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the heat goes wrong
Dec 31, 2005
I´m watching you...
Run your numbers again. This time split your mortgage payment into two, interest payment and principal payment. Interest payment goes to costs, equity payments go under profit.
Just because investment property isnt producing much cashflow, doesn't mean it can't provide a solid return.

Also, how much capital did you put in to this property? Whats the ROI on that? Instead if completely selling, is it possible to take out a equity loan and use those funds to help finance the next property? That way you can increase the ROI on this one and still have extra funds for the next investment.

the heat goes wrong fucked around with this message at 18:56 on Oct 14, 2014

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Bloody Queef
Mar 23, 2012

by zen death robot

Azur posted:

Run your numbers again. This time split your mortgage payment into two, interest payment and principal payment. Interest payment goes to costs, equity payments go under profit.
Just because investment property isnt producing much cashflow, doesn't mean it can't provide a solid return.

Also, how much capital did you put in to this property? Whats the ROI on that? Instead if completely selling, is it possible to take out a equity loan and use those funds to help finance the next property? That way you can increase the ROI on this one and still have extra funds for the next investment.

Yeah, something feels very odd about those numbers. What did you put down and what was the purchase price. You're way over the 1% of purchase price in monthly rent line. Which, as you probably know, it's used as a quick back of napkin calculation with assumptions that most things like vacancy and maintenance are average.

E: are you on a 10 year mortgage? I just bought a house with similar monthly expenses ($85 more) and purchase price was 80k and I put 20% down. A tenant in one of my other properties wants to upgrade from her studio and is down with the $1200 number I threw out when she inquired about it. Motivation to get the new carpet in and finish the wd hookups.

Bloody Queef fucked around with this message at 00:23 on Oct 15, 2014

ShaqDiesel
Mar 21, 2013

Bloody Queef posted:

Yeah, something feels very odd about those numbers. What did you put down and what was the purchase price. You're way over the 1% of purchase price in monthly rent line. Which, as you probably know, it's used as a quick back of napkin calculation with assumptions that most things like vacancy and maintenance are average.

E: are you on a 10 year mortgage? I just bought a house with similar monthly expenses ($85 more) and purchase price was 80k and I put 20% down. A tenant in one of my other properties wants to upgrade from her studio and is down with the $1200 number I threw out when she inquired about it. Motivation to get the new carpet in and finish the wd hookups.

I put down 2k and the price was 39k (didn't have a lot if cash at the time). I've made some updates - siding for $1500; bath for $3000. Its a 20 year mortgage which I'm ten years into.

particle409
Jan 15, 2008

Thou bootless clapper-clawed varlot!
I just had to evict a tenant. Actually, I let him leave, in exchange for me not evicting him and suing him for a shitton of back rent. He left behind lots of stuff. I forgot to get all the pics, but let's look at some of it! I can always get the 3rd bedroom and living room tomorrow.

Bedroom 1


Bedroom 2


This is a flipped dresser drawer. There is a dresser in the room missing its drawer, but the one in this picture is too big to fit in the dresser. Very confusing.


This'll come right out.


That's cool, I didn't want the closet door on its hinges anyway.


Master bedroom. The furniture and mattresses are such a loving pain to get out.


I found a shitload of shoe boxes, which seems to be a theme. Tenants who don't pay rent almost always have thousands of dollars worth of shoes. Seriously, somebody should do a study.


Garage: It's full of auto care products. The tenant drives a nicer car than I do. Also, a shitload of bootleg dvd's, maybe a few hundred of them in bags stuffed in the shelving on the side.

More garage. Instead of having my crew pay to bring this to the dumpster, I may just have a free garage sale, let people take it.


BONUS!!! For reading this entire post, you get a reward!

I found this cd spindle in the master bedroom, with about 50 dvd's. Batman Begins, and not a lovely bootleg? gently caress, I never saw the third one, maybe it's in this pile.


