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mayodreams posted:My understanding is that you need only one copy of data center per virtual host, be it Hyper-V or VMware, and you can have unlimited virtual instances on that host. Then again, Microsoft licensing is black magic, so who really knows. One copy of datacenter edition per CPU socket of the host (any hypervisor). Most people qualify for some kind of discount. You should work with your VAR to actually see what kind of pricing you can get.
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Jan 9, 2015 05:45
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Okay thank god, 2012 Std licensing gives you 2008 R2 Enterprise downgrade rights...
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Jan 9, 2015 06:20
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parid posted:One copy of datacenter edition per CPU socket of the host (any hypervisor). Most people qualify for some kind of discount. You should work with your VAR to actually see what kind of pricing you can get. I don't think that's right any more. With 2012 R2 they changed it from per socket to per-server (more precisely per pair of sockets  ) That ~$6k price covers any two-socket server with unlimited Windows guests.Wicaeed posted:Okay thank god, 2012 Std licensing gives you 2008 R2 Enterprise downgrade rights...
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Jan 9, 2015 06:32
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KS posted:I don't think that's right any more. With 2012 R2 they changed it from per socket to per-server (more precisely per pair of sockets Woah, nice! I'm going to look into that. I may be paying support on way too many copies of Datacenter.
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Jan 9, 2015 06:33
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parid posted:Woah, nice! I'm going to look into that. I may be paying support on way too many copies of Datacenter. I'll make it easy. http://download.microsoft.com/download/F/3/9/F39124F7-0177-463C-8A08-582463F96C9D/Windows_Server_2012_R2_Licensing_Datasheet.pdf 2nd page, right side chart, bottom line. Also 2nd page, left column, bottom paragraph.
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Jan 9, 2015 06:35
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KS posted:I'll make it easy. Said no one ever when it comes to Microsoft licensing
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Jan 9, 2015 07:18
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Jeoh posted:Said no one ever when it comes to Microsoft licensing
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Jan 9, 2015 07:28
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Jeoh posted:Said no one ever when it comes to Microsoft licensing Boy, isn't that the truth. I'm simultaneously dealing with a VDI deployment (so VDA subscriptions or SA) plus potentially moving laptops to Enterprise for Direct Access, plus negotiating Office 365, plus server licensing. I want to shoot myself.
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Jan 9, 2015 08:55
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Misogynist posted:All you lollygagging young'uns complaining about Microsoft licensing need to try pricing a datacenter-wide IBM product rollout by Processor Value Units. Or Oracle. "Is a core 75% of a normal processor or is that hyperthreading". pfffff
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Jan 9, 2015 09:01
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Wicaeed posted:Hyper-V We manage about 40 Hyper-V hosts and a handful of ESX hosts (work in an MSP) Yes, the datacentre licensing for hyper-v is pretty nice and can save you alot of money, especially if you work to the ideal of "split this stuff across as many servers as possible" Theres just alot of poo poo that annoys me about Hyper-V. Stuff like you can't see the ram/cpu usage of a server unless you jump onto each one and start running cmd/powershell commands, or you can drop $10k USD on System center to look at it.
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Jan 9, 2015 10:08
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I work with a very large Hyper-V installation. Multiple cluster.... over 1200 VMs. Its not going to blow anyone's skirt up but its a fine alternative to Vmware.
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Jan 9, 2015 16:36
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Syano posted:I work with a very large Hyper-V installation. Multiple cluster.... over 1200 VMs. Its not going to blow anyone's skirt up but its a fine alternative to Vmware. I'm assuming you have System Center? How are you backing up VMs and what do are you using for HA?
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Jan 9, 2015 16:51
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Tab8715 posted:I'm assuming you have System Center? How are you backing up VMs and what do are you using for HA? Yes we have system center. Backups are done with Netbackup. We don't back up whole VMs though. We only do application level backups. HA is taken care of via normal means. Everything is on shared storage and Hyper-V clusters.
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Jan 9, 2015 17:00
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Mr Shiny Pants posted:Or Oracle. "Is a core 75% of a normal processor or is that hyperthreading". pfffff And when did you purchase that proces-- 
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Jan 9, 2015 18:29
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mayodreams posted:My understanding is that you need only one copy of data center per virtual host, be it Hyper-V or VMware, and you can have unlimited virtual instances on that host. Then again, Microsoft licensing is black magic, so who really knows. This is our current understanding as well. When we redid our EA with Microsoft, even though we run VMware on the physical hosts, we have a datacenter license assigned to each physical host and we're covered 100%. MS signed off on it, and their licensing crew explained that it was cool. Misogynist posted:All you lollygagging young'uns complaining about Microsoft licensing need to try pricing a datacenter-wide IBM product rollout by Processor Value Units. I can't imagine, we have enough trouble with our Cognos licensing. I don't know much about it, but we have a consultant trying to figure out ILMT right now. I try to avoid anything to do with the IBM application itself and just support the VMware/Microsoft OS side of things. I think IBM didn't allow us to renew maintenance on it without a full blown audit of our entire network. I'm not sure, my boss and the BI team handle that stuff. skipdogg fucked around with this message at 18:49 on Jan 9, 2015 |
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Jan 9, 2015 18:45
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skipdogg posted:I can't imagine, we have enough trouble with our Cognos licensing. I don't know much about it, but we have a consultant trying to figure out ILMT right now. I try to avoid anything to do with the IBM application itself and just support the VMware/Microsoft OS side of things.
