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CareyB posted:No I'm not. I'm saying that convicted rapists and murders who have not atoned or been rehabilitated should not be in positions of power and influence. He's done his time.
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Nov 15, 2014 18:04
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CareyB posted:1: The victim will have to see this person in local media week in week out, on the back of football shirts, maybe any time she hears the words "Sheffield United" she will be reminded on some level about this experience. Why is that fair for her? She's a victim of a horrific crime, and her triggers will be complex and difficult to avoid. No it isn't fair, and in my own opinion Sheffield United should refuse to re-sign him just because the girl is local to that club. CareyB posted:watching the film thought it looked like harmless fun, and just started doing it. Yeah Shitthatdefhappened.txt CareyB posted:Allowing this saga to carry on basically keeps the conversation of rape flowing, leading to more rape. Are you happy with that? Talking about rape doesn't make more people rape, you idiot. The vast majority of people are very well aware that rape is a really terrible thing to do to someone. Those that do not hold that opinion will probably, given the opportunity, rape. But they'll do it whether it's talked about or isn't, because that's the kind of person they are. Probably the parents to blame, idk.
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Nov 15, 2014 18:05
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sassassin posted:Who defines what these positions are? The law has already decided which professions are unsuitable for convicted rapists but you've apparently got some different standards in mind. Maybe when those laws were created there was no internet, no twitter, no 24 hour media coverage?
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Nov 15, 2014 18:06
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stickyfngrdboy posted:She's a victim of a horrific crime, and her triggers will be complex and difficult to avoid. No it isn't fair, and in my own opinion Sheffield United should refuse to re-sign him just because the girl is local to that club. Didn't the incident happen in Rhyl or some similar shithole?
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Nov 15, 2014 18:06
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sassassin posted:Didn't the incident happen in Rhyl or some similar shithole? Oh maybe it did, if so I retract that bit.
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Nov 15, 2014 18:08
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stickyfngrdboy posted:Talking about rape doesn't make more people rape, you idiot. The vast majority of people are very well aware that rape is a really terrible thing to do to someone. Those that do not hold that opinion will probably, given the opportunity, rape. But they'll do it whether it's talked about or isn't, because that's the kind of person they are. Probably the parents to blame, idk. Well you can't prove a negative. But you can look at the mountains of evidence in psychology and neuroscience that says that actually people are inspired to do things based on things they read, hear and themselves experience. If the narrative is all "rape is ok" people will believe it's ok. Why is that so difficult to believe?
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Nov 15, 2014 18:09
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If the Operation Yewtree guys get out of jail, should they be allowed to go back on television or the radio or wherever and assume their previous lives in the spotlight and make shitloads of money while being in the public eye constantly, because they served their time in prison and therefore it's all okay?
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Nov 15, 2014 18:09
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CareyB posted:How do you know, or how can you say, what the effects of Ched Evans continuing to play football are? You say I'm a literal moron but you might want to look into how the brain works, how humans operate according to fundamental laws of nature and survival. You're getting a bit unhinged now, but you didn't post any proof. You posted a wall of text about a TED tall that was mostly inapposite to what we're talking about and which you don't seem to understand. In any case.
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Nov 15, 2014 18:10
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Remember how Roman Polanski literally raped a child and then won an oscar
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Nov 15, 2014 18:11
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CareyB posted:Well you can't prove a negative. But you can look at the mountains of evidence in psychology and neuroscience that says that actually people are inspired to do things based on things they read, hear and themselves experience. If the narrative is all "rape is ok" people will believe it's ok. Why is that so difficult to believe? Where is the 'rape is ok' narrative?
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Nov 15, 2014 18:12
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stickyfngrdboy posted:Where is the 'rape is ok' narrative? I said if. You missed my point. Do you disagree with the point I made? blue footed boobie posted:You're getting a bit unhinged now, but you didn't post any proof. You posted a wall of text about a TED tall that was mostly inapposite to what we're talking about and which you don't seem to understand. In any case. Violence begets violence mate, it's not something that should be beyond you, but seeing as your poo poo posts consist of little more than personal attacks it's little surprise you can't process an alternative viewpoint because you refuse to look into it.
