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I'd like to get into quadcopter flying, eventually with camera and possibly FPV way down the road. I'd like to get off to a good start and not toss cash into a blender though. I'm thinking about starting with a cheapo quad to practice with. Currently looking at the Hubsan line and the Blade Nano. Any suggestions /recommendations? Is it worth getting the Hubsan with camera or is the quality not worth it? Should I just start with the RTF, or get a separate transmitter and go for the BNF option? Any other options I'm missing? If this is the wrong thread, my apologies.
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Mar 30, 2015 07:26
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Geburan posted:I'd like to get into quadcopter flying, eventually with camera and possibly FPV way down the road. I'd like to get off to a good start and not toss cash into a blender though. I'm thinking about starting with a cheapo quad to practice with. Currently looking at the Hubsan line and the Blade Nano. Any suggestions /recommendations? Is it worth getting the Hubsan with camera or is the quality not worth it? Should I just start with the RTF, or get a separate transmitter and go for the BNF option? Any other options I'm missing? Camera quality of the hubsan (both recording + FPV) is terribad, just stick with the bog standard version. It's probably cheaper to get the RTF version because the Hubsan rx/tx format is proprietary so you're not gonna be able to use cooler transmitters with it. Don't know about the Blade, it's something like $150 to get to my country so .. yeah. Whatever you pick, make sure you get a pile of spare parts: motors, batteries, props.
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Mar 30, 2015 09:15
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Both options are good. Do you intend on sticking with spektrum gear? If so, go Nano QX. If you intend on going FrSky or other technology radio, the Hubsan is the way to go. The camera on the Hubsan just makes the battery not last as long. Airborne weight is a huge factor in flight time. You should wait to do flight video until your later machines. I drink the spektrum kool-aid. So I go with the nano, and Orange/lemon recievers on my more serious machines. I'll also say, I love my NanoQX
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Mar 30, 2015 09:17
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Real men use the Turnigy 9xr  It's cheap and it does the trick.
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Mar 30, 2015 18:27
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Cannon_Fodder posted:Real men use the Turnigy 9xr I have a 9xr pro, with a spectrum module in it.. but I haven't moved into it yet. I went spectrum before I knew turnigy was an option. OH yeah, I got a 3d printed bit for my goggles. now.. I have a 1 wire hookup for my goggles.  There's more details here: http://realtinker.blogspot.com/2015/03/playing-with-fpv-stuff.html
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Mar 30, 2015 19:07
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Damnit. I'm dumb. When I was ordering replacement parts for my 450X, I didn't realize there were multiple types of Main Gears and I ended up ordering straight cut instead of Helical. I didn't actually notice or realize my mistake until I took it out for a test flight today. Motor spun up, it got light on the skids, everything was going great... then the main blades slowed down and the motor kept spinning. Shut everything down, took a look at it, noticed that the main gear was stripped out from where the metal gear on the motor ate it up. It's a cheap fix, I just feel like an idiot for not noticing that. Now I have to wait on parts again, that's the worst thing about it 
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Mar 30, 2015 20:30
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I'm waiting for some XT60 connectors, I know the feeling. I dropped into a local hobby place just to see if they happened to carry any. I asked and from the reaction you'd think I had just poo poo on the floor. 
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Mar 30, 2015 20:59
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Mister Sinewave posted:I'm waiting for some XT60 connectors, I know the feeling. When I asked for deans at a local shop, the guy behind the counter went on a rant about them being "very dangerous." And "have critical design flaws". And "why don't you just replace everything with XT60. I had come in to buy some XT60, and Deans, to make adapters. They didn't even have XT60 to sell me.
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Mar 30, 2015 21:55
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Nerobro posted:When I asked for deans at a local shop, the guy behind the counter went on a rant about them being "very dangerous." And "have critical design flaws". And "why don't you just replace everything with XT60. I guess I should consider myself lucky then? I found an adapter to plug two 3 cell batteries into a charger as a 6 cell, complete with balance wires. And at a price I consider worth buying over making. They also had all sorts of adapters for deans, XT-60, that T shape, etc. Pretty happy with them really. https://www.greathobbies.com . They seem like what a modern hobby shop should be.
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Mar 31, 2015 00:14
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You have one AT ALL. You're lucky.
