerie cards were in standard at the same time?

A lot of the cards currently on the banned list are/were banned more for past sins than for actual demonstrated distorting effects on the current environment. When cards like Bitterblossom originally got their rep, many of the main decks currently in Modern weren't even a twinkle in anyone's eye; you literally couldn't have built Scapeshift, Pod, UWR Control, proper Twin, etc., as we know them today. The cards didn't exist yet. As it turns out, some of them actually aren't overly powerful against a Modern field that features all these usual suspects.

If you haven't already, I recommend checking out Caleb Durward's banned list series on CFB. Basically, he mocks up what a deck might look like if card X was unbanned, and tests it against the major archetypes in the field. He did it for a bunch of the Legacy banned cards, and now he's on to Modern. Obviously it's not anywhere near a scientifically rigorous exercise, but it's funny how often the banned card gets stomped by the legal deck, especially in Modern.


There's something to be said for erring on the side of banning in cases like these, but hopefully they can slowly walk some of the more contextual offenders off the banned list.

edit: I think technically Shapeshift existed before Extended quite breathed its last, but the general point remains.

JerryLee fucked around with this message at 10:21 on Jul 29, 2014

Karmoderm
Aug 24, 2008

Angry Grimace posted:

Playing Modern U/B Faeries on MTGO, and I don't quite understand why Bitterblossom was ever banned. I mean, its a fun card, but its not doing anything insanely broken as far as I can tell. Was there some sort of interaction that made it really broken? Or was it because all of the Faerie cards were in standard at the same time?

Because when modern was first made a regular format (at a community cup, I think) we had just come off ~2 years of 4-year Extended (where Faeries was one of the best decks), then before that was lorwyn-shards Standard (where Faeries was one of the best decks), lorwyn-time spiral Standard (where Faeries was one of the best decks) and Extended (where Faeries was one of the best decks through multiple seasons). They reasoned (correctly, I think) that regardless of the deck's actual strength we should have a format without them for a while.

Tonetta
Jul 9, 2013

look mother look at ME MOTHER MOTHER I AM A HOMESTIXK NOW

**methodically removes and eats own clothes*

BaronVonVaderham posted:

God drat it internet......



:getin:

Hahaha my next playmat

gonadic io
Feb 16, 2011

>>=
Why are the only M15 events on MODO the 64-man events (that never fire), the new player's phantom draft and the employee events?

Lunsku
May 21, 2006

AlsoD posted:

Why are the only M15 events on MODO the 64-man events (that never fire), the new player's phantom draft and the employee events?

Are you looking at the right place? Release queues had the 8-4, 4-3-2-2 and Swiss draft queues, and 16-person release sealed flights up completely normal last evening.

frameset
Apr 13, 2008

Korak posted:

No offense but how are they contributing "massively" if they're not regularly attending GPs and large events? That's sort of why there's a need for Judges. Judges are really nice to have at FNM but usually not required in the same manner as a GP / SCG / States event needs them.

Events like PTQs and WMCQs also require judges, and often L2+ judges. We do not currently receive any foils for these.

gonadic io
Feb 16, 2011

>>=

Lunsku posted:

Are you looking at the right place? Release queues had the 8-4, 4-3-2-2 and Swiss draft queues, and 16-person release sealed flights up completely normal last evening.

Ah yes, I've got it now thanks. What got me was Release Queues being in a different section to all the other Queues.

En Fuego
Oct 8, 2004

The Reverend
Our very own KingCobWeb joined myself and my compatriots for today's episode of BJ Shea's Geek Nation (the MTG ep!) ... We talk about his set review project, M15 on MODO and all the SDCC news! Whee!

Plus he's kinda funny~

http://media.kisw.com/a/95041072/bjgn-07-29-14-magic-the-gathering-jesse-mason.htm

CellBlock
Oct 6, 2005

It just don't stop.



frameset posted:

Events like PTQs and WMCQs also require judges, and often L2+ judges. We do not currently receive any foils for these.

Based on what I've heard on podcasts and such, the Pro Tour does not give out judge foils, either. (Pro Tour judges do receive other gifts from WotC, though; for Atlanta, it was jackets.)

Star Man
Jun 1, 2008

There's a star maaaaaan
Over the rainbow
That's it? You get a jacket for your trouble and money and time for going all the way out there?

Entropic
Feb 21, 2007

patriarchy sucks

Star Man posted:

That's it? You get a jacket for your trouble and money and time for going all the way out there?

You get your travel paid for too.

Star Man
Jun 1, 2008

There's a star maaaaaan
Over the rainbow

Entropic posted:

You get your travel paid for too.

At least there's that. I've jetted around the country for volunteer work when I was Circle K and I swear I've gotten better accommodations.

CellBlock
Oct 6, 2005

It just don't stop.



You also get whatever other comp is there, but WotC is the TO for the Pro Tour. For GPs, compensation is up to the TO, and WotC throws in the foils as a gift. (Most GP TOs have already shifted to paying a cash per diem instead of just sponsoring accommodation so that local judges don't lose out.)

This is a big shift, but the foils were never meant to be part of the compensation package; TOs have been aware of the change coming for a while now; and there are still 6 months until the new system is in effect.

I mean, I get not trusting Wizards on making a big change, what with MTGO and the new website, but the judge program is reasonably independent, and I generally trust things that come down from the L4s and L5s.

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born on a buy you
Aug 14, 2005

Odd Fullback
Bird Gang
Sack Them All
This is a big thing: http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/2014-2015-premier-play-updates-2014-07-29

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