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n8r posted:I would challenge you to work on a budget where the total $ amount doesn't change and try to stick with that. Actually this brings up a really good point. You keep adjusting your income every month because "it changes" but a strategy I myself employ and find very helpful is literally ignoring the fluctuations and assuming the worst (aka, lying to myself). Let me explain. Say in a good month you have 4k coming in and in a bad month you have 3k coming in. Instead of budgeting around the exact dollar amount you have coming to you, you assume every month you are only getting your minimum. So some months, you do literally have only 3k coming in but hey, it's fine man. You accounted for that (INCLUDING saving from it)! Other months you have 4k and oh hey, now suddenly you have 1k of extra money which you can then divide up into savings or fun at a later time. So when you are like, "Hey we really need a vacation" lo and behold you already had extra money lying around, no need to shift ANYTHING. Basically I think the issue with a variable/unfixed budget is how you are constantly trying to figure out how to make everything "fit." The real goal of budgeting should be the end-game of, "Why do we need to figure out how to fit this? We already have the space [in the budget]!" What people are (probably) trying to get across is that you shouldn't spend/save UP to your income, you should spend/save with SURPLUS from your income. That's key to getting ahead. And if that made no sense, I blame pregnancy-addled brain. But hoping it might help.
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Sep 22, 2014 21:43
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Knyteguy posted:1) A house with a garage, an office/private place, a dog door, and a nursery. All of this would be great so my wife's extended family could come visit down here, making her more happy in the process. Here's a thing about this list - #5 is getting in the way of all the others to the tune of a very large $510 per month for the next five years ($30000!), yet you've put it last.
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Sep 22, 2014 22:44
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Knyteguy posted:Erm well I care about the kid of course, that came off wrong. I just can't really think about how that will all work yet. It's too much for my mind to grasp, and I've just never had a lot of baby exposure at all. Very good. Look at that list again. I don't see a PS4 on there anywhere. You are about to be in a HUGELY stressful, emotional, exhausting situation. Your wife is going to be hormonal and physically beaten up. If she is going to be home with the baby, it's going to be a huge adjustment for her. Don't be shocked when you come home from work and she hands you the baby and locks herself in the bedroom to cry and sleep for a few hours. I think the whole problem you're having is that you look at money as the numbers on the spreadsheet, and not the potential it represents. Let me give you an example. For years, my husband has done contract work at high-pressure places in the middle of downtown Pittsburgh. The commute was wretched, the hours were horrific, and the working conditions were batshit insane. During this time, we worked like hell to pay off over $100,000 in debt (student loans, credit cards, mortgage, 2 car payments). Yes, our lives sucked for several years. We bought our house with 0% down at the end of 2006, and we all know what happened just over a year later. We learned a lot of lessons the hard way. The biggest, hardest one is that every thing we chose to buy before poo poo went south was one more option that we didn't have later. This past April, he was offered a more stable, permanent position at a company he really fell in love with. However, it paid about 8k a year less than he had been making. Because we had way fewer bills, he was able to take that job without a second thought. Now... you are talking about "just this once" upping your discretionary budget to $1000, so you can have a vacation and a game console. Or having $500/month to blow on toys. What if you had that $500/month to rent a better place? You see your savings go up, but it's an abstract number, and kind of a lovely one, because you can't enjoy it. What if that money was the down payment on your dream house?
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Sep 22, 2014 22:47
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OK still really want to get back to some people and points that have posted, but I won't have time to address everything until I get off of work. This has me severely distracted though: April, are you saying that we should consider breaking our lease early and moving (after careful planning)? Or are you instead advising we focus on what we can do to get there by July? That won't be a problem. I've gotta say I'd probably drop the PS4 crap in a heartbeat if it meant getting the gently caress out of this craphole. I don't look down on anyone who lives there, but it's just making me miserable. I need a drat place to take care of my hobbies/get some peace and quiet before I burst. For example I've been putting off a project for about 6 months that could genuinely become a commercial project because I can't work on it without cats loving with stuff (electrical engineering/embedded programming stuff, so lots of loose parts). My wife would appreciate a place to go quietly paint and read too. I know I can speak for both of us when I say I'd absolutely love to get a nursery going as well. I just gotta say holy gently caress I had no idea how much our living situation has been stressing me out. We've lived in pretty awful places the majority of our marriage. I mean we've lived with roommates for close to 3 out of 5 years of our marriage, and that was just absolutely awful. The townhouse was nice and big (maybe too big), but since we knew we were moving out at the end of the lease we just never made it home again after my sister moved out, and it was still bad for animals since there wasn't a yard. This loving place we're in now with an air conditioner that has broken twice (we didn't bother calling a third time), no in-house laundry, no yard, no space, lovely neighbors, no privacy (it goes on)... I can deal with it for now but I think I would break if it meant living here past July. I know my wife feels the same way. Edit: Shoot saw your last post after posting this April. It seems like you advise maybe sitting in the place we're in for now. OK that sucks but again we'll deal with it for now. Knyteguy fucked around with this message at 23:07 on Sep 22, 2014 |
