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Do any of you remember being kids at all?  The message that kids will see isn't "lol, don't take your medication."Don't you remember how intensely frustrating it is to be a child? Don't you remember the frustration when you know things that are real, and true, and important, but no one will listen because you're "just a kid"? Shush now, the grown-ups are talking. Don't you remember being little and someone would ask a question or make a statement, and your reply would get all the adults tittering, but no one would explain why? "'Find x.' 'It's right there, sir. It's not lost.'" These kids are misfits, not taken seriously by anyone, but today they are not wrong. I think that would ring true for a lot of kids watching. Kids are also going to recognise Little Red Riding Hood right away, and be expecting a wolf to show up. They get the Enchanted Forest. They have no problem with literal fairies glowing and sparkling while doing impossible things. Those are just different kinds of wonders. Do the magic forest fairies that fight fire with oxygen make sense? Not really, but Doctor Who has always leaned more towards fantasy than hard science fiction, so it doesn't bother me too much that they didn't really cover up the "litterally magic" with a good coat of  this time. It's not going to be one of my favorite episodes, there are a lot of lazy bits stringing together the pretty bits, but I think if I'd seen it when I was 8 years old I would have thought it was beautiful and wonderful.
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Oct 28, 2014 12:02
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docbeard posted:I think it's honestly better when they don't really address "so why doesn't anyone remember the Yetis in the Underground", because there's never going to be a satisfying answer, and the appeal of contemporary Earth Doctor Who stories will always be "what if this happened to us", not "what if this happened to a futuristic techno-society". Seeing as you've used that example, I should point out that Seven actually did answer that question.  quote:Your species has the most amazing capacity for self-deception, matched only by its ingenuity when trying to destroy itself.
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Oct 28, 2014 12:08
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Gonz posted:I didn't look. However, the store itself is IN a desert. Does that count? OMG, you've already been flattened. No wonder you're seeing shrunken TARDIS's. it makes perfect sense. Now I'm sorry, I truly am. But any information you can give us will help us save the next one.
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Oct 28, 2014 12:25
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dogs named Charlie posted:Doctor Who apparently needs some sort of MST3K style "it's just a show, relax" disclaimer at the opening. I've been watching this show for years, I've even watched some of the early stuff before it was canceled. Every tread I've ever seen on here has been a bunch of making GBS threads on absolutely everything, back handed compliments on the perfect episodes. Like, before Kill The Moon I saw bitching that the new series never deals with the philosophical questions created by time travel. Then all you did was poo poo on Kill The Moon because of consistency reasons. If you're sober enough to care about that poo poo you're too sober because like MST3K this poo poo is best viewed high or drunk because it's a British children's drama. Just because it's live action doesn't mean it's held to the same high regard as whatever it is constructive adults watch in the prime time slot. MST3K is great sober, and man you're really patronising towards children. "Anything made for children must be poo poo" is a really terrible attitude. Also Doctor Who is the programme in the prime time slot.
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Oct 28, 2014 12:38
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Doctor Spaceman posted:Setting a story in a city and having it be essentially empty of people is weird to the point that it's actually an interesting concept in its own right. It's happened at least twice in Doctor Who that I can think of off the top of my head, The Dalek Invasion of Earth and The Invasion of the Dinosaurs.
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Oct 28, 2014 12:40
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MrL_JaKiri posted:It's happened at least twice in Doctor Who that I can think of off the top of my head, The Dalek Invasion of Earth and The Invasion of the Dinosaurs. Also a plot point in "Voyage of the Damned" because most Londoners got canny to the fact London kept getting attacked at Christmas.
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Oct 28, 2014 12:52
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DoctorWhat posted:If he gives a single episode an A+, it'll be Vincent. And he won't be totally wrong. Vincent is, on rewatch, about 2/3 of a full episode stretched into a full length one. It's a very good 2/3, but I feel like more could have been elaborated on (and not just cutting the monster).
