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This is the kind of thing I don't like about this game. There's no rhyme or reason as to what changes between timelines beyond "whatever the game can use to berate the player for their choices." That's tacky game design. I mean, the game does enough things pretty well that this type of forced nonsense feels really out of place.
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Dec 3, 2014 01:30
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This game exists to troll Sigma at every turn.
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Dec 3, 2014 01:52
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Super Jay Mann posted:This game exists to troll the player at every turn.
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Dec 3, 2014 02:24
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xeose4 posted:This is the kind of thing I don't like about this game. There's no rhyme or reason as to what changes between timelines beyond "whatever the game can use to berate the player for their choices." That's tacky game design. Ah, yes, the Spec Ops: The Line philosophy of game writing: "You're a terrible person for buying/playing/liking this game!"
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Dec 3, 2014 03:01
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dotchan posted:Ah, yes, the Spec Ops: The Line philosophy of game writing: "You're a terrible person for buying/playing/liking this game!" Spec Ops: The Line had an actual point: it deliberately disguised itself as a mindless war-shooter clone and then berated you for liking those. There was a logic there that made perfect sense, though you could definitely argue about its execution. This game never pretends to be anything but what it is, it goes as far as to call itself "good people die" and presents a pretty morally gray situation throughout it. What's the point in changing things so that the player is always wrong?
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Dec 3, 2014 03:42
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xeose4 posted:
Probably because the AB game's structure means that being near-death or near-victory is much more narratively interesting for future story branches than a 0 point double betray tie in the first round would be.
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Dec 3, 2014 03:49
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xeose4 posted:Spec Ops: The Line had an actual point: it deliberately disguised itself as a mindless war-shooter clone and then berated you for liking those. There was a logic there that made perfect sense, though you could definitely argue about its execution. Because we're literally hopping into alternate universes. Not the same universe at a different choice. It's like in 999 except Sigma is Akane now. In fact WE the player have become Akane. In that we're only betraying Tenmyouji to see how far down his line we'll get, so we can find the bomb passwords. We have become detached from the pain and suffering of the characters and that in millions of other universes, they'll die. Just like Akane would casually let Junpei die when she had reached a dead end.
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Dec 3, 2014 03:51
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Onmi posted:Just like Akane would casually let Junpei die when she had reached a dead end. To be fair, she died first in two of those bad endings. And she was too far off to help in Knife.
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Dec 3, 2014 03:56
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Hobgoblin2099 posted:To be fair, she died first in two of those bad endings. And she was too far off to help in Knife. I don't mean present Akane, past-Akane did, Every time you get a bad end Past-Akane abandons preset-Junpei to his fate because "That wasn't the right choice."
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Dec 3, 2014 04:03
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The game has already addressed the oddity of the shifting Ally/Betray choices in this update where we Betrayed Alice in the first round after we pick Ally Alice previously before in the same round. It's been a while but I suggest it be reread if someone forgot about it.
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Dec 3, 2014 04:25
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lotus circle posted:The game has already addressed the oddity of the shifting Ally/Betray choices in this update where we Betrayed Alice in the first round after we pick Ally Alice previously before in the same round. It's been a while but I suggest it be reread if someone forgot about it. That doesn't actually answer anything though - I think Phi tries to explain it in one of Fedule's later updates, but it's pretty much just *handwave* the future can affect the past *mystical bullshit pretending to be science by using the word quantum*. It's not worth getting upset about on a story level because all time travel stories fail on some level, but I do dislike it on a game level because if it's your first redone branch, it robs the player of the joy of using their powers to change to the "right" answer, which is half the fun of being able to bring information between timelines anyway.
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Dec 3, 2014 05:18
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No need to get your panties in a bunch over this. We're not trying to win a game, we're reading a novel.
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Dec 3, 2014 07:37
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tiistai posted:No need to get your panties in a bunch over this. We're not trying to win a game, we're reading a novel. Nobody is getting upset here, dude makes a genuine point. The ally/betray choices have lost any tangible impact because we need to pick them to see the story. Which now has greater threats than the nonary game losing conditions. This is why I said it would be better if Sigma would slowly become more and more jaded with his choices as we open up branches. He's done this poo poo before so "No Sigma Whyyyyyyyy?" shouldn't elicit as much of a response from him.
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Dec 3, 2014 07:41
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Ehhhh. Sure, game. Par for the course, I guess.
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Dec 3, 2014 08:07
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Revenge of the quantum anime blue shell.
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Dec 3, 2014 08:25
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Aumanor posted:Ehhhh. Sure, game. Par for the course, I guess. It really is, if you stop to think about it. Cyan/Ally - Alice Betrays Cyan/Betray - Alice Allies Yellow/Ally - Tenmyoji Betrays Yellow/Betray - Tenmyoji Allies Magenta/Ally - Luna Allies Magenta/Betray - Luna Allies One of these things is not like the other. 
