|
StuG Jeebus posted:The bigger problem I ran into with FoW, and at least part of the reason it died at my LGS, is that half of our players wouldn't play a 'blue-on-blue' game, and most people played Germans. We literally had one guy asking other people to pick up a Soviet army so he could kick their teeth in with his Germans. gently caress that guy. Why was everyno playing Jerry? Small unis counts? Massive Wehrmact boners? Nazis?
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2015 05:43
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 7, 2024 10:23 |
|
|
JcDent posted:Why was everyno playing Jerry? Small unis counts? Massive Wehrmact boners? Nazis? They tended to be more elite, and more interesting. They weren't crippled by losing platoon commanders. They also got a decent chance of a second move every turn. Seriously, people weren't kidding when they called it WW2 the movie. That's not to say they were busted, other nations had special rules, too. In fact, when I finally quit I believe the meta was leaning towards American artillery smashing entire tank platoons with 12" x 12" barrages that forced successful armor saves to be re-rolled. But Germans were just more fun. E:Also now that I think about it. The people who think FoW doesn't attract grognards need to check out their forums sometime. It's grognardy as poo poo. I remember years ago one veteran throwing this huge fit because some guy posted info about Tiger Is that didn't agree with his own sources. Carried a grudge about in his sig as long as I can remember. smug jeebus fucked around with this message at 06:23 on Feb 3, 2015 |
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2015 06:17
|
|
|
StuG Jeebus posted:E:Also now that I think about it. The people who think FoW doesn't attract grognards need to check out their forums sometime. It's grognardy as poo poo. I remember years ago one veteran throwing this huge fit because some guy posted info about Tiger Is that didn't agree with his own sources. Carried a grudge about in his sig as long as I can remember. That's not a grognard, that's a wehraboo fetishist, the kind of person who believes in the idiotic notions of the superior fighting ability of the honourable Wehrmacht soldiers who were just over run by slavering slavic hordes in numbers too large to stop, the superior technology of German vehicles and weapons (hint, most of them were actually terrible battlefield weapons and technologically inferior to advances already made by the big three), and that the war crimes weren't as frequent as some historians suggest and were only really committed by a small handful of SS extremists who were not supported by the mainstream of Germany. They play Germany in historical war games, drive German tanks in World of Tanks, paint their Space Marines or Imperial Guard in Nazi heraldry (which is amusing because tanks and armoured cars and planes and ships never had a Swastika painted on them, they universally used the Balkenkreuz), and vote Golden Dawn/UKIP/Republican/LNP. Stay away from these people.
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2015 07:15
|
|
|
Another thing about FoW (or Wargames in general that I don't like) is tanks hugging each other. Most FoW pictures I see feature a fuckton of tanks (cheaper to assemble and paint, I guess) and all of them are hugging each other so tightly it's absurd. And today I decided to watch some Epic Armageddon on YouTube to see how it looks in action... and almost immediately Predators and stuff start taking cover behind buildings in hull-to-hull piles. This should be punished, and not only by artillery (I bet a big part of the meta Arty tank destruction mentioned is because of tanks blobs) but my making them easier to target in general if there are other tanks within, dunno, half and inch or so.
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2015 08:00
|
|
|
NTRabbit posted:ships never had a Swastika painted on them, they universally used the Balkenkreuz Gonna be that guy and point out the Bismarck had a Swastika painted on its fore and aft decks during its transit of the Bering Straight, so the Luftwaffe wouldn't bomb it like dumbasses. IIRC they painted over them once they reached the Atlantic though.  That said, I'm not a closet Nazi. I swear. I prefer Spitfires and P-47s, and T-34s are much cooler. 
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2015 08:00
|
|
|
Galaga Galaxian posted:Gonna be that guy and point out the Bismarck had a Swastika painted on its fore and aft decks during its transit of the Bering Straight, so the Luftwaffe wouldn't bomb it like dumbasses. IIRC they painted over them once they reached the Atlantic though. This thread needs more goons accusing eachother of being Nazis.  omg I am joking please nobody do this
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2015 08:15
|
|
|
Is that a hitler emoticon, you wheraboo nazi bastard?! (Satire)
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2015 08:48
|
|
|
Maybe *I'm* the weirdo for pointing it out, but of the two black dudes who are wargamers in my circle of friends, both chose Germans in FoW/BA which is weird to me. Then again I guess it's not like the US Army of the day was super inclusive since they didnt integrate the army until a postwar executive order. Me, I'd totally do Soviets if I were to play either. The army deals for BA actually look reasonable for the nber of 32mm dolls they give you.
