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Nemesis Of Moles posted:You have the jist of it by my understanding, I think the slime mold isn't really fully explained regarding its relationship with Siri. Its clearly Scrambler and it rode the matter beam thing back. It could have intercepted Siri's communications, or infected Siri's little escape pod on the way out. I'm not really sure to be honest. Seriously? I literally didn't understand anything from Icarus on.
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Sep 14, 2014 23:36
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the new aleksay german adaptation of hard to be a god is out https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CHXTr0s-yOo its very hard to be a god imho
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Sep 14, 2014 23:53
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thehomemaster posted:Seriously? Yeah that is where the book really gets a little hard to follow, here's what I made of it. Bare in mind I also struggled pretty much from the minute they landed on Earth. So they make it to Icarus and get exploring, only to find it full of this weird slime mold that grows very quickly. The Bicams for some reason decide this this is god and talk to it while Valerie the Vampire just kicks back and acts like a creepy loon. The slime starts talking back and eventually shows an image of Siri from the end of Blindsight. Then it freaks out and murders everyone by revealing that all the doors and corridors are actually the mold faking doorways and the like and also growing tendrils and smashing people. Burke goes in with a flamethrower cause he hasn't been inside the station so he figures he can surprise the mold. This works out kinda and he rescues the military guy. Military guy blows up the station and they all flee, leaving the vampire and everyone else to burn. On the way back a couple things happen. They find out Valerie escaped and clung to the side of the ship, military guy goes crazier and talks about collective consciousnesses and smart nets that are sort of spontaneously cropping up everywhere, Burke goes nuts thinking the slime mold made it inside the ship, probably some other stuff. They make it to earth which is utterly hosed cause Icarus accounted for a 5th of the earths power supply, a power supply used to hold back global warming and generally prop up a failing civilization. The three remaining characters all jump out of the ship and climb aboard an old hidden Future CIA shuttle, leaving the main ship to burn up in atmosphere along with Valerie. They land somewhere, then everyone mills around and I have no idea about their physical locations. Eventually Burke calls his wife and somehow reveals that he's the one that Tech Lady has been hunting in a way that supersedes the Future CIA mind fuckery. She almost kills Burke but Military guy intervenes, except by now he's completely lost it. Then Valerie shows up and rescues Burke. They go back to the desert where Burke explores the Bicam facility, convinced there's a clue waiting for him. He actually manages to find something but before we're really told what, Valerie sticks him with some combined version of the mold and Vampire Virus. Burke starts becoming a super vampire, murders Valerie and tries to kill himself as a final act of defiance against the quickly growing vampire slime version of himself. It doesn't work and the fadeout is Vampire Burke walking toward a city, ready to fix all the vampires and take over the world. I probably missed a much and got some wrong, and this all takes like half of the book to happen, so, I dunno.
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Sep 15, 2014 01:44
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All that discussion about Blindsight and Echopraxia makes it sound a lot more stupid and contrived than I originally thought it was. I thought it was a sci-fi horror story about vampires and transhumans fighting super aliens, not vampires finding religion and talking to space mushrooms.Cardiovorax posted:What's that thing called again where you make a statement unclear by making it ambiguous to which of two things you're referring? I keep doing that lately, but I can never remember the word. 
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Sep 15, 2014 02:08
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Cardiovorax posted:All that discussion about Blindsight and Echopraxia makes it sound a lot more stupid and contrived than I originally thought it was. I thought it was a sci-fi horror story about vampires and transhumans fighting super aliens, not vampires finding religion and talking to space mushrooms. it's both and kind of neither
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Sep 15, 2014 02:13
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Cardiovorax posted:All that discussion about Blindsight and Echopraxia makes it sound a lot more stupid and contrived than I originally thought it was. I thought it was a sci-fi horror story about vampires and transhumans fighting super aliens, not vampires finding religion and talking to space mushrooms. Blindsight is much more that than Echopraxia was. Both are still pretty creepy and tense in parts but its all interspersed with ideas on a variety of technical and biological, as well as philosophical, topics. Also my summary of the events is relatively flippant. The space mushrooms are more like a weird distributed unknowable intelligence so much greater than ours and the people that talk to it are equally inhuman intelligences that solve problems by getting all body horror in the headspace.
