Canada Housing/Debt: Trust me, I'm a landlord.

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > Canada Housing/Debt: Trust me, I'm a landlord.

namaste friends: Sep 18, 2004; by Smythe

http://www.cbc.ca/news/business/equifax-debt-report-says-canadians-now-owe-1-5-trillion-outside-mortgages-1.2858643

quote:

Canadians continue to pile on debt and now collectively owe more than $1.5 trillion excluding mortgages, according to the latest figures from Equifax Canada.

The consumer credit rating agency says the level at the end of the third quarter was up 7.4 per cent from $1.409 trillion a year ago, with non-mortgage debt held by Canadians now standing at an average of $20,891.

The auto loan and instalment loan sectors showed the most significant increases, at 6.8 and 5.8 per cent year-over-year respectively.

More debt to come

"Following a frenzied start to the festive shopping season with more to come in the countdown to Christmas, we can expect the consumer debt to rise even further," said Regina Malina, senior director of decision insights at Equifax Canada.

haha gently caress every canadian

# ? Dec 3, 2014 15:20

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# ? May 10, 2024 00:36

Postess with the Mostest: Apr 4, 2007; Arabian nights
'neath Arabian moons
A fool off his guard
could fall and fall hard
out there on the dunes

Cultural Imperial posted:

http://www.cbc.ca/news/business/equifax-debt-report-says-canadians-now-owe-1-5-trillion-outside-mortgages-1.2858643

haha gently caress every canadian

That's some loving lazy reading comprehension by the CBC there. $1.5t / $21,000 would be 70 million Canadians. If they'd read the report, it'd be pretty obvious that of the $1,500b debt, $985b of it is in mortgages. The Globe and The Star got it right.

The Globe posted:

The $1.5-trillion third-quarter debt level � which includes residential mortgages � is up 4.5 per cent from $1.45-trillion in the second quarter and 7.4 per cent from $1.41-trillion in the year-earlier period, according to Equifax.

$21,000 over 25m people isn't that bad considering that only $3,200 of it is credit card debt, the rest is relatively low interest car and bank loans. Burn the CBC to the ground.

# ? Dec 3, 2014 16:02

namaste friends: Sep 18, 2004; by Smythe

Ikantski posted:

$21,000 over 25m people isn't that bad considering that only $3,200 of it is credit card debt, the rest is relatively low interest car and bank loans.

Ahhhhh yesss....the old 'you just need vision' excuse to borrowing more money. Who cares how much household debt you have if monthly payments are low? Every household is now just like a sovereign country. If your income starts decreasing just print mmore mon

# ? Dec 3, 2014 16:09

Baronjutter: Dec 31, 2007; "Tiny Trains"

Does anyone else find it ironic that conservatives keep wanting to cut poo poo (even poo poo proven to more than pay for its self) and treat any public debt as the most dangerous thing in the world even if spent on critical infrastructure and constantly compare public debt to a family budget, while at the same time actual canadian families are up to their eyeballs in debt and blowing it all on horrible investments like cars and houses and that's just vision?

# ? Dec 3, 2014 16:19

triplexpac: Mar 24, 2007; Suck it
Two tears in a bucket
And then another thing
I'm not the one they'll try their luck with
Hit hard like brass knuckles
See your face through the turnbuckle dude
I got no love for you

Baronjutter posted:

Does anyone else find it ironic that conservatives keep wanting to cut poo poo (even poo poo proven to more than pay for its self) and treat any public debt as the most dangerous thing in the world even if spent on critical infrastructure and constantly compare public debt to a family budget, while at the same time actual canadian families are up to their eyeballs in debt and blowing it all on horrible investments like cars and houses and that's just vision?

Yeah but the difference is gently caress poor people, haven't we been over this?

# ? Dec 3, 2014 16:22

Postess with the Mostest: Apr 4, 2007; Arabian nights
'neath Arabian moons
A fool off his guard
could fall and fall hard
out there on the dunes

Cultural Imperial posted:

Ahhhhh yesss....the old 'you just need vision' excuse to borrowing more money. Who cares how much household debt you have if monthly payments are low? Every household is now just like a sovereign country. If your income starts decreasing just print mmore mon

That's not what I'm saying. More that you shouldn't trust a news source that has an arts and entertainment reporter either bungling basic financial articles or deliberately pandering to the "loving stupid people richer than me, they're gonna get what's coming" demographic.

