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We could use a 40k Tactics and Army lists Critique thread we talk about it here but we could also help build lists etc.. My drugs are kicking in but I'll try to do one when I wake up. or Someone else can make one I suck at making threads. Hollismason fucked around with this message at 03:50 on Aug 11, 2014 |
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Aug 11, 2014 02:58
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Hollismason posted:Should I make a Warhammmer Tactics and army lists for 40k Discussion thread?
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Aug 11, 2014 03:17
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I don't know what net list means, but it also have stuff like dirty tactics, how to spot cheaters, and not be exclusive to 40k. As well as going into explaining dice mechanics. I just don't have the energy for it right now. Hollismason fucked around with this message at 03:55 on Aug 11, 2014 |
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Aug 11, 2014 03:51
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Hollismason posted:I don't know what net list means, but it also have stuff like dirty tactics, how to spot cheaters, and not be exclusive to 40k. Net lists are usually the kind of lists that are made specifically to be as cheesy and powerful as possible. Using every exploit an army has to be as good as possible. At least that's what I associate it with.
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Aug 11, 2014 03:58
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Net lists can also mean lists that look skewed on paper and which negatively affect discussion of an army book without actually being a balanced review of said book. In theory.
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Aug 11, 2014 04:02
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Master Twig posted:Net lists are usually the kind of lists that are made specifically to be as cheesy and powerful as possible. Using every exploit an army has to be as good as possible. Also generally means not of your own creation, expect to find it at the local tourney scene with very little change. "Of course you created that on your own.... Suuuuuure you did."
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Aug 11, 2014 04:02
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That's what I take it to mean, lists you'll see over and over with only minor alterations.
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Aug 11, 2014 04:21
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Netlists are the stupid power-builds that you see on sites like Dakka, Whoreseer etc where units are minmaxed to the point where winning is primary, secondary and tertiary. Fun is usually not in the netlister's vocabulary, nor on their opponent's mind when playing the game. Netlisting is bad and people who do it should feel bad. It's one of the primary reasons why everyone hates the idea of Unbound and Daemonfactory lists, because we all dread that someday we'll come across 'that guy' who brings nothing but AV13 Dreads in a 1500pt game because the internet told him so.
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Aug 11, 2014 04:22
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HiveCommander posted:Netlists are the stupid power-builds that you see on sites like Dakka, Whoreseer etc where units are minmaxed to the point where winning is primary, secondary and tertiary. Fun is usually not in the netlister's vocabulary, nor on their opponent's mind when playing the game. But then see son you then bring 3 alt lists and armies and do the math at the tourney to see which net list is the most common and then enter the counter-net-net list so you increase your odds of winning. Or just play some dumb fun dark horse army and have hygienically challenged man-child scoff at your army and make derogatory comments about your painting while he idly scratches flakes of dandruff off his head.
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Aug 11, 2014 04:41
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LingcodKilla posted:But then see son you then bring 3 alt lists and armies and do the math at the tourney to see which net list is the most common and then enter the counter-net-net list so you increase your odds of winning. You could always take comfort that your own paintjob is cleaner than he is  Taking dumb fun dark horse lists are great though, because that sort of manchildren get so used to studying up on how to counter the top-tier lists that they forget that there is in fact armies that aren't Skyblight, Eldar, Tau, or Knightspam.
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Aug 11, 2014 05:51
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WhiteOutMouse posted:Both of these photos remind me of dino riders in the best possible way. I had the tyrannosaurus in the picture. The damned thing was absolutely massive and motorized; it slowly lurched across the floor making sad roaring noises. Five year old me thought it was awesome, but it scared the living poo poo out of my toddler little brother-- he used to run and hide when it started walking.
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Aug 11, 2014 06:22
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HiveCommander posted:You could always take comfort that your own paintjob is cleaner than he is Must of been 2001 or so but my absolute favorite weirdo sighting was a fatty in a muumuu with full size 3rd edition rule book suspended on a chain around his neck resting on his chest.