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Jan 9, 2015 19:21
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evol262 posted:Imagine IBM pricing every POWER system at 1 processor unit so you get a deal on Tivoli, then turning the screws as you slowly migrate to x86, with every additional SMP core being counted, then every additional SMT core, so it's 2012 and you can't even buy a server with less than 8 "cores", so your licensing costs have gone from $1M/yr to $15M/yr, See boneheaded moves. And they wonder why people are not buying IBM anymore. We had Tivoli backup, my god the per TB licensing was insane.
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Jan 9, 2015 19:34
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evol262 posted:Imagine IBM pricing every POWER system at 1 processor unit so you get a deal on Tivoli, then turning the screws as you slowly migrate to x86, with every additional SMP core being counted, then every additional SMT core, so it's 2012 and you can't even buy a server with less than 8 "cores", so your licensing costs have gone from $1M/yr to $15M/yr, Also, gently caress SONAS. skipdogg posted:I think IBM didn't allow us to renew maintenance on it without a full blown audit of our entire network. I'm not sure, my boss and the BI team handle that stuff.
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Jan 9, 2015 20:26
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I have installed some VMs via KVM on a Fedora 21 host. I want to know how much I can strip down the host system while keeping the ability to use graphical VMs. Does the host need X installed? I assume it doesn't need a desktop environment, since the VMs can be managed with libvirt's cli tools. Are the requirements the same for local and vnc use?
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Jan 11, 2015 09:58
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Death Vomit Wizard posted:I have installed some VMs via KVM on a Fedora 21 host. I want to know how much I can strip down the host system while keeping the ability to use graphical VMs. Does the host need X installed? I assume it doesn't need a desktop environment, since the VMs can be managed with libvirt's cli tools. Are the requirements the same for local and vnc use? You can use a minimal install plus the virtualization group, though you'd probably be ok just with virt-manager's dependencies. You need xauth (and only xauth) if you want to use virt-manager over ssh. Or you can manage libvirt from a remote system over qemu+ssh. Or enable "vnc_listen" in qemu.conf, get the vnc port with "virsh dumpxml $vm" or "virsh vncdisplay $vm" and connect to that.
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Jan 11, 2015 16:44
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Thanks, that is so helpful. Now, what would I do if I wanted to use the VMs from the machine itself? Edit: Wait, is that what your last option was for? Death Vomit Wizard fucked around with this message at 05:19 on Jan 12, 2015 |
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Jan 12, 2015 03:48
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Death Vomit Wizard posted:Thanks, that is so helpful. Now, what would I do if I wanted to use the VMs from the machine itself? You mean creating and running vms from a vt? You can do it over remote X with xauth. Or use ganeti. Or ovirt. Or kimchi, which is intended for this. Or if you want plain libvirt on a minimal install, you can create the libvirt XML by hand or use python-virtinst, which is a lot easier/nicer. Specify "console=ttyS0" in grub. VMs have serial attached by default, so configuring a serial console in the guest followed by "virsh console $vm" will work if you don't wanna use ssh or other means for some reason. Do you want graphical guests? Detailing exactly what you want (how to manage vms, create them, get consoles, graphical or serial console on guests) would help me answer.
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Jan 12, 2015 05:58
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Ah, I'm good now. I was mistakenly making the association that vnc = remote. You've given me more than enough to work with, but just since you asked: This is basically a light home server / htpc. I need at least some of the vms to be graphical. So far I have one Fedora VM installed and working. My first goal is to convert my host to "minimum install plus virtualization group" without losing the ability to use my (graphical) VM from the host. From there, I'll try using virt-install to add windows, centos and freebsd vms. Once I have that working I want to tackle vga-passthrough for my nvidia. I don't really care about remote use.
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Jan 12, 2015 17:40
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Death Vomit Wizard posted:Ah, I'm good now. I was mistakenly making the association that vnc = remote. You've given me more than enough to work with, but just since you asked: Ah, ok. KVM doesn't require anything host-side to have/use graphical guests. Even Virtualbox doesn't, actually. Make sure IOMMU/VT-d is working, and passthrough should be a gimme. If you don't have VT-d/IOMMU, though, you're dead in the water.
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Jan 12, 2015 18:41
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Okay, i'm looking to do some virtual lab stuff, and I want to make sure I don't need anything else on my computer: i7 2600k overclocked to 4.5ghz (Should I drop the overclock?) 16GB RAM 120GB SSD 2x 1TB spare drives for separating out storage for the VMs. I am thinking I might put in a new larger SSD in as my primary, and possibly use the smaller SSD as the jumping off point for my VMs. Is there anything else I need to add/remove?
