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PoptartsNinja posted:Warfare in the Inner Sphere is usually surprisingly civil, if brutal. There're a few exceptions, but for the most part personnel can expect to be treated well unless: You forgot the Death Commandos
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Oct 17, 2014 22:07
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No I didn't.
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Oct 17, 2014 22:11
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Dolash posted:It still feels like while your big, mean lances of heavies are brawling to death on a plain or in a city, a sneaky scout that slips past the enemy pickets could just flamethrower the enemy's support staff to make it hard for the enemy force to repair and rearm after the engagement. Yeah, dropships tend to be used as mobile bases and have capital scale armor and a couple hundred tons of weapons. Not something you want to gently caress with if you don't absolutely have to.
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Oct 17, 2014 22:35
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Is there a code about not shooting dropships or non-fighter and helicopter based spacecraft due to the fact that no one can make anything anymore?
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Oct 17, 2014 23:22
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Dropships get made, it's Jumpships that are the ones produced in like, single digits per year per great house (Or something like that.)
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Oct 17, 2014 23:25
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Don't you generally want to capture Dropships if you can? Destroy the mech complement, control the space above it and call it out for a surrender?
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Oct 18, 2014 00:07
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PoptartsNinja posted:Warfare in the Inner Sphere is usually surprisingly civil, if brutal. There're a few exceptions, but for the most part personnel can expect to be treated well unless: Or if you're actively using infernos against vees/infantry, I'd think. I imagine if the enemy force managed to capture you after you went MAXIMUM FIRESTARTER on them, you'd probably get not so great treatment. Trundel posted:Is there a code about not shooting dropships or non-fighter and helicopter based spacecraft due to the fact that no one can make anything anymore? Jumpships, very big yes. Dropships, less so. Those still get produced in not insignificant numbers. You still probably want to capture them rather than destroy them if you can.
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Oct 18, 2014 00:17
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PoptartsNinja posted:No I didn't. Which says a lot about the death commandos. Pirates are often more, "you can be a pirate and salvage for us, or die." than outright slaughter (sometimes a lot of slaughter.)
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Oct 18, 2014 00:49
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Orders are due tomorrow, yes? I'm eager for more updates on this level.
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Oct 18, 2014 03:07
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DatonKallandor posted:Don't you generally want to capture Dropships if you can? Destroy the mech complement, control the space above it and call it out for a surrender? Of course. They might not be nigh-irreplaceable, but they're still expensive as hell especially when you're talking military ones. Even civilian freight-haulers tend to run into the hundreds of millions of C-Bills and they're bare-bones designs with just enough armor and weaponry to perhaps scare off a minimum-strenght raid and protect the thing from micro-meteorites.
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Oct 18, 2014 03:14
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Does anyone make a habit of using their dropship aggressively? If they're so heavily armed and armored you'd think they might help bulk up a salient or anchor a line. I suppose exposing your ride home to open combat is pretty risky and historically command elements don't engage on the front lines unless they have to, but maybe where appropriate? I remember fighting a dropship in MW4: Mercs and that thing was pretty tough. Are all-combat dropship designs that don't actually carry any mechs a thing?
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Oct 18, 2014 04:30
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Dolash posted:Does anyone make a habit of using their dropship aggressively? If they're so heavily armed and armored you'd think they might help bulk up a salient or anchor a line. I suppose exposing your ride home to open combat is pretty risky and historically command elements don't engage on the front lines unless they have to, but maybe where appropriate? I remember fighting a dropship in MW4: Mercs and that thing was pretty tough. I don't think 31st century warfare even has continuous lines and salients anymore, it usually reads as two small forces meeting in the field like the glorious knights they represent. Forming a coherent line across a continent takes literally millions of soldiers. Invading against such a force would require a logistical feat that is closer to a population resettlement than a military operation.
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Oct 18, 2014 04:40
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So I've got a small laser in each leg, if I fire with one or both of them can I kick on the Physical phase or does that prohibit me from kicking like it would with firing arm weapons before punching?
Trundel fucked around with this message at 05:12 on Oct 18, 2014 |
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Oct 18, 2014 05:05
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Any discussion about attacking lines of supply and logistics is inherently moot. This is a system where the very act of feeding and providing water for entire planets is based on a literally impossible logistics network. Hole economy and all that.