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Oct 28, 2014 13:02
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MrL_JaKiri posted:MST3K is great sober, and man you're really patronising towards children. "Anything made for children must be poo poo" is a really terrible attitude. Yeah. I mean, different things will appeal to children than to adults, and things important to adults might not matter to kids, and vice versa. A show like Doctor Who, which is meant to appeal to both audiences, has a tricky tightrope to walk sometimes as a result. But, if anything, it's probably more important rather than less that children's entertainment be well done. The idea of scientific accuracy on Doctor Who is kind of ludicrous, but not because it's a
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Oct 28, 2014 13:07
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Gonz posted:Was at a home decor store yesterday. The windows are all wrong!
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Oct 28, 2014 13:33
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Angela Christine posted:Do any of you remember being kids at all? If they had actually taken this tack, yes, it would have come across better. Just like throwing random into a fantasy story suspends disbelief when they could have gotten away with "maybe it's magic, maybe it's science the Doctor doesn't understand yet", having imaginative, open-minded kids would have smoothed things over. But, with the exception of Maebh, we get TV's standard "snarky, mini-adults." When they're the ones stressing that Maebh needs her medication, it reinforces the sense of "no, she seriously has a real problem, what the hell is wrong with you," making the Doctor come across as criminally negligent at best.Like a lot of the episode's problems, this would have been helped with better commitment to the premise and tone and could have been fixed with another draft (having just one of the kids agree with the Doctor for instance, or having the adults be the ones pushing for the medication or BETTER YET not including medication at all and just saying she'd been "off" since her sister's disappearance/always had strange ideas/been a psychic conduit/whatever).
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Oct 28, 2014 13:40
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I kind of feel like Toxx is going to dislike the Moffat years given his view point of the show. If he gives Unicorn and the Wasp an A then he's going to loving hate the angsty poo poo that Moffat vomits all over the show.
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Oct 28, 2014 13:56
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After The War posted:If they had actually taken this tack, yes, it would have come across better. Just like throwing random Yeah, it definitely could have used another round of polish. I guess they used up all the polish on the previous two episodes. Edit: I really think they were going for a "listen to kids" angle, especially with the nonsense of letting the kids write the warning message to not hurt the trees. Too bad that a much better warning message would have been to tell everyone go go hide in their basements because there was about to be a catastrophic solar flare. 
Facebook Aunt fucked around with this message at 14:04 on Oct 28, 2014 |
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Oct 28, 2014 13:59
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Angela Christine posted:Do any of you remember being kids at all? That's definitely what they were going for and I think they succeeded for 99 percent of the population, but there is a very small contingent of children who may have a family member literally taking medication for schizophrenia for whom it is easy to misinterpret the message as a bit more direct and literal. For me, I think what didn't work as well was creating the alien atmosphere in an earth city. It was little things like the way the people burning the trees yelled at Clara and the children and refused to answer their questions, the way that the Doctor was supposed to be afraid of a tiger such that he needed Danny's help. It just made the episode feel a bit weird. In general, I think I just never felt like anybody was in any real danger, which is sometimes okay, but I think the episode wanted me to feel a bit frightened for the children. I did really enjoy the talk between Danny and Clara, as well as the talk between Clara and the Doctor when is about to give up (even if it stretched my credibility a bit that this particular crisis would be the one to make him give up on the earth). I like Capaldi's Doctor a lot better recently, and particularly in this episode.
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Oct 28, 2014 14:14
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RodShaft posted:Yeah... When I was a kid. This bears an uncomfortable resemblance to my work desk right now...
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Oct 28, 2014 14:21
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quote:In an interview on a Canadian telethon that was hosted by Bob McGrath, Snuffy's performer, Martin P. Robinson, revealed that Snuffy was finally introduced to the main human cast mainly due to a string of high profile and sometimes graphic stories of pedophilia and sexual abuse of children that had been aired on shows such as 60 Minutes and 20/20. The writers felt that by having the adults refuse to believe Big Bird despite the fact that he was telling the truth, they were scaring children into thinking that their parents would not believe them if they had been sexually abused and that they would just be better off remaining silent. Congrats to Moffat & the team for putting less thought into their writing than the crew of Sesame Street.