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Mar 31, 2015 01:04
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The Hubsan X4 Pro looks like a good budget entry to proper drone photography - anyone care to comment on it? I would definitely consider picking one up if the supplied camera can be replaced with a gopro (because I am going to take a stab that my gopro is going to have bettery optics and picture than the camera included with an RTF drone for nearly the same price.)
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Mar 31, 2015 02:01
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Golluk posted:I guess I should consider myself lucky then? I found an adapter to plug two 3 cell batteries into a charger as a 6 cell, complete with balance wires. And at a price I consider worth buying over making. They also had all sorts of adapters for deans, XT-60, that T shape, etc. Pretty happy with them really. https://www.greathobbies.com . They seem like what a modern hobby shop should be. Great hobbies is a pretty good store that started out small did mail order for a long time and then moved on to franchises and the internet. The were kind of lovely and overpriced for a while but they seem to have gotten things figured out now.
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Mar 31, 2015 02:16
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Laserface posted:anyone care to comment on it? I its not out yet.
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Mar 31, 2015 07:25
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Nerobro posted:Both options are good. Do you intend on sticking with spektrum gear? If so, go Nano QX. If you intend on going FrSky or other technology radio, the Hubsan is the way to go. Thanks to everyone for the info. I'm leaning toward the Nano due to flight characteristics, but if I find a Hubsan on large enough sale I may pull the trigger. So what's up with transmitters? Anything I need to know before committing to a brand? I'd like to future proof as much as possible, but don't want to over buy. Maybe I'll stop by the local hobby shops and chat up the r/c equivalent of neckbeards to see what the local trends are. Thanks all!
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Mar 31, 2015 08:29
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Geburan posted:Thanks to everyone for the info. I'm leaning toward the Nano due to flight characteristics, but if I find a Hubsan on large enough sale I may pull the trigger. So what's up with transmitters? Anything I need to know before committing to a brand? I'd like to future proof as much as possible, but don't want to over buy. Maybe I'll stop by the local hobby shops and chat up the r/c equivalent of neckbeards to see what the local trends are. Spektrum is the easy answer that you will get from the hobby shop. It's great if you plan to buy bind-n-fly stuff as most of it is set up for that. They will have big brands (JR, Futaba) (assuming you are US, if you are Europe I think they have a couple different ones), but they will not have Turnigy. If you want super cheap you go Turnigy: Not quite as bind-n-fly friendly but has a fair share of them, and if you build your own stuff you can use any radio so it doesn't matter. They aren't bad transmitters. If you get bigger into the hobby the you can look at the other brands. At some point it becomes a "features and feel" thing. I have a Futaba and love my radio, it just felt better in my hands than the other brands. subx fucked around with this message at 13:03 on Mar 31, 2015 |
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Mar 31, 2015 13:00
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Made some progress today. Got the Bix 3 up in the air today without issue, and tested RTH and GPS hold. Stabilizer was working well, as once I switched it off, it became apparent I really needed to trim the elevator down. RTH and hold were not really inspiring confidence at first either. The plane would circle back once or twice, then seem to be flying off into the sunset before I took control again to turn it back. So that will need some adjustment. Second flight still needed the elevator down more, but was better. GPS hold was working better, same with RTH, but still needs some fine tuning on bank angles and throttles. Fun part was I put on the video module. I didn't fly with it, but did take a peak at the screen a few times, and had the DVR going. It will give me a chance familiarize myself with the various landmarks around there. Video seemed to be working decently, though a bit snowy when directly overhead and ~ 150' up. I can't imagine trying to land FPV like I did LOS though. To me it looked nice and controlled, landed smooth. From the video, it looks like I dive rolled towards the ground, pulling up at the last moment to level out and land. Next flights I'll try and dial in the trims and autopilot settings, as well as get the OSD back up and running.
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Mar 31, 2015 22:52
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DreadLlama fucked around with this message at 09:03 on Apr 4, 2015 |
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Mar 31, 2015 22:57
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DreadLlama posted:I would like to n+1 for questions regarding transmitters. I bought a Frsky Tx module for my Turnigy 9x radio. It binds up just fine to my V911 helicopters. I imagine it would work with the other WL toy stuff. I'll try and find the exact part number later. The hubsan X4 is a proprietary code though. I haven't seen anyone get an aftermarket Tx binding with it yet.
