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Hate to double-post, but it's been 4 days so whatevs. I'm wondering, are there any rules for detecting gunfire, etc, anywhere in the books? I know the Silencer says it gives a -30 and halves the range where it can be picked up, but I cannot find those ranges, etc anywhere and I suspect they might be off with the Tau Starting Wounds.
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Nov 30, 2014 18:58
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| # ? May 31, 2024 23:40 |
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I think the actual values only appeared in the Dark Heresy 2 core book, before it was kinda up to the GM. And even the ones in DH 2 are a bit retarded.
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Nov 30, 2014 19:04
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Shame, guess I'll have to write my own. Ah well.
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Nov 30, 2014 19:07
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DH2 pegs a lasgun crack being audible up to 500 meters, autogun fire to 1 km and a bolter detonation to 2 km. A silenced autopistol is 50 meters. I assume this is in the absence of other noise. A silenced autopistol is not be terribly quiet, but it might be difficult to pick up in the loud environment of a busy hive.
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Nov 30, 2014 19:23
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What's most important for me is not so much picking up the noise as being able to identify its location. I'm doing something about resistance fighters and trying to leave open defeating enemy forces in detail by attacking individual squads/patrols without alerting a whole platoon or getting zeroed in instantly.
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Nov 30, 2014 19:25
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Perception rolls modified by distance and possibly stuff like large buildings in the way, followed by the forces converging on the rough position of the noise?
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Nov 30, 2014 19:38
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Yeah, think that's what I'll go with. As well as modifiers for stuff like loud machinery, other combat, etc.
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Nov 30, 2014 19:44
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Elukka posted:DH2 pegs a lasgun crack being audible up to 500 meters, autogun fire to 1 km and a bolter detonation to 2 km. A silenced autopistol is 50 meters. Wait, does this mean a non-silenced autopistol is only audible up to 100 meters away? drat.
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Nov 30, 2014 20:21
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scalded schlong posted:Wait, does this mean a non-silenced autopistol is only audible up to 100 meters away? drat. Firearm noise ranges, much like firearm ranges themselves, have been subject to extreme shrinkage over the last 40,000 years.
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Nov 30, 2014 20:36
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GW are hilariously ignorant about guns. I'd say either sperg out and make all your own rules or just assume future silencers are advanced enough to work like in movies.
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Nov 30, 2014 20:37
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The ranges seem fairly reasonable to me. 100 meters is the base range for a rifle, which makes 200 meters 'long' range, and it's possible to hit your target all the way to 400 meters. Four times the listed range is the actual maximum.
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Nov 30, 2014 20:52
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All the weapon ranges and such are gamified as it is. Relative to movement, they're all enormous compared to how they worked in WHFRP, which the whole system is based on. Worse, because movement is done in 1m increments, it's really hard to produce a grid map that has enough room for weapons to hit their long ranges, let alone extremes.
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Nov 30, 2014 21:27
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Yeah. They're fairly realistic as-is, but ideally they'd be shorter than that. Use the realistic ranges for narrative purposes and have a lower grid unit number for detailed combat.
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Nov 30, 2014 21:53
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Actually, if they were realistic, they'd have fairly short ranges before suffering penalties and then enormous long ranges. The thing is, a game where your rifle can potentially hit people at 1000-2000m but everyone moves about 18-36m a turn just doesn't work well.
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Nov 30, 2014 22:55
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You won't be able to pinpoint a source on a las weapon. What you'll hear is basically a thunderclap as air rushes back in to fill the volume evacuated by the passage of the laser beam. You can tell, mostly, where a shot is fired in a general sense.
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Nov 30, 2014 23:04
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Las weapons are easier to trace by sight though, since flash suppressors wouldn't work great on a weapon that's all light. And it's in the visible spectrum, for whatever reason.
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Dec 1, 2014 00:13
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Pharmaskittle posted:Las weapons are easier to trace by sight though, since flash suppressors wouldn't work great on a weapon that's all light. And it's in the visible spectrum, for whatever reason. Because we need to have flashy laser battles, goddamnit.
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Dec 1, 2014 00:16
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VanSandman posted:What you'll hear is basically a thunderclap as air rushes back in to fill the volume evacuated by the passage of the laser beam. Uh, what? That's not how lasers work. You'd hear a loud crack from the capacitor discharge at the lasgun end akin to someone dropping a book on the floor, and you'd hear either armor spalling or flesh vaporizing in a steam explosion at the target site. If you're ionizing enough atmosphere with photons to make a visible beam you're massively wasting energy that could be better used with a spectrum that won't be absorbed by nitrogen and oxygen, let alone making such a big plasma trail that there's any significant sound. This does not apply to Laser Destroyers, Turbo-Lasers and above because there would actually be enough energy bleed, particularly in the case of a Volcano Cannon. A lascannon might qualify but probably the ionization would still be minimal compared to the capacitor crack and the sound of that carnifex's chest cavity turning to a cloud of steam, smoke, and a lot of gibs, even though you're going to hear it three seconds later at 'safe' engagement ranges.
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Dec 1, 2014 00:21
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Sour Blossom posted:Uh, what? That's not how lasers work. You'd hear a loud crack from the capacitor discharge at the lasgun end akin to someone dropping a book on the floor, and you'd hear either armor spalling or flesh vaporizing in a steam explosion at the target site. If you're ionizing enough atmosphere with photons to make a visible beam you're massively wasting energy that could be better used with a spectrum that won't be absorbed by nitrogen and oxygen, let alone making such a big plasma trail that there's any significant sound. All valid points, but visible laser beams make for neater and more dramatic-looking battles, so visible laser beams are the order of the day for lasweapons in 40k.