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Aug 11, 2014 06:23
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LingcodKilla posted:Must of been 2001 or so but my absolute favorite weirdo sighting was a fatty in a muumuu with full size 3rd edition rule book suspended on a chain around his neck resting on his chest. I painted a lot of poo poo today. First I did up a Cadian command squad for my retro duders. I love the old plasma gunner, since it looks like the plasma gun is actually a rifle and not a huge heavy weapon. The old paunchy officer is also one of my absolute favorite IG sculpts; his face has tons of character and his shotgun is super cool:        Second, I did some Obliterators from that Russian dude on eBay. I think I switched golds between the last one I did and these ones, since the colors seem really different.Maybe I just didn't shake mine up enough, dunno. Either way, they were fun to paint and painted up quickly:       
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Aug 11, 2014 06:29
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LingcodKilla posted:Must of been 2001 or so but my absolute favorite weirdo sighting was a fatty in a muumuu with full size 3rd edition rule book suspended on a chain around his neck resting on his chest. That... would've been quite the sight. I'm now imagining Homer Simpson playing 3rd ed 40k and having difficulty finding the SRM, those are some cool Oblits. The mutated Chaos Terminator look for Oblits is a lot better than the official models IMO.
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Aug 11, 2014 06:34
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HiveCommander posted:That... would've been quite the sight. I'm now imagining Homer Simpson playing 3rd ed 40k and having difficulty finding the Yup. You about nailed it.
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Aug 11, 2014 06:37
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Thank you! They're pretty much the only "not 40k" alternative models I have, although they're sold by some Russian recaster on eBay. I wish I could find the original sculptor and see if they have much else, I can only find these guys and a Nurgle version. Fun fact: a ton of the weapon bits are blatantly taken from GW kits.
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Aug 11, 2014 06:37
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Fearless posted:I had the tyrannosaurus in the picture. The damned thing was absolutely massive and motorized; it slowly lurched across the floor making sad roaring noises. Five year old me thought it was awesome, but it scared the living poo poo out of my toddler little brother-- he used to run and hide when it started walking. I had, and indeed probably still have somewhere in my parent's shed, the Pterosaur hangglider in the top right, and the Deinonychus (before Jurassic Park made everything a Velociraptor   ) on the left with the helmet. He had a button on his back that you pushed to make the legs kick 
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Aug 11, 2014 06:38
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Oh god, I just thought of something horrible... Since GW are going chariot-crazy this edition, and I have a feeling that Draigo is probably going to end up with something that looks like Karamazov's throne being pulled by a Dreadknight. Remember, you heard it here first. On a lighter note, seriously looking through Forge World's Heresy stuff trying to decide on what would look best for EC. I like the look of mkIV Maximus with Tigrus Bolters (because chunky bolters look old-tech as gently caress  ), would they be a good fit for them? Pretty sure last time I was asking about EC heresy-era armour I was told that mkIV was a good fit for them.
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Aug 11, 2014 07:11
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HiveCommander posted:Oh god, I just thought of something horrible... Since GW are going chariot-crazy this edition, and I have a feeling that Draigo is probably going to end up with something that looks like Karamazov's throne being pulled by a Dreadknight. Remember, you heard it here first. Archon on a chariot being pulled by slaves on hoverboards. Comes with hoverboards, but you need to buy troop boxes from other armies to make the slaves, one from each army is recommended.
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Aug 11, 2014 07:21
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SRM I have never before made a post in this thread just to comment on a paint job but I would be out of line to not tell you those oblits are my favorite thing that I've ever seen.
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Aug 11, 2014 07:27
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The Venom is already a chariot with nothing pulling it, but bonus points if the 'official' model uses the skeevy slaves from the old Dais of Destruction.
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Aug 11, 2014 07:29
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HiveCommander posted:That... would've been quite the sight. I'm now imagining Homer Simpson playing 3rd ed 40k and having difficulty finding the The official models are pretty clearly meant to be mutated terminators, I think. It's just less obvious since for some reason they're significantly bigger than the terminators, but they're the same shape and have a lot of the same parts, just scaled up. I guess the size is part of the mutation, since as we all know, in the 40k universe being awesome is correlated with gigantism.
