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limeincoke posted:just finished season 1. Holy poo poo Oliver is a mass murderer. He'll just straight up murder dozens of people whose only crime is being a bodyguard for the "bad guys." and noone says anything about this. It's a real disconnect when he then has moral dilemmas over killing 1 single person. When Oliver came back from the island he was completely hosed in the head.
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Nov 21, 2014 03:32
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| # ? Jun 1, 2024 06:38 |
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limeincoke posted:just finished season 1. Holy poo poo Oliver is a mass murderer. He'll just straight up murder dozens of people whose only crime is being a bodyguard for the "bad guys." and noone says anything about this. It's a real disconnect when he then has moral dilemmas over killing 1 single person. A lot of people cite this as an issue with the show, but I see it as more of an interesting facet of the character (and one that they acknowledge, so it is purposeful). You can easily have debates and discussions over the morality of this- is it for the greater good? Is the killing of a few bad guy lackies justifiable if it means saving innocent lives?
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Nov 21, 2014 03:36
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Captain Mog posted:A lot of people cite this as an issue with the show, but I see it as more of an interesting facet of the character (and one that they acknowledge, so it is purposeful). You can easily have debates and discussions over the morality of this- is it for the greater good? Is the killing of a few bad guy lackies justifiable if it means saving innocent lives? One of my best friends, who introduced me to the show, apparently missed all of this, because when I confronted him with the data, he said "well then, Oliver is completely unredeemable because he's a murderer." Some people are only capable of seeing the world in black and white, good and evil. They can't conceive of shades of grey, doing bad things for good reasons and a person who has done bad things trying to change for the better.
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Nov 21, 2014 04:03
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Captain Mog posted:A lot of people cite this as an issue with the show, but I see it as more of an interesting facet of the character (and one that they acknowledge, so it is purposeful). You can easily have debates and discussions over the morality of this- is it for the greater good? Is the killing of a few bad guy lackies justifiable if it means saving innocent lives? That's not the issue. The issue is that said interesting facet has fallen into the memory hole of the writers and everyone. The show is pretending really, really hard that Oliver never killed anyone. Now you have the police captain saying "The police are working alongside a mass murderering vigilante," and Oliver going all holier-than-thou about Laurel hanging out with a vigilante who killed one guy and hung up his hood, and Oliver's body count is never brought up at all, even though it really should have been.
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Nov 21, 2014 04:03
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Captain Mog posted:A lot of people cite this as an issue with the show, but I see it as more of an interesting facet of the character (and one that they acknowledge, so it is purposeful). You can easily have debates and discussions over the morality of this- is it for the greater good? Is the killing of a few bad guy lackies justifiable if it means saving innocent lives? A few? Well more like hundreds. And no - it's not. Killing hundreds of people who, for all we know, are just independent contractors working a security mission and aren't bad guys at all, is not worth possibly saving lives. Especially when, like a poster before said, he gets to the big bad guy and decides to let him live. Also especially when news networks don't lead off with "Vigilante murders 25 people in downtown warehouse." That said, that's the only problem I have with the show. It's a entertaining show so it's all good.
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Nov 21, 2014 04:05
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He never should have stopped killing people. 
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Nov 21, 2014 04:07
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CAPTAIN CAPSLOCK posted:He never should have stopped killing people. Ollie lied, Tommy died. Merlyn was right.
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Nov 21, 2014 04:21
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limeincoke posted:A few? Well more like hundreds. And no - it's not. Killing hundreds of people who, for all we know, are just independent contractors working a security mission and aren't bad guys at all, is not worth possibly saving lives. Especially when, like a poster before said, he gets to the big bad guy and decides to let him live. Also especially when news networks don't lead off with "Vigilante murders 25 people in downtown warehouse." But do we know they're "independent security contractors"? Maybe they're just as corrupt as the people they're serving. I don't think it's as cut-and-dry as you're making it out to be. I'm not saying, of course, that this justifies slaughtering them all and leaving the upper class guy alive, just that I'm not sure we as viewers are meant to think those people defending Bad Guy One-Percenter are perfectly innocent.
