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wait a sec, if in the 2nd book Duiker knew about the jhistal, why didn't he warn them when he got to Aren
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Mar 15, 2015 14:58
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I think he tried but whoever was in charge didn't listen.
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Mar 15, 2015 15:22
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Toll the Hounds: drat, that poo poo got real crazy real quick. Really didn't expect him to kill off Anomander <<Anomandarist Dragnipurake>> Rake, but the preamble in dust of dreams explaining that the last two books are actually one book or ehatever makes that make sense. Also lol @ Hood, for what is def the most mentioned character in the series, he ends up making 2 five minute appearances and then is killed with no fuckin fanfare because Rake dies *oh so nobly* 5 minutes later.
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Mar 15, 2015 17:07
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You haven't seen the last of Hood. He's the god of death, if anyone knows how to cheat it, it's him.
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Mar 15, 2015 17:09
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It's also explicitly said that he planned/agreed to all of those events beforehand.
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Mar 16, 2015 07:19
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anilEhilated posted:You haven't seen the last of Hood. He's the god of death, if anyone knows how to cheat it, it's him. Fall of Light is going to own so hard.
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Mar 16, 2015 07:44
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anilEhilated posted:You haven't seen the last of Hood. He's the god of death, if anyone knows how to cheat it, it's him. He also adopts dogs. Finished the series last week for the third time, and I think the ending is probably one of the weaker parts of the series. There are just so many things he tries to cram in there it becomes too much. On the other hand, most of the storylines get their ending so there is that.
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Mar 16, 2015 08:21
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Working through Memories of Ice for the first time. At about the 190 page mark. Wow, this book is awesome so far. Every story line/viewpoint so far is awesome and providing lots of cool insights/revelations/plot/characters. I liked Deadhouse Gates a lot, and can't wait to find out what the heck is gonna happen there.. However, I think I'm gonna like this one even more. It's funny how you can't possibly comprehend the amount of heavy poo poo going down in Seven Cities, then you start book 3 and the poo poo going down on Genebackis is just as, if not more, heavy and crazy. There is an epic level of poo poo going down in this world/magic universe/nexus of dimensions/whatever the gently caress the world of Malazan is. I wish I could read faster. Also, page 188 (paperback), first sighting/description of the dinosaurs with blades for arms race.  Really interested what the gently caress they are. I'm guessing they are some magical/powerful as poo poo dudes since a 100s of thousands year old dead pair of their arm bones act like Skype in GOTM between Whiskeyjack and Dujek.
Damo fucked around with this message at 10:39 on Mar 19, 2015 |
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Mar 19, 2015 10:30
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I just finished my second read-thru of Gardens of the Moon (read it first maybe a year ago) and still came away thinking this was one of the worst fantasy novels I've ever read. The cast is just too big, the backstory too sparse, too much happening off-camera or not explained at all, too many plots all going on at the same time that I think were supposed to link up in the end and maybe did but I really don't know. Just a mess. Is this a common sentiment from people who go on to enjoy the series or should I just give up? I want to give it a chance because TBB seems to like this series and I like pretty much everything else in this genre that TBB likes. I'm not reading this dumb book a third time though, that is for sure.
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Mar 22, 2015 04:06
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Gardens of the Moon was written something like a decade before Erikson wrote the second book; books 2-10 are much better than Gardens of the Moon. I'd at try the second book, Deadhouse Gates. If you make it to the end of the Chain of Dogs and still don't like it then the series is not for you.
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Mar 22, 2015 04:09
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Ross posted:I just finished my second read-thru of Gardens of the Moon (read it first maybe a year ago) and still came away thinking this was one of the worst fantasy novels I've ever read. The cast is just too big, the backstory too sparse, too much happening off-camera or not explained at all, too many plots all going on at the same time that I think were supposed to link up in the end and maybe did but I really don't know. Just a mess. The subsequent books are significantly better written. However, the cast is always going to be too big, the back story will largely remain sparse (it's actually pretty extensive, but distributed in small bits throughout the series), a lot will continue happening off screen and/or not being explained, and a massive number of simultaneous plots that you think were all supposed to link up in the end and maybe they did but you really don't know (they did) is pretty much the hallmark of the series (and my favorite part of GotM, which goes to show how subjective it all is). Maybe other readers will disagree, but to me, all of the things you list ironically enough make this series what it is, and in this GotM is not unique. As the writing improves, perhaps the way these facets are handled becomes smoother, but if those are the things that bothered you, ehhh it may just not be your thing. I'd still recommend giving Deadhouse Gates a shot. Just in case.
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Mar 22, 2015 04:28
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Thanks, I will give Deadhouse Gates at least a shot. I've had the paperback for some time and read the first ~ 100 pages or so after finishing GotM initially. I just felt like I was constantly having only half the story told to me and couldn't connect with any of the characters, then in the end when things came to a head I found I wasn't that interested in what happened to any of them.
