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xie posted:The Wright Bros memorial in Kill Devils Hill is mentioned almost by name in the verse (twice, as an orient point) and used to have a small clump of trees to the south, so there are those that believe it could be somewhere in that area, or more aptly "not on Roanoke," at least. But drat that's one hell of a clue to just be something you pass
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Nov 19, 2014 19:36
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If it were at the Wright Bros memorial, which would be a stretch, because again you can't dig there (though this one in 1981 I'm willing to admit may have been more likely. It's not a historic site with archaeological value), it has to be with the "Roanoke" verse. Unless there's a ferry terminal (or maybe a huge Baum Bridge sign?) located at the memorial, that's really tough to reconcile with the "Land by the window" line and the map of Roanoke. Plus the "Dark Forest" "July-August" matches at the Garden/Raleigh, which I don't think are insurmountable on their own, but when making a case for the Wright memorial you need to explain them. Otherwise I can see it. Pass two friends of Octave // Wright Brothers, this is a freebie In december // The first 3 flight markers beyond the monument itself were from their flights in December. Going with this idea, I would guess that the Near dauntless and unconquerable Determination Your Goal Stanza has a significant hint to the dig location. 1) Either you're looking for the word Determination right in front of you or 2) In this theory the dig site would be near Dauntless and [I]nconquerable on the memorial, which are around the back I believe. But doesn't that just seem too simple? I know it was 1981 but I didn't even need to load up GMaps, I just have a general idea of what's there and I'm still able to fit it.
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Nov 19, 2014 20:04
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I haven't paid attention to the hunt for a while now, but gotta say I slow down and start looking around every single time I walk by the Boston Public Library and see Xenophon and Thucydides up there.
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Nov 19, 2014 20:49
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Boston is one of the most maddening cities to hide one of these in because everything is loving old and historic. You can't walk outside without bumping into a statue, monument, plaque, historic site, etc. If you ever want to drive yourself actually insane, start "playing" this puzzle and walk from Central Square past Harvard Square. I actually think the #1 nail in my Cambridge Common theory should have been "gently caress" because every. single. building. that Harvard has anything to do with is ancient and historic and full of statues, carvings, stained glass, etc. edit: I'm sure you've noticed that Thucydides name is not North of Xenophon's? 
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Nov 19, 2014 20:57
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xie, there's only lovely pictures of the storrows compass online. what makes you so certain it's connected? I can't figure it out from the photos.
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Nov 19, 2014 21:05
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BigFactory posted:xie, there's only lovely pictures of the storrows compass online. what makes you so certain it's connected? I can't figure it out from the photos. The compass itself is shaped exactly like the portal behind her, and I don't just mean "a circle" - it has the same cutouts. I don't even have good photos of this because I don't own a camera & my phone was broken at the time. There is also the word BROOKLINE written on the compass, but the way the stones are bisected (by the lines, like in the painting) the "K" is on two different slabs, it's broken up like a | and a <. The < matches exactly (this is one of the most photo-realistic matches) the "^" visible on the Gypsy's right (stage left) sleeve. The one that isn't the citgo sign, on the opposite sleeve from the "42." When you stand at the compass and look directly south, you can see the Prudential building in front of you. When you invert the painting, the Compass and the Pru hidden on her dress are perfectly aligned with "real life." It's a (forgive me) Polaroid. This is close, but not exactly the right angle: http://www.waymarking.com/gallery/image.aspx?f=1&guid=d184b6a7-3ed2-4f89-99db-31e300bf04df&gid=3 It's also one of the only places that had Shurcliff Benches in 1981, and those are visible when you flip the image upside down.
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Nov 19, 2014 21:12
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I liked your cambridge common theory a lot more than the hatchshell. I just don't register any of those landmarks the same way you do.