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Mar 31, 2015 23:05
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my syma x1 binded to the turnigy 9x w/ the included module (flysky). I got awful range with it though, not sure if it was a problem with the turnigy itself - I ended up removing the module and using it for other purposes.
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Mar 31, 2015 23:05
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DreadLlama posted:I would like to n+1 for questions regarding transmitters. It's accurate - as long as you buy a transmitter that uses the same protocol as your craft, you should be able to bind the transmitter just fine. Golluk posted:I bought a Frsky Tx module for my Turnigy 9x radio. It binds up just fine to my V911 helicopters. I imagine it would work with the other WL toy stuff. I'll try and find the exact part number later. The hubsan X4 is a proprietary code though. I haven't seen anyone get an aftermarket Tx binding with it yet. You can actually get the Hubsan to work with other controllers, too: it uses a XL7105 TX chip, which you can wire into a Devo transmitter running Deviation, and it'll work just as well as (if not better than) the stock Hubsan transmitter. I fly my Hubsan X4 with a Devo 10. I assume you can do it with other transmitters too (given the right modding and firmware), but I've only tried it with Walkera's.
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Mar 31, 2015 23:15
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ionicism posted:You can actually get the Hubsan to work with other controllers, too: it uses a XL7105 TX chip, which you can wire into a Devo transmitter running Deviation, and it'll work just as well as (if not better than) the stock Hubsan transmitter. I fly my Hubsan X4 with a Devo 10. I assume you can do it with other transmitters too (given the right modding and firmware), but I've only tried it with Walkera's. That sounds like a bit more work than just buying a transmitter or transmitter module and it working. Given the X4 and the like are commonly recommended as introductory. Good to know it is possibly with a relatively minor hardware mod though.
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Mar 31, 2015 23:28
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I bought a lot of ncr18650pf. also most of the other parts including those 2 inch nickel strips, and some 12 awg solid core copper wiring. the dude who documented his poo poo on rcgroups comments that the strips ended up burning off the insulation around the positive end and causing a short but that seems kinda sketch as i've seen dozens of photos of people successfully using them.
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Mar 31, 2015 23:31
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A Yolo Wizard posted:I bought a lot of ncr18650pf. also most of the other parts including those 2 inch nickel strips, and some 12 awg solid core copper wiring. the dude who documented his poo poo on rcgroups comments that the strips ended up burning off the insulation around the positive end and causing a short but that seems kinda sketch as i've seen dozens of photos of people successfully using them. Yeah.. that's not how's I'd do it. Look up building a batteyr pack, ideally a sub-c pack. I'd be cutting my own battery bars for 18650s.
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Apr 1, 2015 01:51
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oh, i guess this is what he was referring to https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7KndKJ-COBw&t=151s ive seen a few packs with additional insulation under the midsections so i'll have to consider that  50 of the battery solder strips were 8 bucks and the wire was 35 cents a foot moron izzard fucked around with this message at 02:18 on Apr 1, 2015 |
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Apr 1, 2015 01:59
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A Yolo Wizard posted:oh, i guess this is what he was referring to https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7KndKJ-COBw&t=151s quote:ive seen a few packs with additional insulation under the midsections so i'll have to consider that If you're really worried about the nickel tabs rubbing, step one is to make sure the pack can't rub. And if you're not confident.. you use fiber (read cardboard) washers. Using thick heatshrink like that, isn't good practice. The side by side stacking, like in the picture, is proper.
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Apr 1, 2015 02:47
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DreadLlama fucked around with this message at 09:02 on Apr 4, 2015 |
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Apr 1, 2015 04:16
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DreadLlama posted:Holy poo poo, really? I'd have thought it'd be more like the 27MHz and 49MHz days where the antenna would just induce voltages in whatever relay that ran X servo. When did things get standardized? I'm kind of surprised that things aren't open-sourced by now. The only reason to lock up your hardware would be if you weren't sure it works properly. That's not even how the cheapest r/c cars worked back in the day. Things were standard back then. All the way back to when I started in RC, which was... 86 or so? the 27/49mhz stuff at the toy store would have as many as four channels. Some, even had analog! (the audi quattro I had from ratshack was 100% proportional) When I was 8-9, I got my first hobby grade car, it was on channel 35 I think. There were three "normal" bands for r/c cars, planes, and boats when I got in. Shortly after I started really playing with R/C, PPM radios came out, instead of PWM?. AM and FM were both common at the time. You generally had a FM radio if you had lots of channels, or were really concerned about the twitchy servo action you describe when putting the antenna near the reciever. The reason that would happen, is AM basically isn't encoded. So if you make the antenna see a signal, it will try to do what a "big am signal" should do on all the channels it's listening in on. It's not a "induce voltage in whatever relay" situation. The radio standards for AM and FM are pretty easy to sniff and copy, an oscilliscope is really all you need. The PPM stuff might be a little more tricky. The 2.4 stuff is a bit harder, but there is an open standard out there, I think. And people have reverse engineered the JR/Futaba/Spektrum protocalls.