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Nov 15, 2014 18:16
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CareyB posted:
And in turn, is the irony of this beyond you? A man does a terrible thing. He is punished for it. You are arguing that FURTHER VENGEANCE MUST BE PERPETRATED UPON HIM.
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Nov 15, 2014 18:19
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Eau de MacGowan posted:And in turn, is the irony of this beyond you? A man does a terrible thing. He is punished for it. You are arguing that FURTHER VENGEANCE MUST BE PERPETRATED UPON HIM. Well point proved, surely? It's nothing to do with Ched and vengeance against him personally, it's about what the effects will be on wider society by pretending that everything is all good now he's served his time. Just serving a punishment should not allow everything to carry on as normal if that could negatively impact the lives of others. I'm sorry that you think it's ok for a convicted rapist who doesn't believe he did anything wrong to be an inspiration to young people, and others in their community.
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Nov 15, 2014 18:23
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CareyB posted:Well point proved, surely? I don't like anything to do with his situation. I don't like people on the streets promoting Sharia law either, but, by the very foundations of our society and everything we believe in, they must be permitted to do so.
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Nov 15, 2014 18:26
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Then surely, it should also be permissible for someone to say "ugh, I hope Sheffield United don't re-sign a literal rapist."
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Nov 15, 2014 18:28
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Eau de MacGowan posted:And in turn, is the irony of this beyond you? A man does a terrible thing. He is punished for it. You are arguing that FURTHER VENGEANCE MUST BE PERPETRATED UPON HIM. Beyond this, his point is that we should release rapists into the public to be unemployable social pariahs who will almost certainly commit more crimes. It's inherently a bad position. The better argument is that the prison sentence for rape should be longer.
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Nov 15, 2014 18:30
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CareyB posted:I said if. You missed my point. Do you disagree with the point I made? What? You're arguing that if - if - people go round saying rape is ok then everyone will think yeah it cool and good. Which is probably true. If someone is told something often enough, they will believe it. (I tell my wife she's fat every day just so she never has enough confidence in herself to cheat on me. It's easy. But she is actually fat as well, which helps.) But nobody is doing that, about rape, that I am aware of, so I didn't understand why saying that was relevant. CareyB posted:I'm sorry that you think it's ok for a convicted rapist who doesn't believe he did anything wrong to be an inspiration to young people, and others in their community. Ched Evans has never been, will never be, an inspiration to young people or communities, I don't understand why anyone believes he is.
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Nov 15, 2014 18:32
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Sheffield is a cool city with two clown football clubs, its a real shame
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Nov 15, 2014 18:32
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Eau de MacGowan posted:I don't like anything to do with his situation. I don't like people on the streets promoting Sharia law either, but, by the very foundations of our society and everything we believe in, they must be permitted to do so. But that doesn't apply to everyone and everything does it. You can't work in certain professions if you're a sex offender. If he came out, said I really hosed up, she was pissed and I took advantage, I will go through the rest of my life teaching people that this is wrong, then fair play, I'd hope that he can continue doing the job he loves and be an inspiration to others in a positive way. Unfortunately, that ain't happening.
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Nov 15, 2014 18:33
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CareyB posted:
hes appealing his conviction though, so doing that would be moronic
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Nov 15, 2014 18:43
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Ched Evans has the right to be employed in his profession and any football club has the right to refuse him a job b/c of his lovely history, is basically what I feel.
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Nov 15, 2014 18:50
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TelekineticBear! posted:hes appealing his conviction though, so doing that would be moronic more moronic than failing to understand how an 19yo girl who's woken up in a completely unknown place with two dudes cum leaking out of her might feel like she's been taken advantage of?
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Nov 15, 2014 18:52
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Popehoist posted:Ched Evans has the right to be employed in his profession and any football club has the right to refuse him a job b/c of his lovely history, is basically what I feel.
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Nov 15, 2014 18:54
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CareyB posted:more moronic than failing to understand how an 19yo girl who's woken up in a completely unknown place with two dudes cum leaking out of her might feel like she's been taken advantage of? You sound like an insane person.
