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sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth

SirFozzie posted:

- Fixed goalkeepers not getting back to their own goal quick enough after passing outside their area

No more 60-yarders from Gylfi :(

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The Croc
Dec 19, 2004

A-well-a everybody's heard about the bird!

OH YEAH!



sassassin posted:

No more 60-yarders from Gylfi :(

One of my plaers won goal of the season with such a goal only it was only 41 yards and went in off the post.

jyrka
Jan 21, 2005


Potato Count: 2 small potatoes
Where's the cheapest I can buy FM15 right now?

sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth
Lot of graphical bugs since the update. Missing bars on the match stats screen, goal disallowed cause the opposition keeper was offside...

mark-p87
Sep 27, 2006
Really Dystopian Rhetoric

jyrka posted:

Where's the cheapest I can buy FM15 right now?

It's £20 on Amazon UK at the moment, that's the cheapest I've seen it so far.

Bogan Krkic
Oct 31, 2010

Swedish style? No.
Yugoslavian style? Of course not.
It has to be Zlatan-style.

jyrka posted:

Where's the cheapest I can buy FM15 right now?

I bought from here: http://www.cdkeys.com/pc/games/football-manager-2015-pc-mac-cd-key-steam

but there might be cheaper options by now idk

dkj
Feb 18, 2009

Bogan Krkic posted:

I bought from here: http://www.cdkeys.com/pc/games/football-manager-2015-pc-mac-cd-key-steam

but there might be cheaper options by now idk

Are these region locked? Wasn't even aware you could just buy a steam key.

Jack2142
Jul 17, 2014

Shitposting in Seattle

fixing the goalkeepers for MLS is great since the league has a comparatively really good goal keepers to actual starting positions so every team is signing and moving goalkeepers like crazy.

Bogan Krkic
Oct 31, 2010

Swedish style? No.
Yugoslavian style? Of course not.
It has to be Zlatan-style.

dkj posted:

Are these region locked? Wasn't even aware you could just buy a steam key.

I assume not, I'm in Australia and it worked fine. You get a weird scan of the CD key off a box emailed to you, it's grey market as hell

Bogan Krkic
Oct 31, 2010

Swedish style? No.
Yugoslavian style? Of course not.
It has to be Zlatan-style.

SirFozzie posted:


- Fixed overuse of ‘Eneko’ and ‘Osia’ as first and second names for Spanish newgens and fixed names in existing saves


This fix literally changes names of existing players. I had an Argentine/Spanish regen Sergio Osia I'd just bought from Boca who is now called Julian Rodriguez

sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth

Bogan Krkic posted:

This fix literally changes names of existing players. I had an Argentine/Spanish regen Sergio Osia I'd just bought from Boca who is now called Julian Rodriguez

lol

I almost had the same 60-yard goal again last night but the ball fell to Routledge who put it nearer the corner flag than the old onion bag. Gylfi would've buried it.

Playing a possession 4-4-2 with Target Man, beat Arsenal 1-0 at the Emirates with a Gylfi free-kick, and beat Newcastle 2-1 with a 93rd minute winner after going behind in the first 10, 70% possession, Ashley Williams sent off in the 60th and playing the rest of the game defensive & time wasting like mad.

Bony had 8 shots, 5 on target and 0 goals. Got mad when I criticized him after the game.

Shroud
May 11, 2009

sassassin posted:

Bony had 8 shots, 5 on target and 0 goals. Got mad when I criticized him after the game.

You criticize your forwards if they don't score in a match? Is that you, Mourinho?

sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth

Shroud posted:

You criticize your forwards if they don't score in a match? Is that you, Mourinho?

Would have transfer listed him if we hadn't scored that winner. With the chances he was given he should have had a first half hat trick.

Coohoolin
Aug 5, 2012

Oor Coohoolie.
Fuckkk I missed a buyout clause in one of my best players' contract and now they're going to Barcelona for a paltry 8 million. They don't even have the decency to pay me upfront.

Shroud
May 11, 2009

sassassin posted:

Would have transfer listed him if we hadn't scored that winner. With the chances he was given he should have had a first half hat trick.

You realize that a very, very good striker is one who'll put in a goal every other game, right? Sorry if I sound crazy, but I can't tell if you're joking or not.

Bogan Krkic
Oct 31, 2010

Swedish style? No.
Yugoslavian style? Of course not.
It has to be Zlatan-style.