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Sep 22, 2014 23:01
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People have said everything that needs to be said I think. The big attitude adjustment is really hard to understand or even believe when you haven't made it. It feels really bad to not get something you want, especially when you look at an account balance that is much larger than it. But post-adjustment, while it still isn't a great feeling to not buy something, it also feels similarly bad in the same way to spend money, even on something you are really looking forward to. Growing up, my parents were divorced, and my mom was frugal all along while my dad was not, and even as a child the difference was readily observable. You can see the change in similar threads like this one(Sample Tuyop's thread if you haven't). I realize you can't conjure that aversion out of thin air, but trust me, really feeling the pain of opportunity cost the same way you feel the pain of bills will make a world of difference. On a less serious note, I promise that you will have just as much fun playing any number of the dozens of pc, ps3, ps2, snes etc games that you have not played, and first year console games are generally pretty bad anyway. There are more videogames out there than you will have time to play in your entire life, and 99.9% of the really good ones are not on ps4. I assure you it will be untouched while you have an infant at home, and once they get a little older, it will cost less and you'll have a much better grasp on how much time you can really spend on it. I understand the frustration that other posters/myself feel, and I understand if you feel burned out bearing the brunt of that, because you don't see what they see. Hopefully you will be able to look back on this thread five years from now and will have grown enough that you'll feel it too. Jeffrey of YOSPOS fucked around with this message at 23:24 on Sep 22, 2014 |
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Sep 22, 2014 23:15
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Knyteguy posted:OK still really want to get back to some people and points that have posted, but I won't have time to address everything until I get off of work. Fellow goons, I think we're seeing a breakthrough here. Knyte, I actually did a little fist pump when I read this post. I don't advise breaking the lease. DO NOT do the thing that you do when you say "hey, that sounds like a good idea!" and do it without any planning or real thought. You need to do a few things first. Are you taking notes? #1 Create a budget that DOES NOT CHANGE. It should include your current bills, some savings, some "fun" money. Live on that budget WITHOUT CHANGING IT for 3 months. #2 Recreate that budget without your wife's income, and with a higher rent. Assume that your rent is $1200 or whatever, and that your wife is bringing home $0. (Any extra will obviously go into savings). Live on that and DO NOT CHANGE IT until your lease is up. If you can do that then congratulations! You can go and move into the kind of place you WANT to be in, without going "oh poo poo we can't afford this" a few months after moving in. It's going to take a poo poo-ton of discipline, but you have got to keep your eyes on the prize. It took us several years but holy gently caress it's so goddamn worth it.
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Sep 22, 2014 23:21
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I could dig through your thread and figure it out, but how much are you saving on rent compared to your old place? I hope it's a shitload because it seems horrible and like most of your decisions... Not well thought out.
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Sep 22, 2014 23:28
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Oh man. Whatever you do, please don't tell your grandmother who is willing to give you up to $20,000 that you have decided to contribute nothing towards your child's entrance into adulthood.
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Sep 22, 2014 23:33
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Uncle Jam posted:Oh man. Whatever you do, please don't tell your grandmother who is willing to give you up to $20,000 that you have decided to contribute nothing towards your child's entrance into adulthood. Yeah this is pretty strange to me as well but I didn't want to derail the thread bringing it up.
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Sep 22, 2014 23:38
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April posted:Fellow goons, I think we're seeing a breakthrough here. Knyte, I actually did a little fist pump when I read this post. This. I hope he's had his come-to-Jesus moment, because this is gonna be hard as gently caress. Think about this, KG. Really sit and ponder and plan and ponder some more how this is going to play out. Because it absolutely has to happen this way if you want to move to a place with higher rent at a time when your wife's income will be $0 and your expenses will be higher with the baby. #1 is vital for you to prove to yourself that you are capable of sticking to a budget - a real budget where you don't diddle the numbers and play a shell game with a bunch of categories to get what you want. You don't get what you want in step #1, except the discipline to go to step #2. #2 is the clincher. You will be sitting on money but acting like you have none, because you will assume all you have is your income. Discipline, discipline, discipline. Short-term pain for long-term gain. It is going to suck - no ifs, ands, and buts about it. I hope you have what it takes - your track record is spotty at this point, so I'll reserve judgement and see if you can pull off #1 between now and Christmas. On a lighter note, I read this years ago and, now that I have twins, can say that it is fairly accurate: http://www.allowe.com/laughs/book/So%20You%20Want%20To%20Have%20Children.htm Consider the pharmacy/grocery store bit and how it will affect your expenses in the coming months.
