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Rip_Van_Winkle posted:Not 100% sure why I did this but I couldn't get the image out of my head as soon as I realized what the new Duress art reminded me of. She's using that Dragon Rage.
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Mar 14, 2015 05:23
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Rip_Van_Winkle posted:Not 100% sure why I did this but I couldn't get the image out of my head as soon as I realized what the new Duress art reminded me of. I love it. I also love that the 'flavor' for this art is basically a dragon getting all up in your face and going 'gently caress YOUUUUUUUUU' until you forget one of your spells.
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Mar 14, 2015 05:24
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I mean, being yelled at by a dragon surely counts as being under duress, right?
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Mar 14, 2015 05:57
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vOv posted:I love it. I also love that the 'flavor' for this art is basically a dragon getting all up in your face and going 'gently caress YOUUUUUUUUU' until you forget one of your spells. The best part is that Despise had Zurgo getting up in Sarkhan's face, and Duress has Kolaghan getting up in Zurgo's face.
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Mar 14, 2015 06:10
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I can't wait for the Tormenting Voice with Sarkhan annoying Nicol Bolas to complete the "cycle." Someone asked Maro for it today and I need that alter.
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Mar 14, 2015 06:32
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I think DTK is fine without any fixing lands. The multicolour theme is very light (there are no multicoloured commons and only 5 uncommons) so you could just be splashing for your bomb dragons, and FRF does have a tonne of dual lands to help you out more if you need it. I guess there is a cycle of (enemy!) commons in FRF but those will probably just be last picks.
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Mar 14, 2015 06:54
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Irony Be My Shield posted:I think DTK is fine without any fixing lands. The multicolour theme is very light (there are no multicoloured commons and only 5 uncommons) so you could just be splashing for your bomb dragons, and FRF does have a tonne of dual lands to help you out more if you need it. I guess there is a cycle of (enemy!) commons in FRF but those will probably just be last picks. Its not necessary at all. You have Evolving Wilds if you need it to be nuts and try a full 3 color thing. Just don't be a dummy and try and go 5 color control like you could sometimes in K-K-K. Angry Grimace fucked around with this message at 07:57 on Mar 14, 2015 |
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Mar 14, 2015 07:47
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5 color green looks to work fine, though I'm not certain the rewards are there. Look at all my six cmc dragons and unmorphing dragons! Four by four by hosed by the warrior deck.
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Mar 14, 2015 08:01
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mr. mephistopheles posted:Seriously? I'm on board with a couple of these but a lot of them are almost certainly way too biased to favoring particular archetypes over others to such an extreme extent that I don't think WoTC would ever print them in a million years. Like "comes into play tapped unless you attacked with a creature this turn" basically gives aggro decks drawback-free untapped dual lands for the entire game and control decks guildgates. Same goes for "unless your life total is X or greater", "cards in hand", "cast a spell this turn" (with control decks often wanting to pass the turn and hold mana up to cast reactive spells on their opponent's turn), etc.. It's interesting that outside of conditions related to mechanics/themes particular to a specific blocks, a lot of the intuitive, generic, and fair conditions for dual lands are probably close to being exhausted.
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Mar 14, 2015 08:27
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I found this to be an interesting listen. An Economists view on a card game they do not understand. http://www.npr.org/blogs/money/2015/03/11/392381112/episode-609-the-curse-of-the-black-lotus
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Mar 14, 2015 08:36
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Trigger warning that poo poo man. Zac Hill voice incoming! Also I'm not sure why they bothered with that story; it ignored so much stuff, got so much more wrong, and had the rest be so superficial it was basically pointless.
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Mar 14, 2015 08:41
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Fuzzy Mammal posted:Also I'm not sure why they bothered with that story; it ignored so much stuff, got so much more wrong, and had the rest be so superficial it was basically pointless. That's been my experience with other Planet Money shows when I've already known stuff going in, sadly.
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Mar 14, 2015 12:04
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vOv posted:I love it. I also love that the 'flavor' for this art is basically a dragon getting all up in your face and going 'gently caress YOUUUUUUUUU' until you forget one of your spells. Helmsmashing is a school of magic Zurgo forgot because Kolaghan was just so done with his poo poo she just yelled at him until he forgot how. Its pretty great.
