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zoux posted:Well somebody did it and knew it was a big deal. Oh yeah, I mean I'm not denying it's a big deal issue. It's often credited as ending the Silver Age, so that's something. "Arguably the most important single moment in comic book history" just seems a bit extreme. Like, I'd say it's maybe in the top 50.
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Sep 11, 2014 16:47
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Well in the context of movie making, if the other important events are issues that intro a character, that's going to be taken care of just by, you know, making a movie about them. So remove those issues and how far up does Gwen Stacy dying move?
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Sep 11, 2014 16:51
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zoux posted:Well in the context of movie making, if the other important events are issues that intro a character, that's going to be taken care of just by, you know, making a movie about them. So remove those issues and how far up does Gwen Stacy dying move? I don't really understand the question. We're moving off topic though, so I'll drop it.
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Sep 11, 2014 16:52
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Uncle Boogeyman posted:Oh yeah, I mean I'm not denying it's a big deal issue. It's often credited as ending the Silver Age, so that's something. "Arguably the most important single moment in comic book history" just seems a bit extreme. Like, I'd say it's maybe in the top 50. There's not many other "events" in the stories themselves that can be easily categorized as having a lot of impact. Some of the only ones I can think of: Introduction of Robin (changes the feeling of comics to where kids are part of the story) Formation of the Avengers (really cements that this is a shared universe) Maybe Demon in a Bottle? (comics can be about serious personal issues) Death of Jason Todd (comics are dark now) Death of Superman (Everyone can die*) House of M (big event crossovers are a thing) I think House of M started the trend? maybe I am wrong There's tons of things that happened in real life that changed the cultural place of comics, but there's very events that happen in the stories continuity themselves that single-handedly had an enormous ripple effect on the medium. I'm not entirely sure that Robin's introduction even meets my own criteria. There just aren't that many singular events to point to, largely because continuity drags everything back to the norm eventually. edit: in retrospect, I think that Civil War is a better example of an event that changed how GIANT CROSSOVERS are handled to a better extent than House of M. double edit: even further reading shows that the chain of CROSSOVER leads to CROSSOVER leads to CROSSOVER started to some extent with Avengers Disassembled, a series that I basically have never heard anyone ever talk about. theflyingorc fucked around with this message at 17:34 on Sep 11, 2014 |
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Sep 11, 2014 17:30
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That's a pretty good list, but Death of Superman doesn't really deserve place there. He was dead for what, half a year? Less? All on all, the entire thing was really underwhelming. In retrospect, at least. I am not nearly old enough to have read that while it came out, so it might just be that I am a modern comic book fan, for whom death is meaningless (see Wolverine). It would probably more be Captain Marvel's death, since that really was a new thing, killing a hero with a disease. e X fucked around with this message at 17:38 on Sep 11, 2014 |
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Sep 11, 2014 17:36
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e X posted:That's a pretty good list, but Death of Superman doesn't really deserve place there. He was dead for what, half a year? Less? It would probably more be Captain Marvel's death, since that really was a new thing, killing a hero with a disease. Death of Superman had almost no impact on DC's continuity (well, outside of the stuff it did to Hal Jordan), but it changed the way that death was looked at in comics continuity and the relationship between the publishers and the public in terms of events. I probably should have said "The Death and Return of Superman", because the lack of long-term results from his death is a big part of the reason it's a (terrible, terrible) comics touchstone. Man, can you imagine if it was 20 years later and Superman was still dead? That would honestly be cool as hell. It also wouldn't ever happen, even given Infinite Earths.
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Sep 11, 2014 17:40
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theflyingorc posted:There's not many other "events" in the stories themselves that can be easily categorized as having a lot of impact. Some of the only ones I can think of: I'm pretty sure Infinite Crisis on Infinite Earths would be more the starting point for the big company wide crossovers
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Sep 11, 2014 17:43
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Opopanax posted:I'm pretty sure Infinite Crisis on Infinite Earths would be more the starting point for the big company wide crossovers That's fair, and I probably should have mentioned that one. I think it's worth mentioning both, because the cycle of IT HAS BEEN 12 MONTHS TIME FOR ANOTHER EVENT is a pretty different effect from "THIS IS TOO CONFUSING WE CAN JUST REBOOT NOW IF WE HAVE TO". Anyway, my point was just agreeing that Gwen's death is a huge, huge thing, because it upped the stakes for everything across the board - Spider-man might not always save the day really, really changes your story possibilities. One could argue, actually, that the Death and Return of Superman ruined what Gwen's death had established.