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Sep 22, 2014 23:43
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Funding a child's education is a wonderful gift that fewer and fewer parents are able to afford. Low interest easily available loans are very easy for students to obtain for college. Low interest easily obtainable loans do not exist for your retirement. If you don't want to be a burden on your children and live in near poverty, you want to save for retirement first. College education saving should be pretty far down the list. Knyteguy is nowhere in any position to start doing that.
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Sep 22, 2014 23:45
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n8r posted:Funding a child's education is a wonderful gift that fewer and fewer parents are able to afford. Low interest easily available loans are very easy for students to obtain for college. Low interest easily obtainable loans do not exist for your retirement. If you don't want to be a burden on your children and live in near poverty, you want to save for retirement first. College education saving should be pretty far down the list. Knyteguy is nowhere in any position to start doing that. Exactly. It's OK for Knyte to figure out his own finances first. ETA: I was skimming back through this thread and found this from Knyte on 6/11/2014: quote:Hell no dude (squalid hellhole). It's time to give 100% because it's not just the two of us anymore. I think we'll be able to mostly stay on track to getting a house which is half the point of moving into this semi-ghetto (but safe) apartment place. Ideally the kid has to live there for about 5 months until the lease is up, and then we have the car paid off and we're nearly ready for a 30% down payment on a $120,000 house. ETA 2.0: Also, in the beginning of the thread, Knyte only had 1 dog & 3 cats. At what point did the 2nd dog move in? Why in the world would you consider that a good idea?? April fucked around with this message at 00:25 on Sep 23, 2014 |
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Sep 22, 2014 23:52
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Yup, college money for the kid(s) is completely irrelevant right now. That's a luxury for people who have their financial poo poo together, which means it's going to be some years before Knyteguy needs to even think about it.
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Sep 23, 2014 00:49
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Knyteguy posted:confusion about conflicting advice KG you strike me as a clever, motivated guy who's bursting with energy but also stressed out. Don't feel like you've got to immediately tweak your budget just because an internet expert said "well maybe you should try X". Just think things through calmly and logically, and if you don't agree with what the internet says, don't lose any sleep over it. That being said, you've been given some stellar advice recently and I hope you're able to make sense of it, implement what works for you, and don't lose hope.
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Sep 23, 2014 00:52
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I don't often do this, but I have read this thread pretty much in it's entirety. I usually stay out of threads April posts in because it'd be a little awkward, however, as April's husband, I have to admit that I, like Knyteguy, was short sighted at first about what she was trying to do. For fucks sake, we put a Cadillac and a Trailblazer on a CREDIT CARD. You want to talk about STUPID? Remember that credit was very cheap pre-2008. Re-fi'ing the loans from 10% to 3.5-4.5% over the life of the loan seemed to be the right be thing to do. However, when the credit crunch of 2008 hit, the promises of the credit card company that said the interest over the life of this loan was never going to increase, that it was a fixed rate, went out the window, and paying 30K on a credit card went from $200 a month to over $600 a month over night. Listen, I've read plenty of threads here and read a LOT of advice from different people here. It's tough to look in the mirror and it's even tougher to put it all out there in the open and read as people poke holes in you and your life, point out your flaws and your weaknesses. We all have them, we all dislike having that happen to us. The upside to what has been said in this thread (besides the <in my best Greg House voice> "You're an idiot") and I DO say that tongue in cheek, I promise, is that some of us if not MOST of us have been in the situation that you are in, and we know that it is difficult, and most of the time can be overwhelming. Personally, we would not be in the good financial position if it had not been for April's perseverance, researching, reading this and other money sites, and most often, her drive to get out of debt and not go bottoms up. All of us here know what it's like, we're all here to help you pull yourself out of this position, but you have to be willing to help yourself as well. I see the lightbulb starting to illuminate across your posting, and I think by some means that you are starting to put it together. It's tough, it will be one of the hardest things you'll ever have to go through (besides caring for a new born) however, this is one that you can be able to impart on others, to pay it forward and show them that it works, that it's a mindset change. You can do this, it's just not easy.
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Sep 23, 2014 02:23
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I'd like to hear about this $300 Bay Area vacation. This includes transportation, hotels, food, activities? Sounds crazy low to me.
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Sep 23, 2014 03:08
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slap me silly posted:Yup, college money for the kid(s) is completely irrelevant right now. That's a luxury for people who have their financial poo poo together, which means it's going to be some years before Knyteguy needs to even think about it. There's a difference between starting a fund now and telling people 'I'm not going to ever fund my kids education because I had to pay for it myself', especially when your fam is hooking you up in a way most people can't dream of. A family fund is really underrated, and can help everyone avoid burning money through interest payments on loans. Its crazy not to utilize that power.
