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I wholeheartedly recommend A Land Fit For Heroes, but potential readers need to understand that Morgan goes a lot farther than any other writer when it comes to turning fantasy tropes on their heads.
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Jan 10, 2015 03:02
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Ornamented Death posted:I wholeheartedly recommend A Land Fit For Heroes, but potential readers need to understand that Morgan goes a lot farther than any other writer when it comes to turning fantasy tropes on their heads. How does it compare to the Takeshi Kovacs books?
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Jan 10, 2015 03:24
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HIJK posted:How does it compare to the Takeshi Kovacs books? I haven't read all of the Kovacs books yet so I'll have to let someone else weigh in on that.
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Jan 10, 2015 03:33
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HIJK posted:How does it compare to the Takeshi Kovacs books? As someone who loved all the Kovacs books and hated how Land Fit for Heroes ended, I'd say it compared very poorly. In particular because the fantasy trilogy seemed like it had about one book worth of good ideas, and Morgan just expanded and meandered his way into a trilogy that went nowhere in particular and concluded with nothing interesting. Whereas each of the Kovacs books is, for my money, extremely well written, with nice tight plots and interesting characters. I can't pretend to be measured in my opinion here, as I love all the Kovacs books and have read them multiple times, and I was actually angry with how disappointing the last book in the Land Fit for Heroes was. But at least I will tell you that if you loved the Kovacs books, that's no guarantee you'll like Morgan's attempt at fantasy.
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Jan 10, 2015 03:47
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McCoy Pauley posted:As someone who loved all the Kovacs books and hated how Land Fit for Heroes ended, I'd say it compared very poorly. In particular because the fantasy trilogy seemed like it had about one book worth of good ideas, and Morgan just expanded and meandered his way into a trilogy that went nowhere in particular and concluded with nothing interesting. Whereas each of the Kovacs books is, for my money, extremely well written, with nice tight plots and interesting characters. It sounds like I'm secretly you, that's I feel about the Kovacs books. I'll pick up the first book at a library. Thanks for the comparison!
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Jan 10, 2015 03:59
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Ornamented Death posted:I wholeheartedly recommend A Land Fit For Heroes, but potential readers need to understand that Morgan goes a lot farther than any other writer when it comes to turning fantasy tropes on their heads. This also appeals to me, because the things I loved the most about the Black Company was how it strayed from standard fantasy tropes, especially where the magic and grey morality is concerned. I'll probably start with Malazan, though, since I have them already.
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Jan 10, 2015 04:30
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As a consumer I don't buy books based on Hugo awards at all. I find things via this thread and some good rss/podcasts. You can put a "Hugo award winner!!!!" sticker on your book if you like, it'll just disappear into the same crevice of my brain as the "Now a major motion picture" sticker.
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Jan 10, 2015 05:22
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I'm not sure I read books because they win awards, but I talk about Hugo nominees with friends at the bar and stuff. Probably read at least Ancillary Justice ultimately because of that. Anyway, last year I finished reading everything Lois McMaster Bujold has written (signed copy of The Spirit Ring: check). And I discovered the Elfhome series by Wen Spencer which I think is awesome. I haven't seen that series mentioned yet in this thread. It sounds like boring fantasy (magic and elves really?), quickly turns into sci-fi instead and has a small dash of romance in there as well (which some people may dislike, but I thought was fine. Definitely not as bad as you might fear from reading the book's blurbs. Tinker's back cover blathers about her awkward first date which makes no sense because its less than a chapter. And hilarious.). I definitely think its a fun read. Anyway this year to start, I think I'm going to finish up everything Iain Banks ever wrote. Already read most of the culture novels but there's a few more things I have gotten my hands on yet. Starting with State of the Art and Inversions. I'm also on the lookout for good non-dytopian sci-fi. I'm sick of "in the future, things will suck." A good part of why I like the Culture novels right there. Well, that and how well thought out the world is. And...well its not like we need more Banks praise.