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Aug 11, 2014 07:42
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"Alright, ladz, lock yer spoilas into waaaaaaaagh position!" Boon posted:This is all good advice. Part of the problem is that I'm looking at least one player who will run 4 Knights, but probably two. So there is a good chance I will face a Knight army. Ah, yeah, that would be a concern. Hawks are a pretty nasty tool against Knights 'cause of the Haywire grenades, so that's a solid choice; Spyders also can work there dues to massed S6. If Knights are a big concern, consider trying out Wraithguard inside the Serpents- five S10 shots (rerolling 1s because you had the Spiritseer tag along with them) is no joke, and if you use the Iyanden book you can even pop off Voice of Twighlight for run -> shoot shenanigans in order to dodge their Ion Shield. The Suncannon has just never impressed me much. 5+ invuln isn't an awful thing to have, but S6 small blast? Meh. It'll wreck some idiot who brings Deathwing, but who needs help with that? Ditto on the Trukks- if your four Serpents, artillery battery, and other WK aren't already evaporating all of their dumb little boxes, then something has gone horribly wrong. But it's your option, I guess- just that if you're facing Knights, those S10 are gonna get you waaaaaaay more mileage than a 40pt Best Frag Missile Launcher. Naramyth posted:So, been thinking about feat of blades and that airplanes can't score. Kill points being game one means I still want to play big denial. So I'm thinking of running azblob now that priests are loving crazy. Maybe run Pask in a Punisher plus an Executioner? The vanilla Tank Commander isn't awful, but Pask is so much better it's not even funny. I feel like cramming a Techmarine with a Power Field in there is something you want, but in 1500 that might be a stretch. Wyverns would do some good gap-filling there, but I worry about your anti-tank at this point. Hrm. BuffaloChicken posted:*pics* You are the best warham. HiveCommander posted:Netlists are the stupid power-builds that you see on sites like Dakka, Whoreseer etc where units are minmaxed to the point where winning is primary, secondary and tertiary. Fun is usually not in the netlister's vocabulary, nor on their opponent's mind when playing the game. An alternate take: netlisting is what really whiny people call any list that they don't like because the idea of the dissemination of good information threatens their closeted view of how the game "should" be and anyone who has fun in a way they don't approve of is "ruining the game." I bet drat near everyone in this thread has, at some point or another, seen something on the internets (a list, a model, a paint scheme) and said "that is really cool and I want to try that," and there is absolutely nothing wrong with that. Blaming players for GW's lovely rules design is a rather backwards way to go about things.
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Aug 11, 2014 08:10
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We already blame GW for their own lovely rules design, there's always a backup regiment of apologists in this thread on standby to defend them though. There's also a big difference between fielding an army entirely of Warriors, Raveners, Carnifexen and Tyrannofexen because it'd be cool and you can re-enact Starship Troopers and looking over the tournament-winning lists for [insert faction here] and most obnoxious deathstar imaginable to put on the table in casual games. The former is something that one of my friends has been convincing me to do for years, and the latter is how I feel whenever the local Iron Hands player drops his Chapter Master on bike with Storm Shield, Gorgon's Chain, Thunder Hammer with a squad of Storm Shield bikes including an Apothecary and Librarian hoping for Invisibility. Seeing cool models, conversions or paintjobs and wanting to make an army around them isn't 'netlisting', looking for cheese-builds, hardcore denial lists and copy-pasting recent tourney winning lists with maybe slight wargear alterations is. EDIT: Found out the name of the super-chain relic that IH have HiveCommander fucked around with this message at 08:37 on Aug 11, 2014 |
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Aug 11, 2014 08:32
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SRM, cool dudes. Looking forward to what you do with the Space Marine Librarian sent your way! And, at long last, I finished the Squats! They play as a Veteran Squad with 4+ save, two meltaguns, and a flamer. When joined by a Priest they cost 125 points, exactly enough to tag along with my Imperial Knight as a neat 500pt attachment to any of my other IG lists.  I wanted an Imperial Priest to tag along and show that not all the Squats are secular allies of the Mechanicus. This guy proves that the little dudes are still squarely on the side of the Emperor.  Thanks again to BULBASAUR for donating the arms, and to that dude I know who had a bunch of minis in his basement when I was at his house for a party and gave me the dwarfs for my birthday. You guys make dreams reality.