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Jan 14, 2015 18:39
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Gothmog1065 posted:Okay, i'm looking to do some virtual lab stuff, and I want to make sure I don't need anything else on my computer: Double the memory, skip the SSD, depending on what you wanna lab.
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Jan 14, 2015 19:44
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evol262 posted:Double the memory, skip the SSD, depending on what you wanna lab.
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Jan 14, 2015 20:05
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Misogynist posted:Or go with a much larger SSD if you don't mind stopping and starting your VMs when you need them. 120 GB is gonna run you like three VMs unless you're doing little thin-provisioned Linux things in Vagrant or whatever. Thanks. I was looking to get a larger SSD (I was dumb for getting the 120). I've already got 3, but they're on one of the platter drives to save room.
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Jan 14, 2015 20:44
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Okay goons, I am finally getting around to learning ESXi, and I"m having a problem, and this may or may not be a quick question: I'm installing ESXi inside a Virtualbox machine. However, I happen to have a realtek adapter, and it seems ESXi's main program doesn't support Realtek drivers. I've attempted to change the Virtualbox settings so it's "Generic" but it doesn't seem to work and it keeps kicking me back off saying it couldn't find the network adapater. Is there something I can do within Virtualbox to get the network adapter to work, or am I going to have to load the drivers into the .iso and boot it that way?
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Jan 15, 2015 22:17
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Gothmog1065 posted:Okay goons, I am finally getting around to learning ESXi, and I"m having a problem, and this may or may not be a quick question: Use e1000/intel in virtualbox. Your physical adapter isn't presented to the VM unless you're doing passthrough (which virtualbox probably doesn't do). ESXi will work with that. You might be able to load a VIB, but it's gonna be a bad experience unless virtualbox manifested the ability to do nested virt all of a sudden. Install Linux and use KVM. Or get spare hardware you can install ESXi on natively. Or pay for workstation and install it there. Don't try to nest ESXi inside virtualbox.
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Jan 15, 2015 22:24
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Gothmog1065 posted:ESXi inside of Virtualbox oh god You don't have a physical box you can install ESXi on instead? I'm not even sure that is supported.
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Jan 15, 2015 22:25
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VMware's course labs use ESXi on top of ESXi, and you can run Hyper-V over ESXi. You can also run ESXi on VMware Workstation. Whether or not it works in VirtualBox is another thing.
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Jan 15, 2015 22:28
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Gyshall posted:oh god I did, but I didn't research properly and decided to use the hardware as my new computer and then found out after I sold my other computer off. Oh well, hindsight and all that. HOWEVER, if I fail, I fail. I'll have to work something out, I'll let you know if ESXi can actually work in VirtualBox sometime tonight.
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Jan 15, 2015 22:45
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Gothmog1065 posted:I did, but I didn't research properly and decided to use the hardware as my new computer and then found out after I sold my other computer off. Oh well, hindsight and all that. Virtualbox doesn't do nested virt. Pay for workstation.
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Jan 15, 2015 23:38
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You can do some (kind of lovely) nested virt in the free VMware Player. Although I haven't tried ESXi under it specifically.
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Jan 16, 2015 02:08
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Use VMware player and set the hypervisor to use the e1000 NIC. Should be fine on player: https://communities.vmware.com/docs/DOC-8970 Just make sure you configure things appropriately. Don't expect to run the next AWS out of it or anything.
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Jan 16, 2015 02:45
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Docjowles posted:You can do some (kind of lovely) nested virt in the free VMware Player. Although I haven't tried ESXi under it specifically. The VM is going to be identical to Workstation, you just don't get features like snapshots and clones.
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Jan 16, 2015 02:59
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openstack question. I don't have a openstack test environment setup currently, so i can't just play with it to answer this myself. Is it possible to back an openstack VM with a direct iscsi lun? I have a current ovirt setup that I use for my test environment, and i am interested in converting it to openstack. I however have a lot of VMs that are running off of direct luns for their storage, which I would really like to convert over.
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Jan 17, 2015 16:44
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adorai posted:openstack question. I don't have a openstack test environment setup currently, so i can't just play with it to answer this myself. Good news and bad news. Good news is that Cinder can use LUNs for storage (you generally build LUNs from a glance image). The bad news is that I don't think there's a friendly way to import LUNs, and I don't know the Cinder backend stuff well enough to give you code that'll do it. You may have some luck asking on openstack-operators@, though. You can import to glance from a lot of different sources, but they're all ultimately files. Exporting the oVirt VM to OVF and importing that to Glance, then dumping it onto Cinder would be your best bet. But Openstack is not traditional virt, is not intended to import existing "pets" as virtual machines, and probably isn't the best solution if you want to run persistent VMs on iSCSI LUNs.
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Jan 17, 2015 16:57
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evol262 posted:But Openstack is not traditional virt, is not intended to import existing "pets" as virtual machines, and probably isn't the best solution if you want to run persistent VMs on iSCSI LUNs.
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Jan 17, 2015 17:01
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