Register a SA Forums Account here!
JOINING THE SA FORUMS WILL REMOVE THIS BIG AD, THE ANNOYING UNDERLINED ADS, AND STUPID INTERSTITIAL ADS!!!

You can: log in, read the tech support FAQ, or request your lost password. This dumb message (and those ads) will appear on every screen until you register! Get rid of this crap by registering your own SA Forums Account and joining roughly 150,000 Goons, for the one-time price of $9.95! We charge money because it costs us money per month for bills, and since we don't believe in showing ads to our users, we try to make the money back through forum registrations.
 
  • Post
  • Reply
Rod Hoofhearted
Jun 18, 2000

I am a ghost




Question - My closing was supposed to happen this past Friday (according to the original offer contract). Just today my lender had me sign a form 4506-T authorizing the IRS to give them transcripts of my 1044 tax returns for 2011, 2012, and 2013. How long is this going to take?

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

BEHOLD: MY CAPE
Jan 11, 2004

LabyaMynora posted:

Question - My closing was supposed to happen this past Friday (according to the original offer contract). Just today my lender had me sign a form 4506-T authorizing the IRS to give them transcripts of my 1044 tax returns for 2011, 2012, and 2013. How long is this going to take?

About two days usually, but your lender is sort of being a fuckup if you had contacted them and prequalified before even putting in an offer. You could be more than a week from finishing underwriting depending upon what else is left for them to do internally. Have you verified your bank accounts etc yet?

Rod Hoofhearted
Jun 18, 2000

I am a ghost




BEHOLD: MY CAPE posted:

About two days usually, but your lender is sort of being a fuckup if you had contacted them and prequalified before even putting in an offer. You could be more than a week from finishing underwriting depending upon what else is left for them to do internally. Have you verified your bank accounts etc yet?

Yes, and I gave them my 2013 and 2014 tax returns. I literally gave them everything a month ago and this sprung up on me today, a Sunday of all things. Sounds like a fuckup. I was afraid getting transcripts from the IRS would take a week or more.


EDIT: I just went back through all my docs and checked and I did indeed sign this 4506-T back on 2/22. I just let the lending guy who emailed me today know this.

Rod Hoofhearted fucked around with this message at 01:19 on Mar 30, 2015

Captain Windex
Apr 10, 2005
It'll clean anything.
Pillbug

LabyaMynora posted:

Yes, and I gave them my 2013 and 2014 tax returns. I literally gave them everything a month ago and this sprung up on me today, a Sunday of all things. Sounds like a fuckup. I was afraid getting transcripts from the IRS would take a week or more.


EDIT: I just went back through all my docs and checked and I did indeed sign this 4506-T back on 2/22. I just let the lending guy who emailed me today know this.

Yeah, we usually had results in 2, maybe 3 days at most. That's a rather big gently caress up, ordering results was basically one of the first things we did when we started to undewrite a file. Was the new form filled out any differently? This may have changed recently, but it used to be that the IRS would be super anal about the form exactly matching how you completed your returns so stupid poo poo like including or not including a middle initial in your name or not listing the former address exactly the same could cause it to be rejected, and they don't tell you what the problem was.

Rod Hoofhearted
Jun 18, 2000

I am a ghost




Captain Windex posted:

Yeah, we usually had results in 2, maybe 3 days at most. That's a rather big gently caress up, ordering results was basically one of the first things we did when we started to undewrite a file. Was the new form filled out any differently? This may have changed recently, but it used to be that the IRS would be super anal about the form exactly matching how you completed your returns so stupid poo poo like including or not including a middle initial in your name or not listing the former address exactly the same could cause it to be rejected, and they don't tell you what the problem was.

It turns out the first form didn't include my current address's apartment number. I'm beginning to feel like my first mortgage guy was a first timer or something and now I'm dealing with a second guy who is basically trying to clean up his mess.

QuarkJets
Sep 8, 2008

Jesus, is NFCU really all that and a bag of chips? We're using a local credit union but they basically don't have mortgage services

sharktamer
Oct 30, 2011

Shark tamer ridiculous
OK, just so I'm sure on this and not missing something obvious, this mortgage deal:



is better than this one:



right?

The obvious difference is having to pay £499 up front with the first, but that will get me a better deal over the long run right? I'll just have to work out if I could do with having that money up front or if I can afford to do without it. Also, would it be better to just pay that into the mortgage as an overpayment, would doing that make the second one with no arrangement fee better?

Eryxias
Feb 17, 2011

Stay low.

