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My country has gone crazy by Andrey Makarevich https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MvfKYpjSkrg
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Sep 11, 2014 08:57
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Elukka posted:The Su-25 claim is hilarious, particularly the new idea that it shot it down with its gun. This is a plane that is not only slower than the 777, but also has a maximum altitude about 3 kilometers below MH17's cruise altitude in clean configuration with no weapons on the pylons. Don't forget, the Dutch report also shows the holes in the flight deck floor point downwards, so it would have to have been flying above it at a pretty sharp angle.
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Sep 11, 2014 09:00
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Mightypeon posted:You could also make the comparison to US president Polk running total roughshod over Mexico. Hint: Mexican resistance didnt exactly work. Awww, I missed Mightypeon and his ability to whitewash actions of Russia by pointing at some historical event over a hundred years ago 
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Sep 11, 2014 09:17
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Liandar posted:Did someone actually found the source picture or are you just assuming? First time it comes from fake separatists site novorossia.ru with following title "Donetsk mothers received mailed package with heads of their killed sons inside from Ukrainian army... blablahbla" No clues, no sources, no names of persons who was killed, or mothers names. News in 3 lines Now this "news" comes from another fake separatists site with diametrically opposite title. And now its separatists mailed this package to Ukrainian army. And again: no clues, no sources, no names persons who was killed. There is no even raised criminal case by fact of murder. Ukrainian army is gov department you know.. and it has to react accordingly. So that the conclusion? It's a fake. Some one wants to sow hatred between people. Take a look at face of cadavers, they are not slavic or ossetians, not even chechen. Whey are syrians. So that fake comes from Syria.
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Sep 11, 2014 09:35
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Just a head's up for our friends in Estonia, Four German Eurofighters and 160 German soldiers are now stationed in Estonia. The small unit is part of an NATO-effort to secure the Baltics' air space. In other news, Poroshenko wants to build his own version of the Maginot-line. Hopefully it works better then the French version! Merkel also said she wanted the new sanctions put into work immediately, but now apparently other nations are dragging their feet. Welp, that's the great European Union at work, chaotic as usual.
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Sep 11, 2014 09:37
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Libluini posted:In other news, Poroshenko wants to build his own version of the Maginot-line. Hopefully it works better then the French version! Imagine Putin invading Ukraine through Belarus.
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Sep 11, 2014 09:40
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Phobophilia posted:Also, I have no loving clue why the conspiracy crowd are saying it's a Ukrainian Su-25 that shot down MH17. Su-25s are a loving ground attack plane, they're like Warthogs, they fly low and slow and shoot things below them. I seem to recall that the Russian defense ministry first floated the idea. They weren't really concerned with a credible theory, just producing alternative ones for domestic audiences and useful idiots overseas: IIRC they also made a bunch of claims about plane trajectory, other planes, etc., that the preliminary report debunks.
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Sep 11, 2014 09:44
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TeodorMorozov posted:First time it comes from fake separatists site novorossia.ru with following title I'd also remain skeptical of the claims, but I'm not seeing how you can so definitively proclaim them non-slavic.
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Sep 11, 2014 09:45
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Libluini posted:Just a head's up for our friends in Estonia, Four German Eurofighters and 160 German soldiers are now stationed in Estonia. The small unit is part of an NATO-effort to secure the Baltics' air space. Thats not "small", according to the spiegel, only about 8 of our 100+ or so Typhoons can actually fly. (one Reason is that some air bases have about 8% of the intended mechanics  )Aggressive Germany sends half its airforce to the Baltic! Quick, give me a dial to Kremlin PR!