Oh boy. I never saw the first two.
:nws: http://i.imgur.com/TkMIdzq.jpg :nws:

I'm sensing a theme here.
:nws: http://i.imgur.com/1ME7Zgk.jpg :nws:

I know somebody who used to call this poo poo all the time. She's a 50 year-old West Indian immigrant, I should send this to her.
http://i.imgur.com/lTdwO2I.jpg

Oh cool, a political documentary.
http://imgur.com/89h2uoS

edit: I can post more bootleg BBW porn dvd's, not sure if this is the right thread for it though (it's not).

particle409 fucked around with this message at 00:29 on Oct 18, 2014

adorai
Nov 2, 2002

10/27/04 Never forget
Grimey Drawer

FISHMANPET posted:

~$15k profit right now or $21 profit a month.

The math looks pretty simple on that one.
Your analysis is poor. It's either:

$15k now

-or-

$21 a month + $15k later

The questions that are actually important to the discussion:

What repairs do you foresee from normal wear and tear in the next X years?
Do you currently have a tenant?
If yes, is the tenant a good tenant?

Scrapez
Feb 27, 2004

Sorry if this has been covered and I missed it. For those of you that own detached single family houses, do you do the yard work on them or do you have the tenants do it?

Is there liability involved with having a tenant mow the grass themselves?

BEHOLD: MY CAPE
Jan 11, 2004

Scrapez posted:

Sorry if this has been covered and I missed it. For those of you that own detached single family houses, do you do the yard work on them or do you have the tenants do it?

Is there liability involved with having a tenant mow the grass themselves?

In my rental the tenant is responsible for keeping the lawn maintained to standards of city ordinance. Can't think of any reason why doing yard work would be any special liability above and beyond the general risk of liability you incur by having humans exist in or near something you own.

BEHOLD: MY CAPE
Jan 11, 2004

particle409 posted:

I just had to evict a tenant. Actually, I let him leave, in exchange for me not evicting him and suing him for a shitton of back rent. He left behind lots of stuff. I forgot to get all the pics, but let's look at some of it! I can always get the 3rd bedroom and living room tomorrow.

Bedroom 1


Bedroom 2


This is a flipped dresser drawer. There is a dresser in the room missing its drawer, but the one in this picture is too big to fit in the dresser. Very confusing.


This'll come right out.


That's cool, I didn't want the closet door on its hinges anyway.


Master bedroom. The furniture and mattresses are such a loving pain to get out.


I found a shitload of shoe boxes, which seems to be a theme. Tenants who don't pay rent almost always have thousands of dollars worth of shoes. Seriously, somebody should do a study.


Garage: It's full of auto care products. The tenant drives a nicer car than I do. Also, a shitload of bootleg dvd's, maybe a few hundred of them in bags stuffed in the shelving on the side.

More garage. Instead of having my crew pay to bring this to the dumpster, I may just have a free garage sale, let people take it.


BONUS!!! For reading this entire post, you get a reward!

I found this cd spindle in the master bedroom, with about 50 dvd's. Batman Begins, and not a lovely bootleg? gently caress, I never saw the third one, maybe it's in this pile.


Oh boy. I never saw the first two.
:nws: http://i.imgur.com/TkMIdzq.jpg :nws:

I'm sensing a theme here.
:nws: http://i.imgur.com/1ME7Zgk.jpg :nws:

I know somebody who used to call this poo poo all the time. She's a 50 year-old West Indian immigrant, I should send this to her.
http://i.imgur.com/lTdwO2I.jpg

Oh cool, a political documentary.
http://imgur.com/89h2uoS

edit: I can post more bootleg BBW porn dvd's, not sure if this is the right thread for it though (it's not).

This is my shuddering nightmare, I have no idea what I would even do if a tenant absconded and left my house in such a mess. Are there companies that will clean this poo poo up for you?

sleepy gary
Jan 11, 2006

BEHOLD: MY CAPE posted:

This is my shuddering nightmare, I have no idea what I would even do if a tenant absconded and left my house in such a mess. Are there companies that will clean this poo poo up for you?

You can always hire someone to do something you don't want to. Particle409's photo set doesn't look too bad (not to diminish the lovely situation he was faced with) and if I was his buddy I'd be willing to go spend a day clearing that poo poo out of there with him.