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Sep 23, 2014 03:30
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ufsteph posted:I'd like to hear about this $300 Bay Area vacation. This includes transportation, hotels, food, activities? Sounds crazy low to me. 440 miles round trip @ 56 cents per mile (government rate) means it cost ~$250 just drive there and back in gas and wear on the vehicle...
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Sep 23, 2014 03:34
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Death From Above posted:Cool story Hey welcome to the thread. Thanks for the input on the situation, I think it reaffirms my motivation to keep at this. It definitely is reassuring to know that I'm not the only one in the forum that struggles with this, and has made bad decisions in the past. Sometimes it feels that way, unless I'm reading Slow Motion's thread. spwrozek posted:440 miles round trip @ 56 cents per mile (government rate) means it cost ~$250 just drive there and back in gas and wear on the vehicle... Hey we'll talk business during the trip and it's a writeoff  . Not gonna worry too much about wear and tear/miles on a smallish trip, especially since we don't plan to sell the car.Gas should be about ~$61 according to http://fuelgaugereport.aaa.com/fuelcostcalculator/ ufsteph posted:I'd like to hear about this $300 Bay Area vacation. This includes transportation, hotels, food, activities? Sounds crazy low to me. We're only going to eat out at dinner once (eating at her parent's house one night), fuel $60, motel $75 since we'll be going during the week most likely, and we just want to go to the Exploratorium museum, and walk around the piers. If we assume the museum is ~$30/person and dinner is $50, then that leaves about $55 in spending cash/wiggle room. We'll pack lunches to help keep costs down. Uncle Jam posted:There's a difference between starting a fund now and telling people 'I'm not going to ever fund my kids education because I had to pay for it myself', especially when your fam is hooking you up in a way most people can't dream of. April posted:Exactly. It's OK for Knyte to figure out his own finances first. My Rhythmic Crotch posted:There are few constants in life, but not being able to please everybody all the time is one of them. If you ask 5 people for their opinion, you're likely to get 10 opinions back - especially in a place like BFC where you have a lot of experts with their own methods, ideas, and mantras. Any time I'm in a position where I have lots of feedback coming from lots of different sources, I take it all in, discard the outliers, and try to find the average of what the group seems to be saying. That does not even mean I will follow the group's desires to the letter, but it does give me a way to tackle things without trying to implement every tiny detail or suggestion that each person comes up with. Thanks. And yes you're right, I need to try to find a medium and not make such immediate changes I think. It feels frantic, and it's definitely stressful. Aagar posted:On a lighter note, I read this years ago and, now that I have twins, can say that it is fairly accurate: Wife and I got a kick out of this link  .Bugamol posted:I could dig through your thread and figure it out, but how much are you saving on rent compared to your old place? I hope it's a shitload because it seems horrible and like most of your decisions... Not well thought out. $800/mo is saved (from our previous place) by being in this shithole. Very significant. Dollars -> stress conversion right here. April posted:Very good. Look at that list again. I don't see a PS4 on there anywhere. Cool story and points again here April thanks. ExtrudeAlongCurve posted:Worst case scenario Hawkgirl posted:Worst case scenario also New budget (next post) we tried really hard to take this stuff into account. Reiterating we need life insurance though Think I got to most everyone's posts. Thanks a lot to all of you for the advice today. I feel like a couple more things have clicked for me, and I'm ready to start working harder at this stuff, but without being frantic about it as I feel like I have been. I'm making it a goal to have a more realistic (not so optimistic) budget. Aside: I'm just going to throw it out there: September's budget is now blown by a couple hundred dollars. I'm getting too fat* and I broke the buttons on 2 pairs of shorts in 2 days, bringing me down to 1 presentable pair of shorts, so I got some replacement jeans. Shoes were also lovely and in my wife's case painful so we just replaced those too. I was going to hold off until October but I want to absolutely ensure we meet our new budget (again next post) * Fitness is my next step after finances, but I tried tackling both when the thread died and I think it's one of the reasons I failed at both. It was too hard to focus on two highly consequential, stressful things at once.
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Sep 23, 2014 05:18
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New Budget starting October, lasting until December* (we haven't put it up in the spreadsheet yet):pre:Income: Me: 4334 Wife: 400 Total 4734 Costs: Savings 1150 Rent 790 Car Debt 510 Groceries 500 Vacation 300** Spending 300 Pets 250* Fuel 150 Clothing 150 Restaurants 150 Power 120 Gma Debt 100 Car Insurance 100 Home Goods 100 Medical 100 Student Loan 87 Business 75 Internet 50 Cell Phone 19 Misc 18 Rental Insurance 15 --- Total 5034 (See notes below)** Off Budget Asset Accumulation: HSA/Prepaid Medical Bills 1300 ** The vacation is coming out of savings, hence the reason the totals don't look right. Most of these numbers are inflated beyond what we would normally see, but I'd say almost all of them have happened at some point or another. We're going to do our best to keep away from restaurants but our history tells me that we eat out, so I've accounted for that in the budget anyway. Worst case scenario right? Trying to plan for reality and not optimism like someone wisely put it. I think that if we have the discipline to stick to this budget, our actual savings will be higher than the line item suggests.