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Jan 10, 2015 06:07
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I just learned something I never knew: Bester's The Stars My Destination apparently had the first popular, and fairly accurate, account of what it's like to experience synesthesia. I just finished the book a couple of months ago, and I'm not positive what I made of it. It felt like it definitely influenced Neuromancer, which is one of my favorite books, so I kind of got the same effect that people get when they read LotR too late in life: all of the plot devices felt underutilized or less effective than the works that followed. Also, it felt like the book may have really influenced a lot of the aesthetic of Hyperion as well, but maybe that's me drawing comparisons where there really aren't any.
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Jan 10, 2015 06:25
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General Battuta posted:I don't know of any market that instantly shitcans short stories - someone reads everything, if only a slush reader. In terms of long form, editors are probably getting your work via your agent, and if you're winning a long form Hugo you're probably already at a point where you don't need to worry about being ignored. Absolutely; even major short story markets read short stories by unknowns and get your "no thanks" back in a day or two, it's pretty impressive. ravenkult posted:If it's indie press, I can believe that a Hugo or even a Nebula would blow up your sales. If you're published by one of the big guys, less so, but still good for marketing, at least. I'd also expect something like the Dick award (paperback originals) to have an effect on sales, just cos paperback originals normally don't get big print runs and lots of promotion. Prop Wash posted:As a consumer I don't buy books based on Hugo awards at all. I find things via this thread and some good rss/podcasts. You can put a "Hugo award winner!!!!" sticker on your book if you like, it'll just disappear into the same crevice of my brain as the "Now a major motion picture" sticker. Thing is, do they/we discuss Hugo nominees and winners more than average? I'd expect so, but it's difficult to disentangle cause and effect, especially with fan-voted awards like the Hugos. Hedrigall posted:People need to stop loving using the word "snark" "The Land Fit For Heroes is what I would describe as grimboojum, an adjective I would also apply to Abercrombie's First Law." Better?
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Jan 10, 2015 06:53
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McCoy Pauley posted:As someone who loved all the Kovacs books and hated how Land Fit for Heroes ended, I'd say it compared very poorly. In particular because the fantasy trilogy seemed like it had about one book worth of good ideas, and Morgan just expanded and meandered his way into a trilogy that went nowhere in particular and concluded with nothing interesting. Whereas each of the Kovacs books is, for my money, extremely well written, with nice tight plots and interesting characters. I didn't like the Kovoacs books nearly as much, and my opinion of Land Fit for Heroes is similar. Note I didn't hate the Kovacs books, I just didn't think they were that great. I found the first 2 books of Land to be really good and engaging, then the third is a meandering mess which provides a terrible conclusion.
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Jan 10, 2015 08:10
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I had a read of "The Magician" after it got mentioned positively in the thread and pu it down about three quarters of the way through because I didn't want to deal with the (in certain ways understandably) broken main character in the book for that long. The book very much made me think of this article on the Ivy League in the US: http://www.newrepublic.com/article/118747/ivy-league-schools-are-overrated-send-your-kids-elsewhere quote:Our system of elite education manufactures young people who are smart and talented and driven, yes, but also anxious, timid, and lost, with little intellectual curiosity and a stunted sense of purpose: trapped in a bubble of privilege, heading meekly in the same direction, great at what they’re doing but with no idea why they’re doing it. Not a direct match of course but to me many of the things in the article shine through in the book. One thing I found especially striking in the book is that there is no discussion or planning encouraged or aided by the school of what to do after. They are just told "Now that you have graduated from our elite institution you can do *anything*!". Note that the Author himself went through Harvard and then got a PhD at Yale.
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Jan 10, 2015 11:30
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Munin posted:I had a read of "The Magician" after it got mentioned positively in the thread and pu it down about three quarters of the way through because I didn't want to deal with the (in certain ways understandably) broken main character in the book for that long. That's pretty neat actually. I do think it's worth sticking with the books. They're largely about ultimately getting past all that.
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Jan 10, 2015 15:29
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Munin posted:I had a read of "The Magician" after it got mentioned positively in the thread and pu it down about three quarters of the way through because I didn't want to deal with the (in certain ways understandably) broken main character in the book for that long. Oh man if you put it down before they get to Fillory then you missed out! Also, the trilogy has a very intentional growth arc for Quentin. He does change.
