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FMguru posted:yeah the bubble companies will get blown away, but they dont really employ that many people (unlike 2001, when the downturn emptied out whole office buildings and campuses). all that app 3.0 disruption nonsense could disappear overnight and intel and cisco and google and facebook and apple and the rest of the companies in the f500 will still be hiring and paying programmers and it people yeah the big guys will be fine but ripple effects are hard to predict. I do wonder how much of Google and Facebook ad revenue is from bubble companies, particularly Facebook and mobile games. but the implosion of ads is a long running thing. there is a pretty sizable industry of hangers on that will have to find new jobs or suckers. branding companies are going to have to come up with something to replace the gravy train of gullible startup bros. "incubators" and "coding boot camps" are proper hosed because actual coding for a salary doesn't appeal to all that many people like becoming a millionaire off your fart app.
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Mar 25, 2015 12:55
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Shifty Pony posted:yeah the big guys will be fine but ripple effects are hard to predict. I do wonder how much of Google and Facebook ad revenue is from bubble companies, particularly Facebook and mobile games. but the implosion of ads is a long running thing. the farmville company pretty much collapsed, right? did that cause the whole mobile-game market to suffer?
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Mar 25, 2015 13:01
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I tried to use uber yesterday but the driver who grabbed my fare twice couldn't figure out how to get to me at the hotel and wound up driving around the block twice. I wouldn't up asking the head bellhop for a ride and there was a town car already at the hotel that got me to the airport for a flat $50 charge. that's my latest uber adventure.
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Mar 25, 2015 13:25
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prefect posted:the farmville company pretty much collapsed, right? did that cause the whole mobile-game market to suffer? they just moved from Facebook based to mobile apps with in app purchases required to not have to wait 40 hours to play for 20 minutes again. Facebook integrated pay per install ads for mobile apps and some absurd percentage of their mobile ad revenue comes from those things because all the companies are bidding up the prices for the same subgroup of idiots who will drop $99 for a cookie clicker power up.
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Mar 25, 2015 13:31
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Munkeymon posted:holy poo poo who cares?
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Mar 25, 2015 13:57
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Subjunctive posted:no, because the side of Sand Hill with all the brand name VCs is in Menlo Park what about atherton
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Mar 25, 2015 14:11
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also its almond juice, not almond milk.
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Mar 25, 2015 14:14
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fritz posted:what about atherton I'm sure a bunch live there, but I don't think there are many offices
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Mar 25, 2015 14:15
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thank god all these people who were nine years old during the last bubble are here to tell us all about how it worked
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Mar 25, 2015 14:24
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you don't believe in historians, I guess? even those of us who were of age don't have all-encompassing experiences, so we'd rely on reading and analyzing other sources as well
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Mar 25, 2015 14:27
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an autist's history of Silicon Valley, by Howard "subjunctive" Zinn
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Mar 25, 2015 14:28
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Mido posted:now imagining tori searching his evernote for 'poo poo idiot mido' most of us are using PostgreSQL shaggar uses access tho.
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Mar 25, 2015 14:34
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Jonny 290 posted:California gave us Reagan, and for that, we will never, ever forgive you. 
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Mar 25, 2015 14:34
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Mido posted:hp where is the webzone for yospos.xlsx remembering things about other people is basically what your brain is meant to do, lmao if yours doesn't work properly
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Mar 25, 2015 14:41
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triple sulk posted:ruby is already dead and the people who are still writing in 2015 are either delusional or have accepted the fact that they're gonna maintain rails 2.x apps for the next 15 years my company has started a huge initiative to move from our lovely monolithic .net app to a bunch of SOA Ruby/Rails apps. I'm writing brand new Rails 4 code in TYOOL 2015 and it's p ok
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Mar 25, 2015 14:52
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Shifty Pony posted:yeah the big guys will be fine but ripple effects are hard to predict. I do wonder how much of Google and Facebook ad revenue is from bubble companies, particularly Facebook and mobile games. but the implosion of ads is a long running thing. facebook and google can survive just about anything, their popularity and ubiquity makes them irresistible ad platforms no matter how bad things get the number of parasite companies leeching off the bubble is hilarious, but most of them are localized services in or around bubble hubs like SF and NYC so the actual national impact will probably be pretty slight demand for programmers will probably drop a lot, though. right now every white male "idea man" that can afford to move within commuting distance of sf or nyc is looking to hire a few white male programmers
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Mar 25, 2015 15:07
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Main Paineframe posted:facebook and google can survive just about anything, their popularity and ubiquity makes them irresistible ad platforms no matter how bad things get gonna own when the "rockstar programmers" are working at best buy and I'm still writing medical billing software. lol
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Mar 25, 2015 15:10
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Citizen Tayne posted:gonna own when the "rockstar programmers" are working at best buy and I'm still writing medical billing software. lol bigger lols if best buy dies right around then
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Mar 25, 2015 15:23
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Main Paineframe posted:demand for programmers will probably drop a lot, though. right now every white male "idea man" that can afford to move within commuting distance of sf or nyc is looking to hire a few white male programmers demand for entry level nodejs programmers will drop a lot demand for experienced java/c# devs will plod along as it ever has
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Mar 25, 2015 15:23
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wages will keep falling though. that was never in question. wages in this bubble never even came close to 2001. they're not going to go higher after the bubble pops.