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Oct 18, 2014 05:06
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Dolash posted:Does anyone make a habit of using their dropship aggressively? If they're so heavily armed and armored you'd think they might help bulk up a salient or anchor a line. I suppose exposing your ride home to open combat is pretty risky and historically command elements don't engage on the front lines unless they have to, but maybe where appropriate? I remember fighting a dropship in MW4: Mercs and that thing was pretty tough. There are DropShips that function exclusively as combat platforms. Depending on their armaments, they are either Assault DropShips like the Achilles and Avenger, or Pocket WarShips like the Isegrim or Interdictor. The Assault DropShip was used at the forefront of major invasions to punch through orbital defenses like fighter screens and were the closest thing to WarShips in the Succession Wars, but were armed with fighter-scale weapons like PPCs. These are the one type of ship you might see being used to support ground operations, but the major drawback is that spherical DropShips basically just drop engines-down towards a planet and then fire thrusters to get control on the descent, while aerodyne DropShips handle in atmosphere with all the grace and precision of a jumbo jet. They're both incredibly easy targets in atmo, so most Assault DropShip commanders are not eager to commit to a planetary attack run. Since Assault DropShip commanders are at least equivalent to a Regimental Colonel (and in the Succession Wars, were usually Admirals before that became the rank you held to command a WarShip) they couldn't be ordered to do it either. Pocket WarShips are a Jihad-era invention where people wanted to be able to protect against WarShip attacks in a way that was not the three established methods of fighting one off (having your own WarShip, having a working SDS network, or shooting a nuke at it). They took a DropShip hull and fitted the only WarShip scale weapon that can be used on a DropShip: the capital missile launcher. Since Pocket WarShips have capital-scale weapons taking up the vast majority of their mass, it makes way more sense to have them fire a missile from orbit at an enemy position than have them strafe with their secondary weapons. With this in mind, combat DropShips are far from useless. While Assault DropShips are limited in atmosphere, they are very agile craft in space and serve as a valuable force multiplier for WarShips. Since even a small corvette-class WarShip like the Fox, Fredasa or Mako would still be an enormously rare asset like an aircraft carrier is today, combat DropShips are basically filling the role that small corvettes or gunships or whatever other kind of tiny boat does. (The Achilles is a particular favorite Assault DS of mine and one featured as the flagship of the 2nd Donegal Guards' flotilla in my War of 3039 campaign. Much like the Defiant, it's engines can literally shake the ship apart if you open them all the way up.) Defiance Industries fucked around with this message at 05:18 on Oct 18, 2014 |
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Oct 18, 2014 05:13
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Orders in, jumping to 2341 and leaving building destruction to others. Never not jump.
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Oct 18, 2014 05:53
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Sizuka: Yes please. But please feel free to kill the poo poo out of anything that gets close. I'm going to try to stay at the rear end of the group and pick things off when I see them.
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Oct 18, 2014 06:29
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So I'm going to complete the firing line in the west in either 1042/1143, depending where the Whammy ends up stomping too. Also going to add to the property damage.
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Oct 18, 2014 09:28
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Going to be jumping to 2541 - don't want to shift too far away from the right side.
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Oct 18, 2014 09:39
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Tank Boy Ken posted:So I'm going to complete the firing line in the west in either 1042/1143, depending where the Whammy ends up stomping too. Also going to add to the property damage. I'm thinking 0642 pending on the answers to some questions I sent PTN.
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Oct 18, 2014 10:26
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Trundel posted:So I've got a small laser in each leg, if I fire with one or both of them can I kick on the Physical phase or does that prohibit me from kicking like it would with firing arm weapons before punching? It does prohibit.
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Oct 18, 2014 10:36
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Dolash posted:Does anyone make a habit of using their dropship aggressively? If they're so heavily armed and armored you'd think they might help bulk up a salient or anchor a line. I suppose exposing your ride home to open combat is pretty risky and historically command elements don't engage on the front lines unless they have to, but maybe where appropriate? I remember fighting a dropship in MW4: Mercs and that thing was pretty tough. Steiner used a specially-created force of several Fortress-class droppers aggressively during the OTL 4th Succession War, using them on a few planets to cut off the maneuvering space of kuritan units. IIRC at least one kuritan regiment ended up getting horribly maimed due to that tactic because they ended up with the choice of going head-on against a larger Steiner force or retreating through a narrow canyon that the dropships were zeroed in on. The Fortress is pretty much the best model to pull off that tactic - it's armored and armed to a similar level as the Overlord class (which is half again the mass!) and has a Long Tom artillery in it's nose, that it can only use while grounded. Thing's literally built as a mobile artillery base supporting the combined-arms battalion it can carry.
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Oct 18, 2014 10:45
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So I just updated MegaMek and wow, a ton of mechs have had their sprites changed for the worse. Apparently this is a Warhammer now: Is this some kind of unseen/reseen thing or something?