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Jan 10, 2015 15:32
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Speaking of the Hugos, guess who's back : http://file770.com/?p=20315
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Jan 10, 2015 20:12
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What's the coziest of cozy fantasy novels? I'm talking villages, taverns, young men japing around in castle training yards, all that junk. Preferably just one book (or at most a trilogy), not a massive series. And it has to be well written!
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Jan 11, 2015 14:12
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Well... you said cozy, but then described pastoral, but I'll go with cozy. The Goblin Emperor is pretty heartwarming. Also, and it seems to be either really miss or really hit with anglo readers, Stranger by Max Frei. The most concise way I can think of to describe it is "imagine if Richard Castle got invited to join the Aurors."
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Jan 11, 2015 14:30
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The Sword in the Stone.
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Jan 11, 2015 14:32
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Not sure whether it's what you mean by cozy, but the most heartwarming fantasy book I ever read is Bridge of Birds.
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Jan 11, 2015 14:41
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Hedrigall posted:What's the coziest of cozy fantasy novels? I'm talking villages, taverns, young men japing around in castle training yards, all that junk. Blue Moon Rising by Simon Green. (or Simon R Greene) It's got all the main stuff you want, it's a great story, and it's a complete story in one book OR you can read the other books in the series if you want, but it's not required.
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Jan 11, 2015 15:22
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Hedrigall posted:What's the coziest of cozy fantasy novels? I'm talking villages, taverns, young men japing around in castle training yards, all that junk. I'd say that "The Elfin Ship" by James Blaylock is exactly what you're looking for. There are follow up books, but it's completely stand alone. And completely cozy.
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Jan 11, 2015 17:24
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Hedrigall posted:What's the coziest of cozy fantasy novels? I'm talking villages, taverns, young men japing around in castle training yards, all that junk. The Misenchanted Sword by Lawrence Watt-Evans should fit your bill, also Bridge of Birds. Any book in the Prydain Chronicles. Oh, for sf, Harm's Way by Colin Greenland. Hieronymous Alloy fucked around with this message at 18:20 on Jan 11, 2015 |
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Jan 11, 2015 17:55
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Stardust.
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Jan 11, 2015 19:08
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Hedrigall posted:Oh man if you put it down before they get to Fillory then you missed out! Yeah, I definitely had it down as a coming of age novel so I am not surprised that he does. I read it up to the start of his life of debauchery in Manhattan. I am entirely unsurprised that Fillory does in fact turn out to be a thing. From what I've read so far it is well plotted and has done a good job highlighting the main character's (and first person narrator) blind spots on several occasions; with him remaining uncomprehending or oblivious on several of those. I already mentioned the way it satirises the Ivy League experience. Anyway, I would recommend it to other people and will most likely finish it at some point but right now I think I'll follow one of the feelgood fantasy recommendations. 
Munin fucked around with this message at 19:27 on Jan 11, 2015 |
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Jan 11, 2015 19:21
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coyo7e posted:Stardust. Actually, yeah, given specifically what you were asking for, Neil Gaiman's Stardust is the best choice. Get the version with illustrations by Charles Vess. The other books I recommended are all great books but they're more "leave you with a cosy feeling afterwards" than they are the fantasy equivalent of the cosy mystery (with the possible exception of Misenchanted Sword, which is probably the peak of 1980's American pulp fantasy). Hieronymous Alloy fucked around with this message at 23:57 on Jan 11, 2015 |
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Jan 11, 2015 23:19
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Just finished Graydon Saunders's The March North. I really have to recommend it to people who like The Black Company- it considers a world where hyperpowerful magicians of the Taken kind rule everywhere, except in one land, where people know how to combine into magical squads and so are able to control them. It's a first book, so it has some issues because of that, but to me it was really good.
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Jan 12, 2015 00:02
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cultureulterior posted:Just finished Graydon Saunders's The March North. I really have to recommend it to people who like The Black Company- it considers a world where hyperpowerful magicians of the Taken kind rule everywhere, except in one land, where people know how to combine into magical squads and so are able to control them. It's a first book, so it has some issues because of that, but to me it was really good. Sold!