You could probably put an ad on craigslist in the free section with all those exact photos and have a couple dozen people come and take 80% of it before the garbage men had to deal with it.

SlapActionJackson
Jul 27, 2006

Scrapez posted:

Sorry if this has been covered and I missed it. For those of you that own detached single family houses, do you do the yard work on them or do you have the tenants do it?

Is there liability involved with having a tenant mow the grass themselves?

I made my first tenant responsible for the lawn, but I got tired of sending emails saying the front lawn looked like wild prairie (and this was someone who was keeping the house itself in decent shape). Now I hire a service to do it regularly and it's part of the rent. It's just easier for everyone that way and with he general rising rents in the area, I had no trouble working it in to the monthly cash flow for all the subsequent tenants.

Tricky Ed
Aug 18, 2010

It is important to avoid confusion. This is the one that's okay to lick.


In my experience with house rentals they've either come with yard service built in to rent or offered a rent break for keeping it up themselves (with appropriate minimums defined in the contract and a hefty payment if not). Anyone I've known with double-digit rental properties doesn't offer the option because it's too much of a hassle (and you can often get the service cheaper with that much guaranteed work).

SpclKen
Mar 13, 2006
New Goon... go easy

Scrapez posted:

Sorry if this has been covered and I missed it. For those of you that own detached single family houses, do you do the yard work on them or do you have the tenants do it?

Is there liability involved with having a tenant mow the grass themselves?

I own a rental in a gated community with an HOA. I add the lawn maintenance in my rent. I charge more for rent so I don't get any letters from the HOA that my grass is dying. Honestly, even if I didn't have an HOA I think I would still do it because if the Tennant kills your lawn, the replacement cost can be pretty big when you are trying to rent it again. This is in Central California where lawns are supposed to be nice all four seasons.

Blackjack2000
Mar 29, 2010

moana posted:

I don't want to do it myself, managing renters sucks rear end. I just don't want to sell until I know for sure I want to move, which is why for such a short period of time. Just was wondering if there were any common questions I should be asking.

How do you know? Have you done it before? The hard part is finding good renters, which is hard any way you do it. Property management companies have no incentive to keep costs down, find good tenants, or do anything else right for that matter.

I rented out my house when I moved because I had negative equity. Here's what I had to do.

1. Find tenants. This was a PITA, the house was on the market for like 2 months before I met the folks I ended up renting to, and I got stupid offers like people that wanted cheaper rent in exchange for "fixing the place up". Yeah right, keep your loving paws out of my poo poo.

2. Sign a lease, give them the keys, open an account for the security deposit.

3. 1 month in, the drain clogged. Plumper cleaned it out for $375 and told me it was from the tenants flushing baby wipes. I told the tenant he had to pay me the $375 because it was his fault. Tenant bitched but paid.

4. One of my former neighbors left a snarky post on my Facebook feed about the grass at the property getting too long. Called the tenant, he told me he had hurt himself falling down the stairs, but he would get the grass cut. Deleted the Facebook post and defriended the old neighbor.

5. Got a notice from the city that the water bill hadn't been paid, and that they were going to shut the water off. Called the tenant. He was aware and assured me that he was going to pay the water bill before it got shut off.

6. Drain clogged again. This time the plumber said it was tree roots on the sewer side of the main trap. I have to pay for this one since it's not the tenant's fault. $600.

That's spread over 10 months. I don't really know how a property management company would have made any of that any easier, except I suppose that they would have been talking to the tenant instead of me.

you ate my cat
Jul 1, 2007

I've been living in the same rental for about 8 years now, and while it's a very nice place it's getting to the point where it no longer suits my needs. My work situation has finally become stable as well, so I'm starting to think about moving again. I'm also starting to run the numbers on buying vs renting.

One thing I'm considering is buying a duplex, living in half, and renting the other half. I feel like on one hand, it has the best of both worlds going on - you own the property, but (in theory) someone else is paying some/all of your mortgage. On the other hand, it's the worst of both worlds - you have a lovely neighbor AND a mortgage all in one package.