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Sep 11, 2014 17:48
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The JSA beats the Avengers by decades. And if they don't count, the JLA by a slimmer margin. Snowbirds Don't Fly (My ward is a junkie!) came out 8 years before Demon in a Bottle too.
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Sep 11, 2014 17:52
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Aphrodite posted:The JSA beats the Avengers by decades. And if they don't count, the JLA by a slimmer margin. The Avengers feels more personal and more like they're wandering in and out of each others' books and that continuity is important, at least. DC wasn't really known for having a "universe" feel until after Marvel already existed. quote:Snowbirds Don't Fly (My ward is a junkie!) came out 8 years before Demon in a Bottle too.
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Sep 11, 2014 17:59
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Doctor Spaceman posted:This one's lower quality, but gives a better sense of scale. Looks like a two seater?
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Sep 11, 2014 18:01
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One for Batman one for Justice.
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Sep 11, 2014 18:42
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theflyingorc posted:Sure, I was just spitballing and I'm nowhere near the comics guru half of you guys are. The Harry Osborne drug issue is more important as it was the start of the end of the comic code
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Sep 11, 2014 19:23
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Waterhaul posted:I'd be surprised if Avengers 3 was anything other than "here's every person we have left under contract in one film". I wonder if they will just make Avengers 3 and Guardians of the Galaxy 3 at the same time and have them tell one big story.
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Sep 11, 2014 19:27
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Uncle Boogeyman posted:Actually, as the story goes, Stan Lee had no idea they had killed off Gwen Stacy until well after it happened. Stan Lee is a god drat liar. If someone who was angry about Gwen's death asked him, he'd say "No way would I approve it. I was never contacted!" If someone who thought it was a genre defining moment in which the heroes' wife/girlfriend was no longer invulnerable due to the power of plot, "Well, Conway sure had the balls to do that story but i'm glad he asked me for consent! Excelsior!" Stan is a great promoter of himself but he'll say whatever the gently caress the audience he is currently speaking to wants to hear. Of course in the day and age of social media and You Tube and all those things he wrote several decades back now all being online, those contradicting opinions on the Clone Saga or Gwen or any other number of Marvel related issues are now all out and easily accessible. I thought Gwen's death in ASM2 was great. It was one of the few parts of the movie that I thought was done well. I'm sure deleted scenes help in some cases but I don't think ASM2 is one. ASM1, however, had some deleted scenes that kind of filled in the gap of some of the dropped plots. notthegoatseguy fucked around with this message at 20:09 on Sep 11, 2014 |
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Sep 11, 2014 20:05
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notthegoatseguy posted:Stan Lee is a god drat liar. Entirely possible. If anyone wants a neat primer on 100 important issues in comics, I found this piece from ye olden days of geocities very informative back when I was starting to get seriously into comics. Uncle Boogeyman fucked around with this message at 20:17 on Sep 11, 2014 |
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Sep 11, 2014 20:15
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Codependent Poster posted:I wonder if they will just make Avengers 3 and Guardians of the Galaxy 3 at the same time and have them tell one big story. Avengers 3: The Infinity Gauntlet Saga Part One Guardians of the Galaxy 3: The Infinity Gauntlet Saga Part Two
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Sep 12, 2014 00:05
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Retardog posted:Avengers 3: The Infinity Gauntlet Saga Part One Yea, shut up and take my money. Seriously, totally back to the future this.
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Sep 12, 2014 00:54
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notthegoatseguy posted:Stan Lee is a god drat liar. He was a fiction writer. That's literally what he did for most of his life.
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Sep 12, 2014 01:24
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Retardog posted:Avengers 3: The Infinity Gauntlet Saga Part One Crossover is not what I would expect comics would bring to movies. It would also be awful. Ignite Memories posted:He was a fiction writer. That's literally what he did for most of his life. I don't think you know what fiction is. Or lying really. CharlestheHammer fucked around with this message at 01:45 on Sep 12, 2014 |
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Sep 12, 2014 01:42
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Retardog posted:Avengers 3: The Infinity Gauntlet Saga Part One Or if they could somehow work magic and have Avengers 3 start out on Earth and end with a showdown (with the GotG) against Thanos and GotG 3 would start out in space and ends with a showdown(with the Avengers) against Thanos. Basically the same story but from two different perspectives.
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Sep 12, 2014 02:05
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your avatar is my response to your post.