QuarkJets posted:

Jesus, is NFCU really all that and a bag of chips? We're using a local credit union but they basically don't have mortgage services

NFCU has been pretty awesome for us so far. We originally started out using USAA but they were really slow and had crappy open times. NFCU on the other hand has been extremely fast on response to emails even towards the end of the day, but maybe we just got lucky with the assigned agents.
USAA's insurance has been great for us though, not sure what the hell is wrong with their mortgage dept. I'd recommend anybody for NFCU if you can use them, they've really been on top of everything for us.

BEHOLD: MY CAPE
Jan 11, 2004

sharktamer posted:

OK, just so I'm sure on this and not missing something obvious, this mortgage deal:



is better than this one:



right?

The obvious difference is having to pay £499 up front with the first, but that will get me a better deal over the long run right? I'll just have to work out if I could do with having that money up front or if I can afford to do without it. Also, would it be better to just pay that into the mortgage as an overpayment, would doing that make the second one with no arrangement fee better?

Yes the first one is much better. Too bad you can't get a deal period longer than 2 years.

Kastivich
Mar 26, 2010
Does anyone have experience doing water quality testing on a house with a well?

There seem to be three options
- Bacteria
- Bacteria, lead, nitrates, and nitrites
- Bacteria, lead, nitrates, nitrites, and everything else (metals, pesticides, etc)

There is a $250 price spread between the basic and most extensive test. I've never been on well water before so I don't know if the extensive testing is necessary or common. Home is located in north Raleigh, NC.

ManPortable
Nov 8, 2005

Eryxias posted:

NFCU has been pretty awesome for us so far. We originally started out using USAA but they were really slow and had crappy open times. NFCU on the other hand has been extremely fast on response to emails even towards the end of the day, but maybe we just got lucky with the assigned agents.
USAA's insurance has been great for us though, not sure what the hell is wrong with their mortgage dept. I'd recommend anybody for NFCU if you can use them, they've really been on top of everything for us.

I've been following this thread for awhile and had to jump in here. USAA was almost comedic in how inept they were on the phone. The most irritating thing was when they said we had to accept the loan before they would send a GFE. Another time they called us and immediately put us on hold so they could transfer us, only to have the person who picks up the phone have no idea who we were or why we got transferred to them. For NFCU we got an assigned agent and she has been responsive and highly knowledgable. Gave us a great rate and because they don't sell their loans they can bend certain standards that other lenders strictly adhere to.

uwaeve
Oct 21, 2010



focus this time so i don't have to keep telling you idiots what happened
Lipstick Apathy

Kastivich posted:

Does anyone have experience doing water quality testing on a house with a well?

There seem to be three options
- Bacteria
- Bacteria, lead, nitrates, and nitrites
- Bacteria, lead, nitrates, nitrites, and everything else (metals, pesticides, etc)

There is a $250 price spread between the basic and most extensive test. I've never been on well water before so I don't know if the extensive testing is necessary or common. Home is located in north Raleigh, NC.

You may want to call the local board of health to see what (if anything) is mandated. Here in MA, you need to bring a water quality passing test stamped by the town BoH to closing.

BEHOLD: MY CAPE
Jan 11, 2004

Kastivich posted:

Does anyone have experience doing water quality testing on a house with a well?

There seem to be three options
- Bacteria
- Bacteria, lead, nitrates, and nitrites
- Bacteria, lead, nitrates, nitrites, and everything else (metals, pesticides, etc)

There is a $250 price spread between the basic and most extensive test. I've never been on well water before so I don't know if the extensive testing is necessary or common. Home is located in north Raleigh, NC.

I'd test everything before purchasing the water I'm going to drink and bathe myself in but that's just me, if your inspector is hawking you this service I'd look into a mail order kit or something cause $250++ sounds like a lot of money to spend for basic chemistry

Eryxias
Feb 17, 2011

Stay low.

Kastivich posted:

Well water stuff

I'd recommend trying out one of the well water test kits you can get on Amazon or something. The results aren't as detailed as the kind you can get from an actual lab, but it'll save you quite a bit of money. A Watersafe well testing kit is like $25 and does all of that stuff. If something looks a bit off, order a full lab. FYI I haven't run one these myself but a relative of mine likes to use them on his every so often, so don't just take my word as an expert or anything.

Eryxias fucked around with this message at 02:37 on Mar 31, 2015

SiGmA_X
May 3, 2004
SiGmA_X
Aren't state university labs really cheap and have a fast turnaround? That's what my folks used with our farm in the 90's but that was a while ago.