Shroud posted:

You realize that a very, very good striker is one who'll put in a goal every other game, right? Sorry if I sound crazy, but I can't tell if you're joking or not.

I've noticed that if a striker has had a number of shots without scoring in the first half, criticising their finishing at half time can get them to kick on in the second half and grab a goal or at least play a whole lot better

e. also sassassin has edited Bony's stats to be better than Messi :twisted:

Bogan Krkic fucked around with this message at 22:35 on Dec 11, 2014

Coohoolin
Aug 5, 2012

Oor Coohoolie.
gently caress, that's two. Just lost Gil Dias and John Souttar. Replaced Dias with Ryan Gauld and hopefully my wee youngster defender can step in for Souttar but I'm greatly annoyed. Always double check your contracts.

Waroduce
Aug 5, 2008
How is the AI at handling contracts? I don't understand soccer contracts at all, is there any way for me to designate players I need back and have the AI take care of it?

sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth

Shroud posted:

You realize that a very, very good striker is one who'll put in a goal every other game, right? Sorry if I sound crazy, but I can't tell if you're joking or not.

He had 8 shots, 5 on target, in good areas. Including one double chance where he banged it into Krul twice in a row from 5 yards. This wasn't a random potshot at the lad. His finishing wasn't up to par*.

Having a go at players for specific things is cool and good, even if it's a bit wonky with its logic some times.


Bony received a slight downgrade in my extremely professional attribute review. 17 agility was ridiculous. I did give him that 'Plays with back to goal' PPM but I'm not sure how good that is in the match engine.

*I've heard that all the Finishing attribute actually does is put shots on target. Beating the keeper is based on anticipation and decisions. But asking for clarification on the official forums is considered out of line and like asking for cheat codes.

sassassin fucked around with this message at 10:33 on Dec 12, 2014

Bogan Krkic
Oct 31, 2010

Swedish style? No.
Yugoslavian style? Of course not.
It has to be Zlatan-style.

Plays with back to goal sucks imo but I like strikers who run beyond the defence. Pretty much every attribute plays in to everything, but goalscoring is finishing (knowing where the goal is), decisions (what shot to take) and technique (how many different shots the player can pull off) iirc. Obviously composure, anticipation, off the ball, determination etc all play a part too

sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth

Bogan Krkic posted:

Plays with back to goal sucks imo but I like strikers who run beyond the defence.

So do I but that's not what Bony usually does. My hands are tied.

quote:

Pretty much every attribute plays in to everything, but goalscoring is finishing (knowing where the goal is), decisions (what shot to take) and technique (how many different shots the player can pull off) iirc. Obviously composure, anticipation, off the ball, determination etc all play a part too

Everything plays into everything, yes, but how specifically they play into it is important. And yet it's incredibly vague and the game, manual, and unaffiliated guideto sites all provide contradictory information.

It's a deliberate design choice. A loving stupid one.

Bogan Krkic
Oct 31, 2010

Swedish style? No.
Yugoslavian style? Of course not.
It has to be Zlatan-style.

Tbh I like the opacity of the game. Without it, you're just playing excel

sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth
Fifa's player attribute system is unironically better.

I'm not sure how knowing the actual difference between determination, aggression and workrate somehow destroys the illusion of this game simulating football (pro-tip: determination is the worst one).

Bogan Krkic
Oct 31, 2010

Swedish style? No.
Yugoslavian style? Of course not.
It has to be Zlatan-style.

*passionately* actually, determination is the best one

*squad morale plummets*

*aggressively* that's exactly the reaction I was after

E. Does fifa actually have the same amount of attributes? Like can you just create a player from one in the other?

Brendan Rodgers
Jun 11, 2014




Sassy you're confusing, you're obviously half decent at the game but you don't half come out with some totally wrong stuff.

Brendan Rodgers
Jun 11, 2014




Somewhere out there an AMC with high determination is shedding a tear.

sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth

Brendan Rodgers posted:

Somewhere out there an AMC with high determination is shedding a tear.

People obsess about Determination because it's the easiest one to raise. They want to feel like they've accomplished something important when they get the whole first team squad to 15+.

There's no reason not to do that, since it's so easy and doesn't use any player CA. But I'm not binning a Determination 10 player who's too old for tutoring. I'll just try not to go two goals down when he's on the field.