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Dec 3, 2014 21:59
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luna would never betray us
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Dec 3, 2014 22:00
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Cake Attack posted:luna would never betray us Huh, and since the game finally showed us that Dio is actually a traitorous lying pig, maybe we'll find out that Luna's actually nothing more than a sweet angel?.. Seems impossible but at least there's a glimmer of hope
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Dec 3, 2014 22:41
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Cake Attack posted:luna would never betray us 
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Dec 3, 2014 22:50
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W.T. Fits posted:It really is, if you stop to think about it. Clearly Luna is a robot, and thus not subject to the laws of morphogenesis. The other question is, are we going to Betray again to get out? We should be paired with Clover again, so it means she could get out as well.
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Dec 3, 2014 23:13
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Onmi posted:Because we're literally hopping into alternate universes. Not the same universe at a different choice. It's like in 999 except Sigma is Akane now. In fact WE the player have become Akane. In that we're only betraying Tenmyouji to see how far down his line we'll get, so we can find the bomb passwords. We have become detached from the pain and suffering of the characters and that in millions of other universes, they'll die. Just like Akane would casually let Junpei die when she had reached a dead end. Maybe that's the point.
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Dec 3, 2014 23:15
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I just had a completely random thought. We're obviously not on the moon, but things quite aren't right, we need a suit for outside and they seem way too heavy duty to be hazmat. What if they're actually on Mars? The Red Planet is desert-like , it has it's own moon (moons in fact), it's gravity is a little different but not too much so from Earth but the atmosphere doesn't make it safe to be outside of domes without such a heavy suit.
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Dec 4, 2014 06:15
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Robindaybird posted:I just had a completely random thought. I'm pretty sure this has been discussed before. There's the whole low-gravity issue, which would be very strange to bring up way at the tail-end of the game with no buildup. Phobos and Deimos look nothing like our moon, either. They're tiny specks in comparison; I'm not even sure you could see them in a lunar eclipse. The moon shown in-game is almost certainly Earth's.
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Dec 4, 2014 06:35
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Ramengank posted:I'm pretty sure this has been discussed before.
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Dec 4, 2014 07:59
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Actually it is colored red as what it is expected to look like, no one has any idea of it's actual color.
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Dec 4, 2014 08:34
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Waterguy posted:Actually it is colored red as what it is expected to look like, no one has any idea of it's actual color. Uh, what? We've literally landed robots on Mars, and they had cameras on them. Mars is red, dude.
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Dec 4, 2014 08:39
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Waterguy posted:Actually it is colored red as what it is expected to look like, no one has any idea of it's actual color. http://mars.jpl.nasa.gov/msl/multimedia/images/?ImageID=6097 Even the Viking lander had a color camera, Curiosity had pretty good ones.
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Dec 4, 2014 08:43
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So it's brown then?
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Dec 4, 2014 09:35
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Yeah, like... what? You can even see it's red with the naked eye if you have good eyesight, and any decent telescope will reveal it has a red cast to it.
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Dec 4, 2014 09:41
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But even if it is Mars, how it's that functionality different than the moon? Unless I missed something, the big point of the moon theory is the fact that it's not on earth, not that the specific spot on the moon matters
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Dec 4, 2014 12:10
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Actually the mars seems red for us because of the atmosphere, not because of the ground. The pictures and videos of mars, and actually most of the videos and pictures of space, are colored digitally with approximations of the expected colors. Ever seen a real pic of the sun? it's basically a white marble.
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Dec 4, 2014 13:35
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http://nssdc.gsfc.nasa.gov/planetary/marspath_images_2.html False color and color enhanced images are labeled as such. All the rest are actual color images.
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Dec 4, 2014 13:53
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This is the best derail. 
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Dec 4, 2014 13:55
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Sentient Data posted:But even if it is Mars, how it's that functionality different than the moon? Unless I missed something, the big point of the moon theory is the fact that it's not on earth, not that the specific spot on the moon matters The gravity's closer to Earth's so they wouldn't be bouncing around in their space suits in Dio End.
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Dec 4, 2014 15:18
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Poison Mushroom posted:This is the best derail. We can answer this with another flowchart: Have we seen Cyberdemons? If yes: then we're on Mars. If no: then we're not on Mars.
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Dec 4, 2014 19:09
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Alopex posted:The gravity's closer to Earth's so they wouldn't be bouncing around in their space suits in Dio End. and they would be less likely to notice anything is off - whereas the moon's much lighter gravity would be immediately obvious.
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Dec 4, 2014 19:24
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Mars gravity is still only a third of Earth's. It's closer to moon gravity than it is to Earth gravity. Now Venus on the other hand...
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Dec 4, 2014 19:58
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andipossess posted:Mars gravity is still only a third of Earth's. It's closer to moon gravity than it is to Earth gravity. Yeah, they'd never figure out that they were on Venus. Until they went outside...
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Dec 4, 2014 20:30
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Robindaybird posted:I just had a completely random thought. This was my pet theory, the first time I played the game, after I saw the Dio ending.
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Dec 4, 2014 21:32
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I really love that amidst all these crazy theories about just which celestial body the game is set on, no one seems willing to take the game at face value and just go with Earth.
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Dec 4, 2014 21:41
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