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Francisco pissed. What made Eightfold so important?
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Nov 28, 2014 07:44
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I think it may be more 'Isabel screwed up, her grandfather expects perfection'. He seems to chew her out pretty easily, probably out of concern. More unexpected to me is seeing Ed cut and run. Understandably I guess, he doesn't seem like someone who stands up to anger very easily, certainly not anger that can't be joked out of. But watching him walk in there holding her hand, and then flee... geez.
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Nov 28, 2014 07:57
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You sent her into an unexpected combat situation, she didn't just throw it away. gently caress you, Grandad.
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Nov 28, 2014 07:59
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Rotten Cookies posted:What made Eightfold so important? Cause she could eat books and know what was written in them, which serves the duel purpose of translating languages you can't read and destroying books you don't want others to read. Oh, and possibly even translating ciphers? ...wait, does she do translation? I'm just kinda assuming she does cause that's the first useful thing that popped into my head, but if she can't do that then 
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Nov 28, 2014 08:01
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Rotten Cookies posted:Francisco pissed. Did you not see how adorable she was?
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Nov 28, 2014 08:05
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I'm going to guess Isabel's grandpa could give her a discarded banana peel and if she came back without it he'd be angry with her just on principle. This isn't the first time we've seen Ed be something other than pure comic relief, considering his occasional insightful statements masked as goofing around, but this might be the first time he's been forced to drop the act and run like this. Isabel's a very isolated girl, even friends who want to be there for her like Ed and Eightfold can't be, and Spender is no help at all (as usual). I wonder what Max and Isaac make of Grandpa, or would if they met him? Isaac is too anime not to respect a grumpy old martial arts master, but Max's job is taking the piss out of all the Spectral stuff so he might be a little more equipped to shrug him off.
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Nov 28, 2014 08:40
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isabel about to non-sassingly call out her grandpa on his poo poo in 3, 2, 1... 
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Nov 28, 2014 09:19
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I mean, she did "lose" something incredibly valuable -- whether you consider Eightfold as a friend and ally, or just the book as a tool. If she had just absentmindedly left it somewhere, that'd be pretty dang dumb and irresponsible. Gramps just isn't gonna bother to listen to find out the incredible circumstances under which it was lost. Ed: lovable goofball, can't handle actual conflict or personal stuff. Unfortunate that he's all Isabel has for emotional support at the moment.
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Nov 28, 2014 10:58
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Ditocoaf posted:Ed: lovable goofball, can't handle actual conflict or personal stuff. Unfortunate that he's all Isabel has for emotional support at the moment. Or perhaps he feels unable to risk angering the man who gives him a place to live, be it justified or not.
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Nov 28, 2014 11:18
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http://firstnamezacklastnamemorrison.tumblr.com/post/103691452818/alt-text-canon
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Nov 28, 2014 12:27
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MikeJF posted:Or perhaps he feels unable to risk angering the man who gives him a place to live, be it justified or not. he's a kid, ditching your sibling when a parental figure starts chewing them out is the norm
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Nov 28, 2014 12:29
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Francisco is to Isabel as Lucifer is to Spender, in a way. Except while I think Lucifer's pretty neat, if unpleasant, I dislike Francisco more and more each time he shows up. He's kind of an unrepentant, hypocritical rear end in a top hat and his treatment of Isabel is downright abusive at times. It's no wonder she has problems, living with him.
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Nov 28, 2014 13:04
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Maybe it was the book itself that was important, not the disposable spirit.
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Nov 28, 2014 16:28
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Roland Jones posted:Francisco is to Isabel as Lucifer is to Spender, in a way. Except while I think Lucifer's pretty neat, if unpleasant, I dislike Francisco more and more each time he shows up. He's kind of an unrepentant, hypocritical rear end in a top hat and his treatment of Isabel is downright abusive at times. It's no wonder she has problems, living with him. Uh...he's just a demanding parent.
