|
BIG HEADLINE posted:A friend of my father's landed gear-up in a C-2 once. Those are basically flying delivery trucks. They promoted her, moved her to P-3s (I guess so she could have the chance to crash something more expensive), and she retired a rank higher than my father. I love flying but I've hated the few times I've had to take a C2 ride to or from the boat. No ejection seat, surrounded by a bunch of people who have no idea how to react if it ends up in the water. I always sit right underneath the escape hatch that is in the roof. I figured I probably had the best chance of actually getting to it and getting it open since it's something we practice in water survival.
|
#
?
Aug 13, 2014 06:37
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 7, 2024 19:16 |
|
|
I think I'd make a good pilot in the sense that I'm good at checklist like tasks and at noticing small details, but I'm afraid of transposing numbers in my head even if I were to read them back correctly.
|
|
#
?
Aug 13, 2014 06:59
|
|
|
BIG HEADLINE posted:"The three pilots in the cockpit had a combined 10,000 hours of flying time in the C-5, and were backed by two flight engineers with a combined 12,000 hours in the air. All of the crew members were offered the opportunity to speak to reporters and all declined, according to Dover Air Force Base spokeswoman Lt. Col. Cheryl Law." Godholio posted:They didn't land gear-up, they came down short of the runway because they idled the wrong engine and only had 2 running instead of the 3 they thought. I think they're talking about the gear-up B1 landing, pictures above ^
|
|
#
?
Aug 13, 2014 07:47
|
|
|
The Ferret King posted:I think they're talking about the gear-up B1 landing, pictures above ^ Or the C-17 gear-up landing at BAF (what should've been a write-off was only averted through a Boeing depot team and a couple months of work)...or the C-17 landing at the wrong airport...or Sitka 43. Although in fairness there were (are?) bigger issues at play within the C-17 community than just some poor CRM.
|
|
#
?
Aug 13, 2014 10:25
|
|
|
My PPL instructor hounded me the MUFF* check into so much that I still had it run through my mind when leveling out on final a few hundred hours later. I was many hundreds of hours less than those professional guys, though. After my getting my PPL, I think a notable part for the flight school I then went to going bankrupt was due to 2 of their complex trainers being belly landed. I wish I'd stuck with the first school... *(Mixture, Undercarriage, Flaps: Final)
|
|
#
?
Aug 13, 2014 11:22
|
|
|
The enemy is over-familiarity, it seems. Firstly, familiarity with procedure, and after they were introduced, familiarity with the checklist. The second obviously takes a lot longer than the first to become over-familiar with, and indeed catches the mistakes of the first issue most of the time, but no system is ever perfect.
|
|
#
?
Aug 13, 2014 11:36
|
|
|
simplefish posted:The enemy is over-familiarity, it seems. Firstly, familiarity with procedure, and after they were introduced, familiarity with the checklist. The second obviously takes a lot longer than the first to become over-familiar with, and indeed catches the mistakes of the first issue most of the time, but no system is ever perfect. The enemy is not necessarily familiarity, but complacency. You do the same thing so many times that you expect the aircraft to do *this* when you do *that* or that everything is going to work the way it always has. I say this without a single hour behind a stick but it applies to everything. Once you even get the tiniest hunch something is out of place you need to go on full alert and double-check EVERYTHING.
|
|
#
?
Aug 13, 2014 12:20
|
|
|
rockopete posted:It's being retired? I've lived within 10 miles of Stewart ANG my entire life, they recently switched to the C-17 and shipped out their C-5's.... so after ~30 years I don't hear that roar anymore  I work across the street from Stewart and a few months ago a C-5 came in for whatever. Everyone, who a few years prior would've ignored it, stopped and watched it land, it was pretty cool to see non-aviation people do that.
|
|
#
?
Aug 13, 2014 12:32
|
|
|
Beach Bum posted:The enemy is not necessarily familiarity, but complacency. You do the same thing so many times that you expect the aircraft to do *this* when you do *that* or that everything is going to work the way it always has. This is what happens with seasoned guys. You become comfortable, then confident, then complacent and the junior guy in the cockpit convinces himself "well this guy knows what he's doing" and there ya go. Dual engine military helicopters will get hot gas (blades turning during refuel) with the engine closest to the nozzle pulled back to idle. I've known more than one senior, 2000+ hour pilot who got the one overtorque of their career by getting in a rush, taking on 2000lbs of gas, then trying to yank out of the refuel pad single engine because they skipped checking that both power levers were at Fly. Fixed gear for life!
|
|
#
?
