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Ambaire posted:This. Once you learn the dwarf fortress ui, the speed at which operations may be performed with the keyboard as opposed to using the mouse is insane. It's one reason why I've never really been able to get into Gnomoria, since the r-click menus for designations suck. Very much this. With the amount of options in DF any dropdown menu would be disgusting to look at at take forever to traverse. I'll take 3-5 key deep labyrinth hotkey trees anyday. Although gnomoria was poo poo for a bunch of other reasons too.
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Jan 17, 2015 01:57
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I have a wounded veteran who, despite our best treatment efforts, can't grasp and can't stand. She seems to be pulling herself around on her elbows in a futile quest to store an owned item. Is there anything I can do with her, or should I stick her under a drawbridge and put her out of her misery?
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Jan 17, 2015 02:06
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KERNOD WEL posted:I have a wounded veteran who, despite our best treatment efforts, can't grasp and can't stand. She seems to be pulling herself around on her elbows in a futile quest to store an owned item. Is there anything I can do with her, or should I stick her under a drawbridge and put her out of her misery? I suppose you could use her as bait
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Jan 17, 2015 02:09
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I was going to say something about the inconsistency of ui concepts being one of the main problems with it but I realise now that I have absolutely no idea if that's actually the case because the ui is so complicated.
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Jan 17, 2015 04:30
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The UI is really inconsistent. For the whole start of the game I use the arrow keys to navigate menus, create my world, create search parameters for a starting place, pick a place, etc. Then when you load into the game the menus are now navigated by + and -. Thanks for training me for 20 minutes to use the arrows keys though. There might be more than just that, but I was getting a headache from this poo poo UI so I turned it off.
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Jan 17, 2015 04:43
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KyloWinter posted:The UI is really inconsistent. For the whole start of the game I use the arrow keys to navigate menus, create my world, create search parameters for a starting place, pick a place, etc. Then when you load into the game the menus are now navigated by + and -. Thanks for training me for 20 minutes to use the arrows keys though.  No, you pick your starting place with uhkl
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Jan 17, 2015 05:09
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I think the hours-long headache of twisting your melon around the madcap interface until something snaps in your noggin and it all suddenly seems like it makes sense is an initiation rite at this point tbh
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Jan 17, 2015 05:11
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This is a dead horse. In 2015, in Somethingawful, Kylowinter beat this dead horse. It is festering.
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Jan 17, 2015 05:12
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Spanish Matlock posted:This is a dead horse. In 2015, in Somethingawful, Kylowinter beat this dead horse. It is festering. If you check his post history he's just a really low effort troll. The UI talk has to come up every 10-20 pages though, through whatever means.
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Jan 17, 2015 06:01
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Gibbo posted:If you check his post history he's just a really low effort troll. The UI talk has to come up every 10-20 pages though, through whatever means. Is it trolling if no one got mad and a few people offered advice while everyone else agreed? 
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Jan 17, 2015 06:04
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The UI is poo poo.
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Jan 17, 2015 06:10
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There's no point in talking about it because it's not getting better any time soon.
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Jan 17, 2015 06:46
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GreyPowerVan posted:Is it trolling if no one got mad and a few people offered advice while everyone else agreed? Any kind of response means you're a puppet on his strings.
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Jan 17, 2015 07:01
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TOOT BOOT posted:There's no point in talking about it because it's not getting better any time soon. I'm just responding to people trying to raise the thread threat level or something because god forbid someone doesn't immediately want to learn a set up where around three different hotkeys are used to define the "look" command for different contexts and types of looking. I'll defend the keyboard / hotkey control scheme but the lack of consistency is pretty appalling.