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Nov 28, 2014 17:32
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Hypocrisy posted:Uh...he's just a demanding parent. Depending on the extent to which that is taken, that can constitute abuse yes.
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Nov 28, 2014 17:36
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Man, the only way this mission could have gone any worse is if someone really did die. Everyone in the group is either angry or distrustful of the others now. Like, Ed and Isaac are probably the only ones who bonded in a positive way and that happened offscreen!
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Nov 28, 2014 19:25
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The kids need to throw Spender under a bus because he really hosed this up.
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Nov 28, 2014 19:37
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I love how absolutely nobody is interested in hearing about Isabel's heartfelt, traumatic experience. Hell, her gramps could probably figure out a way to get Eightfold back if he cared about it.
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Nov 28, 2014 19:40
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Rhonne posted:Man, the only way this mission could have gone any worse is if someone really did die. Everyone in the group is either angry or distrustful of the others now. Like, Ed and Isaac are probably the only ones who bonded in a positive way and that happened offscreen! Max and Isabel seemed to be doing a little better by the end and Boss Leader seems to like Max well enough even if Max doesn't trust her, although yeah otherwise everyone is mad with everyone else. You'd think Spender would want to tell Grandpa the train's out of commission, since his business is training Consortium agents and now the agents living at his place can't leave. Maybe he expect Isabel to, although she probably won't get a word in edge-wise for a while. I'm expecting we're about to cut away here and Isabel's just going to endure the lecture and go to bed.
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Nov 28, 2014 22:47
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Hypocrisy posted:Uh...he's just a demanding parent. He had one of his students manifest a fire-ghost clone of his daughter's worst fear to publicly humiliate her in a sparring match. Guy's a prick.
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Nov 28, 2014 22:49
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Oxxidation posted:He had one of his students manifest a fire-ghost clone of his daughter's worst fear to publicly humiliate her in a sparring match. Guy's a prick. Yeah, to force his granddaughter to get over said fear and be a better person. Yeah it's rough, but it's to help her be better.
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Nov 29, 2014 02:51
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Also this operates on cartoonime logic where brutally strict tutors are usually for the best in the long run.
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Nov 29, 2014 03:26
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It still won't be any less satisfying if/when Max sasses him so hard he has to retreat in shame
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Nov 29, 2014 08:22
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I wouldn't mind seeing the text of the lecture just to make sure that what he's saying isn't all bullshit.
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Nov 29, 2014 10:24
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ZenMasterBullshit posted:Yeah, to force his granddaughter to get over said fear and be a better person. Yeah it's rough, but it's to help her be better. That might be his logic behind scaring her with dog imagery, but it's hard to say it's coming from a place of genuine care and concern, considering he's said things like "how could someone as perfect as me give rise to someone so imperfect?" Wanting people to face their fears is one thing, and there are therapies based on it, but ambushing a little girl with them (in the middle of a sparring match) isn't therapy. It's not like she needs to get over this in a hurry so she can return to the battlefield, she's a child. Basically I don't buy that Grandpa actually has a heart and cares for Isabel at all, at least not until the narrative drops a hint. She seems more like another tool to him, which dovetails with his attitude toward spirits.
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Nov 29, 2014 11:21
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I like that the comic forces the reader to confront the fact that comically assholish characters are, in the end, assholes.
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Nov 29, 2014 12:13
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I'm more sympathetic to Spender than Grandpa in the end. Spender has, by all indications, been way in over his head since he was 12 trying to protect this town from something big. All the while having one real, physical perfectionist rear end in a top hat as a teacher in the real world and a spiritual perfectionist rear end in a top hat in his head. Dude is just plain not cut out for this but he's trying. What the hell is Grandpa doing? Sitting around being a narcissist that verbally abuses and holds little girls to unrealistic standards, apparently.
