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SuperMechagodzilla posted:Wait, I thought people were talking about the line in JP1 where he says he's always "on the lookout for a future ex-Mrs. Malcolm." Good lord. She's talking about how he, her biological father, is not around that much. There is nothing in the movie to even imply that she's adopted, and plenty of evidence that she is his daughter, which is what anyone would naturally assume anyway, given the lack of evidence to the contrary.
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Dec 5, 2014 07:12
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Wandle Cax posted:Good lord. She's talking about how he, her biological father, is not around that much. There is nothing in the movie to even imply that she's adopted, and plenty of evidence that she is his daughter, which is what anyone would naturally assume anyway, given the lack of evidence to the contrary. A character in the film comments on how there's zero family resemblance. Because she's black and he's Jeff Goldblum. Also, the exact lines: Malcolm: You’re your own person, and you always have been. You don’t need a parent, you just need someone to pay the rent and try to keep up with you until you take over the world. You amaze me. You’re my inspiration. Kelly: You like to have kids, you just don’t want to be with them, do you? She's not talking about genetics. She's talking about the 'you're my inspiration' bullshit. That's why these lines are written together in a script. SuperMechagodzilla fucked around with this message at 07:27 on Dec 5, 2014 |
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Dec 5, 2014 07:23
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SuperMechagodzilla posted:A character in the film comments on how there's zero family resemblance. Because she's black and he's Jeff Goldblum. Do you really not know how genetics works or it this is just some kind of weird joke. Also her comment is in response to his bullshit explanation about why he's not around her much. Also "have kids" generally refers to biologically having kids unless specified otherwise. Carry on twisting the text of the film to fit your fascinating reading though.
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Dec 5, 2014 07:45
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Wandle Cax posted:Do you really not know how genetics works or it this is just some kind of weird joke. Also her comment is in response to his bullshit explanation about why he's not around her much. Also "have kids" generally refers to biologically having kids unless specified otherwise. Carry on twisting the text of the film to fit your fascinating reading though. The film does specify otherwise, and that is 'how genetics works'. It's not impossible for Jeff Goldblum to have a kid who looks like Vanessa Lee Chester, but very unlikely. Spielberg included a line in the film to draw attention to this unlikelihood.
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Dec 5, 2014 08:32
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If you don't like taking care of kids but like "having" them, what can "having" kids be but sex? What, Ian just enjoys the idea that there are kids he adopted and then abandoned? Edit: I guess it can refer to having someone to carry your name but that still only makes sense with a blood relation. davidspackage fucked around with this message at 09:02 on Dec 5, 2014 |
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Dec 5, 2014 08:58
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The Lost World is not a film of nuance. She's his biological daughter, end of story.
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Dec 5, 2014 09:14
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I'm not saying SMG is right, but have you guys really never heard a parent of an adopted kid saying something like "we have two kids"? They don't act like it's a dang business relationship.
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Dec 5, 2014 09:35
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It's explicitly stated. He likes having someone who'll amaze and inspire him. Malcolm loves his daughter, and they do spend time together, but he has a very 'hands-off' parenting style. He's not a generic deadbeat dad. Hopefully people realize that this whole family drama is a metaphor for the larger dinosaur story (and vice-versa). Hammond is an absent father who lets the dinosaurs grow up 'naturally', 'paying the rent and trying to keep up with them until they take over the world.' Hammond likes having dinosaurs, but he doesn't like being with them - and he didn't have sex with a parasaurolophus. Malcolm clearly states that he tried being an authority figure in Kelly's life, but felt he was terribly bad at it. So he let Kelly's mother take over. This is a basic metaphor for Site B, where Hammond is letting 'mother nature' take control of Jurassic Park. It's the basic premise of the film.
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Dec 5, 2014 09:53
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I don't see why she has to be adopted for that incredibly obvious reading to work? Unless you're just uncomfortable with her being black?
