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To be fair, he did undershoot how long we would be occupying the place. nutranurse posted:That's absolutely the most ridiculous decision you could make when doing a movie about Troy. It's like, wtf man, the Gods dicking around was the only way they could break up all the monotonous human stuff. Yeah, I mean, I get that it would be challenging to depict it literally without it looking stupid, but there are ways of showing the gods interfering with the battle without badly CGI-ing them.
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Jul 29, 2014 18:09
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the iraq war was good and didn't contribute to increasing terrorism
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Jul 29, 2014 18:10
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Swan Oat posted:the iraq war was good and didn't contribute to increasing terrorism actually, it wasn't.
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Jul 29, 2014 18:10
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Swan Oat posted:the iraq war was good and didn't contribute to increasing terrorism Also you can't prove that those more than 100,000 Iraqi civilians who died weren't all secretly working for the Iraqi military.
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Jul 29, 2014 18:11
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The war that was started on false pretense that led to the death of a million Iraqi civilians and even today has caused roaming bands of frothing theocratic madmen beheading people for no reason was a bad thing, in my estimation.
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Jul 29, 2014 18:12
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Look, if at any point any other nation in the world develops nuclear weapons, well, I guess we know where Saddam's WMDs ended up, yeah?  checkmate.
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Jul 29, 2014 18:12
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Chantilly Say posted:Look, if at any point any other nation in the world develops nuclear weapons, well, I guess we know where Saddam's WMDs ended up, yeah? Ugh, don't remind me. In 2007 there was a flurry of reports that Saddam's WMDs were in Syria!  After the Israelis bombed a Syrian facility. Turns out it was a Syrian nuclear reactor.The idea that Saddam's WMDs were blown up by the Israelis but nobody reported on it only makes sense when you realize the people who believe it actually regard the "mainstream media" as a conspiracy to suppress the truth of Bush's victory.
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Jul 29, 2014 18:17
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My own secret conspiracy theory is that they were so sure that Saddam had WMDs because we loving gave him gas and bio weapons when he was our ally in the 80's and since basically the whole Bush cabinet were Reagan veterans they were like "look, let's just trump up some evidence, and it won't matter because when we get in there, there will mos def be WMDs because we, meaning us the people here in this room gave them to him" and then whoops, they weren't there after all. e: I literally have zero evidence for this theory but I'm so diligent about sourcing and digging for info for almost everything else I believe I allow myself this one indulgence.
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Jul 29, 2014 18:20
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zoux posted:My own secret conspiracy theory is that they were so sure that Saddam had WMDs because we loving gave him gas and bio weapons when he was our ally in the 80's and since basically the whole Bush cabinet were Reagan veterans they were like "look, let's just trump up some evidence, and it won't matter because when we get in there, there will mos def be WMDs because we, meaning us the people here in this room gave them to him" and then whoops, they weren't there after all. Except for the fact chemical weapons expire. edit: This is actually a fun rail to be on. What's everyone's pet theory for why we invaded Iraq? I'd guess it was basically an expensive area denial against Russia/China. Pythagoras a trois fucked around with this message at 18:26 on Jul 29, 2014 |
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Jul 29, 2014 18:22
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The funny thing is, we weren't even looking for WMDs, we were looking for a WMD program. Specifically, a nuclear weapons program, for which zero evidence was found. Finding a few rusted shells of mustard gas in a closet somewhere wouldn't have validated Colin Powell's yellowcake speech before the UN.
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Jul 29, 2014 18:23
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Swan Oat posted:that's an excellent story, i'm glad they don't put up with poo poo from bad men if you're into this kinda stuff, check out The Coathangers especially their album "suck my shirt". they don't have the same incisive lyrical commentary that White Lung has, preferring a more pop punk love song approach to the lyrics but the energy is comparable and the music itself is great. their previous album was more synth punk so if you dig the new poo poo it might be worth checking out but it's a big change. (They ditched the synth and went straight punk for the new album) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xHfQ6bExTEc
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Jul 29, 2014 18:31
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I actually feel sort of bad for Colin Powell. Is that at least legit, or has he just been cast in an undeserved martyr role?
