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Hieronymous Alloy
Jan 30, 2009


Why! Why!! Why must you refuse to accept that Dr. Hieronymous Alloy's Genetically Enhanced Cream Corn Is Superior to the Leading Brand on the Market!?!




Morbid Hound

Mel Mudkiper posted:

Well yeah it was the defining book of its era but it was a lovely vapid era

And Great Gatsby does a magnificent job of holding a mirror up to that nature

A book can be a great book and still not be something I'm going to read more than once.

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Mel Mudkiper
Jan 19, 2012

At this point, Mudman abruptly ends the conversation. He usually insists on the last word.

Hieronymous Alloy posted:

And Great Gatsby does a magnificent job of holding a mirror up to that nature

A book can be a great book and still not be something I'm going to read more than once.

Well yeah but its still written terribly :colbert:

the first few pages are barely readable

Hieronymous Alloy
Jan 30, 2009


Why! Why!! Why must you refuse to accept that Dr. Hieronymous Alloy's Genetically Enhanced Cream Corn Is Superior to the Leading Brand on the Market!?!




Morbid Hound
Went googling for Fitzgerald and found this:

quote:

Everybody my age knows about Hemingway's story about measuring F. Scott Fitzgerald's penis in A Moveable Feast, but maybe it's a good way to introduce a younger generation to Big Papa's work. I've always wanted to write a poem about it, but nothing I ever came up with came close to matching Hemingway's account. The story is this. F. Scott Fitzgerald asked Hemingway to advise him about an important problem that had come up between Scott and Zelda. (So to speak.) So Scott and Papa go to Michaud's ("on the corner of the rue Jacob and the rue des Saints-Peres") for lunch and consultation. Fitzgerald swore Hemingway to tell "the absolute truth" when answering. Hemingway says, "He drank wine at the lunch but it did not affect him and he had not prepared for the lunch by drinking before it." (This doesn't have a lot to do with the story, but the sentence knocks me out; I think it's the "did not" and "had not" constructions.) Anyway, Zelda had told Scott his penis was too small. Here's the Hemingway:

quote:


"Finally when we were eating the cherry tart and had a last carafe of wine he said, 'You know I never slept with anyone except Zelda.'

'No, I didn't.'

'I thought I'd told you.'

'No. You told me a lot of things but not that.'

'That is what I want to ask you about.'

'Good. Go on.'

'Zelda said that the way I was built I could never make any woman happy and that was what upset her originally. [This conversation was held somewhat after what Hemingway describes as "what was then called her first nervous breakdown."] She said it was a matter of measurements. I have never felt the same since she said that and I have to know truly.'

'Come out to the office,' I said.

'Where is the office?'

'Le water," [the men's room] I said.

We came back into the room and sat down at the table.

'You're perfectly fine,' I said. 'You are O.K. There's nothing wrong with you. You look at yourself from above and you look foreshortened. Go over to the Louvre and look at the people in the statues and then go home and look at yourself in the mirror in profile.'

'Those statues may not be accurate.'

'They are pretty good. Most people would settle for them.'

'But why would she say it?'

'To put you out of business. That's the oldest way in the world of putting people out of business. Scott, you asked me to tell you the truth and I can tell you a lot more but this is the absolute truth and all you need. You could have gone to a doctor.'

'I didn't want to. I wanted you to tell me truly.'

'Now do you believe me?'

'I don't know,' he said.

'Come on over to the Louvre,' I said. 'It's just down the street and across the river.'

We went over to the Louvre and he looked at the statues but still he was doubtful about himself.

'It is not basically a question of the size in repose,' I said. 'It is the size that it becomes. It is also a question of angle.'

I explained to him about using a pillow and a few other things that might be useful for him to know.

'There is one girl,' he said, 'who has been very nice to me. But after what Zelda said--'

'Forget what Zelda said,' I told him. 'Zelda is crazy. There's nothing wrong with you. Just have confidence and do what the girl wants. Zelda just wants to destroy you.'

'You don't know anything about Zelda.'

'All right,' I said. 'Let it go at that. But you came to lunch to ask me a question and I've tried to give you an honest answer.'

But he was still doubtful.

'Should we go and see some pictures?' I asked. 'Have you ever seen anything in here except the Mona Lisa?'