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Nov 21, 2014 04:28
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I won't link it, but the synopsis for episode 9 just hit the web, and it seems that the main story is going to pick up again, heading back in the direction of Sara's death and the LoA stuff. Maybe these first few episodes were just filler for the crossover and then they were going to pick up the pace after it.
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Nov 21, 2014 04:41
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Wasn't Ollie's bodycount in S1 some number in the 20s? I seem to recall them mentioning 26 at some point. Throughout a healthy chunk of the season (I'd say most, honestly) he mostly shot dudes in the shoulder.
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Nov 21, 2014 05:24
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King of Solomon posted:Wasn't Ollie's bodycount in S1 some number in the 20s? I seem to recall them mentioning 26 at some point. Throughout a healthy chunk of the season (I'd say most, honestly) he mostly shot dudes in the shoulder. Yes, it was said he killed 26 people late in the season. So it's not 'hundreds', maybe the very low dozens at most.
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Nov 21, 2014 05:45
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At least a few of those were self defense. How many people did he murder by Florida law?
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Nov 21, 2014 05:54
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greatn posted:At least a few of those were self defense. I don't recall him killing any black bodyguards.
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Nov 21, 2014 06:04
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This show is very much obsessed with its own history; its own of my favorite things about the creative team. So I have to assume that someone is going to throw Oliver's murdering back in his face. But it hasn't happened yet, and I'm wondering if it ever will. A perfect time would've been Oliver comforting Roy a few episodes ago. Oliver: It wasn't you. It was the mirakuru. Roy: But it was me. My anger. My hands. Oliver: And my hands killed a lot of people when I got back from the island. No serum. And I'll carry that with me for a long time. *Oliver puts a hand on Roy's shoulder Oliver: Roy, there's redemption for all of us. *End Scene*
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Nov 21, 2014 07:03
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Narcissus1916 posted:Oliver: It wasn't you. It was the mirakuru. "If you believe hard enough, Roy, and you really REALLY mean it, God will forgive you. He totally forgave me."
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Nov 21, 2014 07:18
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They're waiting to cover all of this until season 4 when they introduce The Spectre.
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Nov 21, 2014 08:18
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It's still so weird to see this Thea plotline when she voiced Artemis in Young Justice.
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Nov 21, 2014 10:45
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I actually wrote a half-finished Arrow spec script after the first season was over, and it was a pretty kickass writing exercise. The show is so wonderfully structured and gives plenty of opportunity for banter, but you also HAVE to have those "I'm explaining things i've already explained to you" bad writing dialogue bits that are also part of the show. Also, nice shoutout to Young Justice. I never got around to the second season, though I heard great things.
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Nov 21, 2014 11:02
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ufarn posted:It's still so weird to see this Thea plotline when she voiced Artemis in Young Justice. Wait, really? That's kind of rad. Maybe we'll get more YJ actors on the show in the future just like we're getting a Spartacus round-up 
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Nov 21, 2014 11:21
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Narcissus1916 posted:I actually wrote a half-finished Arrow spec script after the first season was over, and it was a pretty kickass writing exercise. The show is so wonderfully structured and gives plenty of opportunity for banter, but you also HAVE to have those "I'm explaining things i've already explained to you" bad writing dialogue bits that are also part of the show. Post the script.
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Nov 21, 2014 11:33
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Pththya-lyi posted:The Episode Where Katana Showed Up and Nobody Cared (Except Me) Not true - I'm loving the Japan/Katana stuff.
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Nov 21, 2014 11:54
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Good to see Roy being addressed as Arsenal, but he's getting sidelined over everything else. Even the fern got more screen time this episode.
