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I'm on board with the idea that everyone gets the same amount, regardless of position, skill, playing time, whatever, but I know that once the genie bottle is opened, it's going to get messy. Just like every episode of I Dream of Jeannie.
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Mar 24, 2015 03:01
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I hope it applies to all student athletes forcing tuition and attendance fees to skyrocket which eventually kills all collegiate sports and leads to the founding of a minor league for football and basketball.
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Mar 24, 2015 03:31
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If the Mens Lacrosse team doesn't get a stipend, count me out too 
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Mar 24, 2015 03:41
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Crotch Bat posted:I hope it applies to all student athletes forcing tuition and attendance fees to skyrocket which eventually kills all collegiate sports and leads to the founding of a minor league for football and basketball. I don't hope this happens
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Mar 24, 2015 04:44
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Crotch Bat posted:I hope it applies to all student athletes forcing tuition and attendance fees to skyrocket which eventually kills all collegiate sports and leads to the founding of a minor league for football and basketball. This but unironically Really, there are about 500 universities that should just drop football right now and accept their fate
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Mar 24, 2015 05:13
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I do like that the people who argue against compensation usually admit that under the table poo poo happens but that is okay because ?????? and doesn't give the school any advantages but putting them on record somehow would.
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Mar 24, 2015 05:23
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limeincoke posted:Jesus. College players get free tuition, free housing, free food, access to the best fitness equipment on earth, athlete only faculties (lounge areas, Ipads in lockers, etc...)all the pussy they can handle, priceless networking opportunities (if you're a former athlete and can't get a job straight out of college simply because of your ex-athlete status u dumb) and the opportunity to play on national TV every week. And, depending on the school and their own motivation level, they don't even actually have to do the whole "student" part. Yea I am sure a linebacker at Akron or Miami Ohio doing 40 hours of football related stuff per week is just rolling in the benefits.
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Mar 24, 2015 05:26
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CharlestheHammer posted:I do like that the people who argue against compensation usually admit that under the table poo poo happens but that is okay because ?????? and doesn't give the school any advantages but putting them on record somehow would. I'm not aware of anybody who thinks under-the-table stuff is OK.
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Mar 24, 2015 05:29
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I'm going to cash in some of my pussy vouchers for a meal
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Mar 24, 2015 05:55
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Pussy vouchers bought my mom a house.
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Mar 24, 2015 06:09
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Everyone knows college students don't ever need to pay for anything other than tuition, books, and housing. I mean, what else even is there?
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Mar 24, 2015 06:10
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VDay posted:Everyone knows college students don't ever need to pay for anything other than tuition, books, and housing. I mean, what else even is there? Most student-athletes barely eat from what I've heard. Often staff members will need to purchase dozens of tacos to keep the kids fed in a harsh winter.
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Mar 24, 2015 06:20
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As a fan of one of the bad football programs only talked about in hushed tones: pay the players
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Mar 24, 2015 06:32
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Deteriorata posted:I'm not aware of anybody who thinks under-the-table stuff is OK.
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Mar 24, 2015 06:40
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Sweet, Jerrod Heard is getting equal snaps in practice for the top QB spot. Maybe he can beat out Swoopes.
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Mar 24, 2015 07:43
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Lessail posted:As a fan of one of the bad football programs only talked about in hushed tones: pay the players 
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Mar 24, 2015 07:49
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Dont pay em, cause gently caress em. Pay me all the money for free instead.
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Mar 24, 2015 12:08
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Imagine if Obama wanted software developer salaries capped at living expenses because he was worried about how Tinder was going to compete with Facebook.
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Mar 24, 2015 12:50
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I'm on board for reasonable stipends for all athletes but beyond that I'm not. Baseball and hockey have farm systems and don't have this problem. Don't tear down college sports just because the NFL and NBA refuse to develop farm systems.
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Mar 24, 2015 12:55
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Crotch Bat posted:I hope it applies to all student athletes forcing tuition and attendance fees to skyrocket which eventually kills all collegiate sports and leads to the founding of a minor league for football and basketball. In reality it probably just means that colleges will not have to shuffle around as much money to hide their profits.