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Mar 25, 2015 15:24
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Notorious b.s.d. posted:wages will keep falling though the extra node.js programmers will be used as an excuse for pay to crater for everyone because someone in middle management read that unemployment was up among programmers and they were desperate for worm.
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Mar 25, 2015 15:26
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Citizen Tayne posted:gonna own when the "rockstar programmers" are working at best buy and hillary nationalizes health care and puts all the medical insurance companies out of business
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Mar 25, 2015 15:27
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Notorious b.s.d. posted:wages will keep falling though. that was never in question. "everyone should learn to code!" - a really rich guy who doesn't want his kids to learn to code
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Mar 25, 2015 15:27
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lol who do you think administers Medicare, Medicaid, and Tricare?
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Mar 25, 2015 15:28
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Shaggar posted:who cares? people who want to hasten the environmental collapse of california 
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Mar 25, 2015 15:28
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Citizen Tayne posted:lol who do you think administers Medicare, Medicaid, and Tricare? with a national market I'm going to assume whoever wins the contract, and it probably isnt going to be the company that has a bunch of expensive domestic programmers
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Mar 25, 2015 15:32
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Citizen Tayne posted:"everyone should learn to ______!" - a really rich guy who doesn't want to pay so much to employ ______
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Mar 25, 2015 15:34
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Notorious b.s.d. posted:demand for entry level nodejs programmers will drop a lot yeah. experienced programmers who know important languages are always gonna be in fair demand. very few real employers are interested in a fresh college grad with three months internship experience in ruby or php, though; the only reason those people are finding jobs is because at any given time there's a dozen new "uber but for X" companies and thirty "X but on/with a smartphone" companies in sf desperately fighting over the sf labor market to build a whole programming team from scratch
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Mar 25, 2015 15:40
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PCjr sidecar posted:with a national market I'm going to assume whoever wins the contract, and it probably isnt going to be the company that has a bunch of expensive domestic programmers Every Fortune 500 company has a bunch of expensive domestic programmers. every company is a software company in one way or another.
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Mar 25, 2015 15:57
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Marzzle posted:i was under the impression that industry software peeps just didn't really care about publications at all and you shouldn't put them on a resume but you are probably talkin' bout grad schools it depends. we're concerned with whether you can do the job. there are problems with cs researchers in that many of them are poo poo at building software. but doing research and publishing also demonstrates competence in other areas related to the job. mainly being able to deeply investigate and analyze a problem and document findings, which is important for software that isn't just gluing poo poo together to make babbies first blog. so it's a big plus but not necessarily sufficient. as long as you can demonstrate that you can also code reasonably well then you're ahead of the curve.
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Mar 25, 2015 16:24
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Citizen Tayne posted:Every Fortune 500 company has a bunch of expensive domestic programmers. every company is a software company in one way or another. even aggressive outsourcers who claim to employ 0 programmers have contractors working in-house ("insourcing" i guess?)
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Mar 25, 2015 16:26
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Notorious b.s.d. posted:even aggressive outsourcers who claim to employ 0 programmers have contractors working in-house ("insourcing" i guess?) It's cyclical too, my company has almost entirely eradicated offshoring as a matter of course in favor of bringing people over and making them permanent employees, or hiring locally. offshoring only happens to make up for unexpected demand.
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Mar 25, 2015 16:29
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a lot of federal work also has strings attached saying it has to be done with us citizen labor. often by requiring security clearances (even public trust level). and even if it doesn't the companies that bid it tend to use us labor because then they can spread it around to a bunch of congressional districts and keep their contract from ever being killed no matter how incredibly stupid it is or how poorly they are executing. see the f35 for a great example.
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Mar 25, 2015 16:52
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many of those giant internal java applications written by terrible outsourced it vendors need people who can locate their own rear end to spend years fixing and enhancing them [and managing more offshore "talent"] it's certainly not glamorous but the need will always be there
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Mar 25, 2015 16:55
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Shifty Pony posted:a lot of federal work also has strings attached saying it has to be done with us citizen labor. often by requiring security clearances (even public trust level). state-level work does this too i've even seen bid documents that outline preference for bidders who have a workforce made up of some percentage of minorities or if they're minority-owned and yes these always explicitly state that women are a minority
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Mar 25, 2015 16:55
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are you saying that women aren't a minority in engineering?
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Mar 25, 2015 16:57
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qirex posted:are you saying that women aren't a minority in engineering? no, but contracting firm presidents apparently need it spelled out that women are not commonly found in the construction field
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Mar 25, 2015 17:00
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H.P. Hovercraft posted:state-level work does this too lol all that does is let a shell company owned by a minority woman disabled veteran win the contract at a higher bid price then immediately subcontract it to megacorp contractor (mysteriously the same one every time) at higher than what the megacorp originally bid. at least that's how it works for federal contracting.
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Mar 25, 2015 17:08
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that sounds better than the alt IMO.
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Mar 25, 2015 17:14
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Citizen Tayne posted:remembering things about other people is basically what your brain is meant to do, lmao if yours doesn't work properly
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Mar 25, 2015 17:25
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