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Fister Roboto posted:I wouldn't give 13 too much credit for that since it's less strategic and thoughtful use of debilitating abilities, and more a giant flashing neon sign saying USE DEPROTECT ON THIS GUY IDIOT
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Nov 8, 2014 17:28
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| # ? May 22, 2024 17:51 |
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Self-imposed challenges don't count; of course I'm into FJF, taking part is why FFV occupies such a high spot on my list of favorite FFs. Generally speaking, buffs and (especially) debuffs are plagued by the same issue that makes them so useless in other FFs: regular encounters are too short for them to be useful, and a lot of bosses are immune to debuffs. Of course, the fact that a number of bosses have specific debuff vulnerabilities that can be exploited is both a point in their favor and the reason why so many games just say "gently caress you, this doesn't work." But yeah, I played through the entirety of FFXIII when it first came out without much difficulty and only very rarely made use of SAB and SYN. Of course, my battle rating was poo poo most of the time and it turned an already long and boring game into a real slog, but that's neither here nor there.
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Nov 8, 2014 17:50
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CeallaSo posted:and a lot of bosses are immune to debuffs Except not really. Like, there is exactly one boss immune to Slow. There is a not insignificant number of bosses susceptible to Berserk (including one of the optional superbosses). There are strategies that involve using Silence to stop boss power-up routines. So on.
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Nov 8, 2014 18:00
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Kyrosiris posted:Except not really. Like, there is exactly one boss immune to Slow. There is a not insignificant number of bosses susceptible to Berserk (including one of the optional superbosses). There are strategies that involve using Silence to stop boss power-up routines. So on. Hahah, well, you'd be the one to know; I'm kind of surprised I forgot this, the last Fiesta wasn't even that long ago. Guess I put my foot in my mouth on that one.
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Nov 8, 2014 18:13
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Also in other FFs it's not that debuffs don;t work or are useless, it's just that killing the enemy is almost always a better way of dealing with the threat.
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Nov 8, 2014 18:17
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There's also the problem of knowing if a debuff attempt failed or if the boss is just plain immune.
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Nov 8, 2014 18:43
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I liked how FFX handled a lot of the debuffs by making them attacks. Ordinarily you feel like casting blind or silence on a boss is more likely to result in a wasted turn than anything, but if you can at least do some damage at the same time then you're only wasting some MP.
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Nov 8, 2014 19:01
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Fister Roboto posted:It's actually the best line in the game. Unironically this. I don't get the hate for it either. Out of all the dumb, angsty poo poo the characters come up with, people cling to this one line. It did a lot more to endear a character to me than any other line in the game.
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Nov 8, 2014 19:10
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The Slow spell alone breaks both FF4 and its sequel in half. Haste is almost always awesome in every game, even the turn-based ones where it just boosts the crap out of your number of hits. Granted, they're the only two status spells really worth a drat in most of the series, but hey.
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Nov 8, 2014 19:39
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Fister Roboto posted:It's actually the best line in the game. Close, it's actually WE'RE JUST PETS
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Nov 8, 2014 19:40
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CeallaSo posted:But yeah, I played through the entirety of FFXIII when it first came out without much difficulty and only very rarely made use of SAB and SYN. Of course, my battle rating was poo poo most of the time and it turned an already long and boring game into a real slog, but that's neither here nor there. What is it about FF13 that makes people ignore half the combat system and then complain that the combat was boring
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Nov 8, 2014 19:41
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It also wasn't until like Final Fantasy X if you find out that the spell actually did miss or if the enemy was just immune.
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Nov 8, 2014 19:42
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Suaimhneas posted:What is it about FF13 that makes people ignore half the combat system and then complain that the combat was boring It's kind of extra weird because the first half of the loving game is a slow, methodical tutorial on literally every possible combination of classes with text tutorials going "HEY THIS IS WHY THIS CLASS IS GOOD, IT WORKS WELL WITH THESE OTHER ONES" and set up fights and party member combinations to force you to learn them. And people still don't and wonder why every fight takes 20x longer than it should.
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Nov 8, 2014 19:46
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Problem with status effects tends to be that they're not worth it on normal enemies and when they work on bosses they tend to be debilitating (if they don't have a 5% chance to land or somesuch). Probably the best way to deal with this would be to implement debuff resistances/vulnerabilities the same way things have elemental ones, for example a boss with 50% blind resistance would get hit by Blind but it'd only reduce their hit chance by 25% instead of 50%.
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Nov 8, 2014 19:59
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Artix posted:I too agree that when playing the game in an incredibly restrictive way, skills that are generally useless for typical play become much more important because they are your only options. Hey, buffs and debuffs made a pretty huge difference in FFXII, and I can't imagine trying to take on most of the tougher bosses and hunts without heavy reliance on them. Of course, XII had the Nihopaloa, which made applying every available debuff with 100% accuracy trivial, so maybe most people don't think it counts.
