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30.5 Days posted:But I don't "identify" as a nerd, and it's because I don't want to be associated with the sort of people who do. Call me a geek or whatever the new "hip" loving word is, but "nerd" is a label defined in the minds of its adherents primarily by how society has wronged its ubermensch and I want nothing to do with it. Thank you for articulating this in a way that I just haven't been able to. I always loved nerdy things, and work in a pretty nerdy field (telecom engineering) but anymore I can't identify that way because of all the awful people coming out of the woodwork. Hell, the only places I've seen anyone use any homophobic slurs in public for the last half decade are at work and a local hobby shop-- the commonality is nerd culture and all the unacknowledged privilege it entails. You have a bunch of people near the top of the social standing buying into a myth that they are at the bottom. In a more normal world, you'd think that these guys would be happy that women are getting involved in their hobbies, since that's a commonality for partners they claim to want (we're ignoring gay nerds for the moment) But in reality they've been there the whole time. But like lots of men, nerds feel they are entitled to 10/10 supermodel sexbots, so these women get ignored. Now there appear to be enough of them to have an effect on their precious hobby, and it's driving a vocal segment crazy. EDIT: We've also seen piles of homophobia in the nerd community, which has driving a lot of LGBT male nerds into the closet again. I don't doubt that there are some LGBT people part of the whole gamergate harrassment campaign, but I certainly haven't seen one yet. That's why you get crazy editorials like the one upthread here. A guy is willing to vote for the GOP purely out of spite over his toys and is angry enough to write about it. There's a comparison to gun rights here, with the obvious difference that there's no constitutional arguement for a right to games. And like lots of gun owners, he's willing to throw women, POC, and LGBT people into the fire to save his stuff. rkajdi fucked around with this message at 14:46 on Nov 18, 2014 |
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Nov 18, 2014 14:42
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rkajdi posted:That's why you get crazy editorials like the one upthread here. A guy is willing to vote for the GOP purely out of spite over his toys and is angry enough to write about it. There's a comparison to gun rights here, with the obvious difference that there's no constitutional arguement for a right to games. And like lots of gun owners, he's willing to throw women, POC, and LGBT people into the fire to save his stuff. Not that I'm disagreeing with you about how nerd culture is way more terrible than it should be, but the bolded statement hasn't been true since Brown v. Entertainment Merchants Association was decided back in 2011.
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Nov 18, 2014 17:00
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Technogeek posted:Not that I'm disagreeing with you about how nerd culture is way more terrible than it should be, but the bolded statement hasn't been true since Brown v. Entertainment Merchants Association was decided back in 2011. That is the most made up sounding Supreme Court case. Really? Brown v. whatever?... wait, it actually happened. gently caress.
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Nov 18, 2014 18:56
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Unreal_One posted:That is the most made up sounding Supreme Court case. Really? Brown v. whatever?... wait, it actually happened. gently caress. I see SOMEONE has never been forced to consult the precedent regarding determinations of competency that was established in Demosthenes v. Baal.
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Nov 18, 2014 20:07
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Technogeek posted:I see SOMEONE has never been forced to consult the precedent regarding determinations of competency that was established in Demosthenes v. Baal. I have suspected we are the butt of some cosmic joke since hearing of "Roe vs. Wade."
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Nov 18, 2014 22:42
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rkajdi posted:EDIT: We've also seen piles of homophobia in the nerd community, which has driving a lot of LGBT male nerds into the closet again. I don't doubt that there are some LGBT people part of the whole gamergate harrassment campaign, but I certainly haven't seen one yet. faces of gamergate. He's also gay, and so serves to deflect criticism of the movement for being homophobic. He is also really bad at being a nerd (he's an online entrepreneur who has mocked gamers in the past) and arguably at being gay (he opposes gay marriage). I had a brief productive argument with a gay gater on Twitter in which I pointed out both of these, to his frank concern.
