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What makes this worse is that Turkey still entirely deny it happened. It's one thing to kill 1.5 million people, and to do it in such a way that it necessitates the creation of the word "genocide", but to then basically play dumb when accused of it is another thing entirely.
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Apr 7, 2015 09:48
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My Dad was a fighter/bomber pilot in the Pacific Theatre. Let's just say that he would strongly disagree with some of the sentiments expressed in this thread.
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Apr 7, 2015 10:19
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Bompacho posted:
I remember watching Rogue, a fairly crappy horror movie about a giant saltwater crocodile stalking and killing a group of tourists. Afterwards I was like "Heh, well, there's no way they grow that big in real life, right?"  *checks Wikipedia article*  ... 
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Apr 7, 2015 10:55
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showbiz_liz posted:Hey, how about a new topic: horrible animal sex! showbiz_liz posted:Oh hey, have some more horrible bug sex! Punkin Spunkin has a new favorite as of 11:37 on Apr 7, 2015 |
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Apr 7, 2015 11:19
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VidaGrey posted:How do people stay alive in Australia? If you live in the bush/outback (like I did as a kid) you learn fast what to do around snakes and spiders and so on. We were also taught in primary school (Elementary school) to "emu walk" i.e. checking the ground in front of you as you're walking. We were also taught the basics of identification for snakes, etc etc. I also had a lot of close experiences growing up. For the first fifteen years of my life, my family lived in this little shack thing my old man built himself. It was pretty basic, and it was easy for determined wild life to make their way inside if they wanted to. While we lived there, I nearly stepped on a Funnel Web Spider, a female who was carrying her eggs on her back. Elsewhere on the property I had a couple of close calls with King Brown snakes, Razorbacks (and a feral cow this one time), white tail spiders, yada yada. I once had to step in between our German Shepherd and an enraged Goanna. Heh, funny story - one time I was doing the washing up with my sister in the kitchen of the poo poo Shack. A primer on the roof - Corrugated iron, insulation, chicken wire, supported by 2x4's. Like I said, easy for something determined to get in if it wanted to. Anyway, I'm wiping up the dishes with my head down, talking away at my bitch sister about some dumb bullshit. Suddenly there's a thump and breaking plate type noises. I look up and turn around to look at my sister, who is now passed out on the floor. There's something long, thin and green just outside my field of view. I swivel around a bit more and lo and behold, there's a Green Tree Snake hanging down from the roof checking our poo poo out. I guess it had been up in an overhanging tree, dropped onto the roof for the heat, and then crawled inside the house once it started to cool down. I backed up slowly - they aren't venomous but they will bite if provoked - and got my old man, who bought it down from the roof and released it elsewhere on the property. My sister was fine, but she is roundly mocked about it to this day. My mum nearly got bit by a King Brown snake when I was about two. She was hanging washing on the line with me on her hip when it rocked up. Dad gave it an introduction to the business end of his .410 and it didn't bother anyone after that. My wife got bit by a snake when she was out on a bushwalk with a school group, and she was fine. It bit her once and hosed off straight away, they didn't get a visual ID but the bite profile, and the fact that she was only mildly envenomated means it was probably a King Brown. She got airlifted to a local hospital and treated within half an hour and yeah, was completely fine. You're only proper hosed if you're too far away from anything to get help. blunt for century posted:Honestly, that would be a good OP for a PYF weird weapons or whatever thread, which we probably need anyway. Solid idea, I'll get on that! DPM has a new favorite as of 13:57 on Apr 7, 2015 |
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Apr 7, 2015 13:53
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ranbo das posted:Another good example is the Lusitania. The Germans found out that the ship was going to be used to smuggle weapons and such to the British, which was against maritime law (we had been doing this for a while, they just hadn't really caught us yet). Germany went as far as to take out an ad in the paper warning people not to travel on the Lusitania. Unsurprisingly, it gets torpedoed, which causes a huge outcry because those evil germans are breaking the rules of war (conveniently ignoring the fact they broke them because we were breaking them). Erik Larsen just put out a pretty good book about the Lusitania called Dead Wake that goes into a lot of detail about the people on the ship and the commander of the submarine, and then a bunch of horror stories about what happened as it sank. Worst one for me was probably a second hand report that one of the survivors saw a pregnant woman giving birth in the freezing cold water after the ship went down.