'I'm not in the mood for looking at pictures,' he said. 'I promised to meet some people at the Ritz bar.'"

http://thebestamericanpoetry.typepad.com/the_best_american_poetry/2009/03/hemingway-reassures-fitzgerald-about-his-penis.html

Safety Biscuits
Oct 21, 2010

I like the implication that Papa looked at Fitzgerald's wang but not vice versa.

corn in the bible
Jun 5, 2004

Oh no oh god it's all true!
Dictionary of the Khazars is like Infinite Jest if it were good and written by an intelligent person who isnt a hack

Smoking Crow
Feb 14, 2012

*laughs at u*


Hemingway was a true friend

CestMoi
Sep 16, 2011

corn in the bible posted:

Dictionary of the Khazars is like Infinite Jest if it were good and written by an intelligent person who isnt a hack

It's zalso nothing like Infinite Jest.

Smoking Crow
Feb 14, 2012

*laughs at u*

What is this Dictionary of the Khazars it sounds like discount Borges

CestMoi
Sep 16, 2011

Smoking Crow posted:

What is this Dictionary of the Khazars it sounds like discount Borges

It's Borges if Borges was Serbian and collected his short stories into an encyclopedia about the conversion of a nomadic country to one of three abrahamic religions.

Smoking Crow
Feb 14, 2012

*laughs at u*

CestMoi posted:

It's Borges if Borges was Serbian and collected his short stories into an encyclopedia about the conversion of a nomadic country to one of three abrahamic religions.

So Eastern European bootlegger Borges

david crosby
Mar 2, 2007

Smoking Crow posted:

What is this Dictionary of the Khazars it sounds like discount Borges

It's like a more mystical & folkloristic Borges. It's pretty good poo poo, but Borges is king

ulvir
Jan 2, 2005

My local library has both versions of Dictionary of the Khazars at hand. I think I'm going to borrow the feminine version.

Earwicker
Jan 6, 2003

Smoking Crow posted:

So Eastern European bootlegger Borges

Not exactly. More like Borges would write a short story describing a book like Dictionary of the Khazars, but Dictionary of the Khazars attempts to be the object itself. IMO it's very good.

CestMoi
Sep 16, 2011

It is very good and is delightfully fairytalely in a way that Borges usually isn't.

Ras Het
May 23, 2007

when I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child - but now I am a man.
I don't really understand Borges. But I do understand Bolaņo who's basically a Borges who didn't go to Eton but has had sex.

ulvir posted:

My local library has both versions of Dictionary of the Khazars at hand. I think I'm going to borrow the feminine version.

the different versions are like the one stupid gimmicky thing that I don't like about that stupid wonderful gimmicky book. It's like one sentence.

Mel Mudkiper
Jan 19, 2012

At this point, Mudman abruptly ends the conversation. He usually insists on the last word.

Ras Het posted:

I don't really understand Borges. But I do understand Bolaņo who's basically a Borges who didn't go to Eton but has had sex.

I dunno, my issue with Borges is that he always seemed to see human beings in his stories as little more than flat objects to sit around and look at or talk about strange things. Bolano is massively more skilled at characterization.

CestMoi
Sep 16, 2011

That's exactly what people in Borges stories are for so that seems like a weird problem to have.

CestMoi
Sep 16, 2011

His later stuff is more directly concerned with human emotion and suffers for it IMO.

Earwicker
Jan 6, 2003

I like the sappy later Borges stuff too.

david crosby
Mar 2, 2007

Mel Mudkiper posted:

I dunno, my issue with Borges is that he always seemed to see human beings in his stories as little more than flat objects to sit around and look at or talk about strange things. Bolano is massively more skilled at characterization.

Bolano also has, like, 600 more pages to work with????

blue squares
Sep 28, 2007

I hated 2666. That's the most overrated book I"ve ever read

Ras Het
May 23, 2007

when I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child - but now I am a man.

blue squares posted:

I hated 2666. That's the most overrated book I"ve ever read

Get Out

david crosby
Mar 2, 2007

blue squares posted:

I hated 2666. That's the most overrated book I"ve ever read

Why do you feel this way? That's like a top 5 for me.

blue squares
Sep 28, 2007

I really enjoyed the first section and thought the characterization was done quite well. Everything after that just bored the poo poo out of me. This review says everything I think but much better. http://www.openlettersmonthly.com/december-2008-the-evidence-of-absence/

Honestly, the critical acclaim for this book just baffles me. I don't understand it at all.