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Sep 15, 2014 02:14
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One thing I didn't get after reading both Blindsight and Echopraxia is that the vampires were explicitly said to be non-conscious beings like Rorschach and the Scramblers, but in Echopraxia Valerie has plenty of moments where she's acting like something that has a sense of self and more-or-less thinks like a person. Are vampires really non-conscious, or are they just 'less conscious' to a greater degree than how Watts describes people who occupy the most powerful positions in society?Nemesis Of Moles posted:Both are still pretty creepy and tense in parts but its all interspersed with ideas on a variety of technical and biological, as well as philosophical, topics. This reminds me, if you're at all interested in this kind of thing and want to see it done magnificently with a whole lot less "vampires finding Jesus" stuff, read His Master's Voice by Stanislaw Lem. I have no doubt that Watts was heavily inspired by it. Tiny Timbs fucked around with this message at 02:21 on Sep 15, 2014 |
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Sep 15, 2014 02:18
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GENDERWEIRD GREEDO posted:One thing I didn't get after reading both Blindsight and Echopraxia is that the vampires were explicitly said to be non-conscious beings like Rorschach and the Scramblers, but in Echopraxia Valerie has plenty of moments where she's acting like something that has a sense of self and more-or-less thinks like a person. Are vampires really non-conscious, or are they just 'less conscious' to a greater degree than how Watts describes people who occupy the most powerful positions in society? Exactly how conscious the vampires are seems to have shifted significantly since Blindsight. Honestly the focus on them and their wildly increasing mind powers is one of the downsides of Echopraxia, but I'm pretty sure its explained in Blindsight as being just 'less' conscious with Rorschach being an example of the next step, an entirely non conscious intelligence. Thanks for the suggestion, I'll check it out!
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Sep 15, 2014 02:24
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thehomemaster posted:I see no one really talked about the Chaos Walking series. Seconding this. I"m always surprised that folks aren't discussing Patrick Ness more. Especially something like The Ask & The Answer; it's far and away the best YA scifi novel of the last decade.
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Sep 15, 2014 02:28
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GENDERWEIRD GREEDO posted:One thing I didn't get after reading both Blindsight and Echopraxia is that the vampires were explicitly said to be non-conscious beings like Rorschach and the Scramblers, but in Echopraxia Valerie has plenty of moments where she's acting like something that has a sense of self and more-or-less thinks like a person. Are vampires really non-conscious, or are they just 'less conscious' to a greater degree than how Watts describes people who occupy the most powerful positions in society? I haven't read Echopraxia yet but religion seems like something that wouldn't occur or be relevant to non-concious beings.
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Sep 15, 2014 02:32
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Ok, well first it's Bruks (with an accent), also named after one of the people from the acknowledgments. Here are some thoughts. I got that the mould had somehow camoflaged itself as Icarus. That was kinda cool how it reared up and attacked everyone (a Good Moment) and then when it killed the zombie. I didn't get the whole thing floating that Dan saw just before, although the rise in heat was a cool signal. I think it's a little absurd though that the slime can travel the galaxy on some beams but whatever. I guess Dan saving the Colonel was neat. I actually really liked all the characters, insofar as they seemed more normal and relatable than the crew of the Theseus. They all had their motives. That said, the Bicams as a whole were loving poo poo. One, there was no clear evidence that they were intelligent, seeing as Valerie outwitted them every step of the way from what I could tell. THey never did anything and just ended up dying. The idea was so awesome (somewhat like handlingers in PSS I felt) but was completely wasted. The zombies were way cooler, the split between military and viral, especially since he goes so into consciousness etc in both books. But yes, I felt like while the book was meant to be about hiveminds it compeltely skipped over them. I also never got a picture of anything, just a lot of words and a general idea. He does dialogue, action and ideas nicely, but not so much place. It makes more sense to me that Valerie injected him with Portia/vampire genes than him being invaded. Especially since he starts acting differently once injected? I think that's the case. I didn't pick up on it so when he killed Valeria I was like...bullshit. As I said, I had no idea what was happening. Also Valerie escaping is BS how did she do it? Who was outside of the Crown of Thorns? Also I don't think Moore is brainwashed, just wants to see his son. Who I beleive is Siri. I mean, Rorsarch already made it to earth via Icarus. I don't really understand the objectives of anyone except for Moore. And this is why this book made me feel like a stupid baseline. Also Rifters books are now all avaiable as ebooks (at least on Amazon).