# ? Dec 3, 2014 16:33

Rime: Nov 2, 2011; by Games Forum

It might be worth renaming this to the Canadian Debt Bubble thread (but please keep Uncle Wongs Cabin) since it's becoming clear that we're hosed beyond just houses.

# ? Dec 3, 2014 17:27

Rutibex: Sep 9, 2001; by Fluffdaddy

Rime posted:

It might be worth renaming this to the Canadian Debt Bubble thread (but please keep Uncle Wongs Cabin) since it's becoming clear that we're hosed beyond just houses.

Canada has become an Aero Bar, apparently solid on the outside but when you bite into it there is nothing inside.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XQhsHmXDd9M

# ? Dec 3, 2014 20:00

Dr. Witherbone: Nov 1, 2010; CHEESE LOOKS ON IN
DESPAIR BUT ALSO WITH
AN ERECTION

peter banana posted:

yeah it's been a long time since "fiscal conservatism" has had anything to do with sensibly cutting public spending. 9 years of Harper and we're solidly in "gently caress poors" territory with the national consciousness to match.

That's senselessly pessimistic. If you want to be sensibly pessimistic, consider that none of the major parties will address the fact that a majority of Canadians are in favour of additional taxation and increasing funding to public services.

Or maybe they believe in full communism! You never have ANY idea what Canadians want with good old Canadian polling! :negative:

# ? Dec 3, 2014 20:22

Baudin: Dec 31, 2009

Baronjutter posted:

Does anyone else find it ironic that conservatives keep wanting to cut poo poo (even poo poo proven to more than pay for its self) and treat any public debt as the most dangerous thing in the world even if spent on critical infrastructure and constantly compare public debt to a family budget, while at the same time actual canadian families are up to their eyeballs in debt and blowing it all on horrible investments like cars and houses and that's just vision?

I find most of the things the federal government does highly ironic, since I tend to lean conservative on some of these issues. Then again I'm rabidly liberal on social stuff, so they've kind of lost me there anyway.

e: having worked in the oil patch up north during university (summer breaks mostly) and currently at work in the commercial real estate industry in Edmonton this thread is entertaining, on point and depressingly. Generally not at the same time. In particular anyone claiming that land near the oil sands is good for food production has never driven the area, nor farmed.

Baudin fucked around with this message at 20:59 on Dec 3, 2014

# ? Dec 3, 2014 20:43

Rime: Nov 2, 2011; by Games Forum

Baudin posted:

In particular anyone claiming that land near the oil sands is good for food production has never driven the area, nor farmed.

There's a reason that Alberta was known for beef and not bumper crops of grain and veggies.

# ? Dec 3, 2014 21:18

namaste friends: Sep 18, 2004; by Smythe

https://twitter.com/M_C_Klein/status/540228891978502144/photo/1

# ? Dec 3, 2014 21:20

Baudin: Dec 31, 2009

Rime posted:

There's a reason that Alberta was known for beef and not bumper crops of grain and veggies.

That's too bad, it should be - Alberta produces the second largest amount of grains (30%) in Canada after Saskatchewan(45%)(source:Agri-Food Canada). North Alberta is not ideal production lands for anything - you don't see large agricultural centres in northern Alberta for good reasons including poor soil and shorter growing season.

e: Alberta actually did well on production more recently, but then again so did Saskatchewan Alberta production, including 2014 projections

Baudin fucked around with this message at 21:32 on Dec 3, 2014

# ? Dec 3, 2014 21:29

namaste friends: Sep 18, 2004; by Smythe

http://www.reddit.com/r/vancouver/comments/2o764j/will_startups_in_the_downtown_eastside_become/

# ? Dec 4, 2014 04:51

JawKnee: Mar 24, 2007; You'll take the ride to leave this town along that yellow line

gently caress reddit and the people that use it, like 95% terrible excuses for humanity

# ? Dec 4, 2014 06:02

FrozenVent: May 1, 2009; The Boeing 737-200QC is the undisputed workhorse of the skies.