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Oct 28, 2014 14:50
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Cerv posted:Congrats to Moffat & the team for putting less thought into their writing than the crew of Sesame Street. To be fair, the crew of Sesame Street actually puts a lot of thought into their writing, which is probably part of why the show has survived so long across so many generations of young children.
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Oct 28, 2014 15:09
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Cerv posted:Congrats to Moffat & the team for putting less thought into their writing than the crew of Sesame Street. That's not the low bar you seem to be implying
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Oct 28, 2014 15:19
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Doctor Who ran from 1963 to 1989 before being cancelled. Sesame Street started in 1969, and has somehow managed not to be cancelled yet. Doctor Who had a 50th bang up for when it started running. Sesame Street is a few short years away from 50 actual years straight producing programming. Doctor Who, and most of human civilization, wishes it was as competent and caring as the team at Sesame Street.
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Oct 28, 2014 15:32
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Bicyclops posted:To be fair, the crew of Sesame Street actually puts a lot of thought into their writing, which is probably part of why the show has survived so long across so many generations of young children. I'm pretty sure Sesame Street has also had actual child psychologists and other education consultants involved in its production for (at least) a large part of its broadcast history. I don't know if Doctor Who does or has as well.
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Oct 28, 2014 15:46
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MrL_JaKiri posted:That's not the low bar you seem to be implying hadn't meant to imply it was a low bar. chose my words terribly!
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Oct 28, 2014 16:29
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Sesame Street is also, unambiguously, inarguably, solely, a children's show.
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Oct 28, 2014 20:34
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Metal Loaf posted:I'm pretty sure Sesame Street has also had actual child psychologists and other education consultants involved in its production for (at least) a large part of its broadcast history. I don't know if Doctor Who does or has as well. It had Robert Holmes. Whose mantra was "let's scare the little buggers."
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Oct 28, 2014 21:12
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Did Dark Eyes 3 get delayed? I could have sworn Big Finish's site originally said October. Whatever. It gives me time to relisten to 1 and 2 again.
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Oct 28, 2014 21:20
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qntm posted:Sesame Street is also, unambiguously, inarguably, solely, a children's show. Agreed. It's also loving fantastic. Not implying you were saying otherwise, but I wanted to pile in on the chorus of praise for that brilliant, brilliant show.
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Oct 28, 2014 22:01
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Century Falls is explicitly a children's programme and it's great. Shockingly, just like programming for adults, programming for children can be LCD or a bit more esoteric.
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Oct 28, 2014 22:06
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Amendment to the first law of Doctor Who fans: Everyone agrees that Sesame Street is great.
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Oct 28, 2014 22:14
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Davros1 posted:It had Robert Holmes. Whose mantra was "let's scare the little buggers." Holmes also weighed in on the "childrens show vs family show" thing; he was adamant that Doctor Who was aimed at "intelligent 14-year olds", which seems about right.
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Oct 28, 2014 22:19
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Detective No. 27 posted:Did Dark Eyes 3 get delayed? I could have sworn Big Finish's site originally said October. Whatever. It gives me time to relisten to 1 and 2 again. It may have been, but it's been Nov for a long time.
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Oct 28, 2014 23:24
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Guys, I think I might be hosed in the "guess what Occ thinks" contest. I'm pretty sure I wasn't thinking and predicted and A for the series finale, even though knowing Oxx the 10 Realdoll will completely ruin the episode for him. I have no idea why I guessed the grades I did for any episodes after like, The Poison Sky.
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Oct 28, 2014 23:32
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The finale looks like it's shaping up to be as good as this episode was. I don't care about that lady in paradise or whatever at all. Also they should probably stop with the "but we've been to the future" "yeah but that was a bullshit future we're doomed this time" bit they keep doing it and it keeps not being doomed. 
