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Waltzing Along posted:Pretty sure Bioware was trolling. That was the original ending of ME3 before they locked themselves in that room for what became the release ending.
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Sep 10, 2014 02:26
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ungulateman posted:Well, I just finished the Citadel DLC, which I maintain is the true ending of ME3. I like Citadel but most of that is wrong. "Storyline that flows naturally from events in ME2 and the earlier events of ME3?" First game is Reapers, second game has Reaper assistants so more Reapers, Citadel is... a clone. "Appropriate scale of conflict?" You're comparing the final fight of Citadel to the Sovereign fight or the Suicide Mission? "Appropriate tone of conflict?" ME1's ending had a serious tone (not many jokes once you landed on Ilos), ME2's SM also was pretty serious in tone, Citadel was cheesy fun which isn't bad but it was hardly appropriate given the Reaper invasion etc.
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Sep 11, 2014 07:54
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Also, Mass Effect is military sci-fi to the bone and takes cues from war movies all over the place.
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Sep 11, 2014 08:00
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monster on a stick posted:I like Citadel but most of that is wrong. This post just reminded me of how loving awesome the last mission on the citadel in Mass Effect was. The scale the first time I played it back then was overwhelming.
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Sep 11, 2014 08:21
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A. Beaverhausen posted:This post just reminded me of how loving awesome the last mission on the citadel in Mass Effect was. The scale the first time I played it back then was overwhelming. I'm not sure any other moment in the series matches stepping out onto the council tower exterior and seeing Sovereign up close. Skippy McPants fucked around with this message at 09:01 on Sep 11, 2014 |
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Sep 11, 2014 08:54
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Skippy McPants posted:I'm not sure any other moment in the series matches stepping out onto the council tower exterior and seeing Sovereign up close. The last hour or so of Mass Effect is on the short list of greatest achievement in video game history.
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Sep 11, 2014 15:46
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So, I'm finally over the trauma of my ending of the game, is the final hours worth playing?
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Sep 11, 2014 15:49
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Dan Didio posted:Also, Mass Effect is military sci-fi to the bone and takes cues from war movies all over the place. First one takes more cues from space opera, second one is inspired by "team on mission" war fiction like Dirty Dozen/Guns of Navarone, third is full on military science fiction. "To the bone" is not accurate for any game but the third one, although obviously there are some mil-sci elements smattered throughout the series.
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Sep 11, 2014 15:54
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itsjustdrew posted:So, I'm finally over the trauma of my ending of the game, is the final hours worth playing? It's just a game. How much trauma could it have been? Did you faint?
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Sep 11, 2014 15:55
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Spikeguy posted:It's just a game. How much trauma could it have been? Did you faint? I did a 'blog' kind of post session in this thread, I'm sure you can find it. It was awful.
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Sep 11, 2014 15:57
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Spikeguy posted:It's just a game. How much trauma could it have been? Did you faint? "But I really connected with the characters."
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Sep 11, 2014 15:57
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Final Hours? What's that. If you mean Citadel, then yes. Of course.
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Sep 11, 2014 15:58
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Final Hours was a digital book about the making of the game, right? For Portal 2 or something.
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Sep 11, 2014 16:00
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Waltzing Along posted:Final Hours? What's that. gently caress, I said playing, my bad. I'm a moron, please excuse me. I played the citadel before the end sadly, But I can see why it should be the ending.
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Sep 11, 2014 16:09
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itsjustdrew posted:
We freaking TOLD you, man. Why you gotta be like that? We TOLD you.
