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Toshimo posted:Maybe someday someone will make an Online version of Dominion and we can all be Dominion buds together. They did, it was great, then they changed it, now it sucks. It's me, I am the grognards. God I wish Goko hadn't got hold of it and someone like BGA or Boite a Jeux could have picked it up. Or,, you know, Iso could have stayed active. My trouble with it in person is that Dominion's just in that uncomfortable length spot where it's not a filler game, it's too awkward to set up to be a mid-length game, and no-one else is happy playing four or five rounds of it in an evening.
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Mar 30, 2015 18:12
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thespaceinvader posted:They did, it was great, then they changed it, now it sucks. I never played it on Isotropic. Why is the new version worse (aside from all of the history and statistics accumulated on Isotropic)?
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Mar 30, 2015 18:18
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homullus posted:I never played it on Isotropic. Why is the new version worse (aside from all of the history and statistics accumulated on Isotropic)? Isotropic was quick, kept stats, did what it was supposed to do and was awesome.
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Mar 30, 2015 18:22
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Lorini posted:Isotropic was quick, kept stats, did what it was supposed to do and was awesome. Right, so, aside from stats, they're the same?
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Mar 30, 2015 18:32
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homullus posted:Right, so, aside from stats, they're the same? Sorry, rushed that. Isotropic was text based, few graphics. Because it was text based, it ran like 500 times faster than the guck currently. It was quick to get into a game, play a game, get into the next game. It was also FREE. I keep hoping that somehow Jay will wake up and let us use isotropic again.
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Mar 30, 2015 18:35
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When the new version launched, it stored your password as plaintext. If you bought anything on it, anyone with your password could also access your credit card number. Plaintext passwords. Jesus.
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Mar 30, 2015 18:39
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homullus posted:Right, so, aside from stats, they're the same? The interface was much much cleaner and designed for online play rather than to copy the physical version to a fault It had confirmation when you were about to do something stupid (like end turn without buying, or playing your coppers with Grand Market on the table, etc) Better game settings options/selection and tracking what your opponents did was a lot easier with the log essentially being the main interface and tabbed and color coded rather than a wall of text hidden behind a button
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Mar 30, 2015 18:40
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homullus posted:I never played it on Isotropic. Why is the new version worse (aside from all of the history and statistics accumulated on Isotropic)? I played ~6,000 games on Isotropic. It was a slick, minimalist interface with good matchmaking. It takes me 10x longer to get a game on Goko and it's usually against someone who isn't in the same skill bracket as me. It also takes ~3-5x longer to play a game. Also, it's missing a ton of features (matching starting hands, veto mode, etc.). Additionally, for some reason, the most important thing visually on Goko is your Casual rating which is great because who gives a gently caress about Casual rating? Even the Adventure mode is designed to be a vehicle for microtransactions. I cannot think of a single improvement going from Isotropic to Goko unless you super cared about all the pretty pictures.
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Mar 30, 2015 18:43
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Lottery of Babylon posted:When the new version launched, it stored your password as plaintext. If you bought anything on it, anyone with your password could also access your credit card number. The idiot who started the new site is gone, thankfully. He was so out there, he already had plans to sell the company before he even got started with the game. I have no clue why Jay went with this loon, there were so many better choices available.
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Mar 30, 2015 18:44
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Lottery of Babylon posted:When the new version launched, it stored your password as plaintext. If you bought anything on it, anyone with your password could also access your credit card number. Don't forget the part where you could maliciously inject Javascript at your opponents.
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Mar 30, 2015 18:44
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I realised that my earlier request for ideas for a Tabletop Day game suitable for 4 players, lots of theme, no dice, direct player interaction (military or economic) and currently available is pretty much fulfilled by Kemet. Archipelago was at the top of my shortlist , but after some searching today I think it's out of print.