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Jan 17, 2015 08:38
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KyloWinter posted:The UI is really inconsistent. For the whole start of the game I use the arrow keys to navigate menus, create my world, create search parameters for a starting place, pick a place, etc. Then when you load into the game the menus are now navigated by + and -. Thanks for training me for 20 minutes to use the arrows keys though. Hahah well basically it's very logical, it's just that it's hard to see the logic at first. I think in Toady's head it was something like "whatever the most prominent thing on a given menu is gets the arrow keys, other things get subsequently less good navigation keys" so in menus the arrow keys go to menu selections, in the game itself the arrow keys are for panning and in site selection they are for moving around the region while uhkm are for lower level site selection. This is mostly learned by memorization though, just be confident that it'll stick at some point and then it'll all be very fast. It wasn't really built for easy learning but rather for speedy use. It's like learning how to type without looking at the keyboard. e: Actually I think the interface is much easier to use for people who type blind and was sort of made with that in mind. I don't have to look to see where "l" is to build a well for instance. I imagine it's pretty annoying if you have to look to see what you're doing if there's no single consistent set of keys for everything. Yeah this game is basically really really nerdy. Shibawanko fucked around with this message at 08:55 on Jan 17, 2015 |
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Jan 17, 2015 08:52
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Shibawanko posted:Hahah well basically it's very logical, it's just that it's hard to see the logic at first. I think in Toady's head it was something like "whatever the most prominent thing on a given menu is gets the arrow keys, other things get subsequently less good navigation keys" so in menus the arrow keys go to menu selections, in the game itself the arrow keys are for panning and in site selection they are for moving around the region while uhkm are for lower level site selection. This is mostly learned by memorization though, just be confident that it'll stick at some point and then it'll all be very fast. It wasn't really built for easy learning but rather for speedy use. It's like learning how to type without looking at the keyboard. So my familiarity with dwarf fortress is dependent on the fact that my keyboard has no letters on it?
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Jan 17, 2015 09:42
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after a while you don't need the menus it's just b-c for a chair, bCw for walls and you don't even think about the lovely UI loving irritating to learn though. what does get me is that some menus use - and + and some use the arrow keys that's just silly.
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Jan 17, 2015 09:42
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Spanish Matlock posted:So my familiarity with dwarf fortress is dependent on the fact that my keyboard has no letters on it? why would you buy a keyboard without letters on it
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Jan 17, 2015 09:45
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ghetto wormhole posted:why would you buy a keyboard without letters on it Ha! What am I, some kind of techno hipster? I bought a really cheap keyboard and let things take their natural course.
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Jan 17, 2015 09:47
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Spanish Matlock posted:Ha! What am I, some kind of techno hipster? I bought a really cheap keyboard and let things take their natural course. You should use it to play Systems Nominal.
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Jan 17, 2015 11:32
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I love when dwarves make artifacts depicting the nobles surrounded by the things they hate. *Stukos Gravelfill is surrounded by the large roaches*
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Jan 17, 2015 11:44
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ghetto wormhole posted:why would you buy a keyboard without letters on it I got one for my last birthday. It was hell for a couple of weeks, but now my typing speed is about 40% higher than it used to be (and I wasn't exactly a slouch before.)
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Jan 17, 2015 11:52
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Moridin920 posted:after a while you don't need the menus it's just b-c for a chair, bCw for walls and you don't even think about the lovely UI I learned Dwarf Fortress over a long weekend when my then girlfriend was out of town. I watched 20 hours of tutorial videos and spent at least 15 hours playing. And it stuck. I'm glad I learned the game in college – there's no way I'd have the time to muscle through all the bullshit now.
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Jan 17, 2015 12:00
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gently caress my face, things got dramatic. First, my fantastic hunter get into a mood and started demanding plant cloth that I didn't have for his masterpiece crossbow. Welp, to the caverns we go in search of wild pig tails. After I manage to locate a patch, the gatherers are beset by a giant olm. One well-placed punch in the throat later, the sheriff is carrying the carcass up and out while the flowerpickers followed suit. There was a troll chilling out by the bowyer's desk, enthralled by what the moody guy was doing. The sheriff immediately dropped the meat and went at the ugly, armed with nothing but his fists and no militia to back him up. After some back and forth with the troll getting horrified by his ferocity and fighting back, it turned into a ten-man curbstomping in the manufacturing corridor. One man got his cheekbone punched to mush, one got grabbed by his ankle and had his foot wrenched all the way in the wrong direction, even the sheriff got his arm broken by a lucky countergrip. Before anyone could succumb to the surprise wrestler, the fat village noble turned up and buried his bronze pick handle-deep into its skull. Time to invent a hospital system.
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Jan 17, 2015 14:09
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So if I start a new game and my liaison outpost immediately doesn't show up, it's probably because I managed to start on a piece of land that isn't connected to the mountainhome's home continent, right? I find it difficult to believe that I'm so unlucky that they're all dead already.
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Jan 17, 2015 14:41
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The last time I was going to play a big version was just about to come out, and someone had worked out how to mod an isometric view into the game, what is this called, and does it work with the latest version? Is it part of this newbie pack in the op? The op is a bit outdated right?