Kastivich
Mar 26, 2010
All good thoughts. I may try the at-home test kit to see if it flags anything for further inspection.

necrobobsledder
Mar 21, 2005
Lay down your soul to the gods rock 'n roll
Nap Ghost
For those on the NFCU train or want to get on, I just talked to my loan officer, and what some people said earlier is confirmed, others are debunked (myself included):

* You do not need a 750 credit score for even the HomeBuyers Choice product. You can go in probably at 720 or so and still get it
* There is no point with using HomeBuyers Choice if you have even 5% down
* You do NOT pay PMI on a conventional loan with Navy Federal. It is very similar to a VA loan but imperceptible to the seller (unlike a VA loan which forces the seller to pay full closing costs aside from down of 2.5%, putting them at a disadvantage out of the gate)
* Most loans that people with good credit, income, etc. they have will meet closing dates within 30 days. 45 days that people cite are for more "troublesome" accounts (this is military, service members are not particularly well known for being good with money in this country).

Basically, Navy Federal breaks all the rules of lending in your favor, and every selling agent would rather deal with a credit union than a bank as the lender. This is primarily because Navy Federal does NOT sell these mortgages on the secondary market. The selling agent I talked to this weekend point blank said if two similar offers came in and one was with a credit union as lender and the other as a regular bank, there'd be no contest because the credit union is far less risk and probably closes faster, which saves them substantial amounts of money.

QuarkJets posted:

Jesus, is NFCU really all that and a bag of chips? We're using a local credit union but they basically don't have mortgage services
NFCU has been stupid good for me, I'm kind of amazed at how quickly they get back to me for random questions. Even if they start dragging their feet, it'll get resolved within hours and still have no problem meeting closing. Internally, this probably means they're able to close on a mortgage within a span of less than two weeks, which is commendable if you ask me. They haven't even gotten my signed contract and they say they'll totally make the 23rd for a closing date still. Absurd? We'll see.

Sound_man
Aug 25, 2004
Rocking to the 80s
I got my home inspection done today, everything looks ok. The hot and cold water are switched in the master tub but that it not too big of a deal.

I hung out in the house during the inspection and it became clear to me the previous owners had smoked in there. Any tips or tricks for getting that smell out? We are already under contract is there anything I can ask for to help with that?

Problem!
Jan 1, 2007

I am the queen of France.
I'd hire a professional cleaning company to come in. You could ask the previous owners to pay for it but even if they say no I'd get a good deep clean anyway while the house is totally empty.

Cassius Belli
May 22, 2010

horny is prohibited

Sound_man posted:

I got my home inspection done today, everything looks ok. The hot and cold water are switched in the master tub but that it not too big of a deal.

I hung out in the house during the inspection and it became clear to me the previous owners had smoked in there. Any tips or tricks for getting that smell out? We are already under contract is there anything I can ask for to help with that?

Bring it up as a point of inspection. You're not limited to things that the inspector finds or writes in the report.

Ciaphas
Nov 20, 2005

> BEWARE, COWARD :ovr:


Time for the old rent vs buy question! My lease on my current apartment is coming up December 2015, so I've got a ton of time to work this one out. Gonna post this while I read the OP and related posts, so maybe some of this will be answered along the way. Sorry if it is. :shobon:

Right now I'm paying $999 rent, ~$50 water/sewer, ~$50 pet fees (one cat), ~$100 "technology" (our apartment has a deal with the local cable company), and ~$15 on renter's insurance monthly. Grand total $1214/mo on living, for a 1k sqft 2bed/2bath apartment with attached garage. Not bad, I figured (and still do, more or less).

For funsies, I decided to poke around on Zillow for local condo prices (it'd have to be a SPECTACULAR deal for me to be interested in a house, because gently caress outdoor maintenance--roof leaks, plumbing, etc. Not so much lawn care, I live in Vegas so I'd probably want rock anyway). An example of one I like, at similar size and spec to my apartment, costs almost exactly $100k right now. Since I'd be getting an FHA loan and a small (probably 5%) down payment, and get the closing costs rolled into the loan, I'm gonna assume that to be the total of my loan as well, 4% fixed for 30 years*. According to the more or less randomly picked mortgagecalculator.com, that'd mean a monthly payment of mortgage, PMI, and property tax of $581.58.

Average homeowner's insurance around here is about $60/mo, and my HOA at this particular condo complex (which includes water and sewer near as I can tell) is $175/mo. Assuming I haven't missed anything, that gives me a grand monthly total of 816.58, something like a $400/mo savings before I even consider things like equity and interest deductions. Even if I put away, say, $200/mo of that into a "HOW much is fixing the toilet gonna cost me again? :stare:" fund, I'd still be $200 ahead.