JawKnee posted:

gently caress reddit and the people that use it, like 95% terrible excuses for humanity

That's true of the entire internet to be quite honest.

# ? Dec 4, 2014 06:05

Rime: Nov 2, 2011; by Games Forum

FrozenVent posted:

That's true of the entire internet to be quite honest.

Reddit has done a particularly good job of aggregating the dregs of society that would have formerly only been seen commenting on news articles.

# ? Dec 4, 2014 06:28

PT6A: Jan 5, 2006; Public school teachers are callous dictators who won't lift a finger to stop children from peeing in my plane

Mentally ill people need medical care, and addicts need to be provided access to their substance of choice in a way that allows them to quit if they choose, and doesn't cause anti-social behaviour if they don't. These things are self-evident in my opinion. That being said, I'm loving sick of panhandlers and unmedicated lunatics loving everything up as I try to go about my daily business. These are not conflicting positions, as I see it. If you're causing poo poo and being a nuisance, you need to be taken off to the government hotel for a day or a night, whether you have a home or not, and then we can address whatever problem causes you to inflict your problems on the rest of society. What's plainly not going to help is ignoring the problem entirely: everyone loses, and all to save a bit of money in the short term (which will certainly be spent in the long term dealing with the effects of drug addiction, poverty and unmedicated mental illness).

InSite is bullshit, but only because it doesn't provide a clean, cheap source for drugs (hardly its fault, I recognize). It saves lives, but does very little else to actually combat the social ills of addiction. Drugs are still expensive, illegal and dangerous. That's the nut that needs cracking. Trying to mop up the after effects is a waste of money when we could just do the right thing for a lot cheaper.

# ? Dec 4, 2014 08:12

JawKnee: Mar 24, 2007; You'll take the ride to leave this town along that yellow line

PT6A posted:

addicts need to be provided access to their substance of choice in a way that allows them to quit if they choose, and doesn't cause anti-social behaviour if they don't. These things are self-evident in my opinion. I'm loving sick of panhandlers and unmedicated lunatics loving everything up as I try to go about my daily business. These are not conflicting positions

They are if the condition "need to be provided access to their substance of choice in a way that allows them to quit if they choose, and doesn't cause anti-social behaviour if they don't" is not realized, given your own statement of what they need.

quote:

InSite is bullshit, but only because it doesn't provide a clean, cheap source for drugs (hardly its fault, I recognize). It saves lives, but does very little else to actually combat the social ills of addiction. Drugs are still expensive, illegal and dangerous. That's the nut that needs cracking. Trying to mop up the after effects is a waste of money when we could just do the right thing for a lot cheaper.

I'm not sure if you're blaming Insite for what it isn't allowed to do, but if you are, you shouldn't.

also:

quote:

you need to be taken off to the government hotel for a day or a night

spoken like a man who has never even been in the drunk tank

# ? Dec 4, 2014 09:27

I would blow Dane Cook: Dec 26, 2008; Can't post for 16 hours!

This isn't normal. This can't go on forever

quote:

First home buyers continue to disappear from the property market as investors dominate

FIRST homebuyer figures have plummeted to their lowest levels in a decade as aspiring property owners get pushed further out.

New figures by one of the nation�s largest mortgage broking firms, Australian Finance Group, show entry-level buyers fell to disastrously low records in Victoria, NSW and South Australia.
In November first home buyers figures in Victoria dropped to 7.4 per cent (down from 11.4 per cent in November last year), in South Australia 6.3 per cent (down from 16 per cent) and in NSW 1.9 per cent (down from 2.8 per cent).

