|
Beckett says something to the effect of "get the key before Sebastian has his gorilla smash this open" after you retrieve it.
|
#
?
Jan 19, 2015 12:06
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 25, 2024 19:10 |
|
|
mauman posted:Actually, I was thinking of the Society of Leopold really. And replace Jackhammer with "A really really really big bomb". They never had the Sarcophagus if I recall correctly, they had the professor. And a really, really big bomb is not that useful for getting information out of an human, especially if said human doesn't know the info you want. Lacroix would totally try prying open the sarcophagus by force, the dumb princeling isn't exactly subtle, but only if he was desperate. At the moment, he still believes he can resolve the stalemate in his favour and recover the key.
|
|
#
?
Jan 19, 2015 13:52
|
|
|
Cador_2004 posted:Probably because nothing would say "Please wake up and kill us" like taking a jackhammer to your bed. Serious question: how many flamethrowers and incendiary bullets can a 3rd gen soak?
|
|
#
?
Jan 19, 2015 18:26
|
|
This poster loves police brutality, but only when its against minorities!
|
DeusExMachinima posted:Serious question: how many flamethrowers and incendiary bullets can a 3rd gen soak? System-wise it depends on the stats of the individual Antediluvian, but from a GM point of view they mostly just bounce off.
|
|
#
?
Jan 19, 2015 18:33
|
|
DeusExMachinima posted:Serious question: how many flamethrowers and incendiary bullets can a 3rd gen soak? 3rd gens have the power of Plot Device, so chances aren't good for whomever tries to take them out.
|
|
|
#
?
Jan 19, 2015 18:39
|
|
|
I thought that was just Caine. What about gen 4-5?
|
|
#
?
Jan 19, 2015 18:42
|
|
|
The rules for Antediluvian Disciplines in the Gehenna book say that any given Discipline at 10 is basically a plot device. It's unlikely you'd even get to an Antediluvian with your flame-spewing army unless the Antediluvian wanted you there for some reason, and killing them might not be as straightforward as simple violence. Malkav, for example, shows up in one of the Gehenna scenarios as a transmissible consciousness, who first manifests himself as 13 creepy little girls speaking in unison. One of the other Antediluvians kills them all in a rage, and Malkav starts talking through another person in the crowd a few seconds later. DeusExMachinima posted:I thought that was just Caine. What about gen 4-5? If they don't have some obscure thaumaturgical anti-fire spell or combination Discipline that ups their fire resistance game, they could have armies of retainers, several Blood Bound servants of only slightly higher generation, and/or enough Celerity to kill you while you're still in the planning stage of the assault. Mechanically, you'd have Fortitude, which is a passive resistance buff in the tabletop game. Wanderer fucked around with this message at 18:46 on Jan 19, 2015 |
|
#
?
Jan 19, 2015 18:43
|
|
|
Well, I guess we're assuming some sort of hypothetical scenario where you somehow got the drop on, say, a 5th gen and somehow got them one vs. your entire crew, the question is "how much fire resistance do they have due to magic and that stuff", "how much Courage do they have to resist the Rötschreck", and "how do you keep them under control them once they get hit with the Rötschreck" - a 5th gen on pseudo-frenzy trying nothing but trying to get the gently caress out will probably wreck your poo poo very, very hard because you're in the way. You'll probably not kill them before they manage to flee, recover, and get very, VERY ANGRY at you. Then things go very pear-shaped.
|
|
|
#
?
Jan 19, 2015 18:57
|
|
|
DeusExMachinima posted:I thought that was just Caine. What about gen 4-5? Depends on their stats. The problem with fighting powerful vampires isn't so much killing them with heavy artillery as it is getting them in a vulnerable enough position to be killed. Most 4th gen have been around since the Fall of Rome, or even earlier. Even then, assuming that you're not hitting them with a Tomahawk missile out of the blue, it'd pretty much take something like this to bring them down for sure: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yoqav3uEXWI
|
|
#
?