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Oct 18, 2014 12:25
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Orders in: moving to 2341 to cover that right side a bit more.
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Oct 18, 2014 14:09
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Scintilla posted:So I just updated MegaMek and wow, a ton of mechs have had their sprites changed for the worse. Apparently this is a Warhammer now: It's a dyanamic walking pose. Can't you feel the speed?
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Oct 18, 2014 15:01
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goatface posted:It's a dyanamic walking pose. Can't you feel the speed? It looks like it has deformed, oversized duck feet. It looks like one of them is coming out of it's shoulder.
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Oct 18, 2014 15:08
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It's not even the worst. Look at the Battlemaster: And the Locust:  At least the Omega is reasonably cool: 
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Oct 18, 2014 15:16
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Pocket Warships often also make use of the WoB-invented Sub-Capitol weapons. The sub-cap missile launchers in particular are nice for not warships, but dealing with enemy ASF waves. You can fit a good number of them with decent ammo and the greater speed of most droppers compared to warships means the reduced range isn't as big of a deal. Especially since sub-cap weaponry still outranges mech/fighter scale stuff. And like Capitol missiles, they take no penalty to hit small targets, like ASF.
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Oct 18, 2014 15:49
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Warhammer orders are in; I'm proceeding to 0642 and then blasting the building in 1340 to give myself a better firing lane. It's going to be hard to take advantage of the maximum range of my guns without leveling the whole map, so if we can draw them south where there's a little more room that would be useful. At least I don't have a minimum range on them (IIRC?).
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Oct 18, 2014 16:09
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ER PPCs have no minimum range, so you can use them in close combat just fine.
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Oct 18, 2014 16:25
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I thought so. I'd prefer to be a million hexes away though, doing 360 torso twist MLG noscopes.
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Oct 18, 2014 16:26
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OptimusShr posted:Orders in: moving to 2341 to cover that right side a bit more. Err, we might have a problem considering that I've already jumped to there.
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Oct 18, 2014 16:51
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Trundel posted:Err, we might have a problem considering that I've already jumped to there. What's a bit of DFA between friends?
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Oct 18, 2014 16:53
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fool_of_sound posted:What's a bit of DFA between friends? Won't happen, someone gets stopped early. Priority goes to the person who sent orders in first.
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Oct 18, 2014 16:55
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AtomikKrab posted:Which says a lot about the death commandos.
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Oct 18, 2014 18:06
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Looks like there's no point using weapons other than the wrecking ball to clear space, and I'm deferring to Zest on what space would be useful if cleared. What happens if I try to Kool-aid man through a building? A piloting check? Damage to my mech? Is it a good idea? A bad one? Something only for desperate circumstances?
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Oct 18, 2014 19:41
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sizuka2 posted:Looks like there's no point using weapons other than the wrecking ball to clear space, and I'm deferring to Zest on what space would be useful if cleared. I'm sure someone will come in an give you a better answer, but when I asked PTN this exact question he replied "vague response is: "Piloting check to avoid damage, damaged based on how durable the building is." He didn't have the books with him at the time which is why it's so vague.
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Oct 18, 2014 20:19
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More specifically (I'm still not home so I still can't check my books), for every building hex you move into or through: 1) It costs extra MP to enter a building hex (based on the type of building, lights are +1, mediums +2, there's nothing bigger on this map). 2) You roll a piloting check to avoid damage (based on the building's CF... divided by 5 or 10 (I'm not home so I can't check) but we're talking either 1-2 or 2-3 damage for the light buildings on the map, but 4-8 for the medium buildings) 3) You damage the building based on your tonnage (I think it's tonnage/10, so it hits like a punch), if this damage is done in the move phase and you do enough damage to destroy the building it collapses immediately (on your head) and automatically deals damage like you'd failed a piloting check, which is adjusted based on how much taller the building is than you (on this map, that means "not adjusted at all" unless you manage to drop one of the medium buildings on your own head).
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Oct 18, 2014 20:28
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If I've got that right, that means a) not likely to do enough damage to destroy most buildings if /10, maybe if /5... and if I succeed, damage to the cockpit? No kool-aid man for me, in that case.
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Oct 18, 2014 20:33
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It's should be perfectly fine to smash through and then shoot one with your rear laser to make it collapse in the shooting phase. The potential damage isn't that bad, but if it collapses on you the damage is to your punch-hit locations (so much more likely to hit you in the cockpit).
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Oct 18, 2014 20:37
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