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Sep 15, 2014 02:47
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I agree with basically everything, most of all the lack of a clear goal for any of the characters besides Valerie. Two things though The beam is a matter transmitter dohicky, basically the mold was emailed over and started replicating months ago. Valerie survived Icarus by being quick and hiding in the escape pod somewhere, presumably just after setting up a decoy outside. How the gently caress she made it from that to the shuttle then over the invisible water bridge back to dry land without anyone seeing her is beyond me. Oh and a minor thing, but the Bicams are definitely intelligent, they're just kinda weird and unknowable. Their ultimate plan is hinted as being to die on Icarus at one point, and I'm of the mind that they also want Portia on earth and figured sacrificing an arm of the super intelligence was a perfectly acceptable way to do it. Nemesis Of Moles fucked around with this message at 02:58 on Sep 15, 2014 |
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Sep 15, 2014 02:54
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The beam doesn't transfer matter, it transfers information. The upstream from Icarus transfers quantum information that somehow allows plentiful gasses to be turned into antimatter, and the downstream from Theseus transfers information that lets Icarus assemble small objects from a substrate like a 3D printer.quote:I'm of the mind that they also want Portia on earth and figured sacrificing an arm of the super intelligence was a perfectly acceptable way to do it. Yeah the goal of the Bicams was definitely to bring Portia to Earth.
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Sep 15, 2014 03:01
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GENDERWEIRD GREEDO posted:The beam doesn't transfer matter, it transfers information. The upstream from Icarus transfers quantum information that somehow allows plentiful gasses to be turned into antimatter, and the downstream from Theseus transfers information that lets Icarus assemble small objects from a substrate like a 3D printer. for what it's worth the return beam is actually from a drone or something that theseus drops so that it can relay the icarus stream to the ship without the stream being in LOS to big ben. Rorschach wasn't supposed to know about it, oops.
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Sep 15, 2014 03:58
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Would have been awesome if Icarus got turned into a Rorschach cell (like cancer taking over the galaxy) and then drained the Sun and wiped out earth. Or something.
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Sep 15, 2014 05:25
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bonds0097 posted:Except everything you're saying applies equally to just about any fiction genre. A lot of what people write is going to be cruft meant to piggy-pack off current trends/successes.  YA fandom just has that extra layer of stupid, because the books are meant for teenagers.
mallamp fucked around with this message at 07:26 on Sep 15, 2014 |
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Sep 15, 2014 07:23
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I went back a bit but didnt see anything about this - anyone read Robin Hobb's new book, Fool's Assassin? I read the first lot so much I started loving annotating them, but I was shocked at how bad the Rain Wilds books were, and I'm seeing a lot of reviews saying that nothing happens and the characters don't feel right in the new book. I'm worried Robin Hobb just, like, lost it at some point and that if I buy this book I'm going to be furious...
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Sep 15, 2014 07:52
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I liked it a lot, but it is a very slow-moving book, to be sure. I honestly don't know what to tell you; the characters felt fine to me but I also haven't read the earlier ones in the series in ages.
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Sep 15, 2014 08:08
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Guys, you should probably make your own Watts thread at this point.
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Sep 15, 2014 10:53
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GENDERWEIRD GREEDO posted:One thing I didn't get after reading both Blindsight and Echopraxia is that the vampires were explicitly said to be non-conscious beings like Rorschach and the Scramblers, but in Echopraxia Valerie has plenty of moments where she's acting like something that has a sense of self and more-or-less thinks like a person. Are vampires really non-conscious, or are they just 'less conscious' to a greater degree than how Watts describes people who occupy the most powerful positions in society? I'm pretty sure it's explicitly stated in Blindsight that vampires are conscious, just less conscious. It's described as a dream-like state.
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Sep 15, 2014 10:54
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Megazver posted:Guys, you should probably make your own Watts thread at this point. Actually, yeah, someone should do that, it is sortof clogging this thread. Not it (since I haven't read them)
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Sep 15, 2014 13:02
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People who liked Blindsight and Echopraxia are finally going to get Watts coming to them.
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Sep 15, 2014 14:09
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If you are still feeling critical of YA fiction, then mark the page in what you are reading, go to your nearest bookshop or the Kindle store, buy Dodger and Nation by Terry Pratchett, and read them. Right the gently caress now, do not post until you are done. Then, if you come back with disparaging comments such as "Well, they have their place, but YA fiction cannot deal with adult themes in the same mature way as Corbett's Vengeance of the Dildomancer series", we know who it is appropriate to point at and laugh.
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Sep 15, 2014 15:20
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:The first book is actually really good. The later ones, not so much. I feel like this sentence describes way too many SFF series and I really wish more authors would write standalones. I realize a lot of this is down to publishing contracts and the like, but it'd be nice if there was a bit more freedom to diverge from pre-existing worlds and characters and make something completely new up. This is probably why I love China Mieville so much.
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Sep 15, 2014 15:23
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Jedit posted:If you are still feeling critical of YA fiction, then mark the page in what you are reading, go to your nearest bookshop or the Kindle store, buy Dodger and Nation by Terry Pratchett, and read them. Right the gently caress now, do not post until you are done. Then, if you come back with disparaging comments such as "Well, they have their place, but YA fiction cannot deal with adult themes in the same mature way as Corbett's Vengeance of the Dildomancer series", we know who it is appropriate to point at and laugh. It is you, for recommending Terry Pratchett.
