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SiKboy posted:Counterpoint; I would absolutely hate it. Now, there isnt any practical difference between "The baddie has made up science powers" and "the baddie has magic powers" but for me it would totally go against the theme of the show. CounterCrossPoint Last loving episode, the monster might as well have been magic. They didn't even bother USING any science to try to explain it. If I have to sit through a loving moon dragon, you can give me a proper supernatural threat. I'm not asking for a elves even though we've already had them or pixies even though we've already had them, I'm just asking for Doctor Who to stop insisting that EVERYTHING weird as all hell like this is super sci fi. It starts to read like a Scooby Doo script where all of the monsters are always fake even if it makes no sense. Which they've abandoned!
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Oct 12, 2014 00:25
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madh posted:Excellent episode. Writer of the episode doing a AMA Oh, he did next week's too? That's... promising, I think?
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Oct 12, 2014 00:25
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This thread is a life saver, I just started watching DW properly this season after only catching bombastic Christmas specials and wondering why everyone is so into it based on those. The discussion of Kill The Moon was a fascinating read, I thought that ep was flat and clumsily directed so I'd pretty much checked out by the end and missed the whole abortion angle. Mummy on the Orient Express is definitely one of the better episodes so far, wonderfully written and sharply paced so some of the Braga-esque magic-tech plot contrivances (oh so the sonic screwdriver is broken now? The medical scanner can absorb/transmit emotions?) weren't too jarring. Isolating the Doctor and Clara so they could independently figure out that they need each other was a good move, shame it amounted to Clara getting locked in a box until she was needed, like a tool, but they did some good soul-searching character stuff there. I'm a little suspicious of Clara's sudden turn-around at the end of this episode.
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Oct 12, 2014 00:26
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Burkion posted:CounterCrossPoint That last point is the most pertinent, I think. The sheer hoops gone through to connect EVERYTHING to science, no matter how contrived, has wasted valuable time and effort that could be put into polishing the episode's writing into a mirror sheen.
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Oct 12, 2014 00:30
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Burkion posted:CounterCrossPoint  Pertwee would say that magic is just a science you don't understand yet.I'm wondering about who GUS might be. He has the ability to phone the TARDIS, the number to which the "shopkeeper" had and gave to Clara. If we're speculating that the shopkeeper is going to turn out to be Missy, then could GUS end up being Chris Addison? I was almost positive that we were going to get a scene in "Heaven" at the end with either the Captain or the Professor. On the one hand, it's a little weird to me that they had me expecting it and then didn't go there, but on the other hand, I'm glad to see another episode that is seemingly unencumbered by season long arc plot.
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Oct 12, 2014 00:30
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Mummy on the Orient Express gifs      
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Oct 12, 2014 00:47
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I think that Clara's turnaround on the Doctor was too quick and not earned enough based on the previous couple scenes, but other than that it was a really good, solid episode. This is shaping up to be as good as, at least, Series 5 for me.
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Oct 12, 2014 00:48
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      Got a wonderful Hartnell vibe from this visual  
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Oct 12, 2014 00:49
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http://i.imgur.com/Oh9huu8.jpg
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Oct 12, 2014 01:01
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I think this episode was an example of "good" technobabble because it explained the motives of the monster and didn't focus too much on random technical nonsense.Jerusalem posted:It just struck me as basic survival instincts - target the weak and sick because you're more likely to succeed. The mummy needed energy to continue its now utterly redundant purpose, they were simply the easiest targets for that energy. There was no malice or even any thought behind it, the thing was essentially operating on auto-pilot until the Doctor figured out the one thing it needed to hear to satisfy the conditions to allow it to stop "fighting" and let the poor bastard finally rest.
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Oct 12, 2014 01:17
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drat you for having a fun time, SA user DoctorWhat!  
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Oct 12, 2014 01:17
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Christ, this one legit broke my heart a little. That little difficulty he has making the salute screamed equal parts "Thank You" and "I'm so tired..."