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Aug 11, 2014 08:59
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Fearless posted:I had the tyrannosaurus in the picture. The damned thing was absolutely massive and motorized; it slowly lurched across the floor making sad roaring noises. Five year old me thought it was awesome, but it scared the living poo poo out of my toddler little brother-- he used to run and hide when it started walking. I think I have a video from christmas 89, of my younger brother fleeing in terror from that t-rex toy.
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Aug 11, 2014 09:56
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Regarding next listing and power cheese, is psychic heavy deemed to be such ? I roll 2x CsM Sorcerer (lv2-lv3) an allied unit of horrors and a Lord of change.
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Aug 11, 2014 12:29
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I've always liked the idea of a lot of MCs in an army - people were saying this new forgeworld book is good for tyranids. What's so good about it? Do they do ebooks?
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Aug 11, 2014 12:31
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SRM posted:Second, I did some Obliterators from that Russian dude on eBay. I think I switched golds between the last one I did and these ones, since the colors seem really different.Maybe I just didn't shake mine up enough, dunno. Either way, they were fun to paint and painted up quickly: Really digging these, esp the green on the guns. Top notch.
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Aug 11, 2014 12:40
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Foul Ole Ron posted:Regarding next listing and power cheese, is psychic heavy deemed to be such ? Lord Twisted posted:I've always liked the idea of a lot of MCs in an army - people were saying this new forgeworld book is good for tyranids. What's so good about it? Do they do ebooks? Stone Crusher Carnifices are good. Malanthropes are GREAT, though not technically a Monstrous Creature anymore. The Dimachaeron is... pretty much awful and will never be bought/used. It's a jumbled mess both in terms of model and rules, but ultimately if someone did ever use it compares really well to a beefed-up Carnifex in the Elite slot. As far as I know Forgeworld doesn't support eBooks at all. There doesn't appear to be an option to purchase anything other than a physical print on their website and I can't find anything FW-related on the Black Library eBook site. PierreTheMime fucked around with this message at 13:03 on Aug 11, 2014 |
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Aug 11, 2014 12:59
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HiveCommander posted:The former is something that one of my friends has been convincing me to do for years, and the latter is how I feel whenever the local Iron Hands player drops his Chapter Master on bike with Storm Shield, Gorgon's Chain, Thunder Hammer with a squad of Storm Shield bikes including an Apothecary and Librarian hoping for Invisibility. Okay, so I don't know your local IH player, but let me just put something out there: maybe he isn't doing that specifically to make the game unfun for you. Maybe he's doing it because he enjoys playing the game to and he finds the idea of a super-tough combat character screaming for the Emperor's Vengeance as he shrugs off the firepower from dirty heretics and worthless xenos from every angle to be really cool. So what if he wasn't the one who invented that build for the Chapter Master? Let's be honest here: none of us are "inventing" anything new or original, we're just taking the pieces GW gave us and arranging them in slightly-different ways. It doesn't take a supergenius to realize that hey, I can give this tough puncher gear to make him tougher and punchier and that ends up being pretty good. Taking ideas that other people have come up with and making use of them yourself isn't called "netlisting," it's called "learning." Being against learning is not a strong position to take. I get that playing against a highly competitive list in a casual environment may not be any fun for you, and that's fair. You have every right to decline a game from that guy on those grounds, and if the problem is pervasive enough it can make getting games in at all somewhat difficult. But creating straw men to blame the problem on- "They just hate fun! All they do is copy lists off the internet and cheat!"