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Nov 18, 2014 23:01
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Technogeek posted:Not that I'm disagreeing with you about how nerd culture is way more terrible than it should be, but the bolded statement hasn't been true since Brown v. Entertainment Merchants Association was decided back in 2011. Just looked up that case, because I thought there might have been a joke there. No joke there, just giant piles of stupid and MUH RITES. The only solace I can take is that unlike gun rights, the involved industry is decidedly against this vocal fanbase instead of continually egging them on. Kegluneq posted:Milo Yiannopoulos (@Nero on Twitter) is a columnist on Breitbart and one of the key public Shocker that this entire thing was continually blown up by rightwing trolls. It's also interesting to see those same guys trying to flip their previous dislike of nerds once they realized that they were actually politically similar on most issues. Once the basics of the culture war (i.e. religion, and to a limited extend anti-science) get dropped, the nerd community is the perfect rightwing foot soldier. And we all know that this stuff is being moved away from with the move towards libertarian garbage in the nutbag end of the GOP as part of their rebranding attempt.
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Nov 19, 2014 03:27
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rkajdi posted:That's why you get crazy editorials like the one upthread here. A guy is willing to vote for the GOP purely out of spite over his toys and is angry enough to write about it. There's a comparison to gun rights here, with the obvious difference that there's no constitutional arguement for a right to games. And like lots of gun owners, he's willing to throw women, POC, and LGBT people into the fire to save his stuff. If you throw people's interests, hobbies, livelihoods, whatever into a fire and expect them to be fine with it, I'm not entirely surprised you don't understand why they would stop supporting causes that don't directly affect them.
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Nov 19, 2014 09:02
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goku im piss posted:If you throw people's interests, hobbies, livelihoods, whatever into a fire and expect them to be fine with it, I'm not entirely surprised you don't understand why they would stop supporting causes that don't directly affect them. take away my vidya games and guns and i'll start hating gays out of spite you guys
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Nov 19, 2014 09:11
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goku im piss posted:If you throw people's interests, hobbies, livelihoods, whatever into a fire and expect them to be fine with it, I'm not entirely surprised you don't understand why they would stop supporting causes that don't directly affect them. I heard one time somebody criticized a movie I like on feminists grounds, now I vote male chauvinism every time. I hope you liked critiquing my movie ladies, enjoy your back-alley abortions and repeal of women's suffrage.
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Nov 19, 2014 09:15
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Kegluneq posted:You are correct, ethical positions on topics that don't affect you are entirely arbitrary and all principles are rooted in selfishness. Or people just get tired of the party/group that they want to support throwing them under the bus whenever it's politically convenient. VitalSigns posted:I heard one time somebody criticized a movie I like on feminists grounds, now I vote male chauvinism every time. I hope you liked critiquing my movie ladies, enjoy your back-alley abortions and repeal of women's suffrage. One more vote that obviously wasn't needed or wanted, right?
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Nov 19, 2014 09:27
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goku im piss posted:Or people just get tired of the party/group that they want to support throwing them under the bus whenever it's politically convenient. Unironically agreed, but replace men and feminists with white people and black liberals, or upstanding Germans and Bolshevist Jews
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Nov 19, 2014 09:42
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icantfindaname posted:Unironically agreed, but replace men and feminists with white people and black liberals, or upstanding Germans and Bolshevist Jews That's a clever comparison, but it still doesn't change the fact that demonizing a part of the voting base that is usually sympathetic to your cause is really not a good idea, unless you didn't give a poo poo about those votes in the first place.
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Nov 19, 2014 09:52
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goku im piss posted:That's a clever comparison, but it still doesn't change the fact that demonizing a part of the voting base that is usually sympathetic to your cause is really not a good idea, unless you didn't give a poo poo about those votes in the first place. Who demonized what now?
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Nov 19, 2014 09:56
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katlington posted:Who demonized what now? You see, cultural criticism is the same as bullying.
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Nov 19, 2014 09:58
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goku im piss posted:One more vote that obviously wasn't needed or wanted, right? Anyone who claims to be a liberal but votes neocon because a woman critiqued a videogame is lying. That person is a neocon looking for an excuse to vote neocon. There was no chance of getting the vote of someone who enjoys seeing the legal system used to hurt all women everywhere. It reminds me of people who say they weren't racist until black people started complaining about racism all the time and now those uppity blacks turned them racist. No. No they didn't, that person was always just loving racist.