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Nov 15, 2014 19:24
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CareyB posted:more moronic than failing to understand how an 19yo girl who's woken up in a completely unknown place with two dudes cum leaking out of her might feel like she's been taken advantage of? One time I was raped by a strawman and this post is very triggering for me.
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Nov 15, 2014 19:50
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blue footed boobie posted:Beyond this, his point is that we should release rapists into the public to be unemployable social pariahs who will almost certainly commit more crimes. It's inherently a bad position. The better argument is that the prison sentence for rape should be longer. If he wants to become employable again then he should be making very real apologies to his victim, and try to work towards raising awareness about sexual assault and try discriminating against the act of it, so as to better influence those who look up to him (as opposed to such people sending death and rape threats to other women). Rape is a lot worse than shoplifting! Chocolate Teapot fucked around with this message at 20:14 on Nov 15, 2014 |
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Nov 15, 2014 20:01
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Agreed.
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Nov 15, 2014 20:02
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Chocolate Teapot posted:If he wants to become employable again then he should be making very real apologies to his victim, and try to work towards raising awareness about sexual assault and try discriminating against the act of it, so as to better influence those who look up to him (as opposed to such people sending death and rape threats to other women). Rape is a lot worse than shoplifting! That's why he got the sentence he did! If a criminal is going to be presumed unfit to rejoin society upon serving their sentence, they should get longer sentences. The idea that we'll release criminals from prison and then marginalized them is counterintuitive and encourages further crime and recidivism
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Nov 15, 2014 20:40
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CareyB posted:People vote UKIP because they have a problem with immigrants. Ask anyone what an immigrant has done to sleight them personally and they never have an answer, ever. They are just told over and over and over again that immigrants are bad, the burka is bad, be scared of these people cos theyre different, and low and behold people start to believe it and build a reality around it. What nonsense this is
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Nov 15, 2014 21:12
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African AIDS cum posted:What nonsense this is when people get their information from a limited number of sources they have a warped view of the world
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Nov 15, 2014 21:23
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White people. Ugh.
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Nov 15, 2014 21:30
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An immigrant working in a chip shop got my order wrong last night cause we couldn't understand each other's hilarious accents. They should all be deported.
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Nov 15, 2014 21:33
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Pantsuit posted:when people get their information from a limited number of sources they have a warped view of the world UKIP voters have real grievances, economically and culturally
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Nov 15, 2014 21:33
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I skipped like 60 posts of idgaf but Ched Evans has the right to any job he is eligible for as a convicted sex offender. Be that footballer, SA mod, fluffer, or cleaning lady(that's his choice if he wants to be a lady) That absolutely does not mean that someone has to hire him for said job but he has the right to "apply" and be considered if he meets the qualifications which is essentially what a trial/training with a club is.
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Nov 15, 2014 21:47
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African AIDS cum posted:UKIP voters have real grievances, economically and culturally African AIDS cum posted:UKIP voters have real grievances, economically and culturally
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Nov 15, 2014 21:54
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I can already hear the chants of "he rapes who he wants" ringing out from the terraces.
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Nov 15, 2014 21:58
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Corrode posted:I can already hear the chants of "he rapes who he wants" ringing out from the terraces. I didn't know Van Persie was playing tonight
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Nov 15, 2014 22:06
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CareyB posted:Edit: by privilegded position of power and/or influence it's based on that persons connection with the general public. Footballers have quite a lot of that. Teachers have a lot of that too, as do doctors, and as has been said, he can no longer do either of those jobs. Can you honestly not see the difference between a rapey footballer being on a football pitch doing football things and a rapey doctor or rapey teacher being allowed back into their profession where they have a duty of care and ample opportunity to be alone with people that would be directly at risk of said rapeyness? Because if not you're a loving moron.
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Nov 15, 2014 22:12
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Shrapnig posted:SA mod Nice
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Nov 15, 2014 22:15
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ToAah0ME4bY
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Nov 15, 2014 22:17
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