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Mar 14, 2015 14:03
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Minority Deport posted:Someone went through and made a pretty exhaustive list of all the time parallels. Most of them are pretty obvious, but there's some cool stuff in there I didn't notice before, like Feed The Clan -> Ancient Carp. Marang River Prowler/Skeleton is my favorite. He really takes "cast from the graveyard" to a new level. Marx Headroom fucked around with this message at 14:34 on Mar 14, 2015 |
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Mar 14, 2015 14:22
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Fuzzy Mammal posted:Also I'm not sure why they bothered with that story; it ignored so much stuff, got so much more wrong, and had the rest be so superficial it was basically pointless. You've just described the entirety of NPR
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Mar 14, 2015 14:50
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It pretty much asked to be done I think.
Cabbages and VHS fucked around with this message at 15:37 on Mar 14, 2015 |
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Mar 14, 2015 15:34
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Minority Deport posted:Someone went through and made a pretty exhaustive list of all the time parallels. Most of them are pretty obvious, but there's some cool stuff in there I didn't notice before, like Feed The Clan -> Ancient Carp. Maybe I'm dumb, but I don't get Silumgar 1->Dig, Mindscour Dragon->Highspire Mantis, and I think Jeskai Sage->Jeskai Elder is kind of a stretch.
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Mar 14, 2015 16:25
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Elyv posted:Maybe I'm dumb, but I don't get Silumgar 1->Dig, Mindscour Dragon->Highspire Mantis, and I think Jeskai Sage->Jeskai Elder is kind of a stretch. The smoke in Dig is in the form of OG Silumgar. The bell in the background of Mindscour Dragon is the one Highspire Mantis is perched on. Sage -> Elder is a stretch. Personally, I like the comparisons between the basic lands.
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Mar 14, 2015 16:30
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mr. mephistopheles posted:Seriously? Maro has already said there's very little design space left in dual lands. If you take a look back, you'll notice they haven't made much headway in innovation in the last what, decade? Its all just rehashes of the same types of duals or lands that care about block mechanics. The Future Sight lands aren't additional design space. They're lands that already exist that WOTC doesn't like enough to reprint for whatever reason. Angry Grimace fucked around with this message at 16:57 on Mar 14, 2015 |
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Mar 14, 2015 16:54
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The space for good duals is drying up, but it shouldn't be so dry that they need to resort to the Guildgates.mr. mephistopheles posted:~ comes into play tapped unless you control another tapped permanent Return to Prophecy confirmed for 2016. Lottery of Babylon fucked around with this message at 17:11 on Mar 14, 2015 |
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Mar 14, 2015 17:08
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They should reprint River of Tears and make a cycle out of it because it is one of my favorite lands.
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Mar 14, 2015 17:09
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Yawgmoth posted:They should reprint River of Tears and make a cycle out of it because it is one of my favorite lands. I love River of Tears, but they probably don't want to make it a cycle because it's asymmetrical and fiddly. As for the other Future Sight lands, they probably don't want to make Grove of the Burnwillows a cycle because it gets much stronger when it's in colors like WU instead of RG. But Horizon Canopy and Glacial Fortress are great and there's no reason not to make them cycles. Bring back River of Tears as a cycle of double-faced lands. One color on one side, one color on the other, transform whenever landfall.
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Mar 14, 2015 17:12
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CoolMountain - Land - Mountain Island - T: Add R. At the beginning of your upkeep, or when CoolMountain comes into play, you may transform CoolMountain // CoolIsland - Land - Mountain Island - T: Add U. At the beginning of your upkeep, you may transform CoolIsland
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Mar 14, 2015 17:13
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Skyl3lazer posted:CoolMountain - Land - Mountain Island - T: Add R. At the beginning of your upkeep, or when CoolMountain comes into play, you may transform CoolMountain // CoolIsland - Land - Mountain Island - T: Add U. At the beginning of your upkeep, you may transform CoolIsland It can't be a Mountain Island on both sides, or else it can tap for both colors on both sides. Also, this is "strictly better" (modulo not having the basic supertype) than basic lands of either type, which they haven't done in a long time. It needs some drawback, like transforming being involuntary.
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Mar 14, 2015 17:14
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I just wanted them to be fetchable, and I don't think you can fetch off the back side of a transform?