Jan 19, 2015 19:02
|
|
|
DeusExMachinima posted:Serious question: how many flamethrowers and incendiary bullets can a 3rd gen soak? It took a week-long running battle with three almost equally-powerful opponents, the sun's rays being magnified/reflected three times, and a spiritually-infused nuke to kill off Zapathasura. Maybe. Probably. They hope.
|
|
#
?
Jan 19, 2015 19:12
|
|
|
DeusExMachinima posted:I thought that was just Caine. What about gen 4-5? Werewolves are walking agg damage machines. They regenerate huge amounts of damage per turn (assuming its not caused by silver). In their warform they can have superhuman strength and attack 5-6 times in the same time as a non-celerity user can attack once. A 4th gen used to solo hunt packs of them for sport. (granted, he was usually winded afterwards and got diablerized in a chance encounter right after one of these jaunts, but still...)
|
|
#
?
Jan 19, 2015 19:33
|
|
|
So basically nuke (s) + a good pair of running shoes. Exterminatus for whatever Tzimisce becomes in Gehenna.
|
|
#
?
Jan 19, 2015 21:26
|
|
|
There are a couple of pretty vicious tricks you can pull on a vampire if you're from one of the other supernatural factions. A werewolf with Renew the Cycle would have a chance to kill an elder vampire, assuming you picked up a couple of other Gifts to ensure you'd be able to get that close (Spirit of the Fray, Mindblock, etc.). Of course, King Albrecht might be the only character in the line who has it and most of the Apocalypse scenarios involve his death relatively early on.
|
|
#
?
Jan 19, 2015 21:47
|
|
|
DeusExMachinima posted:So basically nuke (s) + a good pair of running shoes. Exterminatus for whatever Tzimisce becomes in Gehenna. A good supersonic jet would be more helpful. And as I recall, in the "Antedeluvians destroy the world" ending, Tzimisce turns the sewers of New York into a roiling mass of flesh which then boils out of the manholes and consumes everything in its path.
|
|
#
?
Jan 19, 2015 22:15
|
|
|
Can I ask then what the lowest generation that is reasonably transferrable to the table, without becoming a plot device, would be? For either an NPC or a player?
|
|
#
?
Jan 19, 2015 22:23
|
|
|
DeusExMachinima posted:So basically nuke (s) + a good pair of running shoes. Exterminatus for whatever Tzimisce becomes in Gehenna. Nukes being dropped on things are bad. The nuke dropped on Zapathasura/[Ravnos] ended up destroying Wraith as a game line while also cracking open the jail that kept the imprisoned demons in check. Not to mention the tens if not hundreds of thousands of folks in India that got wiped out in the carnage due to everyone going "FIRE ALL THE THINGS!". I mean, yeah, it worked, but there's basically a dozen more of the bastards out there that won't get chumped like [Ravnos] did. Granted, in Chaining the Beast it talks about how Zapathasura let itself die so it could take over the Indian underworld and rule it as a devilking like Set does. An example of Chimeristry rewriting reality? Who knows! Bobbin Threadbare posted:A good supersonic jet would be more helpful. And as I recall, in the "Antedeluvians destroy the world" ending, Tzimisce turns the sewers of New York into a roiling mass of flesh which then boils out of the manholes and consumes everything in its path. Haqqim turns in to a mobile cloud of blood-death that just zips about handing out hot justice-dickings all over the globe, [Lasombra] turns in to a living shadow (and dies when it decides to try to eat the sun, like a chump), Abisimilard is hanging out in the stomach of Godzilla directing it about, and I think that [Ventrue] just keeps bodysurfing its descendants. ZorajitZorajit posted:Can I ask then what the lowest generation that is reasonably transferrable to the table, without becoming a plot device, would be? For either an NPC or a player? There were rules out there for playing Elders. I think you could end up down at 5th-6th gen relatively "easily". And have access to a nationstate's military industrial complex!
|
|
#
?