Aug 13, 2014 12:56
|
|
|
As a flight instructor, I hate when students opt for long straight in finals as opposed to a nice patten entry. Why? The judgement on "when" to do the GUMPS* check and slow the airplane down is hard for them. Obviously they learn it in time, but I refuse to do the long straight ins on my Mooney with retractable gear. I always opt for a right base or left base (or even make a small one to give myself familiarity and time to process). Hell, the day before I sent a student for his private checkride, he did a landing with zero flaps completely unintentional. Why? Because I got him out of sequence. It happens to everyone, unfortunately. *GAS UNDERCARRIAGE MIXTURE PROP SWITCHES
|
|
#
?
Aug 13, 2014 14:41
|
|
|
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YffmapFxt0M The beeping sound is the gear warning horn, triggered by a low power setting with the gear handle in the up position.
|
|
#
?
Aug 13, 2014 15:22
|
|
|
CharlesM posted:I think I'd make a good pilot in the sense that I'm good at checklist like tasks and at noticing small details, but I'm afraid of transposing numbers in my head even if I were to read them back correctly. Now do this repeatedly for years while tired, on deployment, flying with various crew mix-ups, in bad weather, during an emergency, when radios are blowing up, with inattentive pilots, etc. Mistakes happen. I drat near caused an E-3 to plow into the ground because I just overlooked a simple checklist item. Good thing I was flying with a godly pilot who knew what happened. Not my finest moment. poo poo happens.
|
|
#
?
Aug 13, 2014 16:48
|
|
|
MrYenko posted:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YffmapFxt0M Were they doing an intentional belly landing? They look singularly unconcerned about it. Alarm beepers drive me absolutely nuts, I have to find a way to make them stop before I can do anything else. Of course in the marine world, all you need to do for 90% of them is find the right "ALAM ACK" button. (There's a lot of stupid alarms you don't need to worry about, which is dangerous because it makes the important ones that much more likely to be ignored.)
|
|
#
?
Aug 13, 2014 16:54
|
|
|
FrozenVent posted:Were they doing an intentional belly landing? They look singularly unconcerned about it. Watch a few episodes of Air Disasters on Smithsonian. It's amazing how many of those accidents could be avoided if people actually paid attention to the alarms they heard. A lot of time they intentionally ignore them or get fixated on something else and they are pushed out of the consciousness.
|
|
#
?
Aug 13, 2014 17:06
|
|
|
FrozenVent posted:Were they doing an intentional belly landing? They look singularly unconcerned about it. The problem is that every aircraft that beeps when the throttle is below 1/3 and the gear is up, simply trains you to ignore the beeper because it's 'always going off when I'm descending'. Which is pretty much exactly what you said about 'stupid alarms'. That said, short of adding a radar altimeter, I'm not sure how you could make the gear up warning more useful.
|
|
#
?
Aug 13, 2014 17:08
|
|
|
rockopete posted:The Chinook and C-130 fuselage, god drat. The C-17 can do the former, probably not the latter.
|
|
#
?
Aug 13, 2014 17:09
|
|
|
FrozenVent posted:Were they doing an intentional belly landing? They look singularly unconcerned about it. No, its simply an excellent example of human factors. Humans can get accustomed to all sorts of things that aren't necessarily normal. In this case, they became so used to the gear alarm going off during the descent, that they simply tuned it out.
|
|
#
?
Aug 13, 2014 17:13
|
|
|
holocaust bloopers posted:Now do this repeatedly for years while tired, on deployment, flying with various crew mix-ups, in bad weather, during an emergency, when radios are blowing up, with inattentive pilots, etc. Yeah I know. Sometimes I think about the perception of pilots an doctors and how we sort of think of them as supermen, but then I realize they're human just like me. Probably a fair number of them might be stupider than me, too. I'm a good defensive driver but I've made mistakes before! I kinda look forward to when we can reliably have computers drive and fly.
|
|
#
?
Aug 14, 2014 04:08
|
|
|
Interesting to see doctors pop up in this discussion. Yesterday a coworker's mom died after a doc nicked her spleen during hip surgery or something and she bled to death. It really doesn't take much to gently caress things up pretty badly in some careers.
|
|
#
?
Aug 14, 2014 07:17
|
|
|
"Pilot's arm came off while landing" is probably not something you want to hear about your flight:quote:A pilot lost control of a passenger plane after his artificial arm became detached as he was coming in to land, an accident report has said.
|
|
#
?
Aug 14, 2014 09:18
|
|
|
mobby_6kl posted:"Pilot's arm came off while landing" is probably not something you want to hear about your flight: I can only picture the pilot with an eye patch too
|
|
#
?