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2015 09:16
|
|
|
Playing Germany in historicals is NOT weird. Playing Germany and extolling at length about the pureness of the Wehrmacht in comparison to the SS, how the Panther was a superior fighting machine and Germany had an OBVIOUS technological advantage over the Slavic hordes and how Rommel is your idol: those are the things that make it weird.
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2015 09:25
|
|
|
Tekopo posted:Playing Germany in historicals is NOT weird. Yeah fair enough. Probably a wrongheaded observation for me to make. I am probably overthinking it. Or underthinking it. Its all an abstraction. *Somebody's* gotta play the bad guys after all and they were the snappiest dressers.
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2015 09:28
|
|
|
Our club is the opposite, I was asked to make a German army for CoC because all the Soviet players wanted some Germans to go Bagration all over.
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2015 09:31
|
|
|
Tekopo posted:Playing Germany in historicals is NOT weird. Nah, playing historicals of any sort means there's a good chance of you being a fash-loving weirdo, imo.
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2015 09:41
|
|
|
WINNERSH TRIANGLE posted:Nah, playing historicals of any sort means there's a good chance of you being a fash-loving weirdo, imo. Well, I would play Romans, and they kind of invented the fashina. Reasons to play Jerry: looks cool, sounds cool, Panzer III is adorable, low number of dudes, feeling of eliteness. Unless you're playing Luftwaffe. All those Wehraboos can also take refuge in the idea than even with Panthers and stuff being kind of poop, they still took the world for one hell of a ride, and kind of needed the effort of three empires (and France  ) to stop. ...and they had Italy for an ally, which definitely counts as some sort handicap. I have little experience with Hearts of Iron III, yet I still try playing with Italy, to see how the Germans would possibly do with a half competent ally.
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2015 09:50
|
|
|
LordAba posted:It is "useful idiots" like you that means we get poo poo components to good games. Just like there is nothing wrong with making a game balanced to all levels of play and it makes the game stronger (even though newbs complain about the evil power games), there is nothing wrong with making components and models better because it helps people new to hobbies by increasing the ease of painting details that make even a drybrushing look good and increasing the ease of putting things together with actual *gasp* instructions. Oh do gently caress off, champ. I don't buy any other Mantic stuff, I kickstarted Dreadball and was disappointed with the quality of the sculpts particularly when it didn't come with the payoff of them being easy to assemble (Veer-Myn in particular were a serious pain) which is something that Mantic had originally made a big deal about. Given the vast amount of plastic that I got from the Kickstarter it represented a serious overhead just to get up and running. I have no problems with GW or whoever making better models and better components. I'm asking that they also put some thought towards not making the assembly process a massive headache. PP are particularly bad for this, but getting better, and while their plastics have some issues they generally won't make you swear like a sailor when assembling them and the detail + posing are both pretty good. It's more a case of production issues with them, i.e. mold lines and the like. Older metal miniatures were a genuine problem to assemble, particularly models that had separate components for arms and the weapon they were holding in both hands, and gaps where there shouldn't have been gaps (I'm looking at you Cyclops Savage / Bane Lord Tartarus / etc). Corvus Belli stuff looks nice but some of those models take "fiddly" to a new loving dimension. In case you missed it: I get ill using CA glue unless I take a lot of precautions. CA glue is usually the only thing that works on this stuff in a reasonable amount of time. The harder the assembly, the higher chance I'll gently caress it up & restart or just have to shelve it for now.
