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Beast Pussy posted:Alright, I'm going to hope for the best on this one. That said I'm also hoping for the best, because I really loved Ultima Underworld.
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Feb 18, 2015 23:44
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Basic Chunnel posted:Maybe this is the same sort of deal. Sometimes, incredibly, a guy can self-motivate to collect a bunch of money for an idea but can't motivate when it's time for the rubber to hit the road. Those people aren't necessarily scammers, they're just losers. They're the ballast that should keep people wise about tossing KS pledges at just anybody. It's weird, because for about 5 months there were regular updates that were fairly lengthy and showed what appeared to be progress being made. Then, like a switch being flipped, he was gone and there's been no word from him since the end of September.
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Feb 19, 2015 00:04
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Maybe he's hiding out with Wollay.
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Feb 19, 2015 00:09
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Trapezium Dave posted:That said I'm also hoping for the best, because I really loved Ultima Underworld. Me too. I'm crazy for the original Underworlds and a big Looking Glass fanboy, but as hard as it is to say, I'm pretty underwhelmed by the Underworld kickstarter. I did manage to get over my initial reaction of "Dark... elves...  please, god, no." But then they're talking about all the amazing emergent things you'll be able to do like dam up a river and have it make the dwarves happy because now they can mine there and the fungus people sad because it's too dry for fungus farms, which just sounds like you're just daming a river in one of a couple pre-made spots which leads to some pre-scripted responses from a couple factions. I mean otherwise you'd need Dwarf Fortress levels of fluid simulation and farming and mining and stuff going on in the background. Or where they're trying to show off an emergent spider escape scenario and he blows up the bridge just as the giant spider comes out in a manner that looks very... scripted and non-emergent. How do we get back across the lava? Well, we could activate 'convince-dwarves-to-emergently-rebuild-bridge.script'. How do we get off the island without fighting the tentacle monster? Why use the pre-placed swashbuckle gadget conveniently attached to the ceiling.It feels like they're awkwardly trying to oversell the now fairly standard 'multiple scripted solutions' as MAGIC EMERGENCE. I really enjoy games like Deus Ex or whatever with a bunch of ways to solve areas, but don't try to sell me some E3 Oblivion world where the npcs are 'observing' how I 'play the game' and changing their behavior accordingly. Anyway. I grew up on Underworld and they've got my $50 and the benefit of the doubt, but I don't feel like they're selling it very well. 
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Feb 19, 2015 00:10
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Fintilgin posted:It feels like they're awkwardly trying to oversell the now fairly standard 'multiple scripted solutions' as MAGIC EMERGENCE. I really enjoy games like Deus Ex or whatever with a bunch of ways to solve areas, but don't try to sell me some E3 Oblivion world where the npcs are 'observing' how I 'play the game' and changing their behavior accordingly.
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Feb 19, 2015 00:18
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Beast Pussy posted:I backed Underworld Ascendant, but their daily updates are starting to worry me already. That first one is seriously your bog standard crafting system. Collect 5 spider webs and 2 pieces of iron to construct a grappling hook. Use grappling hook and check against acrobatics skill for success. Not sure why that worries you. The second one seems more meaningless than unobtainable. It's the kind of promise I've heard a lot over the last twenty years for various dungeon crawlers and RPGs and I'm still not sure what the point is or why it's meant to be fun. Also I'm pretty sure every time it's been promised, it has either not shown up or underdelivered, so there's that.
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Feb 19, 2015 00:18
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Groovelord Neato posted:Obsidian hasn't hosed up like Double Fine has. dude. alpha protocol
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Feb 19, 2015 00:19
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Fremry posted:Yeah, that's what I thought. I have a cat, and I freaking love my cat like a child, but I don't get this cat stuff. There's another card game on there called Schrodinger's Cat which doesn't look especially good either, and it's getting funded really well. Neither of them are, really. One is basically Uno with a Russian Roulette element, and the other is Liar's Dice with cards.