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Nov 19, 2014 21:13
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Again, it isn't about solving any individual match. It's about building a case that becomes very difficult to call a coincidence. I can totally see how in a vacuum the hatch shell in the image isn't super convincing. I personally can't see, but can understand how someone may be skeptical of the "arm" on the statue (this is an OBVIOUS match to me, and many people I've shown it to offline). And yeah, maybe that's totally the benches hidden in the box when you flip it upside down, maybe not. I can see how maybe the compass itself isn't super convincing. Maybe you don't see the Pru on her dress. But what are the odds that there's another park that has all 5 "maybe" matches? Especially considering the benches are confirmed unique to the park, and surround the compass. Especially when the main place the benches existed in 1981 was the Compass. Where you can see the Pru, in the exact same orientation as flipping the painting upside down. And the Compass is 5 FOOTbridges from the Hatch shell. Which is very possibly in the image. Which is 50 feet from the statue which VERY possibly contains the gypsy arm... It's like a court case without a body or a smoking gun. You can build a circumstantial case. The columns in Cleveland are not the only columns in the world, probably not even in that city. But it's the columns + the fountains nearby + the wall that tells you "OK, this is the right park." At the end of the day if you don't agree you don't agree, I can't make you agree. But I'm up to 11 or 12 things in that park that are all at least very possible matches. I thought I had 2 in cambridge common and spent a year looking for more, I couldn't find any. It's not that the turrets on the box aren't a hell of a lot like the Harvard Epworth Memorial Church, it's that there's nothing else nearby (except that 4, which I think just coincidentally looks very similar). edit: There's also the verse matches in that park, including culminating in a dig spot that makes a ton of sense and can see multiple verse/park matches, including the "smoking gun" - All the Letters (this is what I've held back because I am actually trying to dig and I don't want someone to gently caress it up for me). xie fucked around with this message at 21:22 on Nov 19, 2014 |
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Nov 19, 2014 21:18
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Sham I Am posted:Somewhere earlier in the thread I pointed out that like 30 or 40% of the verse was about the wright brothers, the verse starts and ends talking about the wright brothers, and "Look north at the wing" could be interpenetrated as "stand at the wing itself and look north" instead of "stand here, look north and see the wing". Makes the Wright Memorial seem at least plausible, if not actually likely. No, it's not "plausible" and don't bring this theory up again as all it does is muddy the issue. First problem: the Wright Bros. Memorial is a big old rock in the middle of a mound with nothing around to match the image. Second problem: it doesn't work as a destination if you follow the verse. Now I admit that Preiss is an idiot who was bad at making puzzles but to have the player get step-by-step directions to take Highway 12 down to the bridge and to Roanoke Island and then to Fort Raleigh and then expect them to magically end up back at the Wright Memorial is a level of ineptitude beyond what Preiss is capable of. There's a bunch of half-rear end image matches in the Garden (by "half rear end" I mean an arch and some columns that match but are pretty generic) and zero, zilch, nada at the Memorial (and there almost COULDN'T BE, it's a big loving rock slab with nothing around). So image + verse point to Fort Raleigh, at least initially. Wherever Cask 3 may be, Preiss at least intended you to pass by the entrance to the Elizabethan Gardens in the Fort Raleigh area on Roanoke Island and there's no way to get back to the Wright Memorial from Roanoke Island without saying "oh look north at the wing means get back in your car, drive away from Fort Raleigh and back across the bridge to the memorial and look north there" which is, to put it mildly, real dumb. Edit: There's absolutely no way to work the "man of Oz" or "dark forest" or "path to mica and driftwood" to the Memorial. It basically relies on interpreting one sentence differently ("look north at the wing") and frequency analysis to make it work. Nothing else supports it. Megaman's Jockstrap fucked around with this message at 22:43 on Nov 19, 2014 |
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Nov 19, 2014 22:12
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xie posted:The compass itself is shaped exactly like the portal behind her, and I don't just mean "a circle" - it has the same cutouts. I don't even have good photos of this because I don't own a camera & my phone was broken at the time. AGAHAHAHHAHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!
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Nov 19, 2014 23:31
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I like the discussion of the rest of the book having clues, because gently caress why wouldn't it. Someone make a new one for Knoxville please.
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Nov 19, 2014 23:51
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joshtothemaxx posted:I like the discussion of the rest of the book having clues, because gently caress why wouldn't it. Because Preiss said they don't. Some people don't buy it but that's what he claims. I feel like I could make a really good one of these by now. I could probably do at least 5-6 just in Boston that would be very hard to find. Like I said, Harvard is a playground. The problem is that this kind of thing isn't super legal anymore.
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Nov 20, 2014 00:00
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I wish people would stop saying Golden Gate Park. Golden Gate Park. It does not look like Golden Gate Park. Just because it is a rectangle doesn't make it look like GGP. For reference, this is GGP: https://www.google.com/maps/place/Golden+Gate+Park/@37.7664993,-122.4754422,15z/data=!4m2!3m1!1s0x808587726045f763:0x71be8b68ef3ba730 It has a 1/2 mile long by 1/2 block wide panhandle at one end and it also bulges a bit before the panhandle. It is also long and thin. It is not a loving match. Sheesh. Idiots.