Now, my actual question is, basically: from a financial perspective, what have I missed? I say financial because, as far as lifestyle goes, I don't have a lot of prohibitions on home ownership. I have no wife or kids, just the one pet; the apartment and condo are roughly in the same neighborhood and have similar crime rates etc.; and (tempting fate here...) my job is so stable I could (and very well might) ride it all the way to retirement some four decades from now. And I seriously loving abhor moving, so I certainly wouldn't get ants in my pants anytime soon.


*(edit) I've run more accurate/more worst-case loan amount and mortgage terms than this, mind; these numbers were just simple for typing out.

Ciaphas fucked around with this message at 18:54 on Apr 1, 2015

SiGmA_X
May 3, 2004
SiGmA_X

Sound_man posted:

I got my home inspection done today, everything looks ok. The hot and cold water are switched in the master tub but that it not too big of a deal.

I hung out in the house during the inspection and it became clear to me the previous owners had smoked in there. Any tips or tricks for getting that smell out? We are already under contract is there anything I can ask for to help with that?
You're screwed. If it's very very mild, TSP to clean, and then Killz primer (3+ coatings) and top coat may help. It semi worked for my friend, then the nicotine started seeping through around the 1yr mark... The real fix is new drywall/ceiling and floorings.

I'd want a lot of money extra to move into a smokers house.

Antifreeze Head
Jun 6, 2005

It begins
Pillbug

Sound_man posted:

I got my home inspection done today, everything looks ok. The hot and cold water are switched in the master tub but that it not too big of a deal.

I hung out in the house during the inspection and it became clear to me the previous owners had smoked in there. Any tips or tricks for getting that smell out? We are already under contract is there anything I can ask for to help with that?

Wash whatever you can with TSP according to whatever instructions it has on the box. Use Kilz primer when repainting surfaces. Get a proper carpet cleaning if there are any and get the ducts cleaned just like you would if you were moving into a home not previously occupied by a smoker.

As a related side note, I always find it totally stupid when real estate listings try to claim a home built in the 1920s never had any smokers in it.

Leperflesh
May 17, 2007

Ciaphas posted:

Time for the old rent vs buy question! My lease on my current apartment is coming up December 2015, so I've got a ton of time to work this one out. Gonna post this while I read the OP and related posts, so maybe some of this will be answered along the way. Sorry if it is. :shobon:

Right now I'm paying $999 rent, ~$50 water/sewer, ~$50 pet fees (one cat), ~$100 "technology" (our apartment has a deal with the local cable company), and ~$15 on renter's insurance monthly. Grand total $1214/mo on living, for a 1k sqft 2bed/2bath apartment with attached garage. Not bad, I figured (and still do, more or less).

For funsies, I decided to poke around on Zillow for local condo prices (it'd have to be a SPECTACULAR deal for me to be interested in a house, because gently caress outdoor maintenance--roof leaks, plumbing, etc. Not so much lawn care, I live in Vegas so I'd probably want rock anyway). An example of one I like, at similar size and spec to my apartment, costs almost exactly $100k right now. Since I'd be getting an FHA loan and a small (probably 5%) down payment, and get the closing costs rolled into the loan, I'm gonna assume that to be the total of my loan as well, 4% fixed for 30 years*. According to the more or less randomly picked mortgagecalculator.com, that'd mean a monthly payment of mortgage, PMI, and property tax of $581.58.

Average homeowner's insurance around here is about $60/mo, and my HOA at this particular condo complex (which includes water and sewer near as I can tell) is $175/mo. Assuming I haven't missed anything, that gives me a grand monthly total of 816.58, something like a $400/mo savings before I even consider things like equity and interest deductions. Even if I put away, say, $200/mo of that into a "HOW much is fixing the toilet gonna cost me again? :stare:" fund, I'd still be $200 ahead.

Now, my actual question is, basically: from a financial perspective, what have I missed? I say financial because, as far as lifestyle goes, I don't have a lot of prohibitions on home ownership. I have no wife or kids, just the one pet; the apartment and condo are roughly in the same neighborhood and have similar crime rates etc.; and (tempting fate here...) my job is so stable I could (and very well might) ride it all the way to retirement some four decades from now. And I seriously loving abhor moving, so I certainly wouldn't get ants in my pants anytime soon.


*(edit) I've run more accurate/more worst-case loan amount and mortgage terms than this, mind; these numbers were just simple for typing out.