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Oct 12, 2014 01:45
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Rochallor posted:I think that Clara's turnaround on the Doctor was too quick and not earned enough based on the previous couple scenes, but other than that it was a really good, solid episode. This is shaping up to be as good as, at least, Series 5 for me. It definitely was very quick but did she realize she wants more adventure or does she think the Doctor needs her too much right now? My guess is the later. I think she remembered that she really does like him this episode and he is obviously on the borderline of going completely cold and heartless if left alone. Either way that conflict has given us some of the best parts of the season. Unless they screw something up toward the end it's at least up there with season 4 or 5 for me.
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Oct 12, 2014 01:50
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Irony Be My Shield posted:I think this episode was an example of "good" technobabble because it explained the motives of the monster and didn't focus too much on random technical nonsense. I agree. The shape of the episode made sense without the science fictional elements, but adding that into the mix seemed to give life to the premise. It wouldn't have worked as well had this been a pure 1920s setting, say. Also, I really liked the bubble wrap! And the jellybabies! This writer can come back, and not just for next week's episode.
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Oct 12, 2014 02:22
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It was a pretty good episode with a pretty good critter! I think it suffered a little bit from the new Doctor thing where it feels like it was meant for the other one in spots, particularly where the Doctor is arguing with/condescending to himself.
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Oct 12, 2014 02:27
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I laughed IRL when the sarcophagus opened up and was full of bubble wrap. A+ episode.
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Oct 12, 2014 02:39
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Burkion posted:CounterCrossPoint What exactly would qualify as "supernatural" within the context of a show about a more-or-less immortal man who can travel the entirety of time and space in his flying blue box, though? What we would call "supernatural" is just poo poo that can't be explained by our current knowledge of how the universe works; to us (the viewers), pretty much everything in the show would qualify. If you mean "supernatural" within the show itself, well, given that one of the Doctor's defining characteristics is that he is insatiably curious and always wants to know the how and the why of everything, do you think he would be satisfied with "a wizard did it," or do you think he'd find and interrogate the wizard and poke him with a sonic screwdriver until he figured out the exact technobabble the wizard used to do whatever it is he just did?
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Oct 12, 2014 02:46
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I adored the turn where Clara was about to chew the Doctor out for making her into a callous liar who was leading a lamb to slaughter... and Twelve's leitmotif kicks in, he stands in front of Maisie and you realise... he was lying about NOT being able to save her. (Or at least about KNOWING he couldn't)
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Oct 12, 2014 02:52
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fixed, now that i've seen the episode and am no longer posting from a line waiting for a screening and on low battery.
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Oct 12, 2014 03:06
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THE OFFICIAL DOCTORWHAT FIRST-VIEWING OPINIONS:
THE END
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Oct 12, 2014 03:23
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DoctorWhat posted:[*] frank skinner for next companion I hope we see him again, maybe in a Christmas episode.
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Oct 12, 2014 03:59
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wow, this is the FOURTH great episode of the season. And the same writer is doing the next episode. 
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Oct 12, 2014 04:00
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Also wow but that cover of Don't Stop Me Now was great https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5-6fEj17MK4
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Oct 12, 2014 04:02
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Jerusalem posted:Also wow but that cover of Don't Stop Me Now was great It actually reminded me of The Coming of the Terraphiles, AKA the only Doctor Who Novel I've ever read and thought was actually good. The Doctor and Amy attend a Renaissance fair, but in the future the Renaissance, Industrial, and Information revolutions are collectively viewed as one massive period of progress, with the mean falling somewhere around the interwar years. Lots of fun, goofy mashing together of different anachronisms in that book.