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Nov 20, 2014 00:32
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I still don't know why the Russian Hill one in San Fransisco petered out. It has really solid matches: the backwards G and H, the sweet smell, the three poles, the steam engine, the giant step, first North then across, etc. People just got to the lamp post and...lost interest.
Megaman's Jockstrap fucked around with this message at 01:18 on Nov 20, 2014 |
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Nov 20, 2014 00:37
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Image 6, Verse 9 - St. AugustineLt. Tanaka posted:I was trying to just lurk but i can't get my mind off this. This question got a little buried. The going Fountain of Youth theory is that the rock represents the water at the Fountain of Youth Park. The negative area around the rock and conquistador represent the state of Florida. An interesting way to layer the clues if this is a correct interpretation. It is also my understanding that the Fountain of Youth shoreline has changed with various hurricanes and there are some more contemporary overheads that demonstrate the match better.   E: This also presumably matches a portion of the fence found in the verse, which would be the green picket fence at the Fountain of Youth park:  Merlot Brougham fucked around with this message at 01:44 on Nov 20, 2014 |
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Nov 20, 2014 01:39
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xie posted:Because Preiss said they don't. Some people don't buy it but that's what he claims. The only real issues are burying and boxes, both of which make the user seem terrorist-ey. But there are other ways to hide stuff. I'm sure the geo-cachers in this thread could come up with a bunch of cool ways to hide stuff. I'm thinking a note/key in a film canister can could be hidden away from public view in lots of places. Or even just pick a specific spot, take a picture, and then the person who wins is the one who sends you a pic of that exact same spot. For me, though, what makes this hunt so inviting is the art. There are so many weird things in each superb fantasy illustration. It's almost... Inviting. Drunk Nerds fucked around with this message at 02:52 on Nov 20, 2014 |
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Nov 20, 2014 02:49
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Drunk Nerds posted:For me, though, what makes this hunt so inviting is the art. There are so many weird things in each superb fantasy illustration. It's almost... Inviting. It better be, because after three decades and a 16-some odd percent success rate, something has to keep people hooked. Good thing a thread I posted years ago about a very solvable local treasure hunt got gassed. Perhaps a rash decision: http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3457535 Here's the d-bag that found it:   e: Too bad there wasn't a hotdog stand soliciting donations at the time, because we might have been able to keep the thread open. Merlot Brougham fucked around with this message at 03:55 on Nov 20, 2014 |
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Nov 20, 2014 03:17
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Merlot Brougham posted:Image 6, Verse 9 - St. Augustine 
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Nov 20, 2014 06:33
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I don't really love the florida in that one, I never have. It's huge, which is not impossible, but man that'd be about the easiest clue in any of the puzzles. And it's not really a map of florida To me the cove always looked more like the one a bit to the south, the one at Mission de Nombre de Dios, which is "helped" by the fact that in the position of the palm tree, there's a giant crucifix that casts a long shadow. https://goo.gl/maps/oBrf7 The shadow isn't going in the right direction here, but you get it. But I'm just saying what it looks like to me, not what it is. And no, I wouldn't suddenly match this verse with "the long palm's shadow." If it is in this area I've liked the mission, though I don't know if there are/were ever any green fences. It's the first mission in the USA (first chapter), it's on Ocean Ave, etc. There are various excavation sites and plaques talking about building materials, churches (there's a cross in the image, but it could be the big one which is visible from Fountain of Youth). What ties everyone back to FOY is the "Wind-Rose" type clues that while not unique to the park, seem to be too much of a coincidence. But this one is on my "I really don't know tons about this puzzle" list with NOLA. xie fucked around with this message at 14:36 on Nov 20, 2014 |
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Nov 20, 2014 14:33
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Agreed. I'm also tired of seeing people take Google maps photos and flipping them backwards, upside down, whatever to make something fit. Preiss probably had nothing more than an Atlas and maybe local maps from the parks to send to the illustrator. There is no reason to believe that anything is a mirror image. Also, I still see the outline of Virginia by the palm tree/rock in the lower right hand corner. I don't think that the cask is necessarily in Virginia, but I think it may be a clue. Nocheez fucked around with this message at 15:52 on Nov 20, 2014 |
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Nov 20, 2014 15:50
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We have no firm evidence but there is nothing stopping anyone from holding the painting or a map up to a mirror in 1981. As far as I'm concerned if it could be done with 1981 tech it's somewhat in play, though less likely. Don't forget transparencies. If it requires actual aerial photography, unless you can show there was a sign in the park with the aerial or something, yeah it's probably not. Cleveland definitely has the shape of Parkgate in the centaur's tail as well, so map features aren't to be ruled out entirely. edit: Not to be a dickhole but if you think it takes any kind of technology to flip a map upside down 
xie fucked around with this message at 18:38 on Nov 20, 2014 |
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Nov 20, 2014 18:32
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xie posted:We have no firm evidence but there is nothing stopping anyone from holding the painting or a map up to a mirror in 1981. No, what I'm saying is doing mirror images is not something that has been shown on any of the solved casks. The illustrations were made to match the photos and maps they had. Why would they mirror anything?