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Nov 8, 2014 20:01
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Artix posted:I too agree that when playing the game in an incredibly restrictive way, skills that are generally useless for typical play become much more important because they are your only options. I really hate this argument that some people pull about game challenge. Just because it's a self imposed challenge doesn't make those skills any less useless, in fact that's like half the fun about old rpgs is self imposing a challenge and seeing it is feasible and sometimes useless garbage poo poo that you normally wouldn't touch becomes the godliest of skills. You can do four black mages in the first final fantasy. It's not a "normal game" so it's not "real challenge" because the designers didn't intend it, therefore the game is never challenging. Hence why Four Job Fiestas are a thing, because the base game is hilariously easy to beat so why not make it a bit more interesting? I'm sure the designers would give you their blessing despite their glorious base game being besmirched by all these "challenges" and "fiestas"
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Nov 8, 2014 20:04
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Suaimhneas posted:What is it about FF13 that makes people ignore half the combat system and then complain that the combat was boring I played through the game more than once (because I have problems in my brain) and the second time I actually made use of de/buffs. It was still an incredibly boring game.
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Nov 8, 2014 20:35
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Kanfy posted:Problem with status effects tends to be that they're not worth it on normal enemies and when they work on bosses they tend to be debilitating (if they don't have a 5% chance to land or somesuch). Etrian Odyssey had what's probably the best answer for this problem, in that bosses had building resistance to status effects after they're applied. So for example, you could land Blind on a boss and it would start whiffing it's incredibly damaging attacks for 2-4 turns, and the status would have a decent chance to land... the first time. To land it a second time could take multiple attempts, and a third time would be almost impossible. It was enough of a benefit that you'd want to try for the status effect, but fights lasted long enough that you couldn't just lean on status effects and coast to victory. It helps that in EO bosses tended to be pretty difficult and throw out a lot of damage so deciding when to try for a good status effect took a good bit of thinking.
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Nov 8, 2014 21:34
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DR on debuffs is nothing new. FF11 predates the first EO game by half a decade and uses the same system you described above, wherein debuffs become harder and harder to stick on a target with each application (though there are ways of making them stick via cooldown abilities). This kinda sucks for the player in terms of RNG, so FF14 uses a WoW-style diminished length system, wherein status effect last their whole length, then half length, then quarter length before the target becomes immune for about 30 seconds.
Varance fucked around with this message at 21:49 on Nov 8, 2014 |
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Nov 8, 2014 21:42
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FFXIII the game itself is pretty boring overall. However, combat system is surprisingly good if you take advantage of all options. That plus Japanese voices plus much better graphics with gedosato make the game more palatable vs console iterations. That said, the game is still somewhat boring and slow but not as bad as I originally thought. Ch.11 turned out a bit of a slog. FFV is actually a good game, but iOS remakes for this and FFVI are terrible. That's a shame since both are really good games. Found my cart for V, then decided heck with it and fired it up on my Note instead (emu). I can't deal with GBA screen anymore and so instead of that i am playing through on a 5.7 screen with physical controller, which is a lot better.
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Nov 8, 2014 23:25
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Yojimbo is rad and cool and awesome
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Nov 8, 2014 23:47
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spectral keeper wtf
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Nov 9, 2014 02:57
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I solved the problem with Yojimbo's Zanmato. Yojimbo is my favorite Aeon forever
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Nov 9, 2014 03:06
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alcharagia posted:spectral keeper wtf That boss and the one after gave me so much loving trouble. Worst part is that it's right before the game properly opens up.
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Nov 9, 2014 05:06
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loving Berserk Tail. I had more trouble with that guy than I did with Yunalesca to be honest. (from what I remember of my last playthrough from five years or so ago)
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Nov 9, 2014 05:17
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Speaking of FFX, I got my hands on the HD version a few days ago and wow is this game a lot better game than I expected. Like, it's solidly in my top 3 for the series. he way every character (except Kimahri) has a unique and useful role in combat combined with how the Sphere Grid works is just hitting all the right buttons for me. The story, characters, and set pieces are really great too... except for Kimahri who's just kind of there. I don't even dislike Kimahri, he just seems like an afterthought to the developers. I mean, you can definitely tell this was an early PS2 game (the animations, voice direction), but it's still really good. Actually, what should I do with Kimhari? I managed to get him on Rikku's section just in time for her to rejoin the party.  Then I had him double back and go down Wakka's path and now I'm at a section where he could break into Lulu's section. Should I make him a mage or stay the course? I'd really like to put him on Auron's path but that's way on the other side of the grid.
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Nov 9, 2014 05:38
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Kimhari is basically a Blue Mage with tons of MP and Lancet to keep it full, so yes, he's a really good mage when equipped with the appropriate weapon. Also, he's really not relevant in the storyline until toward the very end of the game, where you're forced to use him for a 2 on 1 solo battle. Edit: Of course, if you're going after the true endgame side stuff, the Tidus/Wakka/Rikku (single-target) and Tidus/Auron/Yuna (AoE) combos break the game, making Lulu and Kimhari kinda irrelevant. Varance fucked around with this message at 05:49 on Nov 9, 2014 |
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Nov 9, 2014 05:40
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I just used everybody except for him. Though there's a time later where you have a fight solo with him.