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Dec 1, 2014 00:26
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This is the setting with CHAINSAW SWORDS. Lasers are visible because it's cool, no other reason.
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Dec 1, 2014 00:41
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Sour Blossom posted:Uh, what? That's not how lasers work. You'd hear a loud crack from the capacitor discharge at the lasgun end akin to someone dropping a book on the floor, and you'd hear either armor spalling or flesh vaporizing in a steam explosion at the target site. If you're ionizing enough atmosphere with photons to make a visible beam you're massively wasting energy that could be better used with a spectrum that won't be absorbed by nitrogen and oxygen, let alone making such a big plasma trail that there's any significant sound. 40k las weapons have been commonly identified as being more like a lightning gun than a laser.
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Dec 1, 2014 00:56
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kingcom posted:40k las weapons have been commonly identified as being more like a lightning gun than a laser. On the other hand, your game your rules. If you want to play a game of Dark Heresy where lasers work "realistically," go nuts. No one here is going to stop you.
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Dec 1, 2014 01:00
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It's worth noting that they do have in setting ways of "stealthing" las weapons since sniper lasers are described as using them and in the RPG at least you can slap silencers on las weapons without any problems.
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Dec 1, 2014 01:02
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Cythereal posted:On the other hand, your game your rules. If you want to play a game of Dark Heresy where lasers work "realistically," go nuts. No one here is going to stop you. I've always loved the in universe reason of 'the only people who know the ins and out of this stuff are heretics and extremely high up magos so essentially if you want a silenced las you need to pray real hard and maybe it happens.'
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Dec 1, 2014 01:15
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kingcom posted:I've always loved the in universe reason of 'the only people who know the ins and out of this stuff are heretics and extremely high up magos so essentially if you want a silenced las you need to pray real hard and maybe it happens.' Alternatively, my go-to answer to one of my players asking that would be "Lasguns manufactured on worlds A, B, and C all have visible laser beams. Lasguns manufactured on worlds D, E, and F do not. Lasguns manufactured on G shoot discrete bolts rather than beams. They all weigh about the same, have about the same dimensions, use the same ammunition, and have about the same performance, so they're all lasguns as far as the Imperium is concerned."
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Dec 1, 2014 01:21
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Cythereal posted:Alternatively, my go-to answer to one of my players asking that would be "Lasguns manufactured on worlds A, B, and C all have visible laser beams. Lasguns manufactured on worlds D, E, and F do not. Lasguns manufactured on G shoot discrete bolts rather than beams. They all weigh about the same, have about the same dimensions, use the same ammunition, and have about the same performance, so they're all lasguns as far as the Imperium is concerned." Yeah thats a good one too. Standard issue imperial weapons being from all over the universe gives you a lot of possibilities.
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Dec 1, 2014 01:31
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Lasgun shots are visible because the Omnissiah wants the glory of his work to be plain for all to see 
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Dec 1, 2014 03:59
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Now I have a mental image of a Tech-priest driven to madness by the very thought of coherent light lasguns. A decade later an unknown heretek leads a black crusade against every forge world in the sector.
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Dec 1, 2014 04:28
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Horrible Lurkbeast posted:Now I have a mental image of a Tech-priest driven to madness by the very thought of coherent light lasguns. This is un-ironically how hereteks come to be. They start trying to figure this stuff out and actually understand the technology and it drives them to heresy.
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Dec 1, 2014 04:45
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kingcom posted:This is un-ironically how hereteks come to be. They start trying to figure this stuff out and actually understand the technology and it drives them to heresy. Innovation is literally tech heresy
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Dec 1, 2014 05:02
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I can accept fantastic things because I have no frame of reference in reality to judge. Portraying something real with fake characteristics is either lazy writing or it's bad writing. Whether or not las weapons have visible beams or not has nothing to do with what I said - it's the invention of characteristics or misapplication of others'. By their post, VanSandman doesn't seem to know a lasgun from a lightning bolt, and I was sperging about that. I take space-elfgames too seriously.
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Dec 1, 2014 05:08
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You don't know how the laws of physics will change in the next 38,000 years, so just accept it.
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Dec 1, 2014 08:46
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Holy poo poo I didn't know we had handheld dark age of technology hunting and sporting laser weaponry used as military hardware in real life! That's awesome!
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Dec 1, 2014 08:55
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uh they are pretty clearly lasguns, not laser-guns.
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Dec 1, 2014 09:51
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How do you pronounce "lasgun" anyway?
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Dec 1, 2014 10:06
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That's entirely true, for all the common guardsman know any gun which produce a beam of light is a 'lasgun'. Some of them can well be some kind of particle driver with the beam added as a tracer. ^^^^Lhaz-gun.
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Dec 1, 2014 10:10
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Lazz gun. Imagine how you say the first syllable in laser or lazy. Not that. Raspberry. Lasberry. Say it that way.
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Dec 1, 2014 10:32
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 Lightning without and with a laser beam guide. An electron beam would look similar.  Although this would not so much blow off limbs but cause immediate necrotic wounds. And also irradiate the shooter to a lesser extent. Pretty grimdark really.
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Dec 1, 2014 10:37
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Elukka posted:
They're called irrad-cleansers in 30k. 
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Dec 1, 2014 11:05
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| # ? May 31, 2024 23:40 |
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Cythereal posted:On the other hand, your game your rules. If you want to play a game of Dark Heresy where lasers work "realistically," go nuts. No one here is going to stop you. Which reminds me - what changes have you done to the 40k universe for your games? I've personally allowed female Space Marines (not like you'd be able to differentiate what the hell that posthuman monster in front of you is to begin with) and introduced some races from stuff like Endless Legend as really minor xenos species.
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Dec 1, 2014 14:02
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