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Nov 20, 2014 19:44
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The map of Ohio in Cleveland is a mirror image, though it's still recognizable without a mirror. It was possible with 1981 tech and has definitely been a part of other non-Secret puzzles. I don't think The Secret was designed that way, and honestly they're hard enough without it that I'm not going to consider it. However, flipping anything upside down is 100% in play - you have to do it to see the Terminal Tower. I'd say any rotation is fine. I constantly walk the line between "well designed" and "complete poo poo" for these puzzles. As I feel like I'm zeroing in on Boston and it does seem to still be solvable I do give BP a little more credit than I used to.
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Nov 20, 2014 20:59
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xie posted:The map of Ohio in Cleveland is a mirror image, though it's still recognizable without a mirror. It was possible with 1981 tech and has definitely been a part of other non-Secret puzzles. I don't think The Secret was designed that way, and honestly they're hard enough without it that I'm not going to consider it. However, flipping anything upside down is 100% in play - you have to do it to see the Terminal Tower. I'd say any rotation is fine. Look again at the Ohio solve image. Ohio is most certainly not a mirror.  I agree with the 180 degree flip for Tower City, but flipping things around is not mirroring them.
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Nov 20, 2014 21:11
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Nocheez posted:Look again at the Ohio solve image. Ohio is most certainly not a mirror. On the other hand, 2 out of 12 have been solved, so it's a rather small sample size. It seems a bit hasty to rule anything out definitively at this point.
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Nov 20, 2014 21:14
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Somebody fucked around with this message at 14:19 on Nov 21, 2014 |
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Nov 20, 2014 21:23
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How long has he been doing this? It's been a while
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Nov 20, 2014 21:26
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Deteriorata posted:On the other hand, 2 out of 12 have been solved, so it's a rather small sample size. It seems a bit hasty to rule anything out definitively at this point. True. One of the things I've been doing (because at this point I have nothing to occupy me in Boston except to dig) is going through the solved puzzles and trying to understand them as best as possible. There are a lot of common elements in them, but not enough to say that all 12 work that way. One thing I'm fairly certain of - unless we're missing a lot of stuff in the image (and I'm not sure we are at this point), this is a very very self contained puzzle. Most of the other puzzles involve walking around (or seem to) and seeing various things along the way, or following clues. This one was really about zeroing you in on the gardens the entire time. There aren't a lot of clues leading you through a park. The clues for Ohio & Cleveland are there, then the verse starts you looking for something "country" related. It's easier now, but wouldn't be too difficult, to find the Cultural Gardens. There's only one real curvature in any road in the gardens. You find the columns once you're in the park, see the wall, see the 6 steps (plus climbing up the 7th) and the rectangular plot. The wall is depicted exactly as in the image, and it's your "dig here marker." You can brute force it and just dig up the entire bed (which they wound up doing anyway), or go around back [front] and solve the rest of the puzzle - You'll see the names written on the wall and be able to do the counting steps, then go around back to dig. I'll tell you for sure that Milwaukee is a very different puzzle than this. While it still took a long time to find, this one was pretty easy. When Johann posted a picture of the columns (which also had the wall on the same webpage) it was pretty much cracked. The others aren't so simple.
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Nov 20, 2014 21:32
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Cleveland isn't good because the drat verse tells you exactly where to go on the wall to dig. If we had that poo poo for Roanoke it would have been solved too. I think Xie's Boston dig is very important because it shows the veracity of his way of interpreting a verse + image for a set of written directions that isn't as easy as "from a place where rocks abound, take five steps, go three down, now your treasure is in the ground".