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Sep 23, 2014 05:35
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Knyte when I go over budget a month, it's usually for a crazy reason beyond my control. One time it was because my mouth was about to explode from a rotted tooth and I burned through my flex account of 1250 dollars. Another time, I had to use my credit card to go fix our car. I'm working on paying debt down, and I've done a considerable amount of debt reduction this past year, with about 33% of my take home going toward increasing my net worth either through debt reduction or 401k. You know what I don't do with my discretionary spending the month I'm in or the next month when I go over my budget? I loving, don't, get, to do, annyyyythhinnnngggg. Nothing, because I lost all my discretionary spending. I've explained a lot how hard it is, but with me, and knowing my personality in wanting to spend more, i force myself into situations where I can't touch my money just to make it so that I stay on budget, and I do extreme measures to keep myself. I put way too much money toward paying down debts I have, and then find ways to scratch through and get through the month. You have zero accountability to yourself. You're trying to raise your spending, to reward your over spending this month. Hell, 200 dollars over by the 22nd is really bad, and it'll only go up, and now you want to take a vacation. I know the strategy is to just keep berating you until you somehow have it click in your brain, but holy poo poo this instance is pretty bad on you Mr guy. Don't effectively increase your reward budget for going over budget holy poo poo. I honestly can't tell if you're trying to fool us or yourself on this one. Knyteguy posted:
 Veskit fucked around with this message at 05:45 on Sep 23, 2014 |
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Sep 23, 2014 05:40
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Veskit posted:Knyte when I go over budget a month, it's usually for a crazy reason beyond my control. One time it was because my mouth was about to explode from a rotted tooth and I burned through my flex account of 1250 dollars. Another time, I had to use my credit card to go fix our car. I'm working on paying debt down, and I've done a considerable amount of debt reduction this past year, with about 33% of my take home going toward increasing my net worth either through debt reduction or 401k. You know what I don't do with my discretionary spending the month I'm in or the next month when I go over my budget? I loving, don't, get, to do, annyyyythhinnnngggg. Nothing, because I lost all my discretionary spending. Man consider it an emergency then, because it was. I have one pair of shorts now, just one. Not one single pair of jeans and it's fall on Monday. I'm not trying to fool anyone. This has been stuff we've been putting off, and putting off. If we go over on bills I haven't been sweating it too much. Well clothing is a bill in our line items, and nearly everything that we went over on was a bill. I'm not going to look like a hobo going into work, and my wife's feet have been killing her from being pregnant and her doctor recommended new shoes. We should have budgeted for it better. You'll see that our new budget I just posted didn't make this mistake.
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Sep 23, 2014 05:45
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So you blew your budget, so you could make sure to hit the next one. Think about that. And if you don't understand why this is your problem, then keep thinking about it. Here's a hint. The budget is a tool to help you save money/realize your goals. There isn't anything gained if you wreck one month but hit the next three, you still lose in that case. Edit: The budget keeps growing as does the list of stuff you've been putting off forever and just had to get. Edit2: The thread title is great I am now realizing. Although Zaurg just simply didn't want to do the right thing, even though he knew it seems. Not sure if this is worse, because it seems like you want to do the right thing, but seemingly unable to. Edit3:
MrEnigma fucked around with this message at 05:53 on Sep 23, 2014 |
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Sep 23, 2014 05:49
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MrEnigma posted:So you blew your budget, so you could make sure to hit the next one. I won't concede on this. I absolutely needed clothes for work. It would have been bad with money to do anything else. "Hey boss I know I look like a total slob. How's it going?" We probably won't spend a single dime next month on clothes because we never do. The sole purpose of an emergency fund is to fund such things.
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Sep 23, 2014 05:54
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Knyteguy posted:I won't concede on this. I absolutely needed clothes for work. It would have been bad with money to do anything else. "Hey boss I know I look like a total slob. How's it going?" We probably won't spend a single dime next month on clothes because we never do. The sole purpose of an emergency fund is to fund such things. Are you saying that getting clothes was an emergency that you couldn't have possibly forecasted or budgeted for? i don't think never means what you think it does.