At the same time the proportion of investors has climbed to its highest level in a decade and nationally made up 40 per cent of all new loans.
AFG chief executive officer Mark Hewitt said the record-low first home buyers figures were �extremely concerning.�
�We are seeing an emerging generation of people who aren�t going to be owning their own homes,�� he said.
�Investors quite often use equity in their existing property so why their property grows their equity grows and their buying power increases.
�People who aren�t involved in the property market like first-home buyers aren�t having that type of asset growth and are having to save the cash, this can be difficult when they are likely to be renting.�
The dumping of the first-home buyers grant has also been blamed for the demise in entry-level buyers.
Nationally of all loans, first homebuyer figures made up 7.3 per cent � down from 10.3 per cent in November last year.
The overall average home loan size in November was $454,000 compared to $436,000 12 months ago.

This week the Reserve Bank of Australia kept the cash rate on hold at 2.5 per cent and for the 16th consecutive month.
But despite the grim first-home buyers figures, the latest Adelaide Bank/ REIA Housing Affordability Report released yesterday (Wed) found a slight improvement to house prices for potential buyers.
The proportion of income required to meet loan repayments fell by 0.5 per cent to 30.4 per cent during the September quarter.
REIA chief executive officer Amanda Lynch said while housing affordability remained out of reach for many potential buyers it was �improving.�

# ? Dec 4, 2014 12:24

Grand Theft Autobot: Feb 28, 2008; I'm something of a fucking idiot myself

PT6A posted:

Mentally ill people need medical care, and addicts need to be provided access to their substance of choice in a way that allows them to quit if they choose, and doesn't cause anti-social behaviour if they don't. These things are self-evident in my opinion. That being said, I'm loving sick of panhandlers and unmedicated lunatics loving everything up as I try to go about my daily business. These are not conflicting positions, as I see it. If you're causing poo poo and being a nuisance, you need to be taken off to the government hotel for a day or a night, whether you have a home or not, and then we can address whatever problem causes you to inflict your problems on the rest of society. What's plainly not going to help is ignoring the problem entirely: everyone loses, and all to save a bit of money in the short term (which will certainly be spent in the long term dealing with the effects of drug addiction, poverty and unmedicated mental illness).

InSite is bullshit, but only because it doesn't provide a clean, cheap source for drugs (hardly its fault, I recognize). It saves lives, but does very little else to actually combat the social ills of addiction. Drugs are still expensive, illegal and dangerous. That's the nut that needs cracking. Trying to mop up the after effects is a waste of money when we could just do the right thing for a lot cheaper.

# ? Dec 4, 2014 14:19

Brannock: Feb 9, 2006; by exmarx; Fallen Rib

JawKnee posted:

gently caress reddit and the people that use it, like 95% terrible excuses for humanity

Those guys are being downvoted. I bet I could quote you something from here that makes SA look... awful... but I don't think it'd be a valid way to indict the entire userbase.

# ? Dec 4, 2014 15:19

namaste friends: Sep 18, 2004; by Smythe

Jumpingmanjim posted:

This isn't normal. This can't go on forever

Good friends of mine are just about buy a house in Melbourne. uuuuuuugh

# ? Dec 4, 2014 15:58

Kafka Esq.: Jan 1, 2005; "If you ever even think about calling me anything but 'The Crab' I will go so fucking crab on your ass you won't even see what crab'd your crab" -The Crab(TM)

Brannock posted:

Those guys are being downvoted. I bet I could quote you something from here that makes SA look... awful... but I don't think it'd be a valid way to indict the entire userbase.

Wow, I can't read this post without seeing your NCIS: Miami-esque avatar.

edit: Yeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaaah

# ? Dec 4, 2014 16:10

namaste friends: Sep 18, 2004; by Smythe

http://www.cbc.ca/news/business/debt-how-to-use-it-and-not-abuse-it-1.2859435

quote:

The consensus is that debt that adds to your net worth is "good" � or at least better � debt. This includes loans that fund things such as the purchase of a home, investments, education, home improvements, RRSP contributions and acquisition of investment properties.

time to abolish the cbc

# ? Dec 4, 2014 17:11

Lexicon: Jul 29, 2003; I had a beer with Stephen Harper once and now I like him.

^ The quoted statement, is, broadly speaking, true. I fully acknowledge this country is bizarro land right now, but this "all debt = evil and bad and all debtors = greedy idiots" mentality some of you have is completely wrongheaded.