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Jul 29, 2014 18:32
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V. Illych L. posted:I actually feel sort of bad for Colin Powell. Is that at least legit, or has he just been cast in an undeserved martyr role? I'm not sure. I know that pre 9/11 he was part of the Cabinet faction that was vehemently opposed to invading Iraq and after 9/11 everyone had to toe the company line.
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Jul 29, 2014 18:33
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Powell either outright lied about WMDs or was wilfully deceived. i'd bet it's the latter based on everything else he's ever done but still a pretty big black mark on an otherwise good record
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Jul 29, 2014 18:35
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V. Illych L. posted:I actually feel sort of bad for Colin Powell. Is that at least legit, or has he just been cast in an undeserved martyr role? I think it's valid to feel bad for him - not vindicate him for "just following orders" by any means, but certainly feel bad for him. There's a lot of evidence that he fought against some of the Bush Administration's dumbest decisions behind the scenes.
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Jul 29, 2014 18:35
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There was a strong, strong sense of presenting a unified front post 9/11 that basically required everyone in the country to go  to some hosed up poo poo.Even my cold black heart was moved when the members of Congress spontaneously burst into God Bless America on the Capitol steps 
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Jul 29, 2014 18:37
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Cheekio posted:What's everyone's pet theory for why we invaded Iraq? I'd guess it was basically an expensive area denial against Russia/China. Economic stimulus That is why ISIL is now driving around in late model Ford trucks.
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Jul 29, 2014 18:46
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Cheekio posted:edit: This is actually a fun rail to be on. What's everyone's pet theory for why we invaded Iraq? I'd guess it was basically an expensive area denial against Russia/China. V. Illych L. posted:I actually feel sort of bad for Colin Powell. Is that at least legit, or has he just been cast in an undeserved martyr role? illrepute posted:Yep, that's it, Staev. 
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Jul 29, 2014 18:49
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Cheekio posted:Except for the fact chemical weapons expire. Do it better than daddy.
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Jul 29, 2014 18:51
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ReindeerF posted:Powell's original rise to stardom came as the rear end-kisser they sent to Vietnam to whitewash My Lai. Never feel sorry for that man, his whole career has been as an errand boy sent by grocery clerks to lie about the charges on a bill. I honestly did not know about this, or must have forgotten somehow. It makes me really sad to hear about this, but boy, he really did whitewash that whole atrocity, didn't he? quote:Yeah, I know, I deserve it. I was a colossal shithead back in the day. 
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Jul 29, 2014 18:52
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zoux posted:There was a strong, strong sense of presenting a unified front post 9/11 that basically required everyone in the country to go It wasn't just a post-9/11 thing, though. If you read through Daniel Ellsberg's Secrets (and if you haven't do it right now), you see that people throughout the command structure both in State and the Pentagon knew that things were going badly in Vietnam (including the Joint Chiefs and McNamara!), and thought LBJ was making bad decisions and lying to the public, but didn't feel they could do anything because they had to respect their superiors - and ultimately everything goes back to the President.
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Jul 29, 2014 18:53
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comes along bort posted:Angels in America? I actually thought of "And the Band Played On" as an answer to Reindeer, but I was thinking more of the book by Randy Shilts than the subsequent miniseries. (The book was great; I don't remember how faithful to it the miniseries was.)
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Jul 29, 2014 18:57
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Majorian posted:Yeah, I know, I deserve it. I was a colossal shithead back in the day.  Anyway, most of us do something hosed up at some point and we regret it and maybe try not to do it again, but Powell's resume is essentially the guy they hire to do hosed up poo poo because he's good at it and smiles through it. Sort of like Rumsfeld. Willa Rogers posted:I actually thought of "And the Band Played On" as an answer to Reindeer, but I was thinking more of the book by Randy Shilts than the subsequent miniseries. (The book was great; I don't remember how faithful to it the miniseries was.) Seriously, my mother basically had me read that when it came out and I was still a kid and I didn't really understand it. Re-read it later after watching the HBO movie with Modine and it made a lot more sense. The movie was not great, but it was good. The book, however, was fantastic. I'm not really old enough to know, but my recollection is that the book was a sort of watershed moment (at least among people who read books) when it came to the AIDS epidemic. Even though it slid in a bit after the insane "don't sit on queer toilets!" craze had backed off a bit. You'd know that better than I would, I'm sure. ReindeerF fucked around with this message at 19:00 on Jul 29, 2014 |
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Jul 29, 2014 18:57
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ReindeerF posted:I was and remain one. I turn 40 this year and life has taught me one thing: every day you look back at something and go Yeah, well, with Powell it's at least a little more understandable, given that he's a career military guy. He at least has the excuse of being indoctrinated into a mindset that follows orders without questioning them. Rummy's a special case, though - he's just a walking cluster of personality defects. A real piece of poo poo through and through.