Jan 19, 2015 22:29
|
|
|
citybeatnik posted:Haqqim turns in to a mobile cloud of blood-death that just zips about handing out hot justice-dickings all over the globe, [Lasombra] turns in to a living shadow (and dies when it decides to try to eat the sun, like a chump), Abisimilard is hanging out in the stomach of Godzilla directing it about, and I think that [Ventrue] just keeps bodysurfing its descendants. Why are some of their names being bracketed and the others aren't? Does that signify something?
|
|
#
?
Jan 19, 2015 22:52
|
|
Traxus IV posted:Why are some of their names being bracketed and the others aren't? Does that signify something? The was Antediluvians work is that we know some of them, and some of them we only know as the nebulous form of "the Antediluvian for clan X". So [Ventrue] is whoever the Antediluvian for Ventrue is, because we don't know, and we need to distinguish them from the clan in general.
|
|
|
#
?
Jan 19, 2015 22:54
|
|
|
citybeatnik posted:There were rules out there for playing Elders. I think you could end up down at 5th-6th gen relatively "easily". And have access to a nationstate's military industrial complex! The lowest that any PC got in any game that I played in was 6th gen, and that was the reward for enacting a century-long plot to diablerize an asocial elder vampire and then flee to the New World to become vampire kings of the colonies. The actual politicking between players over who got to commit diablerie and then pulling off the cannibalistic murder/escape from England were the best games of sit-down V:TM that I ever played.
|
|
#
?
Jan 19, 2015 22:55
|
|
|
The last I checked, if you were somehow able to play a freshly-embraced low-generation vampire, all you'd get for your trouble right there and then would be the ability to keep and spend a fairly ridiculous amount of blood at once. The real issue with low-generation vampires in the setting isn't the generation by itself, but that most of the vampires who are that close to Caine being thousands of years old with the stats to match.
|
|
#
?
Jan 19, 2015 23:03
|
|
|
Wanderer posted:The last I checked, if you were somehow able to play a freshly-embraced low-generation vampire, all you'd get for your trouble right there and then would be the ability to keep and spend a fairly ridiculous amount of blood at once. The real issue with low-generation vampires in the setting isn't the generation by itself, but that most of the vampires who are that close to Caine being thousands of years old with the stats to match. Good news! There's a background you can take to reflect that you've been around longer than others, and all it costs is a humanity point per dot to get up to +100 freebies! Zeroisanumber posted:The lowest that any PC got in any game that I played in was 6th gen, and that was the reward for enacting a century-long plot to diablerize an asocial elder vampire and then flee to the New World to become vampire kings of the colonies. The actual politicking between players over who got to commit diablerie and then pulling off the cannibalistic murder/escape from England were the best games of sit-down V:TM that I ever played. The book I'm thinking of is the one that's about playing the Archons/Paladins for the Camarilla and Sabbat respectively - you start off at a little lower Generation and get a few more freebies. There's also one out there for playing Elders that does something similar. Because nothing says "fun" to me like playing "RISK, only with fangs!".
|
|
#
?
Jan 19, 2015 23:12
|
|
|
citybeatnik posted:The book I'm thinking of is the one that's about playing the Archons/Paladins for the Camarilla and Sabbat respectively - you start off at a little lower Generation and get a few more freebies. There's also one out there for playing Elders that does something similar. The book that you're talking about is imaginatively named "Archons and Templars".
|
|
#
?
Jan 19, 2015 23:17
|
|
|
citybeatnik posted:[Lasombra] turns in to a living shadow (and dies when it decides to try to eat the sun, like a chump) So does sunlight seriously just chump everything vampire-related? Obviously some of the ant's found... creative ways to get around that but it doesn't change the fact that some of the most godlike beings in the setting would die the second they go sunbathing.
|
|
#
?
Jan 19, 2015 23:26
|
|
|
MechanicalTomPetty posted:So does sunlight seriously just chump everything vampire-related? Obviously some of the ant's found... creative ways to get around that but it doesn't change the fact that some of the most godlike beings in the setting would die the second they go sunbathing. Antediluvians can stand sunlight for longer than other vamps, but it'll still kill them given time. Like someone mentioned earlier, the Ravnos antediluvian Zapathasura died in part from the combined light of the sun reflected down on it by orbital mirrors. But Ravnos have Fortitude as an in-clan discipline, so that might be a very extreme example.
|
|
#
?