Anyone ever do this, or have thoughts on this? I know better than to over-buy and rely on the rent in order to afford payments, at least.

Scrapez
Feb 27, 2004

you ate my cat posted:

I've been living in the same rental for about 8 years now, and while it's a very nice place it's getting to the point where it no longer suits my needs. My work situation has finally become stable as well, so I'm starting to think about moving again. I'm also starting to run the numbers on buying vs renting.

One thing I'm considering is buying a duplex, living in half, and renting the other half. I feel like on one hand, it has the best of both worlds going on - you own the property, but (in theory) someone else is paying some/all of your mortgage. On the other hand, it's the worst of both worlds - you have a lovely neighbor AND a mortgage all in one package.

Anyone ever do this, or have thoughts on this? I know better than to over-buy and rely on the rent in order to afford payments, at least.

I can't speak to the rental aspect but with interest rates so low, now is a good time to buy versus rent in my mind. Unless you see yourself moving out of town soon or there are other unforeseen reasons that you'd rent.

I would think the one nice thing about living next door to your rental is that you can keep a good eye on it and renters would most likely have a tendency to treat the property better knowing the owner is a wall away.

That is speculation as I have no first hand experience.

Bloody Queef
Mar 23, 2012

by zen death robot

you ate my cat posted:

I've been living in the same rental for about 8 years now, and while it's a very nice place it's getting to the point where it no longer suits my needs. My work situation has finally become stable as well, so I'm starting to think about moving again. I'm also starting to run the numbers on buying vs renting.

One thing I'm considering is buying a duplex, living in half, and renting the other half. I feel like on one hand, it has the best of both worlds going on - you own the property, but (in theory) someone else is paying some/all of your mortgage. On the other hand, it's the worst of both worlds - you have a lovely neighbor AND a mortgage all in one package.

Anyone ever do this, or have thoughts on this? I know better than to over-buy and rely on the rent in order to afford payments, at least.

I have a studio apartment with a separate entrance in the attic of my house. It got me hooked on being a landlord. The apartment is 650 sq ft and the portion of the house I live in is 2k sq ft

Great advantage is that your mortgage rate will be good, and you don't need to do 20% down. You can even do FHA. I did 20% down conventional anyway. Just make sure you can afford the mortgage payment if you don't have a tenant in place. If you screen your tenants really well it works out great. As a renter, you can't pick your neighbors. In this particular apartment I probably wind up passing on four potential tenants for every one that I choose to sign the lease. Be VERY picky. They're basically almost a roommate so screen accordingly.

My advice overall is to tell the tenant you manage the property for the owner (not technically a lie)

I'll give you the financial breakdown of my house. Bought for 215k, 20% down. Mortgage, insurance and taxes sum up to 1065 a month. I get 800 a month for the apartment and I include cable, WiFi, and all utilities. I've noticed $50-75 a month jump in electricity. I'd get 1500-2000 if I rented out the portion I live in. In fact once I need more space, I'll buy a new house and rent my portion out. Magical loving numbers, yes. And if I could get deals that good all the time, I'd leverage myself to my eyeballs and quit my job.

Let me know what specific advice you need. Feel free to PM me if you want to keep your details private.

Pompous Rhombus
Mar 11, 2007

Bloody Queef posted:

If you screen your tenants really well it works out great. As a renter, you can't pick your neighbors. In this particular apartment I probably wind up passing on four potential tenants for every one that I choose to sign the lease. Be VERY picky. They're basically almost a roommate so screen accordingly.

How does one cover one's rear end from a discrimination suit during that process?

smackfu
Jun 7, 2004

Blackjack2000 posted:

That's spread over 10 months. I don't really know how a property management company would have made any of that any easier, except I suppose that they would have been talking to the tenant instead of me.

That sounds like a good renter. What if it was someone calling to complain about poo poo every other week?

Kiwi Ghost Chips
Feb 19, 2011

Start using the best desktop environment now!
Choose KDE!

Pompous Rhombus posted:

How does one cover one's rear end from a discrimination suit during that process?