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Sep 11, 2014 16:38
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Megaman's Jockstrap posted:First one takes more cues from space opera, second one is inspired by "team on mission" war fiction like Dirty Dozen/Guns of Navarone, third is full on military science fiction. "To the bone" is not accurate for any game but the third one, although obviously there are some mil-sci elements smattered throughout the series. Space Opera and military science fiction are not mutually exclusive, I don't think any aspect of Mass Effect 1 that drew on the romantic trappings of Space Opera is more important to the series', or even that game's identity than the military stylings that inform the characters, setting, background, premise and gameplay. There's the emphasis on means of interstellar travel, but almost anything else you could ascribe to Space Opera in Mass Effect 1 is just as much a part of any broader science fiction genre, including Military science fiction. Mass Effect 3's as much of a Space Opera as 1 and 2 were, which is what it always was; not that much. People talk about Mass Effect as if it were Bioware's version of Star Trek or Star Wars, but there's a reason it's mostly styled after war films and Battlestar Galactica (2004) in terms of tone and theme. Visually, it represents those other things, but those references are largely superficial and far, far too broad to be attributed specifically in most cases. Shirkelton fucked around with this message at 16:54 on Sep 11, 2014 |
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Sep 11, 2014 16:48
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Arglebargle did a pretty good post in Danger's thread on space and size of environment about the ME1 citadel which can be briefly summarized as "even if you hated walking around the Citadel in ME1 it gave a huge sense of space which paid off in spades like 10000x at the end of the game" it's true. Walking around that place, terrible. The payoff in the last hour? awesome. As a contrast, I liked the suicide mission for a lot of reasons, but "impressing me with the sheer size of the Collector base" wasn't one of them. On the other hand, "slow-jogging around for 20 minutes trying to find that loving NPC in the access hallway" wasn't a problem I had with the collector base.
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Sep 11, 2014 16:52
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Dan Didio posted:Space Opera and military science fiction are not mutually exclusive, I don't think any aspect of Mass Effect 1 that drew on the romantic trappings of Space Opera is more important to the series', or even that game's identity than the military stylings that inform the characters, setting, background, premise and gameplay. Military stylings don't make something military science fiction and "beat the enemy" is 99% of video game premises. (here's a little hint Dan - is there a "hot war" going on in Mass Effect 1 and 2? Now, go find a something regarded as military science fiction that doesn't have a war going on during the story)
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Sep 11, 2014 17:28
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Megaman's Jockstrap posted:Military stylings don't make something military science fiction. Being largely based around military characters, in military settings, undertaking military missions in a gameplay system designed to replicate military encounters does.
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Sep 11, 2014 17:30
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Dan Didio posted:Being largely based around military characters, in military settings, undertaking military missions in a gameplay system designed to replicate military encounters does. Star Wars is now military science fiction. You heard it here first, folks.
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Sep 11, 2014 17:31
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Megaman's Jockstrap posted:Star Wars is now military science fiction. You heard it here first, folks. That's a weird, incorrect thing to say. I wonder why you'd say something so absurd.
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Sep 11, 2014 17:33
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Megaman's Jockstrap posted:Star Wars is now military science fiction. You heard it here first, folks. That doesn't sound too far off, at least for the original trilogy.
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Sep 11, 2014 17:34
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Spikeguy posted:That doesn't sound too far off, at least for the original trilogy. Wouldn't the prequels be more about the military? The whole focus on clone soldiers and the clone wars.
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Sep 11, 2014 17:36
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Mass effect 1 and 2 explicitly rip you out of the military in the first acts. From then on, there's as much politics, alley firefights and investigation as there is combat as you'd see it on a battlefield. Mass Effect is now spy fi 
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Sep 11, 2014 17:55
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Strategic Tea posted:Mass effect 1 and 2 explicitly rip you out of the military in the first acts. From then on, there's as much politics, alley firefights and investigation as there is combat as you'd see it on a battlefield. Spy Fi's my new variety programming channel. The Variety is you can watch Burn Notice or Wrestling.
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Sep 11, 2014 18:03
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The easy, shorthand way to tell if something is military science fiction is: Are the characters in the military? (paramilitary does not count) Even Wikipedia has this as the defining criteria of mil-sci vs. space opera because the genre shares so much with space westerns and space opera. The reality is that every genre can have military trappings, military backgrounds, and military premises (because the military solves conflicts with martial force - literally describing almost every video game ever) and not be "Military fiction" or "Military science fiction" Captain America comic books, despite being about a former soldier who tries to carry himself with military discipline, is not military fiction (most of the time, and the movies are another matter...) If you're calling the original Star Wars mil-sci, then you've essentially rendered the classification so broad as to be meaningless. It would apply to all sorts of things that it plainly doesn't - Firefly, the Foundation series, Dune, A Mote In God's Eye, etc. etc. Basically anything that involves martial conflict of any scale by organized governments in space. That's an overbroad, useless definition IMO. Edit: Does anyone think it's coincidence that The Citadel DLC, which ditched the military science fiction bent of ME3, resonates so deeply with ME1 and ME2 fans? It's because those mil-sci themes are simply not present in the first two games. Megaman's Jockstrap fucked around with this message at 18:20 on Sep 11, 2014 |
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Sep 11, 2014 18:15
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Mass Effect is a loving game where you are a loving space marine who gets put in the loving "super elite space soldier guys who can kill people without consequence" club to kill a loving killer robot army. It is not loving Roddenbery-era Utopian Star Trek.