Jan 19, 2015 23:32
|
|
|
Wanderer posted:There are a couple of pretty vicious tricks you can pull on a vampire if you're from one of the other supernatural factions. A werewolf with Renew the Cycle would have a chance to kill an elder vampire, assuming you picked up a couple of other Gifts to ensure you'd be able to get that close (Spirit of the Fray, Mindblock, etc.). Of course, King Albrecht might be the only character in the line who has it and most of the Apocalypse scenarios involve his death relatively early on. Funny you mention that gift but you don't said Paws of the Newborn Cub, one of the more brutal gifts in the game and far easier to pull off and straight up better than the Ragabash counterpart.
|
|
#
?
Jan 19, 2015 23:40
|
|
|
Zeroisanumber posted:Antediluvians can stand sunlight for longer than other vamps, but it'll still kill them given time. Like someone mentioned earlier, the Ravnos antediluvian Zapathasura died in part from the combined light of the sun reflected down on it by orbital mirrors. But Ravnos have Fortitude as an in-clan discipline, so that might be a very extreme example. 15th Generation, meanwhile, treat sunlight as lethal. Which is part of the reason everyone involved tend to go "WTF IS THIS poo poo!?" and flip their collective wigs.
|
|
#
?
Jan 19, 2015 23:57
|
|
|
MechanicalTomPetty posted:So does sunlight seriously just chump everything vampire-related? Obviously some of the ant's found... creative ways to get around that but it doesn't change the fact that some of the most godlike beings in the setting would die the second they go sunbathing. The sun takes no lip from any bloodsucker. 15th gens are removed enough that the sun goes easy on them and only deals lethal instead of aggravated, but a god of the shadows (Lasombra) deciding to get uppity?  Angry Lobster posted:Funny you mention that gift but you don't said Paws of the Newborn Cub, one of the more brutal gifts in the game and far easier to pull off and straight up better than the Ragabash counterpart. "Each success removes all special abilities (shapeshifting, Gifts, any sort of supernatural or magical powers) for one turn". It might as well say, each success allows you to use Cain combat rules (the enemy loses) for one turn.
|
|
#
?
Jan 20, 2015 00:10
|
|
|
Omobono posted:The sun takes no lip from any bloodsucker. 15th gens are removed enough that the sun goes easy on them and only deals lethal instead of aggravated, but a god of the shadows (Lasombra) deciding to get uppity? There's always a stupid high-level power for whatever situation you find yourself in. In this case, Tchernabog (Obten 9), i.e. "blot out the sun for a while." loving White Wolf, man.
|
|
#
?
Jan 20, 2015 00:28
|
|
The Merry Marauder posted:There's always a stupid high-level power for whatever situation you find yourself in. In this case, Tchernabog (Obten 9), i.e. "blot out the sun for a while." I really like some of the potential high-level disciplines have, even for minor things. Stuff like "Strings of the Marionette", Dominate 7: "Force a vampire to obey your commands even when staked or in torpor". That has some potential for real hilarity. " Projectile", Celerity 6: "Throw objects with the speed of your Celerity". That's like the ultimate fastball. Sounds loving sweet. "Deny", Dementation 8: "Ignore the existence of an object and not be affected by it". Basically just go "no, the sun does not exist, I refuse to acknowledge it, therefore it does not exist" and become a daywalker. Lots of weird and especially hilarious poo poo one could do if the Storyteller is in a cooperative mood.
|
|
|
#
?