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Jan 12, 2015 01:55
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Onean posted:On a separate note, I mentioned Joel Shepherd's Cassandra Kresnov series a while back as a recommendation for someone, and the third book in the second trilogy just came out yesterday. I just wanted to say thanks for making me aware of the second trilogy! Loved the first but somehow missed that Shepherd was cranking out more. Actually this is the best time to learn of a new trilogy, when the third book is freshly available!
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Jan 12, 2015 04:36
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:Actually, yeah, given specifically what you were asking for, Neil Gaiman's Stardust is the best choice. Get the version with illustrations by Charles Vess.
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Jan 12, 2015 06:15
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coyo7e posted:There is a certain lyricism to certain authors and eras, such as Vance's Mazirian the Magician, or Hugh Cook, which are extremely cozy to me but are sometimes a bit darker than I can think of being cozyish.. I'd say Fritz Leiber and Robert Howard and Douglas Adams are all cozy, and might suggest any number of early 20th century Brit authors maybe. The Hobbit is one of my favorite kids' stories, but I also grew up on Beowulf and Native American myths so any oral history style prose could maybe suffice for me as cozy. I guess it depends whether you mean "traditional fantasy" or "comfortable fantasy" or some variation or mix. Lieber I think you're onto something, especially with some of the Lankhmar stuff, but Howard has a dark, rough edge even setting aside the inherent racism; he's far more exciting than comfortable. He knew what he was doing when he put in all those scenes of women whipping each other. I think I've read almost all of Vance's published stuff and he's always enjoyable but it's all so highly mannered; though, again, I guess that counts if we're talking "like a Cozy mystery." Adams is too original and unique and satirical for me to put him in any category but his own. He's fun to read, sure, but comfortable? That bit in Restaurant where the cow that wants to be eaten comes out and introduces itself? The Hobbit probably counts but it's hard for me to think of it as a book in a genre and not as a cultural icon. Another interesting one to consider would be Lord Dunsany's stuff. I dunno. This is an interesting little genre game to think about. I haven't actually read any Hugh Cook so I'll have to give him a look. Hieronymous Alloy fucked around with this message at 06:29 on Jan 12, 2015 |
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Jan 12, 2015 06:24
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Oh. Some of Robert Rankin's stuff could be seen as 'cosy', in that the bulk of the action takes place in Brentford, with the protagonists mostly being intent on going to the pub as frequently as possible. He can be a bit of an acquired taste, because his writing is full of running gags and general silliness, but I love him and you might also!
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Jan 12, 2015 07:05
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Hedrigall posted:What's the coziest of cozy fantasy novels? I'm talking villages, taverns, young men japing around in castle training yards, all that junk. Technically 99% of The Name of the Wind takes place in a tavern. 
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Jan 12, 2015 13:00
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Ok, thanks for the recommendations everyone. I will look into a lot of those books.Megazver posted:Well... you said cozy, but then described pastoral, but I'll go with cozy. The Goblin Emperor is pretty heartwarming. Also, and it seems to be either really miss or really hit with anglo readers, Stranger by Max Frei. The most concise way I can think of to describe it is "imagine if Richard Castle got invited to join the Aurors." The Goblin Emperor sounds great and I bought it for my Kindle right after reading your post! Someone else mentioned Bridge Of Birds, which I already have and will read soon. Stardust sounds great too—I enjoyed the movie a lot and I think it'll be fun to revisit in its original form. When I said "cozy" I didn't know it was a particular subgenre or term in genre fiction. I just meant a book that is kinda warm and inviting, and yes, heartwarming, with characters you love; overall kind of a simpler/"nicer" type of fantasy than GRRM and the like; maybe "pastoral" was a better term. I love the grim stuff too but right now I just have a hankering for warmer fare. To give you some ideas of books I've found "cozy": - all the Harry Potter books (especially all the school stuff that occupies a lot of each book—apart from book 7—before the danger inevitably starts) - the languid first half of Fellowship of the Ring, which is only punctuated by occasional danger: up to and including the lengthy stay in Rivendell - a lot of Discworld books, especially anything set in Lancre - I loved the poo poo out of Redemption of Althalus by David Eddings as a kid, it's like the first big fantasy novel I read, but I understand that if I tried to read it these days it'd be pretty awful - even ASoIaF has its cozier moments for me (pretty much just the first book though): the stuff in Winterfell in its happier times, as well as Jon going through his training in the Night's Watch - oh and Howl's Moving Castle (the book by Diana Wynne Jones and the Ghibli film, both of which have tons of fun stuff with Sophie hanging out in the castle and chatting to Calcifer etc), and I guess Spirited Away felt like this for me too, although that's not a book Nevvy Z posted:Technically 99% of The Name of the Wind takes place in a tavern. As bad as this book was, I gotta say it nailed the cozy aspect. I enjoyed the cavorting around school buildings and taverns in the city, as well as the framing-story stuff set in Kvothe's inn. But yeah, despite the warm atmosphere I despised most of this book. I hope I'm doing a good job of describing what I'm after 
Hedrigall fucked around with this message at 13:55 on Jan 12, 2015 |
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Jan 12, 2015 13:49
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Terry Brooks Magic Kingdom for Sale set of books might work for you.