- isn't helping things any. Talk to the person. Talk to your play group. There's no shame in saying "Look, I don't want to play this game competitively because that's not what I enjoy about it," just as there shouldn't be any shame in saying the opposite. You can both be a part of this hobby and enjoy it in different ways without having to set yourselves up as adversaries. Hell, you can even play each other with wholly different goals and attitudes and still enjoy the game. But it's not going to happen if your method of engagement is name-calling and passive-aggressive sniping at the other guy's aspects of the hobby. Maybe this guy is just a total dickhole; like I said, I don't know him. But at least give him a chance to show that he isn't before you make that condemnation, because I've found that most people in this hobby are actually really decent folks if you just take a bit to get to know them. Let him know what the problem is in a reasonable, non-accusatory manner and chances are he'll be willing to accommodate you in some way (by toning down his list, by creating some kind of scenario, by just taking it easy when he plays you, etc.) You don't need to go looking for imaginary enemies. Lord Twisted posted:I've always liked the idea of a lot of MCs in an army - people were saying this new forgeworld book is good for tyranids. What's so good about it? Do they do ebooks? As far as I know none of the FW content is available (legally) online, unfortunately. IA4 basically gives Tyranids one huge boost, the Malanthrope; it's Toughness 5, four wounds, has 3+ armor, and has the Spore Cloud rule that gives out Shrouded to everything within 6" of it. It fills the same role as the Venomthrope from the codex, but is tougher by half a dozen degrees and thus is far more likely to stay alive and protecting the rest of the army, which is critical. Add in a host of other benefits (Synapse, conditional Preferred Enemy aura, poisoned attacks, etc) and you have a very solid support addition that solves a major problem of the book. They also get the Stonecrusher Carnifex, which is a bit more expensive (30pts) than a normal 'Fex but hits waaaaaay harder- AP2 Hammer of Wrath attacks and -1Str on enemy shooting attacks against it. There's a handful of other critters in there as well, but they're mostly middling and not as important as the first two.
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Aug 11, 2014 13:02
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To be honest I always found the typical net lister was really bad at the game and even though they had the hot off the press cheese of the week they still didn't know how to use it.
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Aug 11, 2014 13:16
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Ugh... I really need to get my poo poo together and finish building this loving Minotaurs army.
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Aug 11, 2014 13:54
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Thanks guys! I have a friend who likes IA books so I might be able to split the cost with him. Just wanted to know what I should be looking out for.
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Aug 11, 2014 14:26
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serious gaylord posted:To be honest I always found the typical net lister was really bad at the game and even though they had the hot off the press cheese of the week they still didn't know how to use it. It turns out that most players, netlister or casual, are actually not very good at this game.
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Aug 11, 2014 15:16
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Sharzak posted:SRM I have never before made a post in this thread just to comment on a paint job but I would be out of line to not tell you those oblits are my favorite thing that I've ever seen. CyberLord XP posted:Really digging these, esp the green on the guns. Top notch. BuffaloChicken posted:SRM, cool dudes. Looking forward to what you do with the Space Marine Librarian sent your way! Also, what's the verdict on Chaos Decimators? I was looking at one but it'd end up being about 100 bucks for one with two arms these days.
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Aug 11, 2014 15:24
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BuffaloChicken posted:Totally awesome things Mah brotha. I'm always glad to see your conversion stuff, and your Jurassic Park IG are my favorite army ever.
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Aug 11, 2014 15:47
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The 30k models are awesome in general but putting them on kick-rear end resin bases (in this case, Dragonforge's Ancient Ruins set) makes them look even better. Cannot wait to get these painted.
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Aug 11, 2014 15:52
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SRM posted:Thanks guys! I love the poo poo out of mine but he's been pretty worthless as an actual unit on the table. Draws fire like a Vindicator though, so there's that.
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Aug 11, 2014 15:59
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Ugh I want some of those 30k figures and I will never play this game. I just want Argel Tal and Kharn and maybe Malcador if they ever make him.
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Aug 11, 2014 16:07
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