There's an FHA exemption for owners who live in a 4-plex or smaller building.

Bloody Queef
Mar 23, 2012

by zen death robot

Pompous Rhombus posted:

How does one cover one's rear end from a discrimination suit during that process?

Don't reject someone because they're black? Or if you do, don't tell them thats why?

But seriously if you have multiple people looking, you're going to have many legal, non discriminatory reasons reasons why each applicant that you reject isn't as good as the one you pick.

Kiwi Ghost Chips posted:

There's an FHA exemption for owners who live in a 4-plex or smaller building.
Is that so? Do you have a link to that exemption?

you ate my cat
Jul 1, 2007

Bloody Queef posted:

Is that so? Do you have a link to that exemption?

“Mrs. Murphy” Exemption
– Owner occupied building with no more than four
families living independently of each other.

That seems to be what we're talking about. That quote is from here (PDF, pg 5). From what I'm reading it looks like I still couldn't say something like "Well I'm not renting to black people."

Thanks for the thoughts so far on the duplex idea I have. My main concern is that it sounds so positive that I'm sure I'm missing something. How would I handle a situation where both units are occupied? Pick a unit and advise the tenant that I won't be renewing the lease (in accordance with local laws, after consulation with a lawyer, I assume)?

Blackjack2000
Mar 29, 2010

smackfu posted:

That sounds like a good renter. What if it was someone calling to complain about poo poo every other week?

That would suck but it would still be worth the money I'm making.

The Dipshit
Dec 21, 2005

by FactsAreUseless
So I suppose here would be a good place to ask a question as a renter. Currently I'm renting out a duplex 3bd/1.25 bath for about 750 a month. It's a beautiful old house built in the 1920s with a *lot* of deferred maintenance. I have a lot of experience doing house work (grew up spending summers working in a custom home construction company as free labor, since it was my grandpa's business and child labor laws don't apply to family working in family businesses). I've made some vague discussions to the landlord about updating some parts, such as tiling the shower (it has mold and needs to be taken down to studs anyway), doing some tiling for the floor of the bathroom, replacing the peel and stick vinyl flooring that is starting to come up, doing some plaster repair for the walls, painting the outside of the house, and sanding/varnishing the upstairs 100 year old growth hardwood... currently painted over in battleship gray.


So far he is receptive to the idea of me fixing things up, and I figure I can do the smaller projects like tiling in the downstairs bathroom/refinishing the stairs first as a show of skill, but from there, is it fair to do the work for the cost of materials? Would it be fair to also put in a (low) labor charge to be taken off the rent? I plan to stay here for ~ 3 years while my fiancee finishes up med school and figures out where she will be for residency, so I'd like the place to be fairly nice, since it's location is fantastic for my commute.

BEHOLD: MY CAPE
Jan 11, 2004
Unless there's some serious shortage of nice places to rent where you are or you just really love doing renovation work, why would you do thousands of dollars worth of skilled labor for your landlord for free or almost free?

The Dipshit
Dec 21, 2005

by FactsAreUseless

BEHOLD: MY CAPE posted:

Unless there's some serious shortage of nice places to rent where you are or you just really love doing renovation work, why would you do thousands of dollars worth of skilled labor for your landlord for free or almost free?

Location is downtown, really close to my work, I do enjoy renovation work (and I love old houses), it's something to do while I'm new in town building up a social circle and trying to avoid missing my fiancee since she is finishing up her research work in Dallas and can't come here to write her dissertation yet. And I'm going to negotiate a bit off my rent, the question is "how much", since I literally don't know anything on the pricing of renovation work, I only know the "how to do it" part.

The Dipshit fucked around with this message at 14:09 on Dec 14, 2014

Rurutia
Jun 11, 2009

Claverjoe posted:

Location is downtown, really close to my work, I do enjoy renovation work (and I love old houses), it's something to do while I'm new in town building up a social circle and trying to avoid missing my fiancee since she is finishing up her research work in Dallas and can't come here to write her dissertation yet. And I'm going to negotiate a bit off my rent, the question is "how much", since I literally don't know anything on the pricing of renovation work, I only know the "how to do it" part.