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Jan 12, 2015 14:23
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Seriously, Sword in the Stone by T. H. White, if you haven't read it. It's available as a stand alone novel or slightly reworked as part of The Once and Future king. It's a lovely and very cozy description of an idyllic childhood. The kind of book you can wrap up in and very much in-line to what you're describing. Beautifully writen as well.
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Jan 12, 2015 14:36
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Hedrigall posted:Ok, thanks for the recommendations everyone. I will look into a lot of those books. Oh man Redemption of Althalus owned. Yeah it was kind of dumb, but it was great light fun. I named my first NWN RP character after him. That was almost a decade ago.
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Jan 12, 2015 14:36
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Strom Cuzewon posted:Oh man Redemption of Althalus owned. Yeah it was kind of dumb, but it was great light fun. I named my first NWN RP character after him. I loving loved it. Maybe I will reread it. The bit near the end where he goes back in time to the events of the prologue, that blew my mind.
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Jan 12, 2015 14:47
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Kalenn Istarion posted:Terry Brooks Magic Kingdom for Sale set of books might work for you. Yeah these are actually pretty fun, though only the first (maybe the second) qualifies as "well written" imho. If you like Dianna Wynne Jones just read everything she's ever written, I have yet to read anything of hers that was bad, and it all fits that comfy fun feeling you're talking about. I'd especially recommend "Dark Lord of Derkholm" and its companion book, The Tough Guide to Fantasyland. Another good author to look at if you like Dianna Wynne Jones is John Bellairs; look up his Face in the Frost. EDIT: Oh, let's not forget the classics! The Last Unicorn by Peter S. Beagle. You know, the guy who wrote the introduction essay for the old American edition of the Lord of the Rings. Hieronymous Alloy fucked around with this message at 15:27 on Jan 12, 2015 |
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Jan 12, 2015 15:22
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Alexander's Prydain books might qualify as well.
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Jan 12, 2015 15:37
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After giving it about a week I went to Joel's Twitter to see if anything interesting had popped up about Originator. There's a couple there, one about how Ghost in the Shell was the first inspiration for Cassandra, and another more interesting, VERY spoilery blurb about 23 Years On Fire, the first book in the second set. Some interesting, non-spoiler quotes: quote:Because it follows the theme I’ve used all through the Cassandra Kresnov series, throwing all kinds of problems at Sandy that she can’t solve with a bullet. ... [I]f there’s any problem I enjoy throwing Sandy’s way the most, it’s her trying to figure out exactly who and what she’s fighting for. We all know she’s lethal, and using those skills is the easy bit. The hard bit is ‘why’, and to what end? quote:I also find the lack of this kind of thing completely dull in a lot of action books/movies. I like taking Sandy out of her comfort zone, and giving her things she’s never done before, and has no idea how to do except to try her best and learn on the job. She’s on a journey to learn about herself, and that’s the more important part of the story than just blowing stuff up. And so your Bourne Ultimatums, your Takens, your other bare handed killers only really interest me if they get to do stuff unfamiliar to them. But most of them, unfortunately, are exactly the same person at the end of the movie than they are at the beginning.
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