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Nov 9, 2014 05:41
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SolidSnakesBandana posted:I just used everybody except for him. Though there's a time later where you have a fight solo with him. Thankfully that fight scales depending on how powerful Kimahri is at the time.
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Nov 9, 2014 05:59
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And as soon as I posted that I found some teleportation spheres. But yeah, if he makes a good mage I'll go ahead and put him on Lulu's path.
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Nov 9, 2014 06:04
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Another nice thing about mage Kimahri is that Lancet's damage/healing is based on your magic stat.
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Nov 9, 2014 06:22
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Scrap Dragon posted:Speaking of FFX, I got my hands on the HD version a few days ago and wow is this game a lot better game than I expected. Like, it's solidly in my top 3 for the series. he way every character (except Kimahri) has a unique and useful role in combat combined with how the Sphere Grid works is just hitting all the right buttons for me. The story, characters, and set pieces are really great too... except for Kimahri who's just kind of there. I don't even dislike Kimahri, he just seems like an afterthought to the developers. I mean, you can definitely tell this was an early PS2 game (the animations, voice direction), but it's still really good. This is pretty much how I feel; FFX is easily my favorite FF game, probably followed by IX. I'm a sucker for the sort of melodrama that's in FFX, and the game does a really good job of setting the sort of melancholy/bittersweet mood throughout the whole thing. Some of the voice acting is awkward, but I generally like the characters and think that Tidus acts pretty reasonably given the circumstances. Has anyone played the FFIX PSN port? How does it hold up (in terms of how the graphics, etc are ported, not the plot/gameplay)?
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Nov 9, 2014 06:37
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Mr. Fortitude posted:Yeah buffs and debuffs are essential in FF XIII, you won't get anywhere without them. You can even poison the final boss and it's a really handy godsend. It's about the one thing FF XIII does well really, because the other games in the series teach you bad habits where you were better off healing or doing pure damage than trying to weaken or strengthen your characters. I find debuffs pretty useful in FFX as well. Necessary, not really, but on the Seymour fights in particular poison works wonders. Fister Roboto posted:It's actually the best line in the game. In the 80s it would have been translated as Mom's our touch, and been infinitely better. Suaimhneas posted:What is it about FF13 that makes people ignore half the combat system and then complain that the combat was boring "Wow this game is really hard and boring when I don't use buffs and debuffs and just mash attack" SolidSnakesBandana posted:I just used everybody except for him. Though there's a time later where you have a fight solo with him. As long as he has steal before that fight so you can stock up on lvl 3 lock spheres and use so he can heal himself with Al Bhed potions that fight is trivial. Just make sure you don't kill one of the bosses before the other is also at crit hp or you won't get to learn both white wind and big guard (if you haven't found them elsewhere).
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Nov 9, 2014 06:53
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The PSN games aren't actually ports, they are literally the PS1 version of the game running in an emulator. If you put a PS1 disc into your PS3 it's the same game. If you play it on a PSP or Vita there's a lot more in terms of options, changing screen ratios, making it take up a bit less or more space. You can also set controls to the analog sticks, touchscreen or D Pad. I personally think it looks much better on the Vita because the screen is small enough that you can't tell it's a really old game Also be prepared for black bars on the side of the screen
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Nov 9, 2014 07:18
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THE AWESOME GHOST posted:The PSN games aren't actually ports, they are literally the PS1 version of the game running in an emulator. If you put a PS1 disc into your PS3 it's the same game. Nah, just stretch it out and ignore the fact that everything looks r e a l l y w i d e.
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Nov 9, 2014 11:31
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Please respect aspect ratios.
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Nov 9, 2014 16:16
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THE AWESOME GHOST posted:The PSN games aren't actually ports, they are literally the PS1 version of the game running in an emulator. If you put a PS1 disc into your PS3 it's the same game. I tried running it in an emulator, and noticed that the emulator manages to make the 3d sprites look a lot less pixelated (though at the cost of them looking a little bizarre). I guess I'll still go ahead and play the one I got on the PSN since it has the benefit of me being able to lay down in bed with my wireless controller while playing.
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Nov 9, 2014 18:04
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I'm playing FFV for the first time. I just got my first death from an enemy doing a LV 5 doom spell. Everyone is instantly dead. I love when games do that bullshit.
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Nov 9, 2014 22:06
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Super Ninja Fish posted:I'm playing FFV for the first time. I just got my first death from an enemy doing a LV 5 doom spell. Everyone is instantly dead. I love when games do that bullshit. Now have a Blue Mage learn it so you can do the same bullshit to a surprising amount of enemies.
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Nov 10, 2014 00:02
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haha I just loaded up Final Fantasy 10-2 and I forgot how much every aspect of this game owns
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Nov 10, 2014 00:03
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