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Sep 12, 2014 02:12
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Ignite Memories posted:your avatar is my response to your post. Well I mean your post was pretty dumb what did you expect. Fiction isn't lying.
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Sep 12, 2014 02:28
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You're a pedantic jerk, and fiction IS lying. Stan lee wrote that a bunch of things happened, but they didn't happen. Just because we already know he's lying when we buy the book doesn't make any of the things he wrote true. But more importantly, you're a pedantic jerk.
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Sep 12, 2014 03:11
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Actually, the key component of lying is deception. A work of fiction is not trying to deceive you into believing it is true. A lie is. Stan Lee wrote a ton of fiction. Stan Lee lies a bunch. He did not always do both of these things at once. (I cannot prove he did not lie WHILE writing, at least some of the time.)
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Sep 12, 2014 03:15
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I've gotta go rewatch Galaxy Quest.
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Sep 12, 2014 03:17
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Stan Lee is on trial in the BSS movies thread 
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Sep 12, 2014 03:35
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zoux posted:Stan Lee is on trial in the BSS movies thread Technically its ignite and his poor grasp of the English language.
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Sep 12, 2014 03:38
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Dude what is lodged in your rear end right now? Do you write fiction or something?
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Sep 12, 2014 03:45
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CharlestheHammer posted:Technically its ignite and his poor grasp of the English language. "Technically" "ignite" and "English" are not even English words, so it looks like its you who has a poor grasp on the language. Checkmate.
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Sep 12, 2014 04:32
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The Silver Age ended at two different times , one for Marvel and one for DC. It ended pretty much around when DC w/ Denny O'Neil took over Green Lantern, and Marvel's was the death of Gwen Stacy. There's no definitive issue that ended the Silver Age for either company though by the mid 70s the Silver Age was over then you get this weird time of 10 years where Anti-Heroes and a lot of more mature titles start coming out. edit: What's interesting is we are now in the Modern Age for comic book movies. Hollismason fucked around with this message at 04:54 on Sep 12, 2014 |
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Sep 12, 2014 04:46
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mr.capps posted:"Technically" "ignite" and "English" are not even English words, so it looks like its you who has a poor grasp on the language. English is a word you be trippin.
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Sep 12, 2014 04:47
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Ignite Memories posted:You're a pedantic jerk, and fiction IS lying. What's it like living in such a tiny, simplistic world?
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Sep 12, 2014 06:55
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Shut up
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Sep 12, 2014 07:24
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mr.capps posted:"Technically" "ignite" and "English" are not even English words, so it looks like its you who has a poor grasp on the language. Technically every single word in English is either from French (29%), Latin (29%), Germanic languages (26%), Greek (6%) or other languages (6%). Also some proper nouns, I guess. I'm sorry to tell you this, but technically there is no English language, just leftovers from whoever was occupying England at any given moment throughout history.
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Sep 12, 2014 09:13
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CharlestheHammer posted:Crossover is not what I would expect comics would bring to movies. I always thought that many of the reasons people enjoyed The Avengers were the same reasons people enjoy comic book crossovers. A team story, ensemble cast, lots of your favourite characters butting heads at last, combining forces against a much larger foe which levels New York. But splitting the story across two films strikes me as unnecessary. These films are decently long already, enough to tell a complete story. A story long enough to take up two of them is surely bloated. And they come out infrequently enough that many people are going to see all of them. I don't see there being that much of a box office gain, because realistically how many people are currently planning to see Avengers 3 but not GOTG 2/3, or vice versa?
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Sep 12, 2014 09:13
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According to the internet Guardians made $588,757,587 worldwide and Avengers made $1,518,594,910 so there will be a lot of people that don't watch both. But yes Marvel have already distilled their crossover mechanisations to their films. The individual films build up a big event and then the event film basically wipes the slate clean and just re-establishes things from the beginning but now all your favourite characters are here again.
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Sep 12, 2014 09:26
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Grendels Dad posted:Technically every single word in English is either from French (29%), Latin (29%), Germanic languages (26%), Greek (6%) or other languages (6%). Also some proper nouns, I guess. I'm sorry to tell you this, but technically there is no English language, just leftovers from whoever was occupying England at any given moment throughout history. Embiggen is a wholly English word.
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Sep 12, 2014 13:46
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Aphrodite posted:Embiggen is a wholly English word. Hashtag, Selfie, Turducken. English is terrible, you guys!
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Sep 12, 2014 13:55
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english is perfectly cromulent, tyvm omglol :P
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Sep 12, 2014 13:56
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