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Apr 7, 2015 14:03
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VidaGrey posted:How do people stay alive in Australia?
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Apr 7, 2015 15:08
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blunt for century posted:
THOR was an awesome idea in theory. Some ideas were scaled sized of projectiles from full-sized ones (your telephone poles) for hardened bunkers down to small-diameter or cluster rods for raining hypervelocity molten metal down on troop formations or other large area targets. The problem was getting such a large system in orbit without anyone noticing. For full coverage you'd need a lot of satellites, and the second that a world power found out they'd be deploying anti satellite missiles to knock them out if you ever pushed too far. Blowing up satellites creates a lot of debris, taking down more satellites and before you know it low orbit is a junkyard of hell metal destroying anything you try to put up. It ended up not being worth starting an orbital Cold War that could gently caress up our entire global satellite networks when you can just produce a few thousand drones and slap some Hellfires on them. Not as sexy, admittedly, but it works.
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Apr 7, 2015 15:57
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War is bad and hosed up things happen during a war, even to civilians. Let's move past this idea and post more content. 
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Wild T posted:THOR was an awesome idea in theory. Some ideas were scaled sized of projectiles from full-sized ones (your telephone poles) for hardened bunkers down to small-diameter or cluster rods for raining hypervelocity molten metal down on troop formations or other large area targets. Oh, I wasn't familiar with the smaller version idea, but it makes sense. As far as size being an issue and people noticing, the only way I can see getting around that is to manufacture the systems already in orbit/on the moon
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Apr 7, 2015 16:04
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Screaming Idiot posted:Say, can someone repost the stuff about the ships that ran aground in the arctic? The bit where one of the crewmen warns the natives not to visit the shantytown of tents nearby the frozen ship gives me chills -- it's the kind of thing that'd make for a good horror story. That would be the Franklin Expedition of the 1840s. The eskimo testimony was that the survivors of the ships had split into 2 groups, one of which had turned to cannibalism. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Franklin%27s_lost_expedition There's a lot of chat about Franklin on the polar fiction/non-fiction thread: http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3655083
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Apr 7, 2015 17:03
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WickedHate posted:when in reality nearly every country is just as bad as each other simply amazing
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Apr 7, 2015 19:06
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Back to Ghost Flights! Last time we covered the Lady Be Good, a plane that has something in common with Mary Celeste and many other famous "ghost ships"- vessels abandoned (for whatever reason) with no one at the controls. Ships, however, can stay afloat for years, whereas planes are only as good as how much fuel they have left and which way the nose is pointed at the time it officially became "ex-crewed". Because of this "ghost flights" tend to have a short life span. But don't worry! Many modern aviation advancements have come about since Orville Wright fistbumped his brother Wilber and screamed "LET'S DO THIS!" (Orville, incidentally, went on to see his invention enable people to cross entire countries and oceans in a matter of hours, deliver atomic destruction, and go faster than the speed of motherfucking sound). These advancements have enabled computers to take over many functions of flying, and keeping the clusterfuck that is landing something the size of a small office building onto a modern day commercial airport to be more "cluster" and less "gently caress!!" Even with a layman's understanding of it, autopilots are modern marvels! But they are not, by any means, perfect. There's a reason there's more than just one pilot up in the cockpit, and all those buttons, lights, and switches are not just for show. There's millions of parts and miles of wiring and anything can go wrong at any time (this is why a tight maintenance schedule is