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Jul 29, 2014 19:02
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spoon0042 posted:hipster concentration camp, that might not be a bad thing. Hey now, I resemble that remark. I'm working with some folks that are building a hipster wonderland out of an old cocoa-cola plant and a bunch of shipping containers. It pretty much a ticks all of the hipster wet dream boxes. Urban farm garden (x) glass artists (x) Stage for shows (x) Food entrepreneurship center (x) Artisan candy factory (x) Beer Garden (x) Nonprofit bike shop (x) Tech Incubator (x) Art Gallerys (x) This whole endeavor is being pretty much entirely driven by millennials. 
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Jul 29, 2014 19:21
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Leroy Diplowski posted:Hey now, I resemble that remark. I'm working with some folks that are building a hipster wonderland out of an old cocoa-cola plant and a bunch of shipping containers. It pretty much a ticks all of the hipster wet dream boxes. It's going to own when this fails miserably and also go gently caress yourself for participating in the whitest of white people activities.
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Jul 29, 2014 19:26
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Too bad that hell is other people
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Jul 29, 2014 19:30
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Will it at least get built?
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Jul 29, 2014 19:32
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DemeaninDemon posted:Will it at least get built? Lemme tell you the story about a goon commune in West Texas/Hawaii that, well, let's just say it struggled a bit.
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Jul 29, 2014 19:33
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DemeaninDemon posted:Will it at least get built? Well the website will, at least.
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Jul 29, 2014 19:33
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zoux posted:It's going to own when this fails miserably. we're supposed to be moving in by November 1st, so you won't have to wait too long. If it all goes to poo poo I'll do an effort post in the schadenfreude thread.
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Jul 29, 2014 19:40
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i think it's good when people try things especially when it makes them happy i wish them the best of luck namaste
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Jul 29, 2014 19:40
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Captain_Maclaine posted:Well the website will, at least. They'll inevitably hire Justine Tunney to run the twitter, just watch.
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Jul 29, 2014 19:42
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I'm going to be in Germany next week on a research trip, Koblenz specifically, and since we spend roughly half our time in this thread/subforum derailing about food and talking about how politics have made us all borderline alcoholics, I figured I'd see if any of you had recommendations on beers/places to eat.
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Jul 29, 2014 19:43
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I moved to a pretty rural area recently noticed some gas stations advertise ethanol-free gas. How much of this is ethanol legitimately causing engine damage and how much of it is out of hatred for anything that even looks like it might be more evironmentally friendly?
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Jul 29, 2014 19:45
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R. Mute posted:i think it's good when people try things especially when it makes them happy What if they are making an artisan candy shoppe?
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Jul 29, 2014 19:48
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zoux posted:What if they are making an artisan candy shoppe?
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Jul 29, 2014 19:50
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All of those things as separate entities sound like Good Cool Things that, when bunched together within proximity of the dwellings of the people running them seems insufferable. I can only air my white bougieness in small doses.
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Jul 29, 2014 19:51
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You get better MPG on ethanol-free, too. Edit: Why would you think Ethanol is environmentally friendly? It's just a bad idea all around. Yes, it's made out of corn, but that just causes other problems.
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Jul 29, 2014 19:51
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made of bees posted:I moved to a pretty rural area recently noticed some gas stations advertise ethanol-free gas. How much of this is ethanol legitimately causing engine damage and how much of it is out of hatred for anything that even looks like it might be more evironmentally friendly? Need it for marine engines. Also you want ethanol free for small engines like mowers, lawn tractors, or weedeaters. They'll run with 10% ethanol, but they run crappy after a while because of it.
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