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2015 09:50
|
|
|
Also the Mantic Elf army looks great, and anyone who thinks it's terrible is hosed in the head all sorts of ways
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2015 10:26
|
|
|
NTRabbit posted:Also the Mantic Elf army looks great, and anyone who thinks it's terrible is hosed in the head all sorts of ways so many nerds don't know the difference between "fried rear end" and "not my cup of tea"
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2015 11:08
|
|
|
WINNERSH TRIANGLE posted:Nah, playing historicals of any sort means there's a good chance of you being a fash-loving weirdo, imo.
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2015 11:09
|
|
|
This brings back an interesting story: there was a dude at my boardgame meetup that was surprised when he found out I was left wing, because he had assumed that since I liked board wargames and heavy economics games, I must be right wing. I guess that the assumption fits most of the times, though.
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2015 11:13
|
|
|
Tekopo posted:This brings back an interesting story: there was a dude at my boardgame meetup that was surprised when he found out I was left wing, because he had assumed that since I liked board wargames and heavy economics games, I must be right wing. I guess that the assumption fits most of the times, though. Is there anything more right wing than moving little faceless meeples around the board to do your bidding in a worker placement game?
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2015 11:27
|
|
|
NTRabbit posted:Is there anything more right wing than moving little faceless meeples around the board to do your bidding in a worker placement game? Honestly it could be considered Maoist as gently caress.
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2015 11:30
|
|
|
Panzeh posted:Honestly it could be considered Maoist as gently caress. Let's play the people's revolution! It's a new 4 to 4 players game.
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2015 12:05
|
|
|
NTRabbit posted:That's not a grognard, that's a wehraboo fetishist, the kind of person who believes in the idiotic notions of the superior fighting ability of the honourable Wehrmacht soldiers who were just over run by slavering slavic hordes in numbers too large to stop, the superior technology of German vehicles and weapons (hint, most of them were actually terrible battlefield weapons and technologically inferior to advances already made by the big three), and that the war crimes weren't as frequent as some historians suggest and were only really committed by a small handful of SS extremists who were not supported by the mainstream of Germany. This is kinda what's happening in video games, too. Company of Heroes II is completely broken in favor of German armor and the campaign is the typical "Russians had one gun for every five soldiers" myth. One of the German super units is the Elefant tank, a monstrosity that was nothing but a Pak 43 that also weighed 65 tons, so huge it couldn't really go anywhere and if it had even minor tread damage you probably couldn't tow it anywhere for repairs on account of the weight. The turret didn't rotate. Less than a hundred were ever built. So of course like all end-game German armor it is nearly unstoppable. Somehow the mythology has developed that the German army was ultra-competent and technologically superior to their foes.
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2015 12:12
|
|
|
The Elefant was built on the hull of the Porsche Tiger, Ferdinand Porsche being so confident his terrible machine was going to win the trials he started production early. Needing to use everything, they were turned into a casemate TD with the Pak 43 and sent to Russia and the Battle of Kursk, where they seemed pretty fearsome until the Russians realised the things had poor vision, and no machine guns or point blank defense against infantry whatsoever, and proceeded to let them drive (slowly) past hidden troops who then destroyed them with molotov cocktails. Such wonder weapons. There's a good book about the mythologising of the soldiers and weapons of Nazi Germany in the US http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/0521712319/ref=wl_it_dp_o_pd_S_ttl?_encoding=UTF8&colid=398UUW3EDBN74&coliid=I1MLXERHQYH4RF
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2015 12:25
|
|
|
OneThousandMonkeys posted:Somehow the mythology has developed that the German army was ultra-competent and technologically superior to their foes. Ironically, probably because it makes for better and more balanced games!
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2015 12:31
|
|
|
OneThousandMonkeys posted:This is kinda what's happening in video games, too. Company of Heroes II is completely broken in favor of German armor and the campaign is the typical "Russians had one gun for every five soldiers" myth. One of the German super units is the Elefant tank, a monstrosity that was nothing but a Pak 43 that also weighed 65 tons, so huge it couldn't really go anywhere and if it had even minor tread damage you probably couldn't tow it anywhere for repairs on account of the weight. The turret didn't rotate. Less than a hundred were ever built. So of course like all end-game German armor it is nearly unstoppable. That game at all... The campaign is stupid as all gently caress. "Ze Djerman War Machine is unstoppable and tactically superior!" Cue next three missions of nothing but off screen germans running into your positions. ...and Panzer III never makes an appearance. Instead, you get (at least in some not!campaign missions) Panzer IV and StugIII that are so lovely at anything, you can almost cry. I'm not sure I didn't. The whole game is hosed towards "cool" German toys, since they exhausted everything else in Company of Heroes I. For the Ardenes Assault, or, to be more precised, the Western Front DLC that comes in three separate parts and costs more than base game, Germans have infrared halftracks, infrared scopes, the panzershreck with wheels and so on. None of the lass glamorous stuff. Maybe they needed a way to justify the world taking so long to beat them back.