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Mar 22, 2015 04:44
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loving hell god drat poo poo gently caress holy crap Memories of Ice owns so hard.
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Mar 22, 2015 04:55
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I would add the stories and events of the other books are much more interesting and awesome so those things you complained about aren't really a big deal because you still have something to hang on to. But yeah read the entire second book and if you still dislike it, his style is just not for you.
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Mar 22, 2015 05:04
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Damo posted:loving hell god drat poo poo gently caress holy crap Memories of Ice owns so hard. I read MoI before DG, because I wanted to read more about Whiskeyjack and Dujek and crew, and the intro to Memories of Ice is what hooked me on the series. quote:"I shall break you. Each of you. I swear this upon the bones of seven million sacrifices. K'rul, you shall fade from the world, you shall be forgotten. Draconus, what you create shall be turned upon you. And as for you, woman, unhuman hands shall tear your body into pieces upon a field of battle, and yet you shall know no respite - thus, my curse upon you, Sister of Cold Nights. Kallor Eiderann Tes'thesula, one voice, has spoken three curses. Thus."
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Mar 22, 2015 05:18
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To echo what others have already said - this series might not be for you, but give the second book a read. In general those things aren't what most people complain about though.
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Mar 22, 2015 05:49
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Damo posted:loving hell god drat poo poo gently caress holy crap Memories of Ice owns so hard. Yeah, out of a series of really loving awesome books I think MoI is still my favourite, with probably RG coming second. Capustan and Coral, man.
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Mar 22, 2015 06:15
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I never understood why people didn't like Gardens of the Moon. I thought it was fantastic. Of course the series only got better, but even so, all those complaints everyone always goes off on it about just really just things that I really enjoyed about the book, and even more the series. I've never had difficulty keeping track of the characters, or of shifting my understanding of the world over time as more information became apparent, or of just appreciating that there was just this world that I was learning about as the characters were living their lives. Man, GotM was a wonderful book, and I'm grateful that it was good enough to convince me to keep reading the series.
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Mar 22, 2015 07:24
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Yeah, I also really liked GotM. So much to like in that book. Dunno why so many people can't handle it, it isn't nearly as confusing or weird or bad or whatever as most people led me to believe.
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Mar 22, 2015 08:04
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I just started Dust of Dreams on my first read through. I am so loving excited. These loose loving ends are all going to get tied together. I expect Karsa to still be my favorite by the end, dammit. But only because Anomander Rake just died. Those are two fantastic characters.
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Mar 22, 2015 08:20
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BigHead posted:I just started Dust of Dreams on my first read through. Prepare to be disappointed. DoD is pretty great however. Regarding GotM, it becomes really good the third time around combined with FoD. Incidentally, this is like only 22k pages you have to read. 
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Mar 22, 2015 15:32
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Drifter posted:I never understood why people didn't like Gardens of the Moon. I thought it was fantastic. Of course the series only got better, but even so, all those complaints everyone always goes off on it about just really just things that I really enjoyed about the book, and even more the series. This is pretty much me. I've read a lot of fantasy, and when I first picked up GotM, thought it was one of the best fantasy books I'd encountered. The writing wasn't as good or polished or page-turney as Martin's had been up to that point (AFfC hadn't come out), but the complexity, the mystery, and, as Karsa would say, the "too many plots" all converging together just blew me away. The first Soletaken encounter in DG clinched it for me. BigHead posted:I just started Dust of Dreams on my first read through. A lot of those loose ends won't be handled until TCG, as it and DoD are essentially one book in two parts, consequently with much of the setup coming in Dust and the resolution in TCG. It's an awesome book IMO, but I know some people weren't thrilled with the lack of explosive ending. But the upside is that TCG is basically one giant climax. And I mean that in every definition of climax. Habibi fucked around with this message at 17:09 on Mar 22, 2015 |
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Mar 22, 2015 17:04
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Watching old films with the wife (Well, mostly making her watch films I found it criminal she hadn't watched) I realised who my mental image of Tavore has always been and not realised - Joanne Whalley as Sorsha in Willow. I still maintain that if we ever, ever got a film of anything Malazan, if Tavore wasn't played by Noomi Rapace the casting people should be shot.
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Mar 22, 2015 18:15
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DG is already much less of a struggle for me than GOTM was. I'm about 50 pages in.
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Mar 23, 2015 19:40
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Well, about 10 months later I've finished The Crippled God. What a great ride and satisfying ending to the series. I love how Erikson introduces you to the Bridgeburners in the first book, then a couple books later after all their backstory and heroic moments of badassery have been fully fleshed out you feel deflated and cheated moving on to the Bonehunters... who then completely eclipse the Bridgeburners in every way to the point where Whiskeyjack shows up at the end of TCG and I'd almost rather just have a scene of Hellian getting blackout drunk again. I don't know if I'll be able to appreciate any fantasy anymore - I don't even care about The Winds of Winter at this point. Is the Black Company series a good shot then?