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Mar 30, 2015 18:51
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I feel like I might be enabling some players I play with to make a lot of mistakes in little details of their turn order. Since I'm usually the one teaching the game, I generally serve as training wheels, reminding people about the abcd order of a dominion turn, reminding people to spend their prayer points on crap in Kemet or to transfer temporary vp, reminding people to not start their actions in GtR until everyone has followed or thought, etc. This is fine initially but I think some players lean on that direction a little too much. Which leads to this interesting dilemma: - if I interfere, I worry that they aren't forced to comprehend the turn order and don't internalize it - if I don't interfere, then a) they skip details like the infamous jumbling of turn sequence in dominion, which doesn't hurt them now but will make things confusing later b) they do forget things that lead to people with too many cards or points etc Some people get fussy too when you enforce a) and they don't yet see the problem with skipping around. It's just fun! Maybe I should make sure every game I play with this particular crowd has a rigid little flow chart of the game turns and then I'll just see if I can get each player to play their turns from that rather than using me as their guide
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Mar 30, 2015 18:55
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EBag posted:I know there's a few people here who've posted about Argent but I think it was mostly with multiple players. How is it with 2 players, and about how long would it take? One of the most common complaints I've heard about it is that it's really long. I haven't played it with two, and I don't plan to. The dynamic of having another player there to split votes up and to encourage or discourage aggression is important, and the game would change radically with only two players. It'd probably take fewer than two hours depending on experience. On the other hand, if you obsessively count the other player's assets, it could take longer on the last couple of turns.
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Mar 30, 2015 19:15
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Deceptive Thinker posted:The interface was much much cleaner and designed for online play rather than to copy the physical version to a fault The bolded thing isn't so much of an issue now -- if you hit "Play Treasures" it will first try to play everything but Copper, giving you the option to buy the Grand Market (it also does this with the action-treasures). As for confirmation on ending a turn without buying, I wonder whether I'd be more frustrated at the times I accidentally ended my turn prematurely, or at the times when I really did want to end my turn without buying and had to confirm anyway.
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Mar 30, 2015 19:15
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EBag posted:I know there's a few people here who've posted about Argent but I think it was mostly with multiple players. How is it with 2 players, and about how long would it take? One of the most common complaints I've heard about it is that it's really long. Argent is really long the first time, but it's not that bad after that. The box says 30 minutes per player and I think with an experienced group you could approach that. It's fine with 2 players, but it's a very different experience. There's a lot more direct attacking, and playing to end the round early is a legitimate strategy if the opponent takes too many spells/vault cards which act as regular actions.
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Mar 30, 2015 19:28
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At least one time, Goko had a bug where everyone was completely unable to start a game for more than a day. That was fun. The terrible lag was great too. There's a reason wtfgoko.com used to redirect to the dominionstrategy forums, really.
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Mar 30, 2015 19:28
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taser rates posted:First of the Dominion Adventures previews is up, holy poo poo. There was also a bonus post for another card, Storyteller: http://dominionstrategy.com/2015/03/30/adventures-preview-1-storyteller/ Apparently in addition to the 3 they are previewing each morning they are having a Dominion Strategy poster preview another one in the afternoon. Storyteller initially looks extremely powerful then kinda weak then potentially powerful but situational. People on their forums have mentioned a few combos with the specialty treasures but I would have to play with it to get a better feel for what would work.
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Mar 30, 2015 19:46
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Storyteller is really cool, that I can't find a home for the card easily is awesome.
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Mar 30, 2015 19:56
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homullus posted:I never played it on Isotropic. Why is the new version worse (aside from all of the history and statistics accumulated on Isotropic)? Security issues aside (and they were legion early on, enough to make me seriously concerned long-term) and programming issues aside (seriously, the way it was programmed was COLOSSALLY dumb) Iso was a LOT quicker, a lot cleaner, had a much clearer interface much less prone to misclicks and accidentally discarding/trashing rather than playing, but most importantly, had a strong user base. On Iso I could routinely play 4 or 5 games in a lunch break. On Goko up to when I gave up on it, it could maybe get one and I'd be lucky to finish it, and the interface was a lot more obtrusive to be playing on a work machine. Plus, it managed really big hands horribly, so playing a draw-my-whole-deck scrying pool engine, for instance, was an absolute nightmare. Basically it had like 6 years of development and userbase behind it making it a fast, lean engine optimised for playing a very mehcanical game for the very mechanical crowd who like it. Then they turned a large proportion of that crowd off with the development of goko for various reasons, kind of wrecked the community feel and made the game much less fun to play. Storyteller looks GREAT for those combos with treasures you really want in play whilst you're still playing actions. It's going to be crazy with stuff like Quarry/Talisman/Horn of Plenty.
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Mar 30, 2015 19:56
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Dirk the Average posted:I haven't played it with two, and I don't plan to. The dynamic of having another player there to split votes up and to encourage or discourage aggression is important, and the game would change radically with only two players. Thanks this was my biggest concern with it, guess I'll probably hold off on this one.