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Nov 19, 2014 10:39
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goku im piss posted:That's a clever comparison, but it still doesn't change the fact that demonizing a part of the voting base that is usually sympathetic to your cause is really not a good idea, unless you didn't give a poo poo about those votes in the first place. Somehow I don't think anyone immature enough to decide to betray all women, or liberals, or America because they think somebody is demonizing video games or people who play video games has very much sympathy for anyone else anyway.
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Nov 19, 2014 11:00
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Jack Gladney posted:Somehow I don't think anyone immature enough to decide to betray all women, or liberals, or America because they think somebody is demonizing video games or people who play video games has very much sympathy for anyone else anyway. Plus like, it makes no sense. The Democrats don't want to ban videogames or ban titties in videogames. There's literally no reason to vote Republican over video games unless your real motive is banning abortions and birth control just to make women miserable. Hell, if I were going to take odds on which of the two parties is more likely to ban titties in videogames, it'd be the loving Republicans, you know the same people who want to ban pornography, want the FCC fining the Superbowl over broadcasting too much of a breast at halftime, and are always on some crusade or other to ban something sexually or spiritually immoral and enforce their prudish religion on the land  Like what the gently caress. If you want to see some titty while you're playing XBox, the party of religious zealots should be your last choice  Unless, as stated, you're actually fine with a theocracy banning your precious video games because you'd get to see them go after women.
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Nov 19, 2014 11:15
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goku im piss posted:If you throw people's interests, hobbies, livelihoods, whatever into a fire and expect them to be fine with it, I'm not entirely surprised you don't understand why they would stop supporting causes that don't directly affect them. Video games are one of my hobbies too, I'm just enough of a functioning human to understand that my hobbies aren't as important as oppressed people's basic rights. All these temper tantrums prove to me is that fedora filth was always the bigoted human refuse they came off as when I've had to deal with them. rkajdi fucked around with this message at 13:46 on Nov 19, 2014 |
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Nov 19, 2014 13:38
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rkajdi posted:Video games are one of my hobbies too, I'm just enough of a functioning human to understand that my hobbies aren't as important as oppressed people's basic rights. All these temper tantrums prove to me is that fedora filth was always the bigoted human refuse they came off as when I've had to deal with them. Wow, look at this post. Way to bully vidya game players, now I'm going to repeal the Civil Rights Act. Way to go LIEburals! Turn back before I vote to legalize slavery, you monsters  .For real tho, how the gently caress are video games being tossed into a fire, video games have not changed one bit the only complaints I hear about them from progressives are all about story, character modeling, etc. Oh no, I was having fun playing a game until a cutscene started and I saw a woman with not comedically huge breasts wearing clothes/armor that were appropriate for the occasion, suddenly the gameplay I was just having fun with is retroactively boring.
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Nov 19, 2014 16:28
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30.5 Days posted:You see, cultural criticism is the same as bullying. It can be, if you're using it as a pulpit and actionable platform to force a change or to pressure someone. Jack Gladney posted:Somehow I don't think anyone immature enough to decide to betray all women, or liberals, or America because they think somebody is demonizing video games or people who play video games has very much sympathy for anyone else anyway. Again, if it wasn't a vote you were counting on, why care, right? rkajdi posted:Video games are one of my hobbies too, I'm just enough of a functioning human to understand that my hobbies aren't as important as oppressed people's basic rights. All these temper tantrums prove to me is that fedora filth was always the bigoted human refuse they came off as when I've had to deal with them. If they weren't conservative voters before, and they deigned to vote, they might be after this. But again, those votes weren't needed anyway, according to what I keep hearing. DrProsek posted:Wow, look at this post. Way to bully vidya game players, now I'm going to repeal the Civil Rights Act. Way to go LIEburals! Turn back before I vote to legalize slavery, you monsters I'll just say that there are much deeper reasons why all this poo poo stinks to high heaven and why people don't want politics mixed in with their games. Progressives really do have a lot more important things to worry about and giving this coverage and attention is retarded.