First: the outdoor maintenance you'd pay on a house is the same as the outdoor maintenance you're paying for the condo. The only difference is that with the condo, you're trusting the condo board to collect enough money via fees to cover all the maintenance. The key thing there is that condo fees can go up, but they never go down. You'll need to investigate any condo association's finances to see how well they're capitalized (they should have a lot of money in the bank to cover major expenses like "oh poo poo we need to replace the roofs on all the condos now")

A bigger concern is actually the lifestyle considerations you mentioned. If you have no wife and kids, but might get one someday, it's quite likely you'll want to move at some point. Wives tend to have jobs, kids need school, both take up square footage, etc.

Regardless, it's best to assume that you'll be more likely to sell eventually than never sell, and in that case, you need to consider your selling costs as part of your math. Typically the seller bears the burden of the buyers' and sellers' agents, which is typically 6%; there are a few other costs too. So if you've got less than maybe 8% equity, you actually have no equity and are in a position where you can't afford to sell without throwing more sunk cash into the transaction.

All that said, if condo ownership is right for you, it certainly looks like you can afford the payments. A 5% down payment is going to have you starting with effectively zero or negative equity, and on your 30-year loan, almost all of your payments for the first few years will be interest rather than principal (meaning, you will not be building meaningful equity for many years). But if you can make significant additional payments on principal, and you'll very definitely be in this condo for at least 5-8 years, it looks like it could work. I'd advise you to save more money so you're not immediately upside-down on your home, though, because being trapped in a condo you can't afford to sell (and may not be able to rent, depending on % of unit rental limits being hit in your condo complex) would suck a whole lot.

Be aware that housing prices can fall, and if they do, you can wind up upside-down even after pouring thousands of dollars of extra payments into your home. As an investment opportunity, an individual condo is quite a risky prospect, with high transaction costs, high maintenance costs, and poor liquidity. As a lifestyle choice, though, it could be right for you. Maybe.

Leperflesh fucked around with this message at 19:15 on Apr 1, 2015

blarzgh
Apr 14, 2009

SNITCHIN' RANDY
Grimey Drawer

What you're talking about is ultimately the reason people buy instead of rent. People with the capital and the credit to purchase real estate should generally do so instead of renting. But I can promise you that you will be paying more than 550 a month; every home buyer eventually learns that, and thats why this thread exists!

- For starters, property taxes are usually somewhere around 3% annually - thats $3,000.00 per year for your $100,000.00 house, you would need to be paying $250/mo to cover that, so $550.00 seems awfully low. Mortgage calculator sites give you the lowest possible numbers, so that you will follow the links to their business. They are out there trying to make money off of you by convincing you that you can afford to borrow from them. Be wary and do your own math!
- How much should you budget for annual repairs? No house makes it through a calendar year without something needing fixing.
- Also, are you going to be paying any closing costs, or rolling those into the note?
- Find out more about homeowners policies in your area, because its usually closer to $100/mo.
- Whats the market like where you're looking to buy? If home prices are on a steady downward trend in that area, then that condo may lose value faster than you build equity.
- Calculate how long on that 30 year note before you get any equity in the place. Look for ~15%.

Go to the tax assessors website in your area and find out what property taxes are. Go to your bank and say you want to get pre-approved for a home loan; see if you qualify for an FHA loan or whatever else.

Learn as much as you can about buying and selling homes. The more educated you are, the fewer mistakes you can make and the fewer unpleasant surprises you will find!


Also, listen to Lord of the Condos, my mortal enemy.

skipdogg
Nov 29, 2004
Resident SRT-4 Expert

All I had to read was "Condo in Vegas" to know that it's a bad loving idea. Rent someone elses Condo, but don't buy one.

Sound_man posted:

I got my home inspection done today, everything looks ok. The hot and cold water are switched in the master tub but that it not too big of a deal.

I hung out in the house during the inspection and it became clear to me the previous owners had smoked in there. Any tips or tricks for getting that smell out? We are already under contract is there anything I can ask for to help with that?

It's drat near impossible to get a smokers smell out of a house. It gets on every surface and permeates every single thing in the house. Really good advice so far.

TSP is great for washing things down. Killz primer and new paint are a must. Carpet and pad will definitely need to be tore up and replaced completely, while it was up I would seal the subfloor as well. HVAC needs to be completely cleaned, and that's tough. Nicotine and other smoking byproducts are a bitch to clean. The internet seems to think vinegar will cut through the residue left behind, haven't tried it though. Even after you have cleaned and replaced as much as you can, you still might need to bring in an onzone generator or something to help kill the last of it.

It will be a ton of work, unless you just do what you can and learn to live with the smell.