Aug 14, 2014 12:52
|
|
|
Where the passengers up in arms about this?
|
|
#
?
Aug 14, 2014 13:23
|
|
|
Did any of the passengers lend a hand?
|
|
#
?
Aug 14, 2014 13:39
|
|
|
I’ve heard of short‐handed flight crews, but that’s just ridiculous.
|
|
#
?
Aug 14, 2014 14:10
|
|
|
Bet he didn't clap after landing.
|
|
#
?
Aug 14, 2014 14:55
|
|
|
I'm glad no one was hurt, because I was laughing pretty hard after the first sentence. um, arm pun.
|
|
#
?
Aug 14, 2014 15:09
|
|
|
The Pilot posted:I'll give up control of this plane when you pry it from my cold, dead hand.
|
|
#
?
Aug 14, 2014 16:41
|
|
|
Man, and I thought my instructor was being harsh when he told me I couldn't fly my plane one handed.
|
|
#
?
Aug 14, 2014 17:21
|
|
|
The tension in the cockpit after that landing was quickly diffused by the co-pilot's disarming smile. I want to say that one arm-ed-ness might be a legitimate disqualification for commercial airline pilots. But I hope it doesn't become one, because I'd fly with that guy.
|
|
#
?
Aug 14, 2014 18:10
|
|
|
bunnyofdoom posted:Man, and I thought my instructor was being harsh when he told me I couldn't fly my plane one handed. CHALLENGE ACCEPTED
|
|
#
?
Aug 14, 2014 19:47
|
|
|
Hermsgervørden posted:The tension in the cockpit after that landing was quickly diffused by the co-pilot's disarming smile. One of my instructors in college (and a close friend to this day) was born with a congenital defect that left him with nothing below the elbow on his right arm. It didn't affect his flying ability one bit, nor did it stop him from riding a motorcycle or driving a car with a manual transmission.
|
|
#
?
Aug 14, 2014 20:11
|
|
|
MrChips posted:One of my instructors in college (and a close friend to this day) was born with a congenital defect that left him with nothing below the elbow on his right arm. It didn't affect his flying ability one bit, nor did it stop him from riding a motorcycle or driving a car with a manual transmission. Jesus, I could see driving stick one handed with my right hand, but I'm trying to imagine it with the left and its not working. E: Motorcycle is probably more impressive, but I don't know poo poo about motorcycles.
|
|
#
?
Aug 14, 2014 20:58
|
|
|
bitcoin bastard posted:Jesus, I could see driving stick one handed with my right hand, but I'm trying to imagine it with the left and its not working. Maybe he had a JDM/British import? v  v
|
|
#
?
Aug 14, 2014 21:00
|
|
|
bitcoin bastard posted:Jesus, I could see driving stick one handed with my right hand, but I'm trying to imagine it with the left and its not working. Considering that your right hand controls throttle and most of your braking, it's something special. Sure, you could move throttle to the left hand and link the front and rear brakes, but then the left hand is still doing gas and clutch at the same time.
|
|
#
?
Aug 14, 2014 21:03
|
|
|
Safety Dance posted:Considering that your right hand controls throttle and most of your braking, it's something special. Sure, you could move throttle to the left hand and link the front and rear brakes, but then the left hand is still doing gas and clutch at the same time. It's "easy" enough to do a custom bike. One of my previous neighbors had a customer who lost his left leg (the one used for shifting), and moved the gear selector up to one of the handle bars. I imagine that you could probably move the throttle to the right foot as a separate leaver than the foot brake. Or just get a damned automatic Goldwing already.
|
|
#
?
Aug 14, 2014 21:09
|
|
|
It's been done: http://www.shockmansion.com/2011/03/13/armleg-amputee-racing-motorcycles/ (semi-NSFW images on page)
|
|
#
?
Aug 14, 2014 22:29
|
|
|
Back to some AI. JATO assisted Ercoupe takeoffs! Would this still be considered light sport? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2w0mKobISt4
|
|
#
?
Aug 15, 2014 01:38
|
|
|
I guess you'd also need some reverse rockets to keep it under 120? If you can't be fast, at least be loud as gently caress.
|
|
#
?
Aug 15, 2014 01:54
|
|
|
Entone posted:Back to some AI. JATO assisted Ercoupe takeoffs! Would this still be considered light sport? At about 25 seconds one of the rockets firing upwards explodes 
|
|
#
?
Aug 15, 2014 03:02
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 7, 2024 19:16 |
|
|
Saw this and thought of you: "What happens when a thunderstorm hits the world's largest airport (ATL)"
|
|
#
?
Aug 15, 2014 09:50
|
|