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2015 12:35
|
|
|
Tekopo posted:Playing Germany in historicals is NOT weird. The best way to collect Germans and not making it weird is to get a second force. No, Afrikakorps don't count as a second force.
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2015 12:39
|
|
|
Rulebook Heavily posted:The best way to collect Germans and not making it weird is to get a second force. I have a 1st SS-Pz.Div. LSSAH and SS-Totenkopfverbände force. 
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2015 12:52
|
|
|
Rulebook Heavily posted:The best way to collect Germans and not making it weird is to get a second force. Or just collect what you want. Not gonna sink  and time to placate some nerds E: wait, what about Italians, Hungarians and Romanians? Otisburg posted:SS-Totenkopfverbände Do they they get to reroll misses against Jew stands if they're within 20cm and not moving? Git good, son, it's SS-Sturmbrigade Dirlewanger or bust. JcDent fucked around with this message at 13:18 on Feb 3, 2015 |
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2015 13:09
|
|
|
JcDent posted:Do they they get to reroll misses against Jew stands if they're withing 20cm and not moving? I think I finally conceived of a terrain diorama worse than space elf rape.
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2015 13:16
|
|
|
Otisburg posted:I think I finally conceived of a terrain diorama worse than space elf rape. *invites a date over for dinner* 'This pile of stuff in the living room? Oh, I'm just working on a 1/100 scale replica of Dachau. We're planning to recreate some blue-on-blue mock battles for our SS companies now that Steve who collects *snort* Brits *snort* was finally kicked out of our group. Some wine?
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2015 13:22
|
|
|
NTRabbit posted:Also the Mantic Elf army looks great, and anyone who thinks it's terrible is hosed in the head all sorts of ways  Go home elf, eat something. Sharpen your stick. They might have improves over the years, but the first ones were a pain in the rear end to clean, and the plastic was only alright... everything about the details seemed soft. Was the second army undead, cause that is SOOO much better in terms of quality. I also don't like their dwarves. And think the ogres look like poo poo. LordAba fucked around with this message at 13:46 on Feb 3, 2015 |
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2015 13:44
|
|
|
Elves are supposed to be tall, thin and lithe, not chunky monkeys with pointy ears. The Elves and Ogres are my favourite KoW armies
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2015 13:50
|
|
|
Spears look naff, rest looks fine to me and the Mantic Ogres are my favourite Ogres out there. OPINIONS man
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2015 13:55
|
|
|
 Never get tired of looking at these guys.
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2015 14:25
|
|
|
I don't like the elves but I do like the dwarfs But this applies to all things E: lizard battle chickens are the best Phoon fucked around with this message at 14:32 on Feb 3, 2015 |
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2015 14:29
|
|
|
Radish posted:
and I'm never gonna buy them Worst part of the range, if they don't get replaced I'll just conjure something up from my Bones II loot.
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2015 14:29
|
|
|
Radish posted:
Those are some interesting flying squigs! ...wait.
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2015 14:32
|
|
|
Radish posted:
I said CONSUMATE v's!
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2015 14:43
|
|
|
Renfield posted:and I'm gonna get rid of some other stuff via the Oath thread as prizes.. just need to contact the guy in charge of it You rang? My email is krushgroove169@gmail.com
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2015 14:52
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 7, 2024 10:23 |
|
|
Daedleh posted:Spears look naff, rest looks fine to me and the Mantic Ogres are my favourite Ogres out there. You like the Mantic models? I like playing 40k. Doesn't mean it is not poo poo.
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2015 14:57
|
|