Debt is a wonderful tool, used correctly.

# ? Dec 4, 2014 17:18

Kafka Esq.: Jan 1, 2005; "If you ever even think about calling me anything but 'The Crab' I will go so fucking crab on your ass you won't even see what crab'd your crab" -The Crab(TM)

Cultural Imperial posted:

http://www.cbc.ca/news/business/debt-how-to-use-it-and-not-abuse-it-1.2859435

time to abolish the cbc

Your shtick is slowly changing from Uncle Wong's Cabin to accelerationist conservative, right?

# ? Dec 4, 2014 17:19

Baudin: Dec 31, 2009

Lexicon posted:

^ The quoted statement, is, broadly speaking, true. I fully acknowledge this country is bizarro land right now, but this "all debt = evil and bad and all debtors = greedy idiots" mentality some of you have is completely wrongheaded.

Debt is a wonderful tool, used correctly.

I agree, it's called leverage, some of you should use a return on equity calculator (for properties with cash flow, clearly).

# ? Dec 4, 2014 17:20

namaste friends: Sep 18, 2004; by Smythe

Lexicon posted:

^ The quoted statement, is, broadly speaking, true. I fully acknowledge this country is bizarro land right now, but this "all debt = evil and bad and all debtors = greedy idiots" mentality some of you have is completely wrongheaded.

Debt is a wonderful tool, used correctly.

I don't think you can call a mortgage good debt right now.

# ? Dec 4, 2014 17:24

namaste friends: Sep 18, 2004; by Smythe

Kafka Esq. posted:

Your shtick is slowly changing from Uncle Wong's Cabin to accelerationist conservative, right?

Hark, a marginalised voice is crying out from the forest paternalistic repression. Time to deploy your social justice Kafka!

# ? Dec 4, 2014 17:26

Lexicon: Jul 29, 2003; I had a beer with Stephen Harper once and now I like him.

Cultural Imperial posted:

I don't think you can call a mortgage good debt right now.

A newly issued one, in Canada in late 2014, almost certainly isn't, I agree. That's a very different claim than "all debt is bad you guys".

# ? Dec 4, 2014 17:26

Baudin: Dec 31, 2009

Cultural Imperial posted:

I don't think you can call a mortgage good debt right now.

Depends what the mortgage is for and where you live. Not all real estate markets are blazing hot like Toronto/Vancouver/Calgary.

# ? Dec 4, 2014 17:26

PT6A: Jan 5, 2006; Public school teachers are callous dictators who won't lift a finger to stop children from peeing in my plane

JawKnee posted:

I'm not sure if you're blaming Insite for what it isn't allowed to do, but if you are, you shouldn't.

Not really. I recognize that they have a useful purpose, and it's really the only one they can have given the drug laws, but the problems associated with drugs are still largely caused by the fact they're illegal (unknown purity, high cost, etc.) so it's only ever going to be so useful. And I know it's not really their fault.

All drugs should be legal, but the enforcement against misuse (such as driving intoxicated, public intoxication, disturbing the peace) needs to also be a drat sight more rigorous than it is.

JawKnee posted:

spoken like a man who has never even been in the drunk tank

Indeed. When I'm drunk and in public, I don't do dangerous or anti-social things. I have no problem with drunk or otherwise intoxicated people, I have a problem with them causing poo poo and nothing being done about it. Even a crackhead, if they're high instead of coming down, is generally a fairly happy, decent person to deal with. I'm sick of the guys with the minty-fresh breath harassing the general public on transit, and not a drat thing being done about it and that sort of thing.

# ? Dec 4, 2014 17:29

Kafka Esq.: Jan 1, 2005; "If you ever even think about calling me anything but 'The Crab' I will go so fucking crab on your ass you won't even see what crab'd your crab" -The Crab(TM)

Cultural Imperial posted:

Hark, a marginalised voice is crying out from the forest paternalistic repression. Time to deploy your social justice Kafka!

Well, you just ruined whatever friendship we could have had.