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Nov 21, 2014 13:18
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ufarn posted:It's still so weird to see this Thea plotline when she voiced Artemis in Young Justice. No she didn't
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Nov 21, 2014 13:24
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spookygonk posted:Good to see Roy being addressed as Arsenal, but he's getting sidelined over everything else. Even the fern got more screen time this episode. I will say, Arrow is not handling it's roster glut poorly compared to last season. Also, I want more Dig kicking rear end.
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Nov 21, 2014 13:27
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Ollie is totally gonna gently caress that guy's wife, right?
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Nov 21, 2014 13:33
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spookygonk posted:Good to see Roy being addressed as Arsenal, but he's getting sidelined over everything else. Even the fern got more screen time this episode. The only mistake they made with Roy in this episode was not showing him doing some more flips.
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Nov 21, 2014 13:36
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DJ and Roy should duel over Thea. DJ keeps pressing buttons to play cliche popular dance songs, causing Roy to stumble, but Roy keeps doing sweet rear end flips and the DJ is all like "Whoa!"
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Nov 21, 2014 13:43
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cross fading skills of the DJ vs Roy's silly parkour
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Nov 21, 2014 14:35
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Well he certainly won't be mixing, he's a house DJ
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Nov 21, 2014 14:54
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greatn posted:Ollie is totally gonna gently caress that guy's wife, right? My wife said Ollie it totally going to gently caress Katana, she also felt back that Felicity just can't get laid. Also after reading the AV Club article about that was pretty much about Felicity, I realized that she has caught CWistis and is now kind of in a love quadrangle.
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Nov 21, 2014 16:20
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greatn posted:Ollie is totally gonna gently caress that guy's wife, right? He is Ollie, so yes.
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Nov 21, 2014 16:24
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Dead Snoopy posted:Not true - I'm loving the Japan/Katana stuff. It's China.
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Nov 21, 2014 16:31
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Rhyno posted:It's China. Hong Kong! 
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Nov 21, 2014 16:51
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nutranurse posted:Hong Kong! Uh-huh, and what country is Hong Kong in?
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Nov 21, 2014 16:54
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Rhyno posted:Uh-huh, and what country is Hong Kong in? Hong Kong is historically its own administrative region/virtually independent. Calling it another part of China would be... well, wrong.
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Nov 21, 2014 17:01
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nutranurse posted:Hong Kong is historically its own administrative region/virtually independent. Calling it another part of China would be... well, wrong. What language do they speak there? What nationality of people live there?
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Nov 21, 2014 17:04
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Rhyno posted:What language do they speak there? What nationality of people live there? English.
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Nov 21, 2014 17:07
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Hong Kong is not "virtually independent", as evinced by the political controversy you might have seen on the news recently; it would be accurate to say that it is a part of China. It may have special laws until 2046 but they only go so far
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Nov 21, 2014 17:14
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CharlieFoxtrot posted:Hong Kong is not "virtually independent", as evinced by the political controversy you might have seen on the news recently; it would be accurate to say that it is a part of China. It may have special laws until 2046 but they only go so far nutranurse posted:Hong Kong is historically its own administrative region/virtually independent. Calling it another part of China would be... well, wrong. Part of the reason Hong Kong's gripped by protests is because, historically, they enjoyed a fuckton of freedoms that mainland Chinese polities didn't.
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Nov 21, 2014 17:16
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| # ? Jun 1, 2024 06:38 |
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Okay that episode was great. Bit of a filler one, but this show does filler pretty well. Plus it always chucks in a few extra hooks. I like that boomerang guy. And I guess watching this episode right after the 4th of Flash threw me off a bit. Barry needs to get his salmon ladder on. I really need some kind of timeline guide thing or I will be so confused. Especially when the full-on crossover episodes start happening. Also Ray is really growing on me. He came off a total jerk his first few scenes but he seems to be a genuinely good guy. If he turns out to be a baddy I will be cross with him.
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Nov 21, 2014 17:26
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