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Mar 24, 2015 04:31
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Read Forge of Darkness his new trilogy on the Tiste. Black Company is fine but I agree with fantasy being ruined. R Scott Bakker is probably the most similar author I have found but I stopped reading his books. Something rubbed me the wrong way. Hand Row fucked around with this message at 04:45 on Mar 24, 2015 |
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Mar 24, 2015 04:42
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acumen posted:I don't know if I'll be able to appreciate any fantasy anymore That's what this series did to me, too.
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Mar 24, 2015 05:07
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Habibi posted:That's what this series did to me, too. Not me! I have a high tolerance for bad fantasy, though.
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Mar 24, 2015 11:11
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acumen posted:Well, about 10 months later I've finished The Crippled God. What a great ride and satisfying ending to the series. I love how Erikson introduces you to the Bridgeburners in the first book, then a couple books later after all their backstory and heroic moments of badassery have been fully fleshed out you feel deflated and cheated moving on to the Bonehunters... who then completely eclipse the Bridgeburners in every way to the point where Whiskeyjack shows up at the end of TCG and I'd almost rather just have a scene of Hellian getting blackout drunk again. I still feel the ending is one of the weaker parts of the series, since it becomes a little too much. On the other hand, he admirably ties together all strings. As for Winds of Winter, I gave up that a long time ago. Waiting 5 years between mediocre books killed my interest pretty well. As for other fantasy, I have no idea. Black Company is fine, Abercrombie as well, Richard Morgan and Robin Hobb might be worth your while. Bakker if you can stand black demon semen.
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Mar 24, 2015 16:17
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Among current fantasy stories the closest thing you're going to find to Malazan is R. Scott Bakker, who was very heavily influenced by Erikson to the point that he thanks Erikson in one of his acknowledgements. He gets a lot of grief for writing books that can generously be described as grimdark to the max, but if you made it through Malazan without having to put the books down then you'll probably be fine for Bakker. I personally find the Prince of Nothing series to be very well-written, suspenseful, and deeply affecting. Bakker is very good at creating atmosphere and tension; there were times where I felt a palpable sense of dread while reading. I wouldn't recommend the series to everybody but if you got through Malazan and still want more he's a good author to check out.
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Mar 24, 2015 21:01
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Bakker is absolutely unparalleled at creating this rumbling deep-bass sense of dread and sick wrongness. There's a lot wrong with Prince of Nothing but they have this texture like the history of the whole world is an HR Giger painting and if you lived there you couldn't escape even by stuffing thermite in your skull.
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Mar 24, 2015 21:06
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This makes me want to try the Prince if Nothing again, but those names...
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Mar 24, 2015 22:32
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You'll get less of the names once you get past the prologue and even so, the prologue is more of a second readthrough thing when you know a bit of who's who. The actual cast of characters is fairly small.
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Mar 24, 2015 23:14
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Much like Malazan I just started with the second book.
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Mar 24, 2015 23:42
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Oh my god, I forgot so many little details about The Chain of Dogs, I'm at 90% on the Kindle and just basically reading every page with my heart in my throat. This loving arc should be a movie.
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Mar 25, 2015 01:47
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Thanks for the suggestions everyone. Turns out Bakker (another Canadian) actually lives in the same city I do. Happy to support local talent!Cardiac posted:I still feel the ending is one of the weaker parts of the series, since it becomes a little too much. On the other hand, he admirably ties together all strings. I partially agree - there's probably four major events that could each be the page-turning climax of their own book all crammed into about 200 pages and it's hard to give each one its due. I haven't felt such a satisfying ending since Breaking Bad though. The thought of Fiddler living the rest of his life alternating between fishing and mournfully reminiscing the staggering amount of losses he's experienced through music is so perfectly, beautifully bittersweet.
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Mar 25, 2015 04:13
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It's not really in the same fantasy wheelhouse as Malazan, but I just finished China Mieville's "Perdido Street Station" and found it highly enjoyable all the way through. The prose is good and the tragedies are oppressive. I can't guarantee every Malazan fan will like it, but this Malazan fan did. 
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Mar 25, 2015 17:15
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Mieville is pretty good, that's for sure. I really enjoy him.
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Mar 25, 2015 22:52
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apophenium posted:The prose is good and the tragedies are oppressive. I wholeheartedly agree. He's like the anti-Rothfuss.
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Mar 25, 2015 23:41
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If you want something that matches Malazan for the battles if not quite the pathos and depth, try Gemmell. The latter two books in the Rigante series, Ravenheart and Stormrider, are particularly close. Now: a long time ago in this thread, someone suggested casting Christopher Walken as Kallor. All I could think of was Kallor spending 100,000 years with one of Icarium's timepieces shoved up his rear end.
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Mar 25, 2015 23:56
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