Spermy Smurf
Jul 2, 2004
You may have to replace a bunch of light fixtures in the heavily-smoked area too. If they are recessed, the baffle inside will likely be brown and really smelly.

blarzgh
Apr 14, 2009

SNITCHIN' RANDY
Grimey Drawer
Re: Getting rid of Smoke Smell

- Carpet and Pads almost certainly have to go.
- Its in the fans and light fixtures take em down and clean/blow them out.
- Paint the walls; it has soaked into the paint.
- Take down the blinds, and soak them in a cleaning mixture. We used a long, under-the-bed rubbermaid containers. That helped alot.

Leperflesh
May 17, 2007

Also: take the house down to the studs inside and out; replace the studs; rebuld interior and exterior with new materials; still get an occasional whiff of cigarette stink.

A smoked-in house is ruined in my opinion. I'd never buy one.

necrobobsledder
Mar 21, 2005
Lay down your soul to the gods rock 'n roll
Nap Ghost

skipdogg posted:

The internet seems to think vinegar will cut through the residue left behind, haven't tried it though. Even after you have cleaned and replaced as much as you can, you still might need to bring in an onzone generator or something to help kill the last of it.
I basically incinerated a bowl of curry in my microwave (inputting 9000 thinking it's milliseconds and forgetting to check back means I had a very, very long day) and while it still smells of smoke, I heated up some vinegar in a bowl repeatedly for a couple days and it's a lot better than it used to be. I think the next step is to use some charcoal to absorb residual odors. The vinegar vapor didn't seem to affect the curry staining the inside of the microwave.


Ciaphas posted:

Time for the old rent vs buy question! My lease on my current apartment is coming up December 2015, so I've got a ton of time to work this one out. Gonna post this while I read the OP and related posts, so maybe some of this will be answered along the way. Sorry if it is. :shobon:
I bought a condo in your situation and pretty much lost in every possible way besides going bankrupt and/or divorced, but it doesn't mean that it'll happen to you. Condos should be purchased as a primary home with one or more of the following criteria in mind:
* intent to rent out eventually or immediately (to take advantage of more tax deductions on the HOA dues that aren't deductible when you live there)
* don't mind paying EXTRA to have someone take care of externalities like lawn, snow removal, roofing, etc.
* inability to find anything in your price range for the foreseeable future (you are somehow unable to save up for a SFH or even townhouse)

In the wrong circumstances, condos can be the worst of renting apartments and the worst of owning a house. In the best circumstances, condos are great to rent out and make decent passive income on long-term or for someone single and not really needing or desiring much space.

When it comes to buying places with HOAs, I wouldn't even look at any of the properties and would first march right into the HOA management office and look through the records as a prospective buyer (if this is withheld from you for any reason whatsoever, immediately give up and leave - this is NEVER a good sign and is about as big of a showstopper IMO as much as a cracked foundation is in a house).

For reference, I'm one of the people that wrote the HOA warning posts quoted in the OP of the thread. I have every reason to hate HOAs with a burning passion, but buying a home for the wrong reasons is probably a bigger factor in utter failure that I had.


If I ever have enough money to just blow on a nice vacation home but am still too cheap to go buy some multi-million dollar villa, I would consider buying a luxury vacation condo and renting it out instead. Otherwise, I'm just going to go to some luxury resort like any other person that has a job and can't go on vacation for literally months at a time throughout the year.

Pryor on Fire
May 14, 2013

they don't know all alien abduction experiences can be explained by people thinking saving private ryan was a documentary

Yeah I'd never buy a house people smoked in either, fortunately that is getting rarer and rarer these days. Maaaaaaybe if it was so old that it needed to be gutted and repainted and new windows/floors anyway and I got a really good deal, but even then probably not.

uwaeve
Oct 21, 2010



focus this time so i don't have to keep telling you idiots what happened
Lipstick Apathy

Ciaphas posted:

Time for the old rent vs buy question! My lease on my current apartment is coming up December 2015, so I've got a ton of time to work this one out. Gonna post this while I read the OP and related posts, so maybe some of this will be answered along the way. Sorry if it is. :shobon:

Right now I'm paying $999 rent, ~$50 water/sewer, ~$50 pet fees (one cat), ~$100 "technology" (our apartment has a deal with the local cable company), and ~$15 on renter's insurance monthly. Grand total $1214/mo on living, for a 1k sqft 2bed/2bath apartment with attached garage. Not bad, I figured (and still do, more or less).