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Apr 1, 2015 04:33
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DreadLlama posted:Holy poo poo, really? I'd have thought it'd be more like the 27MHz and 49MHz days where the antenna would just induce voltages in whatever relay that ran X servo. When did things get standardized? I'm kind of surprised that things aren't open-sourced by now. The only reason to lock up your hardware would be if you weren't sure it works properly. I suppose it really comes down to where you want to go. The Turnigy 9x (or its big brother the Taranis), will run just about any transmitter spec out there with the plug in modules. Which also gives you access to things like LRS radios, which can get into the 10's of miles range. If you just plan to play with WL products and others that use the same 2.4ghz protocol, it is probably perfectly fine. Another big plus of the 9x, is OpenTx, which is open source firmware. It turns a 70$ radio into a full feature radio that would have cost several hundreds a few years ago. I would spend a bit of time reading up on LiPo batteries. But here is the very basics. Ratings: Voltage ranges from 3.7, 7.4, 11.1, 14.8. mAh is the capacity. 500mAh will put out half an amp for an hour on a full charge, 2 amps for 15 minutes, etc. C rating is usually continuous/burst. 2200mah 25/50C means it can put out 55 amps (25*2200), and up to 110 for short bursts (10 seconds). A 3.7 rated battery is fully charged at 4.2 volts. and empty at 3v. It will go below 3v, but will likely be damaged. 3.8v under no load is a common safe time to land point. Batteries should be stored at about 60% capacity, or 3.8 volts per cell. They should be charged at 1C, which means the charger should only be putting a max 500mA into a 500mAh battery. It may be a bit complicated if you don't have an electrical background, but these batteries have allot of energy stored in them, and have burned down many a plane, quad, car, and even house when not used properly. Generally due to storing in high heat, attempting to charge from below 3v, accidentally charging above 4.2v, damaged in a crash. It's more of a concern once you get into the higher voltage/capacity batteries, but something to keep in mind. The WL toys and their chargers will handle most of that stuff for you. At least one guy on RC-Groups likes flying his even though he has a DJI Inspire. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z3AhsYX0CXM Golluk fucked around with this message at 05:42 on Apr 1, 2015 |
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Apr 1, 2015 05:20
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DreadLlama posted:Really? poo poo, really? gently caress. Nothing really stopping you from using a spare output on the receiver to operate a servo to release something like that. People do bomb drops which would be a similar application. I'm using a DTF UHF Tx/Rx system which has a built in beacon transmitter on the receiver. If it loses connection to the radio, it will output a different tone, at different powers, on a set frequency. You can then use one of those walky talkies to listen for it, getting a different sound the closer you get to it. All of which is highly customizable. Ok, I had to go back and find out what you were trying to do. A quad is likely not your best choice. They are fun, but range is not their selling point. As for noise, a small prop on a high RPM motor will be heard from a long ways away, and piezo buzzers are also pretty loud when in the air in a forested area. If you want to patrol a large area, you'll want something like this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bn0LlfuOsgo Talon UAV FPV Labs, and RC-Groups forums will be a good place to start reading. Golluk fucked around with this message at 06:02 on Apr 1, 2015 |
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Apr 1, 2015 05:50
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DreadLlama posted:Most transmitters I find on the internet aren't much more than the WL V666. I don't see why I shouldn't just buy that. If its guts are cross-platform, the worst problem I'd have is poo poo battery life because it's a quad. But then I could just put it's battery and my V913 on its camera. I'd get the same footage. More even, since maybe I could put an extra battery on/in it. Seems to have lift to spare. So WLtoys actually uses a few different protocols - their older craft (including the v913 and a lot of their other helicopters) use one protocol, while most of the v2**/v3** craft and the v666 use another. (also, isn't the v913 battery built-in?)