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Nov 29, 2014 16:18
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Spender is a core character so he gets a lot of panel-time in which to show his subjective point of view, his shortcomings, and the challenges he faces. Grandpa is a side-character who only pops in to be a stern rear end in a top hat caricature of a sensei.
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Nov 29, 2014 17:39
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Cat Mattress posted:Spender is a core character so he gets a lot of panel-time in which to show his subjective point of view, his shortcomings, and the challenges he faces. Grandpa is a side-character who only pops in to be a stern rear end in a top hat caricature of a sensei. And yet I can't really imagine insight that'd paint this in a good light.
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Nov 29, 2014 17:47
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If he was at all reasonable he'd at least find out the circumstances that led to her losing the book before yelling at her about it.
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Nov 29, 2014 18:13
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Fecha posted:If he was at all reasonable he'd at least find out the circumstances that led to her losing the book before yelling at her about it. He'd still be yelling at her for lowering her guard in a fight/not crushing her opponent quickly enough. As a child prodigy and heir to the dojo it's really not possible for her to ever be good enough. It's also possible that something about Spender's training and subsequent descent into anime anti-hero-dom is affecting his behaviour here; maybe he feels like he was too soft on his previous star pupil and doesn't want to see his granddaughter tread the same dorky path?
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Nov 29, 2014 18:25
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We haven't seen much of Isabel's parents, so it's possible Francisco's concerned about her ending up a "failure" like them, rather than Spender.
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Nov 29, 2014 20:01
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That's not doing much to legitimise his behaviour none.
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Nov 29, 2014 22:57
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Yeah like a character can have a motivation, even one that is touching and real, and still do unjustifiable things. At best Grandpa is going to evoke pity from us for a tortured past or something, but he's still the dude who borderline/"borderline" abuses his granddaughter. But also the thing someone said about that being an objective Good Thing For The Student/Child in this sort of fiction so whatever.
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Nov 30, 2014 02:25
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Dolash posted:We haven't seen much of Isabel's parents, so it's possible Francisco's concerned about her ending up a "failure" like them, rather than Spender. It's definitely this, neither Grandpa nor Isabel had good words about her father.
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Nov 30, 2014 06:31
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Countblanc posted:But also the thing someone said about that being an objective Good Thing For The Student/Child in this sort of fiction so whatever. Blackheart posted:Also this operates on cartoonime logic where brutally strict tutors are usually for the best in the long run. Literally every time anime tropes and cliches show up it's as a joke or to make a character look like a huge dork. Just looking at this single page says that of all possible ones to play completely straight, this particular one won't be it. If it even comes up at all I expect "Wow grandpa being an rear end in a top hat has really helped Isabel in the long run!" to have it's legs immediately cut out from under it with "Wait just kidding it actually just made her miserable and have emotional issues that make everything worse and accomplish the exact opposite of whatever Gramps wanted to accomplish with his bullshit."
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Nov 30, 2014 21:19
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Whitenoise Poster posted:Literally every time anime tropes and cliches show up it's as a joke or to make a character look like a huge dork. This isn't even remotely accurate.
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Nov 30, 2014 23:22
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Prison Warden posted:This isn't even remotely accurate. Counterpoint - Isaac, and all things about Isaac. Although I guess you're right that the comic is still written on broadly anime-ish lines, since it stars superpowered kids and has a lot of martial arts stuff going on. The comic pokes fun at these things, but still obeys them. Still yeah I don't think Zach's the kind of writer to turn around and make Grandpa's horrible treatment of Isabel justified in the long run, though he might realize he's been too hard on her at some point.
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Nov 30, 2014 23:37
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Geez guys I think Master Roshi was abusing the kids with all that harsh training. (this one is probably actually true)
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Dec 1, 2014 01:22
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Blackheart posted:Geez guys I think Master Roshi was abusing the kids with all that harsh training. (this one is probably actually true) The bit where he teaches Goku and Krillin language via reading porno magazines is probably not strictly kosher.
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Dec 1, 2014 01:30
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