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Sep 23, 2014 05:57
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MrEnigma posted:Are you saying that getting clothes was an emergency that you couldn't have possibly forecasted or budgeted for? Fine rarely then if you want to be all pedantic about it. No we should have predicted it. That's why I accounted for maybe needing new clothes next month and even in the following three months, and I even said that in my post. quote:We should have budgeted for it better. You'll see that our new budget I just posted didn't make this mistake. But get all crazy about it after both acknowledging and taking steps to fix my previous mistake. Edit: Holy gently caress just wait and see how the budget turns out. I went loving high on everything on purpose, and that's not to spend more money in those categories.
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Sep 23, 2014 06:01
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Knyteguy posted:I won't concede on this. I absolutely needed clothes for work. It would have been bad with money to do anything else. "Hey boss I know I look like a total slob. How's it going?" We probably won't spend a single dime next month on clothes because we never do. The sole purpose of an emergency fund is to fund such things. Clothes are discretionary spending. So are dog training classes, so are restaurants, vacations, and spending money which are all things you somehow when all totaled up equal more discretionary budgeted items than you had for September, not even loving including the vacation you have budgeted. Do you get why I'm harping reconciliation vs budgeting and how you're doing a rec? Knyteguy posted:But get all crazy about it after both acknowledging and taking steps to fix my previous mistake. Want to fix the mistake? That one is easy. GO in, and fix your discretionary spending to be 500 dollars total, not including the vacation (hell, i'll let that slide so you can go in and think this one through). Then, put the money you subtracted into your savings. Then, subtract from your discretionary accounts all the money you overspent this month. all 200 whatever. Veskit fucked around with this message at 06:04 on Sep 23, 2014 |
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Sep 23, 2014 06:02
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Veskit posted:Clothes are discretionary spending. So are dog training classes, so are restaurants, vacations, and spending money which are all things you somehow when all totaled up equal more discretionary budgeted items than you had for September, not even loving including the vacation you have budgeted. Well I was trying to go lower on discretionary than $500, but apparently I miscategorized. I wasn't trying to 'pull one over' on anyone poo poo I'm trying to go about this right. I don't care if we have to pull the clothes out of next month's discretionary, and I'll gladly do so. They were absolutely a necessity like I said. If that means continuing to borrow from our future selves, then in this case it was worth it. I'm not eating the bills though, was some miscellaneous and flex to cover that I'm pretty sure. I'll have to double check. Getting late now and I've been on this stuff literally the entire day. I'll readjust the budget tomorrow. Vacation: I liked Giraffe's input on the matter, so I took the advice: Giraffe posted:First off, make sure your vacation budget is realistic. $300 for a weekend for two in the Bay Area is not a lot, depending on what you do and how much you plan on eating out. But if it is, $300 to give your pregnant wife a weekend away is money well spent in my opinion.
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Sep 23, 2014 06:14
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Knyteguy posted:I won't concede on this. I absolutely needed clothes for work. It would have been bad with money to do anything else. "Hey boss I know I look like a total slob. How's it going?" We probably won't spend a single dime next month on clothes because we never do. The sole purpose of an emergency fund is to fund such things. New clothes are a foreseeable, budget-able expense that can usually be delayed for at least a month if you are paying attention. You said yourself you've been putting it off and putting it off, which means you knew it was coming. The emergency fund is really for when you lose your job, or your car's transmission explodes even though it's only 3 years old, or your baby gets RSV and you suddenly have a shitload of hospital bills - stuff you can't reasonably predict. It's not for replacing things that wear out every single year. The only reason clothes costs are an emergency now is because you've been neglecting the coming expense. The reality is that you're not used to forecasting expenses over a long period of time. That is common and normal and makes a lot of sense. But in fact there are plenty of things that cost money every year, but not every month: clothes, car repairs, Christmas presents, travel, house repairs if you ever buy a house. None of those are really "emergency" expenses. Personally - well, take a look at my savings account post. If those kind of expenses exceed my free money for the month, I take the rest out of the discretionary savings accounts without ever touching the emergency account. I don't really care about taking you to task or micromanaging your budget concepts. It's your (lack of) money after all. But maybe the perspective will help.
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Sep 23, 2014 06:26
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slap me silly posted:New clothes are a foreseeable, budget-able expense that can usually be delayed for at least a month if you are paying attention. You said yourself you've been putting it off and putting it off, which means you knew it was coming. The emergency fund is really for when you lose your job, or your car's transmission explodes even though it's only 3 years old, or your baby gets RSV and you suddenly have a shitload of hospital bills - stuff you can't reasonably predict. It's not for replacing things that wear out every single year. The only reason clothes costs are an emergency now is because you've been neglecting the coming expense. Well yes but the plan was to purchase them in October. Considering I went from 3 pairs of clothes I could wear to work, to 1, in 2 days, it came up sooner than we expected. Got a couple other things we were holding off on since there was a 20% sale also running at the time (on top of my wife's 25% employee discount). Cheap shot on the lack of money though we're doing the best we can at the moment. I don't think it's right to dog pile when again I've already acknowledged that yea poo poo I should have planned better, and then immediately did so for our budget going forward. Also I meant to talk about your post earlier. The car debt is higher than say me commuting to work, I was pretty much just naming them off in the order I thought about them.