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Apr 1, 2015 05:52
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I've been learning how to fly quadcopters with a few cheaper RTF options, namely the Dromida Ominus, Estes Synchro, and Hubsan X4. I'm decent enough at flying them now to avoid crashes 99% of the time even in moderate wind (and indoors), and the Hubsan's terrible camera has made me love the idea of drone footage. So I'd like to look at FPV stuff now but I'm not sure which option is best for my budget. I'm looking to spend around $500-700, maybe a little bit over if it's worth it. I've looked at the Bebop, the Phantom 2 Vision, and another in that range I can't remember the name of. I don't have a GoPro or any other camera, but I'm also open to buying a quadcopter with a gimbal and getting the GoPro separately. Are there any advantages or disadvantages for certain quads? I'd love the ability to set GPS waypoints for it to fly automatically but I'm entirely unfamiliar with what capabilities are available in that price range. I'm also very open to building one myself (and would prefer it) if there's a recommended kit/guide in that price range. I guess I'd need a transmitter if I built one too? Currently I just use whichever controller came with the drone. (As a side note, I discovered that the Hubsan X4's camera wires can be cut from the main circuit board and the entire camera module can then be removed without any loss of control over the drone, for a bit extra flight time due to the reduced weight. Found that out when a rather hard crash caused one of the solder points to break. )Edit: Looking at DJI's F450 kit as a possibility after some more research. I think a few of the local RC shops have this kit as well: http://www.helipal.com/dji-flamewheel-f450-combo-3-naza-lite-legs.html Fairly competent with soldering and such, mostly just wanting to get the best option for my budget and goals. Mina fucked around with this message at 18:02 on Apr 1, 2015 |
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Apr 1, 2015 06:02
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I suppose that is one thing to ask. What is your goal? It seems like there are two paths to take. Heavy lifter for aerial photography, and fast and nimble for acrobatics/racing. I sounds like you are aiming for the former.
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Apr 1, 2015 22:00
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Golluk posted:I suppose that is one thing to ask. What is your goal? It seems like there are two paths to take. Heavy lifter for aerial photography, and fast and nimble for acrobatics/racing. I sounds like you are aiming for the former. I'm mostly just looking for something that can do decent quality gimballed video, with a way to view the video in realtime. Fancier poo poo like autopilot and GPS would be great too. Not really too interested in racing yet, mostly just "wow this random place we're hiking through looks amazing from 1000ft up" moments. For now. I'm sure I'll end up spending a small fortune on this hobby eventually and have an army of different drones at my disposal.
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Apr 1, 2015 23:48
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Krittick posted:I'm mostly just looking for something that can do decent quality gimballed video, with a way to view the video in realtime. Fancier poo poo like autopilot and GPS would be great too. Not really too interested in racing yet, mostly just "wow this random place we're hiking through looks amazing from 1000ft up" moments. DJI would likely be the best route then if you have more money than time. Speaking of money, just dropped ~$150 on a mobius and diversity Rx (FR632), plus a few accessories. I cringe thinking of how expensive this hobby would be pre direct from China.
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Apr 2, 2015 01:54
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Golluk posted:DJI would likely be the best route then if you have more money than time. Speaking of money, just dropped ~$150 on a mobius and diversity Rx (FR632), plus a few accessories. I cringe thinking of how expensive this hobby would be pre direct from China. Thanks. After reading a bunch of reviews and use cases, I think I'm going to go with DJI's Flame Wheel ARF kit since I want to tinker with building them as much as I want to fly them, and it gives me more freedom with parts and upgrades/modifications. Edit: Just picked that F450 kit up, charger/batteries, and Futaba T8J transmitter and receiver. The local hobby shop was out of the Naza-M flight controller so I'll be grabbing that elsewhere tomorrow unless there's a better option I can use. Total was around $550 and I'm expecting to spend up to $300 more on the flight controller. A bit more total than I planned but I'm excited as hell to start flying this. 