I'd still negotiate for getting a discount on rent or something like that.

Bloody Queef
Mar 23, 2012

by zen death robot

Claverjoe posted:

Location is downtown, really close to my work, I do enjoy renovation work (and I love old houses), it's something to do while I'm new in town building up a social circle and trying to avoid missing my fiancee since she is finishing up her research work in Dallas and can't come here to write her dissertation yet. And I'm going to negotiate a bit off my rent, the question is "how much", since I literally don't know anything on the pricing of renovation work, I only know the "how to do it" part.

Get a contractor to come out and give you an estimate and provide the landlord with that estimate. Then ask what he thinks is fair for the work based on that estimate.

I've never allowed a tenant do work on one of my places, but I've had many applicants say they'd do work for reduced rent. Sorry, I just want someone licensed and bonded in case something was hosed up.

BEHOLD: MY CAPE
Jan 11, 2004

Bloody Queef posted:

Get a contractor to come out and give you an estimate and provide the landlord with that estimate. Then ask what he thinks is fair for the work based on that estimate.

I've never allowed a tenant do work on one of my places, but I've had many applicants say they'd do work for reduced rent. Sorry, I just want someone licensed and bonded in case something was hosed up.

Yeah same here, any prospective tenant who makes an approach like that is saying to me "I can't afford the rent you are asking....".

BEHOLD: MY CAPE
Jan 11, 2004

Claverjoe posted:

Location is downtown, really close to my work, I do enjoy renovation work (and I love old houses), it's something to do while I'm new in town building up a social circle and trying to avoid missing my fiancee since she is finishing up her research work in Dallas and can't come here to write her dissertation yet. And I'm going to negotiate a bit off my rent, the question is "how much", since I literally don't know anything on the pricing of renovation work, I only know the "how to do it" part.

I agree with the advice above to get a professional estimate. Also carefully consider what permits, fees, licenses, and insurance/bonding are going to be necessary or wise for you to have and include that in your expenses (especially if this is or potentially could be qualified as historic renovation). Take your sense of how long it's going to take you to work and see if that all adds up to something that's fair for you and your landlord will agree to. I can't speak to all areas but in my relatively low cost of living area the labor of a skillful contractor who can do anything except structural work is about $40/hr. At that rate plus materials the amount of work you're talking about (including what sounds like a total bathroom redo) should probably wipe out your entire rent for more than a year. I'd think really hard about doing all of the things you have listed for cheaper than that.

The Dipshit
Dec 21, 2005

by FactsAreUseless

BEHOLD: MY CAPE posted:

Yeah same here, any prospective tenant who makes an approach like that is saying to me "I can't afford the rent you are asking....".

Oh haha, I showed him my offer letter before I signed the paperwork and brought up the whole renovation stuff, I get paid more than 5x the monthly rent after taxes. Glory be to the national labs system and living in a low COL area.

Bloody Queef posted:

Get a contractor to come out and give you an estimate and provide the landlord with that estimate. Then ask what he thinks is fair for the work based on that estimate.

BEHOLD: MY CAPE posted:

I agree with the advice above to get a professional estimate. Also carefully consider what permits, fees, licenses, and insurance/bonding are going to be necessary or wise for you to have and include that in your expenses (especially if this is or potentially could be qualified as historic renovation). Take your sense of how long it's going to take you to work and see if that all adds up to something that's fair for you and your landlord will agree to. I can't speak to all areas but in my relatively low cost of living area the labor of a skillful contractor who can do anything except structural work is about $40/hr. At that rate plus materials the amount of work you're talking about (including what sounds like a total bathroom redo) should probably wipe out your entire rent for more than a year. I'd think really hard about doing all of the things you have listed for cheaper than that.

That's helpful, thanks.

The Dipshit fucked around with this message at 17:05 on Dec 14, 2014

FISHMANPET
Mar 3, 2007

Sweet 'N Sour
Can't
Melt
Steel Beams
Are you in Idaho by any chance? That's the only place I can think of that has a National Laboratory near a Downtown where everything is cheap as dirt.