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Feb 19, 2015 00:23
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A Fancy 400 lbs posted:Maybe he's hiding out with Wollay. Anyway, I had no idea it'd been that long since a Bear Simulator update. Very weird. And confession time, despite my avatar, I never actually gave money to the project, I just couldn't resist a good bear pun. As fun as the pitch and everything involved with it was, the game itself seemed like it would be a little too gimmicky. Plus it looked like it was just one guy trying to do everything himself, which is not good.
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Feb 19, 2015 00:23
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Fintilgin posted:Me too. I'm crazy for the original Underworlds and a big Looking Glass fanboy, but as hard as it is to say, I'm pretty underwhelmed by the Underworld kickstarter. The video looks scripted because it probably is. The whole thing is basically a proof of concept demo and presumably not actually what the final game will be like. True dynamic gameplay is still a hugely, hugely lofty promise, but you can't really take much away from that footage other than "these are the types of possibilites we would like to create".
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Feb 19, 2015 00:23
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Interactions in Dwarf Fortress are still essentially scripted, there's just more use of an RNG thrown in. All interactions between objects in games are scripted to some degree, because a computer doesn't think the same way we think.
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Feb 19, 2015 00:24
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Toxxupation posted:dude. alpha protocol Alpha Protocol is actually really interesting (though very flawed) and it's nowhere near akin to what Double Fine did with the kickstarter or with the star dwarf fortress game. I didn't mean "made games that weren't good" I meant straight hosed up.
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Feb 19, 2015 00:26
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PaletteSwappedNinja posted:Serious questions: has anyone here backed a crowdfunded project that wasn't delayed? Elegy for a Dead World came out 3 months early, which made me practically fall out of my chair when I read the announcement. And it's a game, technically...
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Feb 19, 2015 00:28
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Groovelord Neato posted:Alpha Protocol is actually really interesting (though very flawed) and it's nowhere near akin to what Double Fine did with the kickstarter or with the star dwarf fortress game. I didn't mean "made games that weren't good" I meant straight hosed up. To be clear I'm not sayin Obsidian is on DF's level and they've made some actually good, complete games in the past ten years (including, arguably, the game of the generation or at least close to it), but Obsidian's track record is nowhere near spotless and the insane defense it always gets on these forums rankles me Either way they don't deserve the DF comparisons because they haven't scammed anyone
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Feb 19, 2015 00:30
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Groovelord Neato posted:Alpha Protocol is actually really interesting (though very flawed) and it's nowhere near akin to what Double Fine did with the kickstarter or with the star dwarf fortress game. I didn't mean "made games that weren't good" I meant straight hosed up. I still don't consider broken age a straight hosed up experience. It's still being made and is presumably still going to come out, even if it's taking forever. That's arguably better than being rushed out and being underwhelming. Maybe I'm rationalizing it because I'm a backer, but I don't feel bilked out of my money or anything. There's no excuse for spacebase, though.
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Feb 19, 2015 00:37
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Toxxupation posted:To be clear I'm not sayin Obsidian is on DF's level and they've made some actually good, complete games in the past ten years (including, arguably, the game of the generation or at least close to it), but Obsidian's track record is nowhere near spotless and the insane defense it always gets on these forums rankles me There was no comparison, he's the one that brought up Obsidian in the first place. I think at some point even he forgot what he was arguing. torgo posted:It looks like two of the games I kickstarted are dead, or at least MIA. These actually bum me out, even though I didn't give money. I already knew the Mansion Lord developers were AWOL (and in retrospect not giving a single name for the project is really sketchy), but I had no clue about Bear Simulator being in such a state.
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Feb 19, 2015 00:39
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A Steampunk Gent posted:On one hand The Oatmeal sucks and that's a bad kickstarter. On the other, seriously why give such a poo poo? People earn far more for doing far less every day and they're not really doing any harm, just let people back their stupid monkey cheese game in peace It's just a reminder that we're being slowly digested by an amoral universe, is all.
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Feb 19, 2015 00:40
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As one of the upper tier backers of this project, I can only say that it was a really good pitch at the right time. I sunk a chunk of change into this.