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Nov 19, 2014 18:22
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goku im piss posted:I'll just say that there are much deeper reasons why all this poo poo stinks to high heaven and why people don't want politics mixed in with their games. Progressives really do have a lot more important things to worry about and giving this coverage and attention is retarded. its getting coverage because manchild gamers are cowardly threatening to rape people for having opinions they don't like pro-gamergate people are too dumb to understand that. nobody cares about video games, but they do care when people who strongly identify as video gamers threaten mass murder in defense of video games the small fraction of people who play video games as a regular hobby who are driven to madness over liberal feminist strawmen are not worth catering to as they are fickle and idiotic people anyway
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Nov 19, 2014 18:25
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goku im piss posted:I'll just say that there are much deeper reasons why all this poo poo stinks to high heaven and why people don't want politics mixed in with their games. Progressives really do have a lot more important things to worry about and giving this coverage and attention is retarded. No one is putting politics in games except the developers.
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Nov 19, 2014 18:44
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Popular Thug Drink posted:its getting coverage because manchild gamers are cowardly threatening to rape people for having opinions they don't like Its the internet, whats new about that? Also the only people who seem to be advocating for some ethnic cleansing seem to be coming from the anti-side. The game side of things is trivial. Someone brought up earlier that Cultural Criticism wasn't Bullying. I said it could be if it was used as a platform for change, in the strictest sense of the word. But disagreement with someone is being touted as Harassment. And It could be, in the strictest sense, if by disagreeing with someones position you make them FEEL harassed.
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Nov 19, 2014 18:45
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goku im piss posted:Also the only people who seem to be advocating for some ethnic cleansing seem to be coming from the anti-side. i'm not confident that your reality and my reality are the same reality goku im piss posted:AThe game side of things is trivial. Someone brought up earlier that Cultural Criticism wasn't Bullying. I said it could be if it was used as a platform for change, in the strictest sense of the word. But disagreement with someone is being touted as Harassment. And It could be, in the strictest sense, if by disagreeing with someones position you make them FEEL harassed. i think threatening to go into someone's house and rape them or murder a bunch of people in public counts as harassment, yes
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Nov 19, 2014 18:47
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goku im piss posted:Its the internet, whats new about that? Hmm, maybe people who traditionally haven't been part of "the internet" (that is, the parts of the internet that talk about raping people) are trying to engage with it now and are being offended.
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Nov 19, 2014 18:48
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Nintendo Kid posted:No one is putting politics in games except the developers. I meant gaming in general.
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Nov 19, 2014 18:48
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goku im piss posted:I meant gaming in general. what, like betting on horses? penny slots?
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Nov 19, 2014 18:50
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Popular Thug Drink posted:i'm not confident that your reality and my reality are the same reality You post your examples and I'll post mine. Popular Thug Drink posted:i think threatening to go into someone's house and rape them or murder a bunch of people in public counts as harassment, yes Yeah, that would be harassment. Its idiotic to think otherwise. computer parts posted:Hmm, maybe people who traditionally haven't been part of "the internet" (that is, the parts of the internet that talk about raping people) are trying to engage with it now and are being offended. Maybe if they don't want to be offended they shouldn't be engaging them then. Turn it off, walk away, etc. Popular Thug Drink posted:what, like betting on horses? penny slots? The Addams Family slot machine has offended me with its liberal bias I guess. goku im piss fucked around with this message at 18:56 on Nov 19, 2014 |
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Nov 19, 2014 18:52
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goku im piss posted:I meant gaming in general. No is putting politics in gaming in general except the developers and publishers.
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Nov 19, 2014 18:54
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goku im piss posted:Maybe if they don't want to be offended they shouldn't be engaging them then. Turn it off, walk away, etc. That's what we're asking you; developers and publishers make changes to their games that skeletons like and gamergate folks don't. If this bothers you so much, maybe stop playing games?