Mina fucked around with this message at 05:48 on Apr 2, 2015 |
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Apr 2, 2015 02:42
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Looks like it should be a fun build. I've put my quad on the back burner while i work on my plane. I suspect I'll likely have to put a new Naze32 in it since it is acting oddly. I think I managed to damage the accelerameters. Uploaded a five minute clip testing the OSD in what I can only guess was 25 km/h winds. Based on a 10 km/h ground speed into it, and 60 going with. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=srP8eDfq8Q8 I also noticed something that might explain my GPS hold and RTH acting oddly. I would lose GPS information briefly at times, but still have the other info from the FC. Which makes me think I was losing power to the GPS briefly, as it would have to reacquire satellites. Its mounted on the tail, so I'll try protecting/reinforcing the wires in straw tube to prevent the wind wiggling the wires. Of course now Digi will know roughly where I live from the GPS co-ordinates.
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Apr 3, 2015 02:22
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DreadLlama fucked around with this message at 09:02 on Apr 4, 2015 |
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Apr 3, 2015 04:32
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DreadLlama posted:I realize I'm posting a lot in this thread with questions but not a whole lot about advice for people stupider than me. So first, sorry, and thank-you. Second, I found this today and it was very helpful to me: The H8C is a brushed motor(silver cylinders) quadcopter and it just gets its power from the main board from 2 wires. It's brushless motors you need an ESC for. Brushless motors are 3 wires.
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Apr 3, 2015 04:48
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32MB OF ESRAM posted:The H8C is a brushed motor(silver cylinders) quadcopter and it just gets its power from the main board from 2 wires. It's brushless motors you need an ESC for. Brushless motors are 3 wires. You can also get boards with 4 ESC in one. Of course if one fails, you're likely replacing all of them. I'll have a look through that article a bit later, but could you point out roughly what you want to do DreadLlama? I read something back about you wanting an FPV pulsejet to scare people off property, and now its onto quads. Do you want something you build yourself, and work out the configurations? Or do you want to mostly buy something off the shelf. Whats your rough budget? Do you want a Quad (good for 10-15 minute flights), and will it be for racing around acrobatics, or taking photography/video? Do you want a helicopter? (Very few people fly these fpv, similar flight times to the quads) Do you want a plane? (15-30 minute flight times) Is it for acrobatic flying, or long duration/distance. Do you want to fly visually from the ground (LOS)? Or fly first person view through a monitor or googles? Answers to those would make it much easier to point you in the right direction with regards to a frame, and required electronics and accessories. Golluk fucked around with this message at 05:06 on Apr 3, 2015 |
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Apr 3, 2015 05:02
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Golluk posted:You can also get boards with 4 ESC in one. Of course if one fails, you're likely replacing all of them. Holy poo poo. Thank you for the newbie questions. I will try to follow: 1. Undecided. As I gain knowledge, I grow critical of prepackaged boxes. They increasingly seem to be built as cheaply as possible. I am dimly aware that I've spent upwards of $400 on 3 separate drones, only to end up with zero capable of doing what I want, which is mapping a property, while allowing the owner to zoom in at will on interesting features, not get blown away in 35km/h winds, and be undamaged after a water or hard landing, while requiring as little 'down-the-road' maintenance as possible. If I could get something that I could pass to my geriatric senile father and say, "here you go dad. Look at all those trees and rocks you own" and then come back in 15 years and find it still not broken due to software lockouts on doing something stupid and requiring zero maintenance, I'd be willing to spend about 500,000₩ ($575). 2. This is intended strictly for endurance. It would ideally perform as does the camera in a video game. Its goal is to fly around and look at things. Its goal is not to look cool or do neat tricks. 3. Yes! But only because they look cool mechanically and do neat physics things when they fly. (For the record I own an autococker). 4. Yes! But only because bearings fail eventually and so do reed valves. Tesla abhorred metal springs. Are brushless motors really that great? Why don't the same principals apply to gas engines? I've never seen an electric system that could offer better power density than a two-stroke motor. 4. LOS takeoff/landing. FPV everything else. Imagine being able to loiter about as though one were a zeppelin, but able to wander effortlessly great distance as though a cloud. Imagine you could stay up forever, but also being able to swoop down and shriek at things while making GBS threads on them and then flying away because you're an rear end in a top hat and you enjoy tormenting people. How would you build that?
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Apr 3, 2015 06:19
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