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Mar 30, 2015 21:03
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Played Kemet yesterday Last in turn order, seemingly not a threat to anyone. Go for an all-in turn. Use +1 speed, and wallhax to go to 9 points from 7. During night phase get my free pyramid level. Declare myself winner w/ 9 prayer points left. "Hey dumbass, night happens before day, gotta hold it another turn" but but but I could have upgraded the pyramid anyway since I had two wasted actions 
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Mar 30, 2015 21:27
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I played my first Kemet game yesterday with the Cyclades critters. They seem pretty decent, not sure how they effect balance. The Cerberus ability to block an attack for a turn is interesting but no one thought to use it. The Kraken and Chiron actually seemed to have the biggest impact on the game because I had this loving ridiculous stack in the center temples with the mummy, kraken, charge, blades of neith, and finally chiron. I was holding onto two +2 strength cards most of the game and just kept wandering around the center bashing people. The medusa seems like it might combo in a pretty neat way with crusade. I might try that soon.
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Mar 30, 2015 21:37
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fozzy fosbourne posted:I played my first Kemet game yesterday with the Cyclades critters. They seem pretty decent, not sure how they effect balance. The Cerberus ability to block an attack for a turn is interesting but no one thought to use it. The Kraken and Chiron actually seemed to have the biggest impact on the game because I had this loving ridiculous stack in the center temples with the mummy, kraken, charge, blades of neith, and finally chiron. I was holding onto two +2 strength cards most of the game and just kept wandering around the center bashing people. It's been a while since I played/read Kemet's rules, but I thought you were restricted to one monster a stack (except I think Chiron?)
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Mar 30, 2015 21:44
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quote:It's been a while since I played/read Kemet's rules, but I thought you were restricted to one monster a stack (except I think Chiron?) Kraken wouldn't have actually been in the stack - he just goes on the board and eats things near the river. I like Kemet, but I'm not sure whether I'm going to grab the expansion yet. There's tons of things I like about it, and it worked really good to start.. but now that we all play basically competently, the dudes-on-a-map-direct-conflict kingmaking problems seem to be coming back. We've had a run of somewhat unsatisfying games that were decided by "catchup-by-politics" in round n-1 followed by "final winner picked by the guy in 3rd". jmzero fucked around with this message at 21:50 on Mar 30, 2015 |
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Mar 30, 2015 21:46
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Yeah I should probably got Kemet. I don't have a dudes-on-a-board game yet and Kemet looks like fun to play with my buddies on Tabletop Day. Introduced my parents to Port Royal this evening. They need another game or two to memorise what each card type does, but overall they really like it. Six months ago it was a struggle to get them to sit down to play even Ticket to Ride. Now, my parents play enough each day (either between themselves or with me) that they're falling beind on their TV shows. So that when they go on their narrowboat they don't have to raid my collection all the time, today I gifted them something to start off their own game collection with: Carcassonne and Jaipur. That should supplement the truly awful Narrowboat Game that's on the boat at the moment, a game I reviewed way way back for the previous thread and now I can't find it
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Mar 30, 2015 23:26
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taser rates posted:First of the Dominion Adventures previews is up, holy poo poo. So I may forego the "buying in release order" and pick up Adventures when it hits...this looks fun.
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Mar 30, 2015 23:34
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jivjov posted:So I may forego the "buying in release order" and pick up Adventures when it hits...this looks fun. You already know you like the game -- just buy them all. They're all fun, even Alchemy. Alchemy's just less fun than the others, in my opinion.
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Mar 30, 2015 23:51
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homullus posted:You already know you like the game -- just buy them all. They're all fun, even Alchemy. Alchemy's just less fun than the others, in my opinion. Oh I already know I'm buying all of Dominion, but I've been trying to space everything out, get some solid play time with each expansion before moving to the next. I had also seen a couple goons strongly suggest going in order.
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Mar 30, 2015 23:57
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jivjov posted:Oh I already know I'm buying all of Dominion, but I've been trying to space everything out, get some solid play time with each expansion before moving to the next. I had also seen a couple goons strongly suggest going in order. You'll definitely appreciate Adventures much more if you go in order.
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Mar 31, 2015 00:27
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I've had Goko pull an incredibly odd bug on me where the cards just become invisible and I can't see what I'm playing. You can't refresh a game of Goko to solve things like that because that just counts as you leaving. Forced to quit and consequently lost a game I was totally winning, I was not happy.