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Mar 14, 2015 17:17
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Angry Grimace posted:Maro has already said there's very little design space left in dual lands. If you take a look back, you'll notice they haven't made much headway in innovation in the last what, decade? Its all just rehashes of the same types of duals or lands that care about block mechanics. The Future Sight lands aren't additional design space. They're lands that already exist that WOTC doesn't like enough to reprint for whatever reason. Even the Future Sight lands weren't that original. Horizon Canopy is just a slightly different pain land. Grove is a reverse pain land. Cairns is just a mostly better Skyshroud Claim et al (and that cycle's done anyway.) River of Tears is original but would make a pretty terrible cycle. Nimbus Maze is pretty much the only original one that would make a good cycle.
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Mar 14, 2015 17:18
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Irony Be My Shield posted:I think DTK is fine without any fixing lands. The multicolour theme is very light (there are no multicoloured commons and only 5 uncommons) so you could just be splashing for your bomb dragons, and FRF does have a tonne of dual lands to help you out more if you need it. I guess there is a cycle of (enemy!) commons in FRF but those will probably just be last picks. The development team likes to define a strategy for each 2 color pair in limited, so it will likely still be possible to go after an enemy color pair in the two Dragons packs then get rewarded in the third pack when you can pick up 1-3 of your pair's multicolor common. BW will still be warriors and can pick up the hella strong Harsh Sustenance, UR can be what the Goblinslide deck never was because new-Goblinslide makes 2/2 flyers, BG still has some toughness matters cards, RW still functions as the army colors and it's got War Flare, Volcanic Rush, and Magmatic Chasm as finishers, and UG is still the morph color pair (both colors have 3 common megamorphers as opposed to 2 in the others).
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Mar 14, 2015 17:31
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Skyl3lazer posted:I just wanted them to be fetchable, and I don't think you can fetch off the back side of a transform? Though it's inelegant, I'm sure that something like "~ is a also an island when it is in your library" or some such is a solution
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Mar 14, 2015 17:32
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Gotta love Matt Tabak and his Tumblr:MaRo posted:I'm writing a book about a trading card game company. In it I need the Head Designer to find a way to circumvent the Rules Manager so I was hoping you could help me with some realistic tips on how'd he do that. You know, for authenticity. For my book. That I'm writing. The more detail the better. Thanks. Tabak posted:This fictional Rules Manager of yours sounds incredibly clever, so circumventing him won’t be easy. I think this Head Designer (Is that even a real thing?) would be better served working with the Rules Manager. But all is not lost. Here are some tips that may convince the Rules Manager that some of your ideas are okay: I don't even know why I'm finding it so funny, besides "these two are huge nerds".
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Mar 14, 2015 17:52
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Lottery of Babylon posted:It can't be a Mountain Island on both sides, or else it can tap for both colors on both sides. To deal with the best duals ever being on the reserve list, there needs to be a new cycle of 10 that's just as good. The transforming ones are better than basics, but still worse than original duals, because sometimes you don't know until your opponent's end step if you'll want to cast Flusterstorm or Vampiric Tutor with your Underground Sea.
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Mar 14, 2015 17:54
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Chamale posted:To deal with the best duals ever being on the reserve list, there needs to be a new cycle of 10 that's just as good. The transforming ones are better than basics, but still worse than original duals, because sometimes you don't know until your opponent's end step if you'll want to cast Flusterstorm or Vampiric Tutor with your Underground Sea. Sure, typed at-will flippylands are reasonable if you're looking for something new to put in Conspiracy 2016 so you can ban the original duals in Legacy and keep the format from being strangled by the reserve list. But they're not a cycle they can just print in standard whenever they want, because the usual criteria for a new land cycle is "can't be strictly better than basics", not "can't be strictly better than alpha duals".
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Mar 14, 2015 18:02
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Lottery of Babylon posted:Sure, typed at-will flippylands are reasonable if you're looking for something new to put in Conspiracy 2016 so you can ban the original duals in Legacy and keep the format from being strangled by the reserve list. But they're not a cycle they can just print in standard whenever they want, because the usual criteria for a new land cycle is "can't be strictly better than basics", not "can't be strictly better than alpha duals". Although considering how complicated that would be, I'm sure they'd just put Snow Duals somewhere at some point, maybe with a clause like "This card can't be in the same deck as a card named Underground Sea."
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Mar 14, 2015 18:05
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Serperoth posted:Gotta love Matt Tabak and his Tumblr: Tabak's blog is the best of the 4 MTG tumblrs even though I don't care about football or wrestling.