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Sep 11, 2014 18:36
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Fag Boy Jim posted:Mass Effect is a loving game where you are a loving space marine who gets put in the loving "super elite space soldier guys who can kill people without consequence" club to kill a loving killer robot army. It is not loving Roddenbery-era Utopian Star Trek. Star Wars is a loving movie where Luke is a loving soldier's son who gets put in the loving "super elite space wizard guys who can kill people without consequence" club to kill a loving killer clone army. It is not loving Roddenbery-era Utopian Star Trek. It's also not military science fiction, dummo.
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Sep 11, 2014 18:39
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Megaman's Jockstrap posted:
It's because there was a shitload of in-jokes op
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Sep 11, 2014 18:42
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All genre distinctions are overbroad and useless.
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Sep 11, 2014 18:43
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Megaman's Jockstrap posted:Star Wars is a loving movie where Luke is a loving soldier's son who gets put in the loving "super elite space wizard guys who can kill people without consequence" club to kill a loving killer clone army. It is not loving Roddenbery-era Utopian Star Trek. Well, A) It might be, B) Mass Effect, from the very start, has had a unique focus on the military as part of it's world-building and lore. Like, to the point where human culture might as well not loving exist apart from the Alliance. It even has loving fascist themes in it (tip: if your sci-fi story is vaguely fascist, it might be military sci-fi). This is all apart from the whole thing where John Effect, unlike Luke, is actually in the military, the fact that he is in the military is a significant part of his characterization, the military itself plays an active and significant role in the story, you spend most of the loving game shooting things with guns as part of the military, etc.
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Sep 11, 2014 18:45
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Mass Effect is a big blend of all kinds of sci-fi, hope this helps.
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Sep 11, 2014 18:47
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Dan Didio posted:All genre distinctions are overbroad and useless. Right, but it still weirds me out when people claim that ME1 was some kind of thoughtful work of sci-fi, like it was the boring bits of the first Star Trek film turned into a game, or some poo poo. Ignoring all the parts where you shoot people with guns, and a space tank.
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Sep 11, 2014 18:47
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Lt. Danger posted:Mass Effect is a big blend of all kinds of sci-fi, hope this helps. It is.
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Sep 11, 2014 18:48
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Sometimes when I go to the bathroom I like to turn up Ride of the Valkyries to full volume and Shock and Awe whatever little things may be living in my toilet. Only the dinosaurs could truly understand that extinction level event. really makes you think.
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Sep 11, 2014 18:51
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Dinosaurs were the white man of their day.
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Sep 11, 2014 18:53
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Fag Boy Jim posted:the military itself plays an active and significant role in the story, you spend most of the loving game shooting things with guns as part of the military, etc. You're not part of the military for 80% of Mass Effect 1 and 100% of Mass Effect 2. You're part of a paramilitary organization. Like it's really bizarre to me that you've spend dozens of pages and hundreds of posts with this game, you swoop into literally ever argument, and you can't even get basic facts about it right. Eventually I just get tired of correcting you and stop responding. And it's really weird to me that Dan Didio is now walking back from "the game is military science fiction to the bone" with "it's really a blend of various science fiction genres" because of course it is. No single genre asserts dominance in the Mass Effect franchise until Mass Effect 3, where mil-sci finally triumphs and the game becomes really bad. That, Dan Didio, is when the game - not the franchise - becomes military science fiction to the bone. Megaman's Jockstrap fucked around with this message at 18:58 on Sep 11, 2014 |
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Sep 11, 2014 18:55
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Megaman's Jockstrap posted:You're not part of the military for 80% of Mass Effect 1 and 100% of Mass Effect 2. You are in every way that matters. Megaman's Jockstrap posted:And it's really weird to me that Dan Didio is now walking back from "the game is military science fiction to the bone" with "it's really a blend of various science fiction genres" They're not exclusive.
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Sep 11, 2014 18:57
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Mass Effect 3 rather pointedly avoids the Reaper war for most of the game and instead spends much of its time grappling with big moral questions in the form of the genophage and the geth.
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Sep 11, 2014 18:58
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Seriously, though Spectre aren't and never were space yes sir no sir shoot mans soldiers. They were James Bond in space.
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Sep 11, 2014 18:58
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