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Sep 15, 2014 15:45
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Cpt. Mahatma Gandhi posted:I feel like this sentence describes way too many SFF series and I really wish more authors would write standalones. I realize a lot of this is down to publishing contracts and the like, but it'd be nice if there was a bit more freedom to diverge from pre-existing worlds and characters and make something completely new up. I think that's more of a problem for other authors. In the case of the Temeraire series I think she planned for a series from the start. It's more that her source material is really strong -- 18th century historical novels can be all kinds of awesome, as the Aubrey/Maturin thread on this forum will tell you -- but as her series progresses she gets further and further away from that source material. By the time you're four or five novels in, her world has deviated so much from the real world that it's become alt-history instead of (historical fiction + dragons). Novik also has real problems grounding her characters squarely in the time period; the characters just stop acting like actual denizens of the 18th and 19th century and start acting more and more according to modern moral codes, etc. Another way of saying this: the first few books are "wouldn't the Napoleonic-era Royal Navy have been awesome with dragons added?" The later books are "What would dragons have meant for colonialism and imperialism?" Notice the lack of "awesome" in that second sentence.
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Sep 15, 2014 15:57
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corn in the bible posted:It is you, for recommending Terry Pratchett. "Hey, have you heard of a little series called Harry Potter? Thought so.  "
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Sep 15, 2014 16:06
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corn in the bible posted:It is you, for recommending Terry Pratchett.
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Sep 15, 2014 16:09
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There's a quip that's been floating around for a long time that 'the golden age of science fiction is 12'.
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Sep 15, 2014 16:14
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I too was born in 1925-33.
I'm the Book Barn IK. Feel free to PM me or email bookbarnsecretsanta@gmail.com if I can help you with anything.
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Sep 15, 2014 16:39
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I finished Seal of the Worm (and therefore Shadows of the Apt). The best characters all died.
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Sep 15, 2014 16:57
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Finished Hyperion last week following a spell of Simmons-induced ennui. After the god-awful detective's tale it was odds-on to suffer the same fate as Stranger in a I'm currently halfway through Wuthering Heights which is completely loving ace and Hyperion is all but a dim memory.
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Sep 15, 2014 17:10
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regularizer posted:This is dope. Is the Temeraire series worth reading? I don't think I've read a book about dragons since i read some of the Pern books as a kid. Books 1 and 4 are pretty good. Everything else is basically travelogue. 2 and 3 are ok, I guess.
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Sep 15, 2014 17:20
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Forgall posted:What, we are supposed to hate him now? I dunno, when was the last time he wrote a good book? Snuff and Unseen Academicals were dross, Thud! was little better and Making Money falls apart in the second half. I Will Wear Midnight left so little impression on me I couldn't tell you what it's about, now... though I do remember liking Nation and Wintersmith. I don't think either of them ever rose above "okay", though (so, not a great example of YA fiction being as good as adult fiction). I haven't read Dodger, Raising Steam or the Long series, thanks to Snuff-induced apathy, so we're back to Going Postal. In 2004. And it's not great, either. It's all been downhill since Night Watch. 
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Sep 15, 2014 18:13
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Who knew that Alzheimer's would lessen your ability to turn out great books 
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Sep 15, 2014 18:38
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On the topic of YA, I tend to have a better time selling China Mieville's young adult books to a broader audience. The mega-freaky body-horror stuff and the rather grim and cheerless atmosphere can be major turnoffs, so it's good to have a more friendly and accessible way to give people a taste of that fantastic imagination of his before they dive into the seriously heavy poo poo.
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Sep 15, 2014 18:40
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House Louse posted:I too was born in 1925-33. That's an interesting interpretation.
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Sep 15, 2014 18:47
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Darth Walrus posted:On the topic of YA, I tend to have a better time selling China Mieville's young adult books to a broader audience. The mega-freaky body-horror stuff and the rather grim and cheerless atmosphere can be major turnoffs, so it's good to have a more friendly and accessible way to give people a taste of that fantastic imagination of his before they dive into the seriously heavy poo poo. On the other hand, The City & The City doesn't have any body horror or whatever and it rules. I usually recommend that as the go-to book for people who want to stick their toe in the Mieville pool.
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Sep 15, 2014 20:47
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I recommended TC&TC for my gf and her mum who both like crime novels. Didn't pan out very well.
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Sep 15, 2014 23:16
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thehomemaster posted:I recommended TC&TC for my gf and her mum who both like crime novels. Dude wrote it for his mom who likes crime novels, as it turns out.
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Sep 16, 2014 02:01
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