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Feb 19, 2015 00:41
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mycot posted:There was no comparison, he's the one that brought up Obsidian in the first place. I think at some point even he forgot what he was arguing. That was actually my entire point???/ The thing he said! mechaet posted:As one of the upper tier backers of this project, I can only say that it was a really good pitch at the right time. I sunk a chunk of change into this. Source your quotes.
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Feb 19, 2015 00:41
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Groovelord Neato posted:
mechaet posted:As someone who has thrown money hand over fist back during the "lifetime insurance" days, I've spent literal thousands of dollars on Star Citizen. mechaet posted:As someone who has thrown money hand over fist back during the "lifetime insurance" days, I've spent literal thousands of dollars on Star Citizen. mechaet posted:As someone who has thrown money hand over fist back during the "lifetime insurance" days, I've spent literal thousands of dollars on Star Citizen. mechaet posted:As someone who has thrown money hand over fist back during the "lifetime insurance" days, I've spent literal thousands of dollars on Star Citizen. mechaet posted:As someone who has thrown money hand over fist back during the "lifetime insurance" days, I've spent literal thousands of dollars on Star Citizen.
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Feb 19, 2015 00:43
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Hakkesshu posted:The video looks scripted because it probably is. The whole thing is basically a proof of concept demo and presumably not actually what the final game will be like. True dynamic gameplay is still a hugely, hugely lofty promise, but you can't really take much away from that footage other than "these are the types of possibilites we would like to create". Oh, I know it's a concept demo, I just feel like if you're trying to aspire to emergent gameplay and literally saying "nowadays everyone scripts everything, but we don't want to do that" then maybe your demo reel shouldn't have a dramatic scripted moment (bridge is blown just in time to prevent MEGASPIDER from crossing) standing in for emergent gameplay.
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Feb 19, 2015 00:45
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How does a non-interactive video make the differentiation between a player blowing up a bridge just in time by skill/luck and blowing it just in time in a scripted sequence? If they just played it over and over until they got the timing right for the video it would be indistinguishable.
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Feb 19, 2015 00:48
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I'm gonna cross the lava by building a bridge out of all the broken "emergent gameplay" promises in various games over the years.
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Feb 19, 2015 00:53
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I do have an uncanny ability to heavily back some amazing projects.
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Feb 19, 2015 00:53
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Toxxupation posted:dude. alpha protocol -an actual thing that happened
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Feb 19, 2015 00:56
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Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:I still don't consider broken age a straight hosed up experience. It's still being made and is presumably still going to come out, even if it's taking forever. That's arguably better than being rushed out and being underwhelming. Maybe I'm rationalizing it because I'm a backer, but I don't feel bilked out of my money or anything. But Spacebase, yeah. Don't know much about it and didn't buy it, so I don't have much of an opinion. e: and also as I was typing this, got an update through email about Broken Age act 2 being in beta. Next documentary episode will be after the game launches. No final date yet though. https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/doublefine/double-fine-adventure/posts/1106281
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Feb 19, 2015 00:57
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Sega delayed Alpha Protocol and then refused to let Obsidian use the delay time to work on polishing the game. It's probably one of the best examples of publisher interference loving up games of all time.
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Feb 19, 2015 00:59
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mechaet posted:I do have an uncanny ability to heavily back some amazing projects. You are so bad with money that it qualifies as a mental illness.
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Feb 19, 2015 01:00
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Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:That first one is seriously your bog standard crafting system. Collect 5 spider webs and 2 pieces of iron to construct a grappling hook. Use grappling hook and check against acrobatics skill for success. Not sure why that worries you. The second one seems more meaningless than unobtainable. It's the kind of promise I've heard a lot over the last twenty years for various dungeon crawlers and RPGs and I'm still not sure what the point is or why it's meant to be fun. Also I'm pretty sure every time it's been promised, it has either not shown up or underdelivered, so there's that. The reason is that it seems like every game with that kind of crafting is either really obtuse in its execution, and underdelivers, or is pretty much handled by the community, like starbound, minecraft, and skyrim. Also, after watching Star citizen explode into Chris Roberts agreeing to whatever will make you sign checks, I'm jaded. I'm always wary of a game with vague, "emergent" goals. Now, if you'll excuse me, I'm going to go look at pictures of my spaceship.