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Sep 23, 2014 06:34
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Knyteguy posted:Hey we'll talk business during the trip and it's a writeoff Please tell me you know that "write-off" doesn't mean "free," and that depending on your tax bracket you'll probably only see 25% off on your taxes.
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Sep 23, 2014 06:34
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Inverse Icarus posted:Please tell me you know that "write-off" doesn't mean "free," and that depending on your tax bracket you'll probably only see 25% off on your taxes. I've been running some business or another and filing taxes for it since I was in highschool (well can't remember if I filed taxes back then, but probably). I'm aware yes that write-offs only help a tiny bit. Credits on the other hand  .Thanks again all for the helpful words today. I probably need to refine the budget a little more, but that's why I posted it.
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Sep 23, 2014 06:37
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Proof is in the pudding:Knyteguy posted:Yes. Here's our October budget that's a month ahead. See? We budgeted high for clothes because we knew needed some. If even 1 more pair of shorts had lasted we would've been good until October. I understand it's such an important decision to go over budget for the month. This was one of them.
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Sep 23, 2014 06:42
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Dude, dogpiling in BFC is a feature, not a bug  Your job is to decide how much credence you want to give it.
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Sep 23, 2014 06:44
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This is a great learning opportunity to see how budgets really work. If you were truly budgeting properly and you had to spend $100 more on the dog or $150 or clothes - both of which I could see happening. What you do is you figure out some way to cut costs from other line items to make up for it. You don't go out to eat as much or you cut your 'blow' budget or whatever. You do whatever it takes to make the numbers come out right at the end of the month. What would impress me or the other posters in here is if you decide to double your clothing spending or whatever you go into the other categories and cut by equal amounts. This comes back to why I think you need to set a budget where your total expenditures after taking out for savings and fixed costs doesn't change. This will actually force you to think about what you want and prioritize over the course of the month. You're still practicing reconciliation not budgeting. I feel like a bit of a broken record at this point. Edit: If you don't want a hyper dog walk it daily. n8r fucked around with this message at 07:05 on Sep 23, 2014 |
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Sep 23, 2014 07:03
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Here you big jerks I was having trouble sleeping with this in the air, so budget draft #2.pre:Income: Me 4334 Wife 400 (net less HSA) --- Total 4734 Costs: Savings 1700 Rent 790 Debt 700 Bills 600 Groceries 450 Discretionary 450 Business 40 Medical 0 HSA should cover all going forward --- Total 4730 Savings Expenditures: Vacation 300* * Vacation THIS ONE TIME per other posters is coming out of savings per previous 5-10ish posts. Off Budget Asset Accumulation: HSA/Prepaid Medical Bills ~1350 I also dropped the month ahead premise. It's too hard for me to focus on another complicated (for me) issue at the moment. I'd like to revisit the premise in the future, because I think that it will be worth it. I remember when we were YNABing it was nice. n8r that's the goal with this new budget. You guys gotta remember I learned on YNAB which is a little different than traditional budgeting. We were walking hardcore when we got the hyper dog (and part of the reason we got a hyper dog). Need to get back on that poo poo. Is this more of a budget than a reconciliation now? Also: This stupid thing kept making me and my wife crack up while trying to go to sleep. Thanks a lot. Edit: I forgot rent in the reposted budget. Bed time. Edit2: God I suck at going to bed tonight. I merged a bunch of categories to try to stop micromanaging budget categories (as has been discussed in the thread multiple times). I also tried to estimate categories to be just a little high. I'm going to really try not to spend our discretionary early on this month. It's imperative that we keep it high as long as possible to cover any possible category overages. Knyteguy fucked around with this message at 07:54 on Sep 23, 2014 |
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Sep 23, 2014 07:21
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Knyteguy posted:To everyone: quote:Income: 4700 ...I'd probably spend a lot of time online reading things, doing research, watching youtube videos or TV, playing video games I already owned or that were free, etc. I'd probably not go out with friends (instead of staying in with the wife) unless it was going to their place to hang out instead of going out for drinks or something. Also, Tropico 3 is free right now (10 hours left) from the Humble Bundle. EDIT: ^ I think you should seriously be including your HSA contributions in your budget because it IS money you're saving that you're going to spend. People count their 401k savings in their budget. I don't see how your HSA is significantly different. The beginning of SlowMo's thread has an example of how he accounts for it. Colin Mockery fucked around with this message at 08:07 on Sep 23, 2014 |
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Sep 23, 2014 07:53
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So is the PS4 off the table?Knyteguy posted:I also dropped the month ahead premise. It's too hard for me to focus on another complicated (for me) issue at the moment. I'd like to revisit the premise in the future, because I think that it will be worth it. I remember when we were YNABing it was nice. I'd say it's even worth cutting into the emergency fund to get there, because living a month ahead is effectively one month of emergency savings. Or more, if you cut discretionary when the true emergency arises. Knyteguy posted:The sole purpose of an emergency fund is to fund such things. Knyteguy posted:I don't think it's right to dog pile when again I've already acknowledged that yea poo poo I should have planned better, and then immediately did so for our budget going forward. The dog pile is because you've been down this road before. It's not the action, it's the attitude.