For funsies, I decided to poke around on Zillow for local condo prices (it'd have to be a SPECTACULAR deal for me to be interested in a house, because gently caress outdoor maintenance--roof leaks, plumbing, etc. Not so much lawn care, I live in Vegas so I'd probably want rock anyway). An example of one I like, at similar size and spec to my apartment, costs almost exactly $100k right now. Since I'd be getting an FHA loan and a small (probably 5%) down payment, and get the closing costs rolled into the loan, I'm gonna assume that to be the total of my loan as well, 4% fixed for 30 years*. According to the more or less randomly picked mortgagecalculator.com, that'd mean a monthly payment of mortgage, PMI, and property tax of $581.58.

Average homeowner's insurance around here is about $60/mo, and my HOA at this particular condo complex (which includes water and sewer near as I can tell) is $175/mo. Assuming I haven't missed anything, that gives me a grand monthly total of 816.58, something like a $400/mo savings before I even consider things like equity and interest deductions. Even if I put away, say, $200/mo of that into a "HOW much is fixing the toilet gonna cost me again? :stare:" fund, I'd still be $200 ahead.

Now, my actual question is, basically: from a financial perspective, what have I missed? I say financial because, as far as lifestyle goes, I don't have a lot of prohibitions on home ownership. I have no wife or kids, just the one pet; the apartment and condo are roughly in the same neighborhood and have similar crime rates etc.; and (tempting fate here...) my job is so stable I could (and very well might) ride it all the way to retirement some four decades from now. And I seriously loving abhor moving, so I certainly wouldn't get ants in my pants anytime soon.


*(edit) I've run more accurate/more worst-case loan amount and mortgage terms than this, mind; these numbers were just simple for typing out.

Read the sections in the 2nd post on Why Renting Isn't Throwing Away Money, Condos, and HOAs.

Leperflesh reiterated my lifestyle concerns from the Stupid/Small Questions megathread. It's not what your lifestyle IS it's how your lifestyle may change that is important. You get a 2 BR condo with 1 garage, giving you +1 to extra rooms, 0 to extra garage spaces, and +25 to pride of ownership. You hump a kid into a waitress and get married, you now have 0 extra rooms and -1 available garage spaces, $shitload/month in additional expenses, -$15k equity, potentially -$8k to sell (oh you can't sell the HoA is back in litigation again and sales can't be recorded), and hate the place. Then you start finding out what the inspector missed. Then you get a speeding ticket and your insurance goes up. Then your dog gets cancer. Etcetera.

Financially, I'd say have a solid plan in place for emergency fund, retirement, college for the kids you don't yet know about. Then shop as if you were going to furnish the new place, redecorate, paint. Build a small toolkit for basic repairs or expect every visit by a tradesperson to be $150 or more. Assume your appliances need replacement over the next 2-10 years. Assume the HoA is insolvent or whatever and you're going to be hit with special assessments for maintenance (you have to pay for the poo poo that "isn't yours" that breaks, just not directly).

So yes this is worst-case on worst-case, but all this stuff happens and adds up. It's critically important to understand the "rent is a ceiling, mortgage is a floor" concept. If you do all these exercises and still come out ahead/saving money every month/with clean underpants, then condownership may be for you.

I'll mention again that I'm not trying to poo poo on your parade or dissuade you from going this route. I'm not one of the thread experts, just someone with some posting time and an appreciation for how costs can creep. It hasn't broken me yet, but it's been eye-opening. I'm coming at this from having knowingly overstretched, at risk. As such, a lot of my deliberation focused on cash-on-hand, transitional expenses (moving, kitting out for more maintenance, the additional things that go wrong with a house with a shitload of bells and whistles compared to my prior house), and balancing this with down payment. I'm not one of the horror stories, but my experience was basically that immediate expenses and the maintenance of a bigger/more-poo poo-to-break house are more expensive than I (conservatively, I thought) estimated. Luckily I built in enough of a cushion that it's working out fine for us, but basically our emergency "well pump, roof, HVAC all go in the same year" balanced with college savings and retirement is just barely keeping pace with projections.

Rooster Brooster
Mar 30, 2001

Maybe it doesn't really matter anymore.
What Leperflesh said is dead on. If you put a low $ down and pay mostly interest for the first few years, you can wind up wanting to sell within 10 years and needing to bring a giant pile of money to the table to make it happen. That'll greatly skew your rent vs buy calculations.

Only other thing I'd add on what other people have said is that good condo buildings generally don't let you rent out your unit without any conditions. This is to prevent the building becoming occupied only by renters, and driving down property values. Banks also sometimes don't like to give you loans for condos in mostly-rental buildings. Here in Chicago I was told 20% was a good limit, but in other places it ccould vary. This is both something you should ask about when buying, and something you need to think about as an owner. A building that has strict renting rules is better for your resale, but a bigger pain in the rear end as far as your flexibility.