BEHOLD: MY CAPE
Jan 11, 2004

Claverjoe posted:

Oh haha, I showed him my offer letter before I signed the paperwork and brought up the whole renovation stuff, I get paid more than 5x the monthly rent after taxes. Glory be to the national labs system and living in a low COL area.

No sorry I'm not implying you can't afford your rent - a tenant with steady income who's already paid rent and deposit would be a lot different than getting a rental application out of the blue with some kind of in-kind offer attached.

Just make sure you don't get taken advantage of, given that your starting point of negotiations was to do it for free plus materials. There is a good reason why there is a lot of overdue maintenance on a property that rents for $750/mo. I know if one of my good, reliable tenants offered to do a bunch of expensive renovation work for a song I'd be salivating.

As a final thought, I would also insist upon re-signing a long-term lease if you're going to do something like this. An unscrupulous landlord could easily agree to your arrangement and then after you do all of this work simply kick you out at the end of the year and jack the rent up on a freshly renovated property.

BEHOLD: MY CAPE fucked around with this message at 22:29 on Dec 14, 2014

The Dipshit
Dec 21, 2005

by FactsAreUseless

FISHMANPET posted:

Are you in Idaho by any chance? That's the only place I can think of that has a National Laboratory near a Downtown where everything is cheap as dirt.
Nope, Savannah River National Labs, and I'm living in Augusta GA. Spun out of the support lab that the Savannah River Site has, which made a bunch of nuclear weapons back in the 1950s, and now it is mostly concerned with environmental remediation and nuclear nonproliferation stuff (we do things like down blend nuclear warheads to fuel and a lot of environmental remediation).

BEHOLD: MY CAPE posted:

No sorry I'm not implying you can't afford your rent - a tenant with steady income who's already paid rent and deposit would be a lot different than getting a rental application out of the blue with some kind of in-kind offer attached.

Just make sure you don't get taken advantage of, given that your starting point of negotiations was to do it for free plus materials. There is a good reason why there is a lot of overdue maintenance on a property that rents for $750/mo. I know if one of my good, reliable tenants offered to do a bunch of expensive renovation work for a song I'd be salivating.

As a final thought, I would also insist upon re-signing a long-term lease if you're going to do something like this. An unscrupulous landlord could easily agree to your arrangement and then after you do all of this work simply kick you out at the end of the year and jack the rent up on a freshly renovated property.

Thanks. Way ahead of you on the long term rental stuff. As for the "taking advantage of" part, I'm not all that bothered by it, as long as he pays for the material and maybe, oh I dunno ~$50/month off rent for the approximately three years I'm living there, I'm cool with it all. It's part of my nature to fix up things.

Blackjack2000
Mar 29, 2010

FWIW, as a landlord, I doubt I'd ever agree to any kind of arrangement like this. I like simple arrangements and feel that in return for keeping the property in good repair and addressing issues when tenants raise them, I receive full rent each month.

What do I do if I make some cockamaime deal with a tenant for $50 off rent and he does a crappy job on the tiling? With a contractor I call him up and tell him to do it again. More likely, I choose a guy with a good reputation and references and don't end up with a lovely job in the first place. But if I don't like the tiling job, and refuse to take the $50 off rent, the tenant is now pissed off and I have crappy tiling in the bathroom with no real recourse.

I'm sure your intentions are good, and you may be perfectly capable of doing the work, but don't be surprised if the landlord outright refuses.

poopinmymouth
Mar 2, 2005

PROUD 2 B AMERICAN (these colors don't run)
Wanted to finally post an update, as we signed the contract yesterday. The previous owner found out last minute (supposedly) that if they sold before 2 years from their purchase date, lots of extra taxes would be charged, so we waited (not much choice)

The good news, is because of Iceland's crazy financial system in regard to loans, the loan we are taking over has gone down in amount because of interest rate decreases. The tenants have been in constant contact with us to ensure a smooth change over in regard to their deposit and our plans to let them keep renting and they seem like really nice steady renters (and they had recommendations as well). House inspector said the outside of the house was kind of poo poo, but the apartment itself was well maintained.