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Dec 5, 2014 10:42
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Jurassic Park in 'black daughter' unpredictable genetics subtext shocker.
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Dec 5, 2014 10:45
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PriorMarcus posted:I don't see why she has to be adopted for that incredibly obvious reading to work? Unless you're just uncomfortable with her being black? I didn't say she has to be adopted. She could be from a different relationship. As in the first film, race and class are important. The first scene of Jurassic Park is a black man dying in a horrific workplace accident. Hammond profits off of Dominican mining operations and walks around in plantation clothes. Jurassic Park itself uses an 'African' font to look 'primitive', when the font was actually created in Germany. The Malcolm character's response to this was all "white men suck, leave nature be". And that's where we're at when this film starts: with Malcolm seeing his attempt at 'building a family' as a failed experiment. And that basic language - 'experiment' - is a weird choice for a generic fatherhood story, but fits fine alongside all the weirder family units on display. The film's all about artifice and how there's no such thing as a nature. If anything, it's simply more interesting on a character level if Malcolm feels he doesn't belong partly because - even though he loves her - he's not Kelly's 'natural' father. SuperMechagodzilla fucked around with this message at 11:39 on Dec 5, 2014 |
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Dec 5, 2014 11:36
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Are we still talking about the new one with Chris Pratt on a motorcycle riding with raptors?
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Dec 5, 2014 11:43
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nexus6 posted:Are we still talking about the new one with Chris Pratt on a motorcycle riding with raptors? Yes. In this film Chris Pratt was born a poor black child.
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Dec 5, 2014 12:15
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Chris Pratt is one of Malcom's other adopted kids
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Dec 5, 2014 12:30
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Jeff Goldblum made love to a velociraptor and Chris Pratt is the result! It all makes sense now.
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Dec 5, 2014 13:43
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Like the other Jurassic Park movies without Goldblum, this one will be bad.
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Dec 5, 2014 15:18
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ITT: nerds arguing over wether a girl in a movie about dinosaurs is adopted or not because of the colour of her skin. This has been an enlightening two pages.  I think the most interesting part of Jurassic World, from this fan's perspective will be how they managed to make the park successful and up and running flawlessly up until the events of this film, as Crichton's main themes have always been about the perils of genetics and the futurism (whilst making an entertaining story), so it'll be interesting to see how the new film compares to the views he had.
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Dec 5, 2014 15:43
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Clearly they hired more than two programmers.
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Dec 5, 2014 15:48
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nexus6 posted:Clearly they hired more than two programmers. I'm sure they spared no expense.
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Dec 5, 2014 16:19
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I'm just going to go ahead and keep thinking that they cast a black girl because they liked her and thought she was right for the part and then threw in that line about there being no family resemblance because they know people are morons and would be distracted by it. Basebf555 fucked around with this message at 16:55 on Dec 5, 2014 |
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Dec 5, 2014 16:53
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Basebf555 posted:I'm just going to go ahead and keep thinking that they cast a black girl because they liked her and thought she was right for the part and then threw in that line about there being no family resemblance because they know people are morons and would be distracted by it. David Koepp's script specifies that Kelly is African-American.
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Dec 5, 2014 17:30
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SuperMechagodzilla posted:David Koepp's script specifies that Kelly is African-American. And you're sure she wasn't cast before the script was written? Lost World was a HUGE movie so it wouldn't shock me if the basic plot and characters were mapped out before a scriptwriter even got a shot at it. But yes, that fact forces me to admit that there may be more to it than just casting.