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Sep 11, 2014 09:46
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Mightypeon posted:Thats not "small", according to the spiegel, only about 8 of our 100+ or so Typhoons can actually fly. (one Reason is that some air bases have about 8% of the intended mechanics Would you say this is grounds for Russia to use terrorists to slaughter thousands of Estonian civilians, then I mean I know how much you love and cum at the idea of ex-Soviet states suffering
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Sep 11, 2014 09:49
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OddObserver posted:I seem to recall that the Russian defense ministry first floated the idea. They weren't really concerned with a credible theory, just producing alternative ones for domestic audiences and useful idiots overseas: IIRC they also made a bunch of claims about plane trajectory, other planes, etc., that the preliminary report debunks. Nope, they didnt float that "idea", they pointed out that the Kievan side claimed they had no planes up in the area, and then Russia provided proof that they in fact did, propably while wondering why Kiev would open up their propaganda war with an easily disprovable lie. At the same presenation, they also proved that Kiev has Buks in Donbass, which Kiev initially said they did not. This was done to show that Kiev/the west lies, in order to reduce the credibility of actually credible western evidence (which exists) for a seperatist shootdown, not to create/impose their own theory (they left that to non goverment actors). That some people ran off with the "Kiev lied about not having a plane, therefor they must have shot the M17 down with that plane" stuff you see peddled has nothing "directly" to do with the Russian goverment.
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Sep 11, 2014 10:00
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Finlander posted:Would you say this is grounds for Russia to use terrorists to slaughter thousands of Estonian civilians, then What about activating your Irony/Sarcasm detector once in a while.
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Sep 11, 2014 10:01
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Reuters links about the reduced gas flow to Poland (Slovakia and Germany reported smaller reductions in their supply). http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/09/11/us-ukraine-crisis-gas-poland-idUSKBN0H60O220140911 http://in.reuters.com/article/2014/09/10/ukraine-crisis-gas-poland-idINL5N0RB2KI20140910 Polish sites are now reporting that gas flow was actually down 45% Wednesday. http://www.polskieradio.pl/42/3167/Artykul/1229403,PGNiG-Rosja-zmniejszyla-dostawy-gazu-o-45-proc- There's speculation this is a response to Poland rerouting some of its supply to Ukraine.
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Sep 11, 2014 10:02
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Mightypeon posted:What about activating your Irony/Sarcasm detector once in a while. So all this time that you were cheering on Russia all the while its terrorists murdered, tortured, and inflicted unspeakable horrors onto Ukraine's populace, you were just pretending to be a twisted monster?
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Sep 11, 2014 10:02
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Mightypeon posted:Nope, they didnt float that "idea", they pointed out that the Kievan side claimed they had no planes up in the area, and then Russia provided proof that they in fact did, propably while wondering why Kiev would open up their propaganda war with an easily disprovable lie. I imagine Ukraine meant "We have no planes in the area that can shoot down an airliner". They probably had some attack helicopters in the area too, but since those aren't the type that can shoot down airliners, it's not an issue to discuss.
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Sep 11, 2014 10:48
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Mightypeon posted:(one Reason is that some air bases have about 8% of the intended mechanics Austerität ist eine gute Idee. Brown Moses posted:Don't forget, the Dutch report also shows the holes in the flight deck floor point downwards, so it would have to have been flying above it at a pretty sharp angle. It's funny because a Russian site was "debunking" the Buk hypothesis by quoting some Russian brass explaining that a Buk missile first goes above the target plane and then crashes down on it. Cat Mattress fucked around with this message at 10:50 on Sep 11, 2014 |
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Sep 11, 2014 10:48
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http://antikor.com.ua/articles/13410-igorj_girkin_strelkov_najden_mertvym_v_rossii According to these guys Igor Strelkov has been found dead in Russia. I can't find anything anywhere else confirming this and I have no idea how reliable these guys are. If it ends up being true I can't help but wonder if the Kremlin is now cleaning up the biggest loudmouths and anyone who might bring the fight home to Russia or be in a position to tell tales.
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Sep 11, 2014 11:22
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Hambilderberglar posted:http://antikor.com.ua/articles/13410-igorj_girkin_strelkov_najden_mertvym_v_rossii Meanwhile tons of journalists are liveblogging his press conference...
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Sep 11, 2014 11:29
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He seemed fairly alive during his press conference: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aUQeJHqNZFs&hd=1
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Sep 11, 2014 11:37
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Mightypeon posted:You could also make the comparison to US president Polk running total roughshod over Mexico. Hint: Mexican resistance didnt exactly work. Oh, well this will all blow over when the Ukraine gives 20 miles on it's border to Russia to pretty up a rail line route then! edit: No, wait, that was a different purchase. Either way, Ukraine wishes it was an analogue to the war and after it's over Russia will give them half a trillion for Crimea. Killer-of-Lawyers fucked around with this message at 11:45 on Sep 11, 2014 |
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Sep 11, 2014 11:40
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OddObserver posted:Meanwhile tons of journalists are liveblogging his press conference...