Ciaphas
Nov 20, 2005

> BEWARE, COWARD :ovr:


Thanks for all the great advice. And no worries about making GBS threads on my parade or whatever, I'd much rather have that than make a lousy decision :v:

Coupla things I can clarify/ask about right away...

- If condos and their associated HOAs are as horrifying as you say though, I'd consider townhouses too. I didn't even know they existed in Las Vegas until a day ago, spread out as this city is. I guess townhouse lots would still have HOAs though, right?

I guess I could be convinced to look for a proper SFH, but finding an SFH that's around 1000-1100 sqft (I frankly do not want and can't use much more than that) and in a neighborhood I want is rather limited in comparison. Still loathe the idea of yardwork but I guess that's what hiring people to come buy every few weeks is for.

- My prospects for marriage or kids are so slim as to be negligible. (And willingly, believe me. Bachelorhood and an empty house suits me juuuust fine. :goonsay:) Acknowledged that things could change, though it would be a pretty unbelievably drastic change in... well, me.

- I could almost certainly stay at least five years, and probably a lot longer.

- Property taxes for the areas I'm interested in seem to average around 2%, though I will of course figure out the actuals if I continue forward with this in the coming months.

- Home values in all the areas are at worst stagnant ever since the big housing crash a few years ago, and at best up by 3-4%. Again, though, I'll remember to pay attention to that.

- My retirement fund right now is at just over $100k, at 30 years old. I think I'm okay on that front. (I think I know the answer to this but I wanna make sure, taking a loan on the 401k portion of that to get a bigger down payment and avoid PMI would be seriously bad mojo, right?)

- I fully acknowledge that Renting != Flushing Money; it just seems like every time I run the numbers on housing prices out here for places similar to my apartment, even in the worst case I'm getting fleeced by at least $200 monthly, not counting the eventual building of equity, and interest deductions.

- In fact, that feeling of getting fleeced is just about the entire reason I'm considering this. Getting a wee bit closer to work would be a boon too, but it's not significant. I don't buy into the whole ~Pride of Ownership~ thing one bit, for example.

-I acknowledge I'd have to be there for a while for it to be a financially sound call, yeah, assuming my down payment is crap.

Ciaphas fucked around with this message at 22:09 on Apr 1, 2015

moana
Jun 18, 2005

one of the more intellectual satire communities on the web
Wooooo got an offer for my house today, exactly $200k more than what I paid for it six years ago. It's FHA, so I'm crossing my fingers it goes through.

Problem!
Jan 1, 2007

I am the queen of France.
My views on buying condos and townhouses vs a detached house is why do you want to chain yourself to sharing walls/floors/ceilings with other people for 30+ years, people who could be total shitheads but since they also own you're stuck? That sounds like my version of hell.

blarzgh
Apr 14, 2009

SNITCHIN' RANDY
Grimey Drawer

moana posted:

Wooooo got an offer for my house today, exactly $200k more than what I paid for it six years ago. It's FHA, so I'm crossing my fingers it goes through.

Flying right under that $250K exclusion. Check with your CPA.

moana
Jun 18, 2005

one of the more intellectual satire communities on the web

blarzgh posted:

Flying right under that $250K exclusion. Check with your CPA.
I'm married so it would be twice that, but yeah, I checked into it before listing.

Zhentar
Sep 28, 2003

Brilliant Master Genius

Ciaphas posted:

- I fully acknowledge that Renting != Flushing Money; it just seems like every time I run the numbers on housing prices out here for places similar to my apartment, even in the worst case I'm getting fleeced by at least $200 monthly, not counting the eventual building of equity, and interest deductions.

You aren't "getting fleeced" by $200/mo, you're paying $200/mo for services provided to you. You have no responsibility to perform or manage maintenance (at $200/mo, the maintenance work I've put into my home would be paying below minimum wage) and protection from risks of future uncertainty (home equity doesn't always go up; your net worth can disappear practically overnight, being bound to one location significantly increases unemployment). Don't undervalue these services; they provide very real, significant benefits even if they aren't tangible.

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

Ciaphas
Nov 20, 2005

> BEWARE, COWARD :ovr:


Aquatic Giraffe posted:

My views on buying condos and townhouses vs a detached house is why do you want to chain yourself to sharing walls/floors/ceilings with other people for 30+ years, people who could be total shitheads but since they also own you're stuck? That sounds like my version of hell.

If I'm honest, I hadn't put much thought in to this. I've lived in only two places since fleeing the nest, and in both my neighbors were not an issue at all (quite friendly at my last place, aloof at my current). I should know better than to think that streak will continue :v:

  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
  • Post
  • Reply