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Oct 12, 2014 04:16
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completely expected there to be some sort of dumb "the whole train is a sarcophaGUS!" thing that episode owned
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Oct 12, 2014 04:17
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Republican Vampire posted:It actually reminded me of The Coming of the Terraphiles, AKA the only Doctor Who Novel I've ever read and thought was actually good. Probably because it was written by an actual real author! I think it was Lawrence Miles who wrote a rather funny self-deprecating thing about how when Moffat became showrunner he decided to swallow his pride and send him an e-mail asking if he could write any new Doctor Who novels. After all, who else was better qualified than him to take the job? And the next day Michael Moorcock was announced as writing a new Doctor Who novel
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Oct 12, 2014 04:22
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kant posted:It definitely was very quick but did she realize she wants more adventure or does she think the Doctor needs her too much right now? My guess is the later. I think she remembered that she really does like him this episode and he is obviously on the borderline of going completely cold and heartless if left alone. Clara's question about whether the Doctor is an addict made me wonder if Clara's quick turnaround might be because Clara herself is now addicted to the thrill/adrenaline/etc. of traveling with the Doctor. She created a flimsy rationalization as to why she doesn't need to change her habits or to think about quitting any longer, she lied to the Doctor with that rationalization, and she shifted blame/responsibility to Danny for why she did or didn't have to quit. At least, that's why I didn't find that turnaround to be too jarring. If it is addiction, there will be more ups and downs to come.
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Oct 12, 2014 04:32
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At the end, for a moment I thought they were all in Missy's afterlife.Anals of History posted:Clara's question about whether the Doctor is an addict made me wonder if Clara's quick turnaround might be because Clara herself is now addicted to the thrill/adrenaline/etc. of traveling with the Doctor. She created a flimsy rationalization as to why she doesn't need to change her habits or to think about quitting any longer, she lied to the Doctor with that rationalization, and she shifted blame/responsibility to Danny for why she did or didn't have to quit. At least, that's why I didn't find that turnaround to be too jarring. If it is addiction, there will be more ups and downs to come. I thought that was pretty transparently the implication of that scene.
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Oct 12, 2014 04:34
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Jerusalem posted:Probably because it was written by an actual real author! No lie, I basically felt like a sixteen year old girl when I read an early blurb and the twist at the end was that it was describing Captain Cornelius rather than The Doctor.
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Oct 12, 2014 04:37
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Jerusalem posted:Also wow but that cover of Don't Stop Me Now was great Apparently there's a full version  https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=830564583630628&fref=nf
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Oct 12, 2014 04:48
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DoctorWhat posted:
There was something really retro about it. There were parts that reminded me a bit of the light orchestral scores from the Tom Baker era.
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Oct 12, 2014 04:54
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Burkion posted:You know, all pretense aside, I would love it if the Doctor had to deal with something truly, honestly supernatural some time. He does on rare occasions, usually its presented as a dangerous and awe-inspiring thing and he tries running away. There was the Celestial Toymaker for One way back when, that time Two's Tardis stopped out of time back with, I think, Jamie and either Victoria or Zoe, the time when Ten had to deal with that guy who set him and Amy/Rory up with alternate scenarios and they had to choose which was real.
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Oct 12, 2014 04:56
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It seemed like the angle they were going for with "The Devil" in that Ood episode was supernatural. Like, he wasn't meant to be "the Devil" in the sense that he was literally exactly the same as the popular Christian interpretation of him. But he was still made out to be something strange, powerful, and outside of normal explanation.quote:...the time when Ten had to deal with that guy who set him and Amy/Rory up with alternate scenarios and they had to choose which was real. Nah, they explained that with telepathic pollen or something.
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Oct 12, 2014 04:59
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Cliff Racer posted:He does on rare occasions, usually its presented as a dangerous and awe-inspiring thing and he tries running away. There was the Celestial Toymaker for One way back when, that time Two's Tardis stopped out of time back with, I think, Jamie and either Victoria or Zoe, the time when Ten had to deal with that guy who set him and Amy/Rory up with alternate scenarios and they had to choose which was real. Those are usually treated as celestial beings of enormous psionic power or something though - it's functionally identical to magic without them coming straight out and saying,"Yeah okay it's magic". Personally I don't think a purely supernatural being really would fit in with Doctor Who as a show, but I'm all for the Doctor every so often running into something that he doesn't understand or know about, or suggestions that maybe, just maybe there might be something spiritual/supernatural but leaving it up to the viewer to decide for themselves what they think (ala The Unquiet Dead). The Dream Lord was from Matt Smith's run, and he didn't actually exist outside of being a mental projection of the Doctor's own self-loathing (which has also been postulated as the seeds of what would become the Valeyard).