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Sep 11, 2014 12:06
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Russia's probably not self-destructive enough to assassinate one of the leaders for the terrorist that they armed with heavy weapons just yet. I mean, they're probably gonna do it, make no mistake, but acting right now, when the terrorist movement is in full swing and right on their doorstep, Putin's probably not going to give them a reason to attack Russia as well. On the other hand, Putin doesn't have any qualms about sending 20-year old conscripts to their deaths, lying to them about it their deployment to fight alongside civilian-torturing terrorists as being a military exercise, and then wiping their tombstones and declaring their parents to be traitors, and is a known to have a "lowered sense of danger"/megalomaniacal psychopathy and bloodlust, so there's really no way that whatever decision he makes will count for civilian victims, Russian or otherwise.
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Sep 11, 2014 12:07
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EU sanctions are finally coming. They make getting credits harder for Rosneft, Transneft and parts of Gazprom.
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Sep 11, 2014 12:08
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Lucy Heartfilia posted:My country has gone crazy by Andrey Makarevich I really doubt that this country now is Makareviches country. Don't think he will be expelled like Snowden but now his reputation is really damaged by his own actions. More interesting is how Andrew became `so eager ` pro-ukrainian singer He has the real estate and business in Krim. for example: http://yellow.com.ua/companyrus.aspx?c=15059 Earlier when Krim was Ukrainian he must pay 15% income taxes in hryvnia. Now circumstances changed and he must pay 13% income taxes but in roubles to Russia. That are significantly more expensive. So this so called patriot bitching only because he wont pay taxes to country that he is calling "My country". That's all about money $$$ you know %)
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Sep 11, 2014 12:24
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I don't think currency exchanging works that way. 13% of a specific amount of money is the same no matter what you change it into, so how would that become an increase in Russian Currency?
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Sep 11, 2014 12:27
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TeodorMorozov posted:I really doubt that this country now is Makareviches country. Don't think he will be expelled like Snowden but now his reputation is really damaged by his own actions. More interesting is how Andrew became `so eager ` pro-ukrainian singer You are very naive. Posts like this show that you have not the slightest idea how repression and propaganda work. Inform yourself how dissent is silenced and stop falling for Putin's lies, which are supposed to make you support the murder of innocents. Edit: Yo seriously, all your posts in this thread are basically Russia can behave like a murderous, thieving monster because the rest of the world isn't angels either. Lucy Heartfilia fucked around with this message at 12:46 on Sep 11, 2014 |
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Sep 11, 2014 12:41
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The Soviet Union made Tu Quoque an art form. It's good to see it hasn't been lost.
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Sep 11, 2014 12:48
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Finlander posted:Russia's probably not self-destructive enough to assassinate one of the leaders for the terrorist that they armed with heavy weapons just yet. I think he took necessary steps to avoid being a target --- note the portrait in background: 
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Sep 11, 2014 13:17
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I stumbled upon these videos earlier today and I can't stop watching them. Apparently, they are commercials that the Estonian Tourism Board used to advertise in Russia last year. Because this is as close to the general EE chat thread SA is ever going to get, here are the links: https://vk.com/video555370_166761351 https://vk.com/video555370_166761353 https://vk.com/video555370_166761357 https://vk.com/video555370_166761358 https://vk.com/video555370_166761359
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Sep 11, 2014 13:25
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Armed far-right veteran's groups are a very good thing to have in a country about to go through an economic cataclysm: http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/sep/10/azov-far-right-fighters-ukraine-neo-nazis?CMP=twt_gu
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Sep 11, 2014 14:13
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Cheatum the Evil Midget posted:Armed far-right veteran's groups are a very good thing to have in a country about to go through an economic cataclysm: http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/sep/10/azov-far-right-fighters-ukraine-neo-nazis?CMP=twt_gu If Putin hadn't decided on slaughtering thousands of Ukrainians with the use of terrorists, or the free world had given Ukraine actual help when Russia became a terrorist nation, this wouldn't even be an issue. It is pretty worrying, though: After the conflict ends, the Kiev government will have to deal with both continued Russian-sponsored terrorist attacks AND the armed far-right groups. Edit: Actually, what are the chances of Russia actually further arming and sponsoring these far-right groups for the sake of further destabilizing the area? Finlander fucked around with this message at 14:23 on Sep 11, 2014 |
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Sep 11, 2014 14:20
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Cheatum the Evil Midget posted:Armed far-right veteran's groups are a very good thing to have in a country about to go through an economic cataclysm: http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/sep/10/azov-far-right-fighters-ukraine-neo-nazis?CMP=twt_gu This is the big problem. Someone above mentioned Russia might be attempting to build a stab in the back legend around Poroshenko, and that's what I said might be happening while the ceasefire negotiations were going on as well. Entirely possible that they're using the ceasefire to consolidate while provoking the real Ukrainian far right to do something so they can have a more solid casus belli if and when the fighting resumes.