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Nov 20, 2014 22:11
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If you're at Q4T you should check in at the "Image 4" thread or "verse 4" whichever one is active. I've really been trying to break down that puzzle and it loving sucks. There are a few problems everyone has with the instructions. The "counting" instructions only work if you do the counting from the "front" of the wall, not the back where the casque was buried. There is nothing we can decipher that tells you this is how it should be. How is anyone supposed to know that? The front of the wall definitely has the names inscribed, so you can tell it's the right wall, but if you go to where you should on the back you won't find the treasure. That's why I'm trying to rework what the steps were supposed to be in Cleveland, but no matter which side of the wall you see first nobody can figure out how you were supposed to know to do a bunch of counting on the front then go around the rear to dig - IDK. But yes, the Boston dig is very important for solving the other ones for that exact reason.
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Nov 20, 2014 22:17
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xie posted:I constantly walk the line between "well designed" and "complete poo poo" for these puzzles. xie posted:it loving sucks. This. The art is pretty brilliant, it gives clear clues about stuff in the area and the final dig point. Brilliant work by JJP and BP, especially since it seems like they only communicated with a few notes and polaroids. But the verses, man, they are the most needlessly convoluted stuff I've seen in my extensive work with puzzles. Just say "when you get to the wall count nine stones from the left and then dig." I don't need a whole verse for that. I especially don't need a verse telling me how to walk through a park or take a ferry or whatever when YOU HAVE DRAWN ME A PICTURE OF THE DIG SPOT RIGHT THERE. Because it seems like the pictures can only get you within a few yards of the dig spot, after which we have to rely on the twisted ramblings of a mad BP, it's really tough to find these casques.
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Nov 20, 2014 22:45
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Nocheez posted:Look again at the Ohio solve image. Ohio is most certainly not a mirror. Illinois is a mirror: 
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Nov 21, 2014 01:10
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LMAO he's right. Fuckin' Preiss, man. He's provided "clues" in the form of an endless ammo belt of flipped, chopped, stretched, and mirrored images to "confirm" matches to. Son of a bitch.
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Nov 21, 2014 01:13
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Drunk Nerds posted:
This is why Boston is important. I've said before that I've never wanted to dig before, and I mean that. My solution indicates a small area to dig. In pure BP fashion there is some debate as to which side to dig on, but I believe this spot is very clearly indicated by the painting (and verse, to credit).
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Nov 21, 2014 01:46
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I just took a poo poo. One of the turds kinda looked like Roanoke. Then I flushed. Someone should crawl into my sewers and dig.
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Nov 21, 2014 03:03
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I've been looking all morning, and it really pisses me off that I can't find another state outline in any of the unsolved pictures. The two solved pictures have an outline of the state in which the casque was located. Maybe the magician's hair looks like a flipped outline of Wisconsin, but that's the only one where I can even stretch my imagination to see a state outline.
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Nov 21, 2014 18:07
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I've been trying to find the "iconic building" in as many as I can. In Roanoke I definitely see how this could be a lighthouse. Note the two odd black "blobs" (one above the jewel) which could be windows. We have a building in both solved ones, Boston, and Milwaukee for sure. edit: Charleston has a map of Charleston, St Augustine might have a map of FL, Roanoke has a picture of Roanoke. The Cleveland and Chicago verses offer no hints about the city, which could be why. It's really looking more and more like all 12 of these puzzles have common elements but do not all work the same way. xie fucked around with this message at 18:48 on Nov 21, 2014 |
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Nov 21, 2014 18:41
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Does Roanoke HAVE a lighthouse? If you search for it, the results are the Hatteras Visitors center.
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Nov 21, 2014 22:03
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Roanoke does have a lighthouse. It's located adjacent to the park I posted a few pages ago with the cross in it (Bicentennial/Jules Park). It doesn't look like a traditional lighthouse though, it's small. http://roanokeisland.com/MarshesLighthouse.aspx From the bridge connecting Jules Park with Roanoke Island Festival Park you can see the Bodie Lighthouse, and I believe from the Northern points (where you can see the Wright Bros memorial to the north) you can see a lighthouse in that direction. I forget the name of that one. Maybe Cape Hattaras lifesaving station? The Cleveland Terminal tower is 5 miles (though a dead straight shot) to the Cleveland Cultural Gardens, the Pru is like a mile from my site in Boston, and the Water Tower in Chicago is also a bit of a ways from Grant Park (but also a straight shot if memory serves).
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Nov 21, 2014 22:42
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| # ? Jun 8, 2024 00:39 |
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What do you mean by "straight shot?" I don't understand because any two points on the same plane are a straight shot from each other. Thanks!
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Nov 22, 2014 00:27
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