Jan 20, 2015 00:35
|
|
|
TheMcD posted:I really like some of the potential high-level disciplines have, even for minor things. Stuff like "Strings of the Marionette", Dominate 7: "Force a vampire to obey your commands even when staked or in torpor". That has some potential for real hilarity. " Projectile", Celerity 6: "Throw objects with the speed of your Celerity". That's like the ultimate fastball. Sounds loving sweet. "Deny", Dementation 8: "Ignore the existence of an object and not be affected by it". Basically just go "no, the sun does not exist, I refuse to acknowledge it, therefore it does not exist" and become a daywalker. Chimeristry 9 lets you make water run up hill, time reverse, and rewrite someone out of existence.
|
|
#
?
Jan 20, 2015 00:59
|
|
|
Has it really been so long since we last posted the Gehenna parodies?
|
|
#
?
Jan 20, 2015 01:09
|
|
|
citybeatnik posted:Nukes being dropped on things are bad. This is the one thing we should all take away from this thread.
|
|
#
?
Jan 20, 2015 02:53
|
|
|
Pierzak posted:Has it really been so long since we last posted the Gehenna parodies? This doesn't sound familiar to me. 
|
|
#
?
Jan 20, 2015 05:54
|
|
|
Omobono posted:They never had the Sarcophagus if I recall correctly, they had the professor. And a really, really big bomb is not that useful for getting information out of an human, especially if said human doesn't know the info you want. Oh yeah....derp  My new job is turning my brain into mush
|
|
#
?
Jan 20, 2015 09:06
|
|
|
DeusExMachinima posted:This doesn't sound familiar to me. Holy gently caress someone missed those. :wtcaine: The Truth About Gehenna Gehenna: The Musical
|
|
#
?
Jan 20, 2015 17:03
|
|
|
Wow I remember these. But not that god awful text/background combo
|
|
#
?
Jan 20, 2015 17:39
|
|
|
MechanicalTomPetty posted:So does sunlight seriously just chump everything vampire-related? Obviously some of the ant's found... creative ways to get around that but it doesn't change the fact that some of the most godlike beings in the setting would die the second they go sunbathing. Even Cain is still bound by the three curses that angels laid on him and his descendants when he refused to repent. There's the curse of fire (You have an instinctive fear of fire and it causes terrible injuries to you), the curse of sunlight (sunlight harms you and forces you into sleep) and the curse of blood and ash(Oddly enough, vampires can survive without blood by eating ash, but they don't unless they absolutely have to because it tastes disgusting. This curse is also the source of The Beast). These weaknesses can be mitigated by a powerful enough vampire, but they cannot be removed completely. Stroth fucked around with this message at 20:54 on Jan 20, 2015 |
|
#
?
Jan 20, 2015 20:41
|
|
|
Stroth posted:Even Cain is still bound by the three curses that angels laid on him and his descendants when he refused to repent. There's the curse of fire (You have an instinctive fear of fire and it causes terrible injuries to you), the curse of sunlight (sunlight harms you and forces you into sleep) and the curse of blood and ash (Oddly enough, vampires can survive without blood by eating ash, but they don't unless they absolutely have to because it tastes disgusting. This curse is also the source of The Beast). These weaknesses can be mitigated by a powerful enough vampire, but they cannot be removed completely. Wait, what, really? I thought the "ash" part of the curse referred to how a vampire can be staked.
|
|
#
?
Jan 20, 2015 21:31
|
|
|
would eating the ashes of a dead vampire count as diabliserizing? gently caress I can't spell today
Robindaybird fucked around with this message at 22:28 on Jan 20, 2015 |
|
#
?
Jan 20, 2015 22:15
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 25, 2024 19:10 |
|
|
citybeatnik posted:Wait, what, really? I thought the "ash" part of the curse referred to how a vampire can be staked. Why? Staking puts you in torpor, it doesn't kill you. And yes. The exact quote from the book of nod is "And then, through dread Uriel God Almighty cursed me, saying. 'Then, for as long as you walk this earth, you and your children will cling to / Darkness / You will drink only blood / You will eat only ashes" There's actually a set of thaumaturgy rituals that work by amplifying the Curses, one of which makes the target vomit up any blood he tries to drink for the next week, forcing him to eat ashes instead if he wants to avoid torpor.
|
|
#
?
Jan 20, 2015 22:23
|
|