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Oct 28, 2014 23:37
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Metal Loaf posted:I'm pretty sure Sesame Street has also had actual child psychologists and other education consultants involved in its production for (at least) a large part of its broadcast history. I don't know if Doctor Who does or has as well. There was one completely finished episode of Sesame Street that was shelved, because they couldn't make the subject matter work in a way that didn't traumatize their test audiences. Divorce is apparently too difficult a subject for even Sesame Street to handle. But, I'm pretty sure it does officially make them the anti-Doctor Who. RBA Starblade posted:The finale looks like it's shaping up to be as good as this episode was. I don't care about that lady in paradise or whatever at all. I'm cautiously optimistic about the finale, because I've always found that, at the very least, Moffat does good finales (whether the rest of the season is set up in a way that works for them is another question). Plus, I'm happy to have a finale that's focused on the Cybermen. I like them more than the Daleks, even if they have difficulty with their potential.
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Oct 29, 2014 00:29
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I was a big fan of Moffat's first finale, but they got weaker when he started cramming them into one episode. Name Of The Doctor had a good atmosphere but the story was a mess, and the less said about Time Of The Doctor the better. Hopefully with more room to breathe this one will come close to the generally decent standard of this series so far.
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Oct 29, 2014 01:44
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Speaking finales, I honestly do not remember a thing that happened in The Wedding of River Song. In my memory, it's just a string of unrelated scenes and zero context that ends on a pyramid? There's eyepatches or something too. That was a bad episode.
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Oct 29, 2014 01:47
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HD DAD posted:Speaking finales, I honestly do not remember a thing that happened in The Wedding of River Song. In my memory, it's just a string of unrelated scenes and zero context that ends on a pyramid? There's eyepatches or something too. Pretty much. The first episode of Season Six held so much promise too. I mean, it was immediately kissed away in the first few seconds of the second episode, but still...
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Oct 29, 2014 01:49
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PriorMarcus posted:Pretty much. The first episode of Season Six held so much promise too. I mean, it was immediately kissed away in the first few seconds of the second episode, but still... See, I actually enjoyed Season Six a lot minus AGMGTW, LKH, and TWORS. The first two episodes set up a decent plot thread (only to fall to poo poo mid-season), but the rest contains some of my favorite episodes of the revival (the ganger two-parter, The Girl Who Waited, and The God Complex).
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Oct 29, 2014 02:04
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HD DAD posted:See, I actually enjoyed Season Six a lot minus AGMGTW, LKH, and TWORS. The first two episodes set up a decent plot thread (only to fall to poo poo mid-season), but the rest contains some of my favorite episodes of the revival (the ganger two-parter, The Girl Who Waited, and The God Complex). Those last two are really good, but I didn't like the Ganger two parter at all. Also, on rewatch, knowing that the Crack is in the Doctor's room is silly as gently caress and makes no sense to his character at all.
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Oct 29, 2014 02:06
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I still get a kick out of the fact that the majority of The Wedding of River Song is the Doctor having already solved the problem and having to deal with the complications that have arisen from his idiot friends trying to help and just constantly making things worse.  There's no excusing that loving scene with the skulls eating Mark Gatiss though.
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Oct 29, 2014 02:30
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The only thing I remember from the season 6 finale is the astronaut resolution, and I thought that was pretty cool.PriorMarcus posted:Also, on rewatch, knowing that the Crack is in the Doctor's room is silly as gently caress and makes no sense to his character at all.
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Oct 29, 2014 02:42
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Jerusalem posted:There's no excusing that loving scene with the skulls eating Mark Gatiss though. I don't remember this at all. Probably for the best.
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Oct 29, 2014 02:46
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Irony Be My Shield posted:The only thing I remember from the season 6 finale is the astronaut resolution, and I thought that was pretty cool. Reasonable? Yeah sure. But the strength of that scene before they explicitly showed it was that it was up to each individual viewer to imagine what it could have been and that gave it a universal strength that no reveal could ever hope to match. marktheando posted:I don't remember this at all. Probably for the best.   I'm sorry, I'm so, so sorry.
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Oct 29, 2014 03:02
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