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Sep 23, 2014 10:10
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Ok - there's a lot of budgeting/tweaking talk in here, but I want to go back to this:quote:Picked up a second dog around the time the thread died in Marchish. She's a hard hyper dog, but we love her. The intention was to provide a companion for our first dog. In that regard it was a successful venture. Once again, Knyte saw a situation (single dog is lonesome) immediately decided on a course of action (need second dog) and ran to the first possible solution (grab available dog now now now) without thinking it through. Knyte, did you take the time to "meet" and hang out with multiple dogs before choosing the difficult one? Did you take into account extra costs for food, medical care, training, etc? Your situation is NEVER going to improve until you stop saying "Ok, I will fix this RIGHT NOW" and start actively thinking and planning. You are 100% in reactionary mode right now. Every single thing that happens (breaking a button) is throwing you off and sending you running for a fix (I'll overspend JUST THIS ONCE) that is sabotaging you long-term. Note* I am not saying, don't buy clothes for work. I'm saying, what if you had the $300 you spent on the secured card on a whim? Would a broken button send you over budget in that case? Also, stop and REALLY think about this. You were going to spend $600 on a PS4, knowing that you only had, what? Three pairs of pants to wear to a job I'm assuming you want to keep? Your priorities are frequently completely out of line with your goals. THIS IS A HUGE PROBLEM. Now, back to budgeting/tweaking talk: DFA & I have a system that works for us and covers most contingencies. In a nutshell, we have several savings accounts that we contribute to monthly, and they are: Car repairs, house repairs/items, Christmas, clothing, vacation/entertainment, car replacement, and emergency/unexpected expenses. THESE ARE ALL THINGS THAT WE KNOW WE NEED AND THAT WILL RECUR. They are also unrelated to day to day spending (groceries, gas, utilities) and not for long-term savings. They are specifically earmarked for those items. We also have personal accounts, and every pay a chunk goes to our personal accounts. We take turns buying groceries out of our "allowance" and we also pay for our own gas out of it, as well as any other unnecessary items - eating out, toys, my lending club notes, and frequently our own clothing. drat kids keep outgrowing their stuff and sucking up all the clothing budget. I like having the multiple accounts, so I know how much I have to spend on x, y, or z. Other people prefer having one account or category that everything goes into, and they just spend it as they need/want. Personally, I think it might be good for Knyte to keep his budget broken down. He still hasn't figured out yet that Christmas comes periodically, and it might be good to plan for that, or that clothes don't last forever, or that cars need oil changes and new brakes every so often. Knyte, I think you're going in the right direction, but you need to go further. It's great to plan to spend the minimum on everything, and put everything into savings but it's also unsustainable if you have to spend your savings every month because you didn't remember that birthdays come every year. I guess what I'm taking forever to say is: what is the purpose of your savings? DFA and I have both short-term (see above) savings, and long-term (Roth IRA, 401k, some CD's we can cash out in a crisis that we don't touch, some other stocks & mutual funds). So - are your savings short-term (something you are planning to spend for a specific purpose in the next few months) or are they long-term (we are going to save up for a house down payment, a solid 10k emergency fund that we'll never touch, etc.)? You need to find a balance between the two. Otherwise you're going to keep putting X into savings for one of your major goals then taking out Y because you didn't plan for the stuff that will happen every month or every few months, and getting frustrated and saying "this isn't working!" because you aren't saving as much as you thought you would at the beginning of the month.
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Sep 23, 2014 10:43
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Knyteguy posted:College isn't for everyone, and again we're not even in a position to think about something like this yet. We'll probably open one of those 529 plans and put like $1,000 in there like I mentioned. I don't want to deny our child opportunities, but there are resources like scholarships, grants, and subsidized student loans that don't built interest until after they graduate to help them along as well. It just depends what our situation is like, and we're talking 18+ years in the future here. We could have a total glut of educated people and need skilled tradesmen by then, it's hard to say. What I'm saying is there is a lot more than college. There are a lot of big expenses for kids entering adulthood, you should read LoveMeDead's thread which is a better demo of that than I could ever explain. Also, everything you're experiencing right now.
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Sep 23, 2014 14:00
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