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Mar 24, 2015 12:57
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Don't pay the players, Ohio State needs that money for Gene Smith's $1.5M salary. The bureaucrats are the real heroes.Thoguh posted:I'm on board for reasonable stipends for all athletes but beyond that I'm not. Baseball and hockey have farm systems and don't have this problem. Don't tear down college sports just because the NFL and NBA refuse to develop farm systems. Steve Kerr wrote "Why should NBA franchises assume the responsibility and financial burden of player development when, once upon a time, colleges happily assumed that role for them?" I'm pretty sure the stated mission of NCAA Athletics is "assuming the responsibility and financial burden of player development so a billion dollar industry doesn't have to" Spacemonkey57 fucked around with this message at 13:49 on Mar 24, 2015 |
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Mar 24, 2015 13:44
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Spacemonkey57 posted:I'm pretty sure the stated mission of NCAA Athletics is "assuming the responsibility and financial burden of player development so a billion dollar industry doesn't have to" I thought it was "Making a profit off of unpaid amateurs"
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Mar 24, 2015 14:15
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That Works posted:I thought it was "Making a profit off of unpaid amateurs" Exactly. The benefit to the NBA and NFL is just a coincidence.
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Mar 24, 2015 14:18
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Thoguh posted:I'm on board for reasonable stipends for all athletes but beyond that I'm not. Baseball and hockey have farm systems and don't have this problem. Don't tear down college sports just because the NFL and NBA refuse to develop farm systems. Your overall point is well taken, but a lot of hockey's farm systems aren't NHL-created. The AHL and ECHL are farms, but all the junior leagues around Canada, Europe and even a couple in the US aren't directly related to the NHL. It sucks but the NFL and NBA (OK, the NBA has a D-league but it's an afterthought), from their points of view, basically have the perfect 'minor leagues' in the NCAA. Plus we're at the point where I'm sure we could have a decent NBA minor league, but I don't know how feasable an NFL minors would be at this point. There's no chance the NFL would allow it to run during the same season, and I don't know if people would have an appetite for it in the spring or summer. Maybe I'm wrong though.
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Mar 24, 2015 14:42
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This is all an interesting subject because you have a couple of things going that should be addressed. 1. The entire system overall makes boatloads of money off of college football. So, leaving the players unpaid and making them jump through a lot of hoops regarding compensation while claiming "they get so many benefits" is not really IMO a great argument. If I was worth millions in my job and was paid with a dorm room, on the job training and a food stipend I'd probably not like working there any longer than I needed to. 2. Paying players is a solution but where do you draw the line? Do you pay all the players for all NCAA sanctioned sports at a University? (arguably the most 'fair'). Do you pay them all the exact amount irrespective of school (again likely the most 'fair'). Or, do you pay only athletes in profitable sports. Subdividing that further, do you pay some players more than others based on their perceived worth to a program? If you decide to pay players and then claim it will ruin smaller athletic programs that do not turn a profit then is this a suitable excuse to keep making profit off of unpaid players at larger programs? Paying players would likely end a few athletic programs, possibly many. Is that a bad thing? If your best way to compete is to turn the University academic environment on its head into one that caters to an athletes ability to be a better (and more profitable for the University) athlete then are you even fulfilling the point of college athletics in the first place? It sort of throws out the original intent for student athlete.
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Mar 24, 2015 14:50
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That Works posted:I thought it was "Making a profit off of unpaid amateurs" Just like high school, middle school, and rec league athletics. That in itself is not an issue. Most of those leagues have to charge admission and sell concessions to make money off amateur athletes so as to pay administrative costs. The difference with college athletics is that a whole lot of money being made, far beyond any reasonable administrative costs. The NCAA itself doesn't get much of that of money, though. Most of it goes to conferences and individual athletic departments. Paying the players is a nice idea on the surface, but the consequences of it end up being rather terrible. Good intentions with bad results are bad ideas. The solution is to reduce the commercialization of college sports. Athletic departments are not stand-alone corporations, they are a department of their universities. The Athletic Director reports to the President of the University. Thus, the situation can be changed if the Presidents of enough universities decide to do something about it. This has happened numerous times in the past, and in fact the NCAA itself was created by college presidents themselves due to all the chaos in intercollegiate athletics back in 1905. Insufficient faculty control of athletics has been an issue as long as college athletics has existed. Rather than a movement to pay the players which will essentially destroy college athletics, I would much rather see a movement to influence university faculties and presidents to reassert their control and reduce the commercialism in college athletics.
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Mar 24, 2015 15:03
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If we're playing players, do we get to a point where the scholarship becomes a contract and players aren't able to leave early for the NBA/NFL?
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Mar 24, 2015 15:03
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Deteriorata posted:Just like high school, middle school, and rec league athletics. That in itself is not an issue. Most of those leagues have to charge admission and sell concessions to make money off amateur athletes so as to pay administrative costs. While I admire the sentiment I don't see Universities doing anything at all to cut off potential revenue streams while they are facing ever increasing funding cuts from their respective states. Private schools would have to lead with this if it were to happen at all.