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Dec 5, 2014 17:42
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Wikipedia says that she's his daughter from a failed marriage and Wikipedia never lies, so yeah... also https://www.facebook.com/pages/Why-is-Jeff-Goldblums-Daughter-Black-in-Jurassic-Park-2/366240491491
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Dec 5, 2014 17:47
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Basebf555 posted:And you're sure she wasn't cast before the script was written? Lost World was a HUGE movie so it wouldn't shock me if the basic plot and characters were mapped out before a scriptwriter even got a shot at it. Kelly is a combination of the two children in the Lost World novel, one of whom was black. She carries the novel's theme of nurture. The velociraptors in the novel were brutal and chaotic because they hadn't been taught how to behave by adults. In the film, she acts out to rebel against Ian's hands-off parenting. Ian admires chaos and worships Kelly's natural state, but without discipline, she won't reach her full potential. Her relationship to Ian Malcolm was invented for the film and parallels Spielberg's adoption of two black children, Theo and Mikaela.
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Dec 5, 2014 17:54
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Facepalm Ranger posted:I think the most interesting part of Jurassic World, from this fan's perspective will be how they managed to make the park successful and up and running flawlessly up until the events of this film, as Crichton's main themes have always been about the perils of genetics and the futurism (whilst making an entertaining story), so it'll be interesting to see how the new film compares to the views he had.
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Dec 5, 2014 17:58
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Nipplebox posted:Kelly is a combination of the two children in the Lost World novel, one of whom was black. She carries the novel's theme of nurture. The velociraptors in the novel were brutal and chaotic because they hadn't been taught how to behave by adults. In the film, she acts out to rebel against Ian's hands-off parenting. Ian admires chaos and worships Kelly's natural state, but without discipline, she won't reach her full potential. Her relationship to Ian Malcolm was invented for the film and parallels Spielberg's adoption of two black children, Theo and Mikaela. Still seems just as likely to me that Spielberg, knowing that the two kids had to be combined into one for the film, chose to cast a black actress because he's progressive and also happened to think she was the best actress for the part. I'm not really buying that her relationship with Malcom is meant to be a parallel to his real-life adoptions, that he adopted black kids only really proves that race isn't a hang-up for him. Edit: And I'm not trying to do the typical "you're thinking about the movie too much" thing. I just don't think this particular reading works. Basebf555 fucked around with this message at 18:04 on Dec 5, 2014 |
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Dec 5, 2014 18:01
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Basebf555 posted:Still seems just as likely to me that Spielberg, knowing that the two kids had to be combined into one for the film, chose to cast a black actress because he's progressive and also happened to think she was the best actress for the part. I'm not really buying that her relationship with Malcom is meant to be a parallel to his real-life adoptions, that he adopted black kids only really proves that race isn't a hang-up for him. Given this director, it seems unlikely to me for the Jewish man with fatherhood issues and a black daughter to be a coincidence.
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Dec 5, 2014 18:10
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Nipplebox posted:Given this director, it seems unlikely to me for the Jewish man with fatherhood issues and a black daughter to be a coincidence. I think a coincidence is exactly what it is. One of the children in the book is black, the Ian Malcom character is probably Jewish and is played by a Jewish actor. Neither of these characters were created by Spielberg. The kid character in Lost World(film) had to have a reason to be there and there aren't any other appropriate characters to attach her to. Spielberg happens to be a person who would cast someone he feels strongly about regardless of race. Normally I wouldn't go with "its a coincidence" as an explanation for something in film but in this case I'm not seeing anything in the actual text of the movie that supports the other reading, with the exception of the family resemblance line.
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Dec 5, 2014 18:18
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Children from mixed race marriages look significantly more like one parent's race than the other all the time. I don't see what's weird about it unless someone's under the impression that Malcolm is super racist. Her mom was black and she happened to get more of her appearance from that parent.
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Dec 5, 2014 18:47
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Basebf555 posted:I think a coincidence is exactly what it is. One of the children in the book is black, the Ian Malcom character is probably Jewish and is played by a Jewish actor. Neither of these characters were created by Spielberg. The kid character in Lost World(film) had to have a reason to be there and there aren't any other appropriate characters to attach her to. Spielberg happens to be a person who would cast someone he feels strongly about regardless of race. The details of the adaptation process don't matter. It's difficult to believe that Spielberg of all people would make a film about a Jewish father and his black daughter without considering the daughter he adopted a year prior, this man who told the story of his parents' divorce using a $1.5 million puppet.