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Feb 19, 2015 01:00
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A Fancy 400 lbs posted:Sega delayed Alpha Protocol and then refused to let Obsidian use the delay time to work on polishing the game. It's probably one of the best examples of publisher interference loving up games of all time.
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Feb 19, 2015 01:01
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Oxxidation posted:You are so bad with money that it qualifies as a mental illness. I mean hell, if I was a multi-millionaire I'd probably fund a few projects I really liked at the $5,000 or $10,000 levels just to stroke my own ego.
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Feb 19, 2015 01:01
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Accordion Man posted:KOTOR 2 was far worse. Obsidian barely ever caught a break until they pitched Eternity. They finally got to delay a game!
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Feb 19, 2015 01:10
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Great Joe posted:hey, obsidian? yeah, it's sega, yeaaaahhhhhhhhhh im gonna need you to make alpha protocol more rpg-ish. yeah no, don't let the player use a pistol like they would in an fps from the get-go, lock that behind a big experience point gate. also if you dont do this were shutting you down, okay? thaaaaaaaaaanks Do you have a source for this? It'd be great to hear all the things that went wrong in Alpha Protocol's development. I thought it was a great game, but I could easily believe that it was the product of some extensive meddling.
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Feb 19, 2015 01:23
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Kenshin posted:He might just be rich enough that it doesn't really matter. I've beaten myself up several times in the past few years on bad business decisions I've made. Not in that I've backed kickstarters too much at too high a tier, but that I wasn't making enough money to back even more. If only I was some cool rich person who could spend money on his childhood dreams instead of a moderately poor person doing the same despite it being a bad idea 
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Feb 19, 2015 01:25
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A video from Tim re Broken Age: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mnY0TdkXZwI Includes a defense of everyone's favorite game developer, Mr. Molyneux.
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Feb 19, 2015 01:28
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Just because you got millions doesn't make you not a stupid for backing bad things. I got a good amount of disposable income but I've only ever backed Barkley 2, Hyper Light Drifter, and Drift Stage and I think the latter two were at the most basic "get the game" tier.
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Feb 19, 2015 01:39
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Litany Unheard posted:Includes a defense of everyone's favorite game developer, Mr. Molyneux. Honestly I'm not sure why they don't see why Molyneux is a special case. Schafer has trouble budgeting but I never believe that he's deliberately trying to deceive me and he is in fact delivering Broken Age. Molyneux just lies in everyone's face all the time and doesn't bat an eyelid at veering his project in a total different direction from promised.
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Feb 19, 2015 02:22
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and Alpha Protocol STILL managed to be the best game of last gen
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Feb 19, 2015 02:58
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Accordion Man posted:KOTOR 2 was far worse. Obsidian barely ever caught a break until they pitched Eternity. As I remember it, Lucas Arts told Obsidian that they would have X extra months for development beyond what was initially scheduled. Obsidian altered their schedule to take the extra time into account. Lucas Arts then came to Obsidian and said that not only would they not get the extra time but also that they needed the game RIGHT NOW and didn't care that it wasn't anywhere close to being finished yet. So Obsidian scrambled to get everything pulled together in a very short amount of time.
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Feb 19, 2015 03:01
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Great Rumbler posted:As I remember it, Lucas Arts told Obsidian that they would have X extra months for development beyond what was initially scheduled. Obsidian altered their schedule to take the extra time into account. Lucas Arts then came to Obsidian and said that not only would they not get the extra time but also that they needed the game RIGHT NOW and didn't care that it wasn't anywhere close to being finished yet. So Obsidian scrambled to get everything pulled together in a very short amount of time.
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Feb 19, 2015 03:02
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