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Mar 24, 2015 15:14
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Deteriorata posted:Just like high school, middle school, and rec league athletics. That in itself is not an issue. Most of those leagues have to charge admission and sell concessions to make money off amateur athletes so as to pay administrative costs. The crazy part is that more money could be made off players via licensing names and other aspects of their local and regional names. Also while the conferences and schools are making most of the money in football, the NCAA funds itself via Basketball in March. Even more money is made by the networks and retailers. The goal of any changes should be to increase fairness in monetization while maintaining parity. There are a few ways to do this, some more extreme than others: - Switch to full cost of attendance: amounts to a "raise" for players and maintains the status quo. You may lose a few smaller programs that cannot support CoA in their budgets. - License player names & likenesses to video game and apparel manufacturers. Use funds to pay for continuing insurance & pay out players evenly - Institute a draft and salary cap: say screw it and turn college ball into a professional sport. You'll lose at least half of the programs.
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Mar 24, 2015 15:22
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The moment you even consider a draft or salary cap, or anything like that, you aren't even pretending to be anything other than a minor league for the NFL/NBA. If you want to follow pro sports go follow pro sports.
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Mar 24, 2015 17:34
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Deteriorata posted:I'm not aware of anybody who thinks under-the-table stuff is OK. Are we talking about my school or some other school that we compete with for recruits? Because Auburn and A&M are villainous monsters for paying off recruits, Texas is just doing what you gotta do.
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Mar 24, 2015 17:38
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The facade is what's most important
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Mar 24, 2015 17:49
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I couldn't wait. Ive started my re-watching of old games. Hold me, TFF.
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Mar 24, 2015 20:55
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Deteriorata posted:Paying the players is a nice idea on the surface, but the consequences of it end up being rather terrible. Good intentions with bad results are bad ideas. The solution is to reduce the commercialization of college sports. I like how you just say this as if it's an obvious fact while still not actually addressing how player compensation will destroy the holy sanctity of collegiate athletics, or any of the ways people have brought up that it could be limited when implemented. But yeah let's go with your idea and sit on our hands while waiting for something to magically happen. I'm sure university presidents will all stand up and vote to make less money for their schools for the sake of the idea of amateurism any day now.
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Mar 24, 2015 21:19
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VDay posted:I like how you just say this as if it's an obvious fact while still not actually addressing how player compensation will destroy the holy sanctity of collegiate athletics, or any of the ways people have brought up that it could be limited when implemented. Players being paid makes them employees of the athletic department and divorces them even further from academics. Eventually the pretense will be dropped completely. At that point they are professionals, not students, and what they're playing is no longer college athletics. At that point the whole concept of the athletic scholarship as a means for an athlete to get an education breaks down and college athletics as we know it is over. Unless, of course, you can demonstrate that paying players would actually make them better students. Good luck with that.
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Mar 24, 2015 21:34
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KKKLIP ART posted:I couldn't wait. Ive started my re-watching of old games. Hold me, TFF. I'm gonna do this to analyze my team's free agent signings, though~
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Mar 24, 2015 21:53
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Deteriorata posted:Players being paid makes them employees of the athletic department Deteriorata posted:Eventually the pretense will be dropped completely. At that point they are professionals, not students, and what they're playing is no longer college athletics. Deteriorata posted:At that point the whole concept of the athletic scholarship as a means for an athlete to get an education breaks down and college athletics as we know it is over. And no, I guess I can't prove your made-up nonsensical hypothetical that paying players would make them better students, a point that no one is making or arguing, so I guess you win this one Bill O'Reilly.
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Mar 24, 2015 22:14
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Great job knocking down those strawmen...
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Mar 24, 2015 22:18
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Deteriorata posted:Players being paid makes them employees of the athletic department and divorces them even further from academics. Eventually the pretense will be dropped completely. At that point they are professionals, not students, and what they're playing is no longer college athletics. Do you have any problem with student musicians who are on scholarship making money from playing in Concerta for the school? Do you think that makes them worse students? And more money=worse students is laughable and stupid. We all know rich kids who were good students and rich kids who weren't. Same with poor kids.
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Mar 24, 2015 22:30
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It doesn't matter because Deteriorata's argument is rooted in the notion that the way to fix the problem is to remove commercialization from college athletics. That would fix it sure but has about a 0% probability of happening.
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Mar 24, 2015 22:43
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