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Sep 11, 2014 14:40
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Finlander posted:If Putin hadn't decided on slaughtering thousands of Ukrainians with the use of terrorists, or the free world had given Ukraine actual help when Russia became a terrorist nation, this wouldn't even be an issue. It is pretty worrying, though: After the conflict ends, the Kiev government will have to deal with both continued Russian-sponsored terrorist attacks AND the armed far-right groups. I don't know that Russia needs to do anything directly to fund them. They're already somewhat popular, and they're going to have more and more popular support due to revanchism, especially if Ukrainians feel betrayed by a political settlement to the crisis that gives up too much (too many concessions to autonomy in the East, or even allowing outright secession). My hunch is that if Putin allows any sort of political deal to end the crisis, it's going to be one with the aim of further destabilizing the Poroshenko government through unequal treaties and forcing concessions and making room for an actual right-wing takeover (as opposed to the current one that only exists in the minds of propagandists and Russia Today). This would more than likely allow for more overt Russian interference in Ukraine.
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Sep 11, 2014 14:41
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TeodorMorozov posted:Earlier when Krim was Ukrainian he must pay 15% income taxes in hryvnia.  You know what, I'm ready to believe that Russian Fiscal Maths do really make it so that 13% is bigger than 15%. Nice mudslinging, by the way. I believe you could say that... Crimea doesn't pay.
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Sep 11, 2014 15:23
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Cat Mattress posted:
Next thread title "Crimea and Punishment"?
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Sep 11, 2014 15:38
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Rinkles posted:Reuters links about the reduced gas flow to Poland (Slovakia and Germany reported smaller reductions in their supply). How possible would it be for Ukraine to "tap" into the existing pipeline to Poland? I mean, what's stopping them? Can't remember if there's a seperate pipeline to Poland that avoids Ukraine entirely, but from the sound of some articles that doesn't seem to be the case, or...? Pimpmust fucked around with this message at 16:24 on Sep 11, 2014 |
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Sep 11, 2014 16:22
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Pimpmust posted:How possible would it be for Ukraine to "tap" into the existing pipeline to Poland? I mean, what's stopping them? Can't remember if there's a seperate pipeline to Poland that avoids Ukraine entirely, but from the sound of some articles that doesn't seem to be the case, or...? Quite possible... I sure can't think of any reason why Ukraine wouldn't want to give Putin a little Casus Belli. /annals of bear poking
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Sep 11, 2014 17:23
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archaeo posted:Quite possible... I sure can't think of any reason why Ukraine wouldn't want to give Putin a little Casus Belli. I thought you were already pretty convinced that Putin got casus belli for using terrorists to torture and slaughter civilians by the thousands from Ukrainians having the loving vulgarity of not letting themselves be massacred by a kleptocratic dictator using snipers against a popular peaceful protest movement, though?
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Sep 11, 2014 17:28
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Finlander posted:I thought you were already pretty convinced that Putin got casus belli for using terrorists to torture and slaughter civilians by the thousands from Ukrainians having the loving vulgarity of not letting themselves be massacred by a kleptocratic dictator using snipers against a popular peaceful protest movement, though? No, but I am pretty convinced that you are one of the most hilarious posters in a hilarious thread!
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Sep 11, 2014 17:31
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archaeo posted:No, but I am pretty convinced that you are one of the most hilarious posters in a hilarious thread! I also think murder of innocents and beginning unjustified wars is hilarious.
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Sep 11, 2014 17:32
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