Hopefully will be very boring from here on out, just getting rental payments and doing a few much needed renovations.

Dragyn
Jan 23, 2007

Please Sam, don't use the word 'acumen' again.
My fiance and I are relatively new to the landlord thing, and we have a tenant coming in on 1/1 to the townhome that adjoins our own. The tenant is a professional woman in her mid 50s and her mini schnauzer.

We did our background checks/credit history, the only thing of note is that she had a bankruptcy when she went through her divorce and her house was underwater (around 2009). Her references checked out and she had letters from her previous landlords, one of which we verified with him.

When she came to sign the lease, she had her adult daughter with her, as well as her granddaughter because they were out running errands. My fiance was concerned that the tenant was using her credit/background to get a place for her daughter to live without having to go through her own checks. Today she called and told us that her daughter, granddaughter and two cats will have to stay with her for "two weeks at the most" while her daughter sorts things out with her landlord at her new place. The daughter also has a fiance, and they all previously lived together. I've heard no mention of him moving anywhere.

We're concerned that something not on the up-and-up is taking place here, and I'm hoping the more experienced landlords here have an idea if I should suspect anything here. Should I be concerned, and if so, what should I do to cover my rear end?

"The Lease' posted:

Here is what the (signed) lease states for occupancy & pets:

5. Use & Occupancy of Property:
a. The only person(s) living in the Leased Premises is are: <Tenant's name>.
b. Any change in the occupancy will require written consent of the Landlord.
c. Any change in occupancy may be subject to an adjustment in the amount of rent.
d. The Tenant will use the Leased Premises only as a residence.


The following pets are allowed: ____one miniature schnauzer _. Any others require the landlord's written approval.

BEHOLD: MY CAPE
Jan 11, 2004
Tell them that's not acceptable under the terms of the lease, and sorry about the situation. If you let them move in regardless of what your lease says you run a risk of putting yourself over an eviction barrel when they don't leave. It's worth knowing your state and local laws about what constitutes occupancy requiring eviction extremely well. Many of your prospective tenants are going to be, shall we say, well versed and aware of their rights.

Alternately if you don't mind living next to the whole crew feel free to propose whatever rent increase you think is fair. You have a lot of leverage with her rent and deposit in hand. It's up to you to decide how valuable a signed tenant with apparently good references is at this point.

Bloody Queef
Mar 23, 2012

by zen death robot

Dragyn posted:

:words: about a future nightmare tenant

Was it really hard to find this tenant? Even if it meant sitting on the unit for another month, I'd tell the Woman no deal.

You'll lose a lot more than a month of rent if you have to evict her, her daughter, her daughters fiance, etc.

Ribsauce
Jul 29, 2006

Blacks in the back.
Do not let them in your house. The extended family is never leaving. Say sorry, that is not acceptable, and she is going to have to find other housing.

You're lucky this happened before she was living there and you are lucky she actually told you. However, you can't let them in, they will never leave, you will have 3 animals and 4 humans putting wear and tear on the house when it should have just been one person.

Even worse, they will be living next to you so they will be lying to your face daily about how "its just one more week until the bank gets my check straight" and bullshit like that and you have to pretend you believe them, which is the worst part of being a landlord in my opinion. I have a couple of low end housing units and holy crap the excuses I have to pretend I believe. It is so annoying.

If you let them move in you will be lied to every time you see them for a year straight and your house is going to be ruined. 3 generations of family and 3 pets....no thanks.

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Dragyn
Jan 23, 2007

Please Sam, don't use the word 'acumen' again.

Bloody Queef posted:

Was it really hard to find this tenant? Even if it meant sitting on the unit for another month, I'd tell the Woman no deal.

You'll lose a lot more than a month of rent if you have to evict her, her daughter, her daughters fiance, etc.

Thanks for the input, everyone. I just want to clarify on this one. You're saying that we tell her no and she decides not to move in at all (the tenant, that is)? I assumed that since a leased is signed and security collected, that it is too late to break the original lease.

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