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Mar 31, 2015 00:35
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Got Galaxy Trucker for my birthday! Sweet! Also got Cards Against Humanity..........
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Mar 31, 2015 01:29
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It's hard to overstate what a complete trainwreck Goko is. They own the rights to Race for the Galaxy as well, here's what the designers said about it last year:Wei-Hwa Huang posted:Goko's RftG work had pretty much none of those issues. Keldon pretty much wrote all of the RftG app himself with some advice from me and Tom, and it played great (on a touch screen). But it just didn't get released when Goko was still doing development because they were still trying to save the sinking ship named Dominion. It got a bit of a release as a Microsoft Surface app, then disappeared. Tom Lehmann posted:Yes, Keldon worked on a browser version of RFTG for Goko, with interface design assistance from Wei-Hwa and myself. This was finished and worked well in the limited testing that was done. Keldon Jones posted:Unfortunately, that's a bit generous. I received half of the agreed on fee, with the other half contingent on final delivery of the released version. Since it was pretty clear near the end that Goko was out of money, I wonder if that other half of the fee was part of the reason they cut off communication. They literally had someone else do all the hard work of making the game for them and never released it. You can still sign up for the Beta and get an automated email response for a game that will likely never exist. In the process they stiffed basically everyone involved. elgarbo posted:Got Galaxy Trucker for my birthday! Sweet! Turn it in to custom adventure cards for Galaxy Fucker Bubble-T fucked around with this message at 01:56 on Mar 31, 2015 |
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Mar 31, 2015 01:40
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All we can do is hope that Jay didn't license this to them in perpetuity....at some point he should get the rights back and he/we can start over.
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Mar 31, 2015 02:27
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Lorini posted:Sorry, rushed that. Isotropic was text based, few graphics. Because it was text based, it ran like 500 times faster than the guck currently. It was quick to get into a game, play a game, get into the next game. It was also FREE. If you want something similar you can play Dominion.Net. It's bot based and has no multi-player but the interface is super fast, so you blast out games quite quickly. The AI isn't bad, it can usually do a little better than Big Money, but obviously it's not the smartest. Dominion is pretty much a single player game anyway  Just check out dat minimalism!  http://dominion.technowall.net/ 
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Mar 31, 2015 02:50
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Broken Loose posted:You'll definitely appreciate Adventures much more if you go in order. And going in order means that Adventures will probably be on a decent sale by the time I get to it.
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Mar 31, 2015 02:56
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Lorini posted:All we can do is hope that Jay didn't license this to them in perpetuity....at some point he should get the rights back and he/we can start over. Lehmann did say that Jay promised to investigate regaining the rights to RftG. Presumably if that's possible it means they could regain Dominion too, though I'm not sure whether they'd want to given that Goko Dominion at least exists and (somewhat) works.
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Mar 31, 2015 03:22
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If the people who have Dominion aren't even working on it full time, it's unlikely that it'll grow and I would also wonder how profitable it is. It's very sad, he didn't increase the adoption of the game by giving it to them. I think he would have at least as much money if he had kept isotropic, charged a sub for 'premium' access and called it a day. Would have been much less work as well.
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Mar 31, 2015 03:25
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Bubble-T posted:Lehmann did say that Jay promised to investigate regaining the rights to RftG. Presumably if that's possible it means they could regain Dominion too, though I'm not sure whether they'd want to given that Goko Dominion at least exists and (somewhat) works. I wonder who has the rights for RftG. BGA?
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Mar 31, 2015 03:32
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Lorini posted:If the people who have Dominion aren't even working on it full time, it's unlikely that it'll grow and I would also wonder how profitable it is. It's very sad, he didn't increase the adoption of the game by giving it to them. I think he would have at least as much money if he had kept isotropic, charged a sub for 'premium' access and called it a day. Would have been much less work as well. The main reason my friends and I have gotten into Dominion personally is that the Goko version looks like the real game. The plural of anecdote isn't data, but the ability to learn the game visually with the real card art as "training" for the real thing is a big plus for me. Of course, if that came with this hypothetical premium access on isotropic, I'd have been into that too.
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Mar 31, 2015 03:51
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As I understand it you can't copyright the rules of a game. Couldn't they just rename isotropic Dominion to Fauxminion, rename the cards and re-release it?
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Mar 31, 2015 04:00
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