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Jan 17, 2015 15:37
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DiabloStarCraft posted:The last time I was going to play a big version was just about to come out, and someone had worked out how to mod an isometric view into the game, what is this called, and does it work with the latest version? Is it part of this newbie pack in the op? The op is a bit outdated right? What you're thinking of is Stonesense, but you can't actually play the game with it. It's more for screencaps and such.
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Jan 17, 2015 16:04
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Solid Poopsnake posted:What you're thinking of is Stonesense, but you can't actually play the game with it. It's more for screencaps and such. I thought there was a thing to make stonesense replace the primary view for the game or something?
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Jan 17, 2015 16:56
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What's with all of the content lately? Did someone spike Toady's water supply with Adderall or something? I'm not complaining by any means mind you.
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Jan 17, 2015 17:58
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Warbird posted:What's with all of the content lately? Did someone spike Toady's water supply with Adderall or something? I'm not complaining by any means mind you. To summarize the earlier discussion, it's just the product of years of under-the-hood work.
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Jan 17, 2015 18:01
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Lurdiak posted:So if I start a new game and my liaison outpost immediately doesn't show up, it's probably because I managed to start on a piece of land that isn't connected to the mountainhome's home continent, right? I find it difficult to believe that I'm so unlucky that they're all dead already. It's something like six months before they appear, isn't it?
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Jan 17, 2015 18:53
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I seem to have found a map with toxic air in my current Warlock game  Literally everything that comes onto the map including my "livestock" I started with (dwarven prisoners) dies of suffocation immediately on entering the map. The edge is covered with corpses. What the gently caress Dorf Fort. e: oh I take that back, some Kiwis are surviving Seriously, 50 units croaked on entering the map wtf Flesh Forge fucked around with this message at 19:02 on Jan 17, 2015 |
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Jan 17, 2015 18:55
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Kenning posted:I learned Dwarf Fortress over a long weekend when my then girlfriend was out of town. I watched 20 hours of tutorial videos and spent at least 15 hours playing. And it stuck. I'm glad I learned the game in college – there's no way I'd have the time to muscle through all the bullshit now. rofl okay. Gotta study before I can play.
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Jan 17, 2015 19:48
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KyloWinter posted:rofl okay. Gotta study before I can play. Contact bay12 support, explain the problems you're having and see if they'll give you a refund?
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Jan 17, 2015 20:08
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Spacefox has grown on me since using it for my baby overseer updates. 
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Jan 17, 2015 20:14
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KyloWinter posted:rofl okay. Gotta study before I can play. That guy's a tool and a sissy. I picked up Dwarf Fortress immediately. Most of us do unless there's some level of brain damage on the part of the player.
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Jan 17, 2015 20:18
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It is totally OK to not like a game 
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Jan 17, 2015 20:31
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The trick is to start playing eight years ago and learn every bit of added complexity since then as it comes.
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Jan 17, 2015 20:32
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PublicOpinion posted:The trick is to start playing eight years ago and learn every bit of added complexity since then as it comes. I would not have enjoyed 2D dwarf fortress, tbh. A college acquaintance tried to get me into dwarf fortress a few years ago using the default tileset, and I balked at it and mocked him for trying to bend spoons with his mind . It is a Matrix joke, you see, because nothing but gibberish on the screen and past-me is, was, will have been, and always has been oh-so-clever.  I got started with DF2012 using a graphics pack that actually made a barrel look like a barrel (and for some reason my dwarves could be pendants and my goods were weighted in palm trees, but whatever). The game is so much more approachable now with the Lazy Newb Starter Pack Omnibundle Express Suite doodad.
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Jan 17, 2015 20:35
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Well, more like 7 and a quarter years ago. I started on the first 3d version. Siege pathfinding was incredibly broken at the time, and when the version that fixed it came around my fortress (which had needed no defenses up until then) got hit hard and ripped itself apart in a tantrum spiral. I remember the dungeon master tried picking a fight with his dog horde and was torn apart. e: I wonder if new people coming in now expect siege engines to be able to actually work across different z-levels. I know my first fort had a great catapult tower that was absolutely worthless. PublicOpinion fucked around with this message at 20:49 on Jan 17, 2015 |
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Jan 17, 2015 20:41
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