Brendan Rodgers
Jun 11, 2014




Determination effects almost everything though. I'm more forgiving of low work rate and natural fitness, not by much though.

sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth

Brendan Rodgers posted:

Determination effects almost everything though. I'm more forgiving of low work rate and natural fitness, not by much though.

Based on playing the game I'd say that if it effects 'almost everything' it does so only slightly, and not harshly. I don't buy for a second that it's some major primary stat like Decisions that controls every action a player takes. I've seen no evidence of that at all. If it was that important it would be worth CA points.

My pet theory is it's purely an on-field motivational attribute and with the right captain and team talks it's entirely redundant.


I love Natural Fitness. Anything that lowers injury risk and recovery is top tier for me.

Brendan Rodgers
Jun 11, 2014




It helps shoot, tackle, it makes your players step up in important situations instead of being anonymous, and it helps your players develop stats on the training pitch etc. The right player can do fine with weaknesses but it is a weakness.

sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth

Brendan Rodgers posted:

It helps shoot, tackle,

How so?

Brendan Rodgers posted:

it makes your players step up in important situations instead of being anonymous

Aggression, Work-Rate, Important matches, Pressure, Temperament, to a lesser extent Teamwork

Brendan Rodgers posted:

and it helps your players develop stats on the training pitch etc.

Categorically untrue. Tests have been done. Determination has absolutely no influence on attribute development.

Brendan Rodgers
Jun 11, 2014




Link this test I'll accept it's a superstition stat if there's data.

Dallan Invictus
Oct 11, 2007

The thing about words is that meanings can twist just like a snake, and if you want to find snakes, look for them behind words that have changed their meaning.
Isn't the idea mostly that high determination tends to come along with hidden attributes that actually do influence development (Professionalism, etc.) so the attribute is more useful as a signal than as an actual attribute?

(also, speaking of development, what's the difference in the CA/PA star ratings between, say, "three stars, fourth star is black" and "three stars, fourth star is grey"?)

Brendan Rodgers
Jun 11, 2014




What about when you're playing a low league and you have those guys with high determination or work rate, and they do really well. The determination guys will shoot and tackle much better than the other stats imply.

Determined to win the ball back or score.

sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth

Brendan Rodgers posted:

Link this test I'll accept it's a superstition stat if there's data.

Here's 100 spreadsheets on Ajax's u12s training drills. Somewhere in there is the explanation from the official forums' most respected sperg.

http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php/380395-Ajax-When-Real-Life-Meets-Football-Manager-FM14?highlight=Ajax

Dallan Invictus posted:

Isn't the idea mostly that high determination tends to come along with hidden attributes that actually do influence development (Professionalism, etc.) so the attribute is more useful as a signal than as an actual attribute?

There's no practical link that could have any effect. It might be part of the regen generation algorithms, but there's no correlation in the database itself.

sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth

Brendan Rodgers posted:

What about when you're playing a low league and you have those guys with high determination or work rate, and they do really well. The determination guys will shoot and tackle much better than the other stats imply.

Determined to win the ball back or score.

When everyone's bad at football but some players have high determination and others low, yes the former will probably perform better than the latter.

Are you worried that a low determination player is going to get the ball in front of goal and decide he can't be bothered to score?

Brendan Rodgers
Jun 11, 2014




No but that he'll be mentally weak in a way that even Composure won't save him, especially if it's injury time or something.

sassassin
Apr 3, 2010

by Azathoth

Brendan Rodgers posted:

No but that he'll be mentally weak in a way that even Composure won't save him, especially if it's injury time or something.

Concentration.

Bogan Krkic
Oct 31, 2010

Swedish style? No.
Yugoslavian style? Of course not.
It has to be Zlatan-style.

Hmm maybe all the stats are important for all the players and positions :sterv:

Nothing more than Decisions and Technique though

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Shroud
May 11, 2009

Brendan Rodgers posted:

Link this test I'll accept it's a superstition stat if there's data.

I swear this gets brought up every drat year.

Determination has NO effect on development. What matters is Professionalism, Ambition, and to a lesser extent, Injury Proneness.

http://www.thedugout.net/community/showthread.php?t=75695

http://www.thedugout.net/content/articles/item,1,2,1,Player_Development_and_Tutoring_Guide.html

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