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Mar 14, 2015 18:08
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Serperoth posted:Gotta love Matt Tabak and his Tumblr: My guess is that most of the higher level guys in design/development like Maro and Tabak have a pretty awesome job, particularly now that they've gotten pretty good at honing in on what actually works in set design.
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Mar 14, 2015 18:14
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I'm deeply ambivalent to any complaints of 'no fetchlands' or any of that, but thats largely because I don't play this game, but from an outside perspective, I always saw fetchlands as a rather low effort borderline sleazy way to get players to fork over green, I always felt strongly that staple mana lands should have been uncommon and rare reserved for omnicolored lands or utility. I'd much rather that wizards found new and interesting mechanics to drive lands instead of recycling a set of old ones over and over and over as the meta revolves a bit too quickly. But as land mechanics are indeed a very dry design space and theres not much they could do, I can't blame them too much. Rather, this set is a failure because its namesake dragon theme was tepidly and unambitiously put together, and the other mechanics are rehashed painfully and megamorph is outright laughable. With FRF building on and very much exceeding KTK from a design standpoint, I was actually a bit surprised how underboiled this set was, I was a bit optimistic that a dragon theme could be boldly done in grand style like ROTE was back in zendikar block, that was a bang-up job. In that regard, I think a lot of the weight of what I'll appraise a set on goes into the mechanics and number of mechanically interesting one-off cards, and I give a lesser but still important attention to what the set brings thematically and flavorwise in new and unique worldbuilding / backstory and its balance. Dragons wasn't terrible from a flavor standpoint, but it didn't really deliver on its potential as a time-shifted khans, instead it just kind of filled in the expected lines about "all khans are now dragons" and a resounding meh was echoed. Theres been worse flavored sets for sure, like the latter two thirds of theros or the entirety of the stinkeroo that was ravnica 2.0. So flavorwise, not amazing, not bad. But mechanicswise, this set is a bloody joke. Thank god at least theres living lore to make me forget for a minute we had an entire cycle of chimney imp dragons and a cyclone of completely identical colorshifted mana rock dragons, not even bothering to add the filler keywords of the former (flying + trample is totally worth the same cost as flying + lifelink, oh yeah!) I mean one of my complaints going into KTK is that while the delve cards were indeed pushed and some were well though out, it was the most mechanically interesting thing in the set and it was just a reprinted mechanic, so I was a bit meh about it. But now that seems to be spoiling us compared to how rebound was thrown in and butchered just for the sake of limited prowess or something, and megamorph is just, lol, megamorph, I'm going to be bringing up megamorph as a new whipping boy when I review future sets, I can stop hating on infect now Someone in another thread called this set "+1/+1 counters of tarkir" and they were spot on, hell, this set could have been done better if wizards went the darksteel route and just abandoned the dragon theme entirely and reworked the whole set to put the counters front and center. Even megamorph might have made sense in a set with stuff like modular or interchangeable charge & +1/+1 counters. There aren't enough +1/+1-counters-matters cards to make megamorph remotely justifiable. Another thing that really rubs my rhubarb is the whole thing where legendary creatures like zurgo got timeshifted instead of retconned out of existence. Flavorwise it sets me off, this whole set is supposed to be a bajillion years in the future after a world changing timeline fork where entire empires fell and it just so happens that the exact same characters were born anyways, just wearing a different hat? Even star trek didn't abuse that trope so hard. I mean, in planar chaos it made sense and was justifiable by the storyline- it wasn't a single forked timeline in the distant past, it was random and numerous splits in space time that turned everything into a messy soup, so it let them come up with riffs on old cards from all around, and that was fairly cleverly done (with some exceptions), but this is like marty mcfly returning to the present to find everyone in the exact same place, just wearing different clothes. They should have stuck with things like places and justifiable zombies like the tombshell and ancient golems and other age-spanning points set out in FRF instead of trying to cross from KTK.
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Mar 14, 2015 18:21
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not to mention that some of the cards will go good in some of my edh decks
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Mar 14, 2015 18:26
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We need a :mtggoonsay: smiley, holy poo poo
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Mar 14, 2015 18:51
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whydirt posted:We need a :mtggoonsay: smiley, holy poo poo I'm not sure it he's being serious. He seemed to like the set a week ago.
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Mar 14, 2015 18:54
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It's a post from mtgsalvation 
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Mar 14, 2015 18:58
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It's not my fault the two are near indistinguishable during spoiler season these days.
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Mar 14, 2015 19:02
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