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Nov 19, 2014 18:57
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Nintendo Kid posted:No is putting politics in gaming in general except the developers and publishers. And the Media, and Cultural pundits, and Educational institutions, and
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Nov 19, 2014 18:59
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goku im piss posted:Its the internet, whats new about that? Games Journalism has always been a joke, with reviewers being funded primarily by ad revenue from the companies making the very games they're reviewing. That's not news or surprising to anyone. But no one really gave much of a poo poo because it's just video games so why would they? Then as soon as you throw some women game designers in the mix suddenly Ethics In Game Journalism is an issue. But it's totally not just misogynistic bullshit, honest!
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Nov 19, 2014 18:59
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goku im piss posted:You post your examples and I'll post mine. well i can't really post any examples of anti-gamergaters calling for ethnic cleansing, because i'm not aware of any. it was a scenario you positied, i just politely called you a retard goku im piss posted:Yeah, that would be harassment. Its idiotic to think otherwise. agreed, pro-gamergaters are idiots. im glad we can see eye to eye sometimes goku im piss posted:Maybe if they don't want to be offended they shouldn't be engaging them then. Turn it off, walk away, etc. it is difficult to just walk away when people intrude into your personal spaces to continue harrassing you, such as telling other people where you live, your home phone number, etc. i think the real lesson here is try not to piss off hardcore gamers because they have nothing better to do than send child porn to your parents
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Nov 19, 2014 18:59
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goku im piss posted:And the Media, and Cultural pundits, and Educational institutions, and all of these institutions care far more for the tendency of self described gamers to be absolutely horrible sociopaths than they care about the content of games
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Nov 19, 2014 19:01
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goku im piss posted:And the Media, and Cultural pundits, and Educational institutions, and I'm sorry child, but those are people talking about the politics already present in "gaming". Much like no one had to add politics to Mein Kampf or the Bible.
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Nov 19, 2014 19:04
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It's not even as if anyone is actually proposing anything like banning certain games or legally regulating their content. It's literally just some women publicly saying "Hey maybe we should think about representations of women in games and the cultural impact of that?" and Gamers going apeshit in response.
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Nov 19, 2014 19:07
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Entropic posted:It's kind of adorable seeing a generation of "Gamers" run into the real world where you actually get in trouble for calling someone a human being and threatening to burn their house down and rape them. "Gamer Culture" (lol) is toxic and incredibly unselfware about how toxic it is. I guess. I'm taking the side of the other here because there would be no back and forth otherwise. Anyway, calling for any form of ethics within the Game community is pretty stupid. But I do like watching Gawker get hammered. Popular Thug Drink posted:well i can't really post any examples of anti-gamergaters calling for ethnic cleansing, because i'm not aware of any. it was a scenario you positied, i just politely called you a retard Oh ok. Popular Thug Drink posted:agreed, pro-gamergaters are idiots. im glad we can see eye to eye sometimes We don't, I dislike you immensely and from this point on I will put you on all my block lists and have to spend hours in therapy and meditation to cleanse all the bad energy you imparted on me blah blah blah Popular Thug Drink posted:it is difficult to just walk away when people intrude into your personal spaces to continue harrassing you, such as telling other people where you live, your home phone number, etc. It was obviously ok when it happened to other people, even encouraged.
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Nov 19, 2014 19:10
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Nintendo Kid posted:I'm sorry child, but those are people talking about the politics already present in "gaming". Much like no one had to add politics to Mein Kampf or the Bible. That's an interesting example.
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Nov 19, 2014 19:13
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goku im piss posted:Oh ok. i would like to see these examples of calls to ethnic cleansing against? gamers though, that might be funny goku im piss posted:It was obviously ok when it happened to other people, even encouraged. lol it's never been ok see this is the problem of gamergate folks, you can't extrapolate what's socially acceptable on the dark lovely corners of the internet into what's acceptable in general society. the internet does not follow the same rules as society, and expecting society to adhere to or approve of lovely internet behavior is delusional just because helldumping was a thing for a while didn't make it acceptable then, neither does it make it acceptable when you try to use this tactic in your fantasy bullshit crusade against mean old feminists. doxxing is generally an awful tactic internet losers use when they can't get the last word online and it's horrible behavior
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Nov 19, 2014 19:15
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