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Dec 5, 2014 18:50
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Nipplebox posted:The details of the adaptation process don't matter. It's difficult to believe that Spielberg of all people would make a film about a Jewish father and his black daughter without considering the daughter he adopted a year prior, this man who told the story of his parents' divorce using a $1.5 million puppet. I mean, yea he "considered it" in the sense that he doesn't give a poo poo about the race of his own kids, so he therefore doesn't care about the race of Malcom's kid. Its just not something that's an issue for him. To me that's a simpler, easier to believe explanation. Edit: Eh, lets just drop it, its a pretty stupid debate anyway. Basebf555 fucked around with this message at 19:07 on Dec 5, 2014 |
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Dec 5, 2014 18:55
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Basebf555 posted:I mean, yea he "considered it" in the sense that he doesn't give a poo poo about the race of his own kids, so he therefore doesn't care about the race of Malcom's kid. Its just not something that's an issue for him. To me that's a simpler, easier to believe explanation. I doubt Spielberg would have called attention to the lack of "family resemblance" if he believed in race erasure.
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Dec 5, 2014 19:01
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Nipplebox posted:I doubt Spielberg would have called attention to the lack of "family resemblance" if he believed in race erasure. Spielberg has actually talked about adoption at length. On Larry King live, he's said that racism is obviously a real thing, but that adoption has created a sort of race-neutral zone in the specific context of his family unit. If adoption were 'universalized', he says, then racism would cease to exist. And that's exactly what we see in Lost World: it's refreshingly free of the typical Harry Potter "you're not my real dad!" shenanigans, but people looking at the family from the outside see Kelly's race as an elephant in the room. That happens in the film. Even if you discount the adoption aspect there, Sarah absolutely steps in as a mother figure for Kelly by the end. Same diff.
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Dec 5, 2014 22:16
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Shutthefuckupasaurus
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Dec 6, 2014 01:16
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Can we please start talking about Dinosaurs again? Here- i'll start. I really hope we get to actually see Baryonyx this time- it's technically been on the part roster since JP1, but never actually been in a scene.
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Dec 6, 2014 01:29
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Dinosaurs are only onscreen in Jurassic Park for about 15 minutes. The film is mostly about a group of scientists and intellectuals sitting around engaging in philosophical debate.
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Dec 6, 2014 02:04
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SuperMechagodzilla posted:Dinosaurs are only onscreen in Jurassic Park for about 15 minutes. The film is mostly about a group of scientists and intellectuals sitting around engaging in philosophical debate. So Godzilla 2014 really is a rip off of Jurassic Park.
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Dec 6, 2014 02:41
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Peanut President posted:So Godzilla 2014 really is a rip off of Jurassic Park. Imagine if a T-Rex in Jurassic World ended a fight as cool as Godzilla did.
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Dec 6, 2014 03:01
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Doflamingo posted:Jeff Goldblum made love to a velociraptor and Chris Pratt is the result! It all makes sense now. He couldn't resist looking up their skirts.
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Dec 6, 2014 03:26
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Detective No. 27 posted:Yeah. The first movie never made any changes to the dinosaurs to make them more exciting to the viewer in a way. Things like giving the T-Rex binocular vision, frilly poison spit, or making the raptors twice as big as they should have been. T. Rex did have binocular vision. Macaluso posted:The t-rex in san diego IS great and so is the t-rex roaring infront of the backdrop of the city and so is everyone in the boat somehow torn to pieces by the t-rex that was inside the big cargo hold JP3 should have been about a colony of raptors living in the sewers and emerging at night to eat the homeless and drunks. Charlz Guybon fucked around with this message at 06:10 on Dec 6, 2014 |
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Dec 6, 2014 06:06
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