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Oct 12, 2014 05:00
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You know, this is really the first episode that i've really felt that Capaldi was The Doctor. The thing that this season has lacked is that sense of wonder the Doctor gets when he sees something new. You got a bit of it last week when he realized the moon was an egg. But tonight it all just worked. I mean you could have told me that the episode was originally written for Eleven and I would've believed it, and I don't mean that as an insult.
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Oct 12, 2014 05:05
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Gordon Shumway posted:That episode was absolutely fantastic. I loved the atmosphere, the story, all the character development, and it was non-stop with Couldn't have put it better myself. Great summary. Irony Be My Shield posted:The Doctor lies. Rule #1. reality_groove posted:Really liked that episode, the setting, the mystery, the mixture of horror and just the right amount of sci-fi. Loved Frank I was a little surprised myself. A lot surprised, actually. I had the impression that she had worked everything out, she was leaving, and that would be that. True, near the end, we started to see that resolve disintegrate a little, but she was still on course to leave. And that conversation with Danny... BAM, 180 degrees. Not only 180 degrees, but mimic-The-Doctor 180 degrees. Mr. Larger Than Life influenced another one. I instantly thought of Davros's line about The Doctor turning ordinary people into weapons. True, Clara's not a weapon, per say, but it looks like she's on a path of a Manipulator, lying to Danny (telling him mission accomplished (mission being this is her last trip with The Doctor)), then lying to The Doctor ("He's fine with it"), then making sure to cover up her lie to Danny by making sure she always gets back on time. Hum. Maybe The Doctor doesn't influence - maybe he just brings out whatever potential (good or bad) are inside people, if they are with him long enough. I still can't forget the dramatic example of Martha - from healer to soldier. Edit: True, she started lying a little before also (getting Maisie to follow her to the lab)... RunAndGun fucked around with this message at 05:30 on Oct 12, 2014 |
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Oct 12, 2014 05:22
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I'll echo the praise -- I thought this was a fantastic episode from start to finish. Best of the season, in my opinion. Anals of History posted:Clara's question about whether the Doctor is an addict made me wonder if Clara's quick turnaround might be because Clara herself is now addicted to the thrill/adrenaline/etc. of traveling with the Doctor. She created a flimsy rationalization as to why she doesn't need to change her habits or to think about quitting any longer, she lied to the Doctor with that rationalization, and she shifted blame/responsibility to Danny for why she did or didn't have to quit. At least, that's why I didn't find that turnaround to be too jarring. If it is addiction, there will be more ups and downs to come. Yeah, I didn't think it was that bad of a turnaround - she was obviously struggling with leaving him the whole episode (the "you'll still pop round for dinner?" bit) teamed with her realization at the end that while he may outwardly appear heartless at times, he's generally just trying to do the best thing, even if it's hard or he gets wrong sometimes. She's not only addicted to the traveling and the adventure, she's addicted to the Doctor, too. I mean, he's been her friend through two incarnations now, and she did split herself into fragments all throughout his timeline last season. You can't just walk away from that. When she said "I love you" at the end on the phone to Danny, her eyes were locked on the Doctor (and I don't mean that it was intended in a romantic way, but just in a "he is incredibly important to her" way). Also, a nice touch from the author's AMA over on Reddit: quote:Q: Did Peter Capaldi say the lines exactly as you wrote/envisioned them or did he tweak anything?
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Oct 12, 2014 05:23
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StarkRavingMad posted:The jelly babies were his idea! Which I think we can all agree was genius. Moffat: Okay, I'll call the prop department so we can get a cigarette case full of jelly bab- Capaldi: Oh I think we both know there's no need for that.
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Oct 12, 2014 05:52
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It's as if RTD found a lost Hinchcliffe-era script and filmed it with a Moffat-era budget. Which is to say, I absolutely loving loved it. Between the 70's mystery music and lounge Queen, the music alone is reason enough to like the episode. More like this, please.
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Oct 12, 2014 05:55
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Hehe the top question on the AMA is "Forget the smell of the mummy, what does Jenna Coleman smell like?"
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Oct 12, 2014 05:58
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