# ? Dec 4, 2014 17:30

namaste friends: Sep 18, 2004; by Smythe

Kafka Esq. posted:

Well, you just ruined whatever friendship we could have had.

That would just get in the way of my ability to pad my klout score

# ? Dec 4, 2014 17:33

Demon_Corsair: Mar 22, 2004; Goodbye stealing souls, hello stealing booty.

PT6A posted:

Indeed. When I'm drunk and in public, I don't do dangerous or anti-social things. I have no problem with drunk or otherwise intoxicated people, I have a problem with them causing poo poo and nothing being done about it. Even a crackhead, if they're high instead of coming down, is generally a fairly happy, decent person to deal with. I'm sick of the guys with the minty-fresh breath harassing the general public on transit, and not a drat thing being done about it and that sort of thing.

What transit are you taking? I have been taking transit for years and most of the time when there are obnoxious drunks on the train its either a)stampede or b)after a flames game.

Does being asked for change count as being harassed?

# ? Dec 4, 2014 17:48

peter banana: Sep 2, 2008; Feminism is a socialist, anti-family, political movement that encourages women to leave their husbands, kill their children, practice witchcraft, destroy capitalism and become lesbians.

PT6A posted:

Indeed. When I'm drunk and in public, I don't do dangerous or anti-social things. I have no problem with drunk or otherwise intoxicated people, I have a problem with them causing poo poo and nothing being done about it. Even a crackhead, if they're high instead of coming down, is generally a fairly happy, decent person to deal with. I'm sick of the guys with the minty-fresh breath harassing the general public on transit, and not a drat thing being done about it and that sort of thing.

Cool. It was smart of you to be born without debilitating mental health issues or in an environment of systemic inter generational poverty and substance abuse issues. I can see how other people not making the same choices as you would be "inconvenient" for you, PTA6.

# ? Dec 4, 2014 17:51

PT6A: Jan 5, 2006; Public school teachers are callous dictators who won't lift a finger to stop children from peeing in my plane

Demon_Corsair posted:

Does being asked for change count as being harassed?

Depends. If it's polite, no. If a "sorry, I don't have any" is met with a slurred "gently caress you, fuckin' rear end in a top hat," then yes. Sitting beside a solider in uniform at 9AM, and drunkenly ranting about how we ought to "nuke those cocksuckers in Afghanistan" is probably also on the list of poo poo that just shouldn't be done.

peter banana posted:

Cool. It was smart of you to be born without debilitating mental health issues or in an environment of systemic inter generational poverty and substance abuse issues. I can see how other people not making the same choices as you would be "inconvenient" for you, PTA6.

If drugs were legal, available and inexpensive (with taxes going to rehab programs), they wouldn't be linked to generational poverty in nearly the same way they are now, for one thing. For another, substance abuse doesn't cause anti-social behaviour, assholes cause anti-social behaviour. Alcohol isn't to blame for drunk driving or domestic violence, or any of those other things: assholes are. I get drunk all the time, and I've never driven, or beat women, or threatened random people on the C-Train as a result. Funny, that...

# ? Dec 4, 2014 18:08

Baronjutter: Dec 31, 2007; "Tiny Trains"

peter banana posted:

Cool. It was smart of you to be born without debilitating mental health issues or in an environment of systemic inter generational poverty and substance abuse issues. I can see how other people not making the same choices as you would be "inconvenient" for you, PTA6.

If PTA lost his job he'd be smashing car windows and digging out change to pay his cigar and cheese dealer, who would end up murdered for labeling cheese incorrectly.

# ? Dec 4, 2014 18:11

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# ? May 10, 2024 00:36

Ceciltron: Jan 11, 2007; Text BEEP to 43527 for the dancing robot!; Pillbug

Baronjutter posted:

If PTA lost his job he'd be smashing car windows and digging out change to pay his cigar and cheese dealer, who would end up murdered for labeling cheese incorrectly.

"The fucker said it was reggiano but that poo poo was grana padano. The world is a better place thanks to me, you all ought to give me a medal!" PT6A, at his trial

# ? Dec 4, 2014 18:19

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > Canada Housing/Debt: Trust me, I'm a landlord.

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