Ras Het
May 23, 2007

when I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child - but now I am a man.

blue squares posted:

I really enjoyed the first section and thought the characterization was done quite well. Everything after that just bored the poo poo out of me. This review says everything I think but much better. http://www.openlettersmonthly.com/december-2008-the-evidence-of-absence/

Honestly, the critical acclaim for this book just baffles me. I don't understand it at all.

Also taking what you said into account, the review seems a bit lost in its own argument, since the first part blatantly isn't about death, and if the last part isn't either, then... I mean, I like death, so I don't really have to disagree here.

corn in the bible
Jun 5, 2004

Oh no oh god it's all true!

Ras Het posted:

I don't really understand Borges. But I do understand Bolaņo who's basically a Borges who didn't go to Eton but has had sex.


the different versions are like the one stupid gimmicky thing that I don't like about that stupid wonderful gimmicky book. It's like one sentence.

It's silly, but the rest of the book is real good. I tried to read landscape painted in tea though and thought it was too gimmicky. loving crosswords, gently caress off with those.

Stravinsky
May 31, 2011

Smoking Crow posted:


It is sometimes called "the new sincerity" and it is a big deal in Russian poetry

Do you have any recs on some modern Russian poets (who have translations in English because I can't read Russian :languagefail:)

blue squares
Sep 28, 2007

Ras Het posted:

Also taking what you said into account, the review seems a bit lost in its own argument, since the first part blatantly isn't about death, and if the last part isn't either, then... I mean, I like death, so I don't really have to disagree here.

It's been a while since I read the review, but I found everything after The Part About the Critics to be dull and poorly written. The book as a whole seemed like a first draft, which from what I read it was

Hieronymous Alloy
Jan 30, 2009


Why! Why!! Why must you refuse to accept that Dr. Hieronymous Alloy's Genetically Enhanced Cream Corn Is Superior to the Leading Brand on the Market!?!




Morbid Hound

Stravinsky posted:

I can't read Russian :languagefail:)

Bro do you even lit

I can't read Russian either, such bad mod

CestMoi
Sep 16, 2011

Stravinsky posted:

Do you have any recs on some modern Russian poets (who have translations in English because I can't read Russian :languagefail:)

I'm sorry to do this to you STravinsky, but you can't post in this thread any more.

Stravinsky
May 31, 2011

CestMoi posted:

I'm sorry to do this to you STravinsky, but you can't post in this thread any more.

.......ffffffffffffffffffffffff

Stravinsky
May 31, 2011

I had a choice between the languages of warmongering genocidal savages and a peaceful civilised people. I chose the former so I could study chinese

Mel Mudkiper
Jan 19, 2012

At this point, Mudman abruptly ends the conversation. He usually insists on the last word.
I learned Spanish because 20th boom literature is the best literature

Magical Realism 4 Lyfe

Also bluesquares you take back what you said about 2666 or I am coming for you

blue squares
Sep 28, 2007

its a bad book

Mel Mudkiper
Jan 19, 2012

At this point, Mudman abruptly ends the conversation. He usually insists on the last word.
Yo dawg maybe you best try something like the Hunger Games instead

Nanomashoes
Aug 18, 2012

If you don't speak at least two languages you should probably stop posting, and go outside, and then go learn a second language and start posting again.

mycophobia
May 7, 2008
I don't speak any languages

chernobyl kinsman
Mar 18, 2007

a friend of the friendly atom

Soiled Meat
i communicate primarily via pheromones

Nanomashoes posted:

If you don't speak at least two languages you should probably stop posting, and go outside, and then go learn a second language and start posting again.

hey man some of us have disabilities, like being born in America

Smoking Crow
Feb 14, 2012

*laughs at u*

Stravinsky posted:

Do you have any recs on some modern Russian poets (who have translations in English because I can't read Russian :languagefail:)

Nobody's translating modern russian poetry nowadays. Most of the stuff from the soviet period isn't translated yet either. The number 1 new sincere poet is Dmitry Vodennikov but nobody's translating him

sorry anglophones

Smoking Crow fucked around with this message at 04:40 on Mar 19, 2015

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Smoking Crow
Feb 14, 2012

*laughs at u*

Here are some Russian Futurist poets to soothe your pain

http://hlebnikov.com/works

Fun fact: the guy that wrote this thought that Dostoyevsky's writings would have to be destroyed in order to progress to the great fascist future

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