important) - and the autopilot is no exception. A plane in flight always needs constant supervision and a way for a human to take back control instantly. That said, today's autopilot systems are pretty reliable! They can keep a plane up, even if everyone on board has died. And I don't mean "abandon ship", here - I am talking about corpses at the controls, sitting in the passenger seats, and nothing but ghosts (sorta) keeping them up in air. Are you fuckers ready to hear about the 1999 South Dakota Learjet Crash. Well too bad, you sick fucks, because in this case, we have no idea who was dead and who was merely incapacitated the moment the plane hit ground. But all tragedy aside - and the following story is tragic- a plane of the dead is pretty loving metal, is what I am saying.  Pictured: metal as gently caress In 1999, a Learjet took off from Orlando, Florida. Hours later, it was over the Dakotas. Problem was, it was supposed to be a direct flight to Dallas, Texas. The plane was a chartered flight, and thankfull, not filled to capacity. On board was a pro golfer named Payne Stewart and his two agents, Van Ardan and Robert Fraley, along with Bruce Borland who was a highly regarded architect with the Jack Nicklaus golf course design company. The crew weren’t slouches, either: quote:The 42-year-old captain, Michael Kling, held an airline transport pilot certificate and type ratings for the Boeing 707, Boeing 720, and Learjet 35. He also had Air Force experience flying the KC-135 and Boeing E-3 Sentry. Kling was also an instructor pilot on the KC-135E in the Maine Air National Guard. According to Sunjet Aviation records, the captain had accumulated a total of 4,280 hours of flight time (military and commercial) and had flown a total of 60 hours with Sunjet, 38 as a Learjet pilot-in-command and 22 as a Learjet second-in-command.[1] Two years after the crash, there was some question about both pilots’ learjet training - more on that later - but both pilots were certified to teach other people how to fly airplanes, and Kling could fly a KC-135, which is a giant plane designed to refuel other planes while in midflight. It’s also really, really hard to dismiss 1,751 hours of flight time, let alone 4,280 - including experience flying a lot of planes with ‘Boeing’ in the name. The point it, neither of them were ‘green’, and this flight should have been a milk run. Shoulda: quote:(Kermit notes: Times followed by Z are in 24-hour format and in Universal Time Coordinated which is more or less Greenwich Mean Time, just more exact) Within the span of six and a half minutes, something had gone very, very wrong. And also horribly right. The crew and passengers were all dead or disabled, but the autopilot was working just fine. See if you can spot the moment where everything went from sugar to poo poo!  Go on, take a minute, answers are on the back of this forum With no human intervention, the Learjet began its short career as a ghost flight, keeping on its last programmed heading. Visibly, the plane was fine, save for one disturbing detail: quote:About 1454Z (now 0954 CDT due to the flight's crossing into the Central Time zone), a U.S. Air Force F-16 test pilot from the 40th Flight Test Squadron at Eglin AFB in western Florida, who happened to be in the air nearby, was directed by controllers to intercept N47BA. When the fighter was about 2,000 feet (600 m) from the Learjet, at an altitude of about 46,400 feet (14,100 m), the test pilot made two radio calls to N47BA but did not receive a response. The F-16 pilot made a visual inspection of the Lear, finding no visible damage to the airplane. These being pre-9/11 times, the reaction was more grim pondering rather than anus puckering terror. Actually, considering the Learjet was now an unguided missile poised to crash into the northern United States or southern Canada, anuses probably puckered anyway. By now the powers that be had a better grasp on what was happening, even if they didn’t know the exact causes of it (yet). With still no response from the Learjet, they redirected a couple more jets at the problem. quote:At 1613Z, almost three hours into the flight of the unresponsive Learjet, two F-16s from the 138th Fighter Wing of the Oklahoma Air National Guard (ANG), flying under the call-sign "TULSA 13 flight", were directed by the Minneapolis ARTCC to intercept. The TULSA 13 lead pilot reported that he could not see any movement in the cockpit, that the windshield was dark and that he could not tell if the windshield was iced. We’ll revisit that number later, it’s kind of important. Also note the response is measured and reasonable - sending in agile and fast military jets that can keep up and safely recon a cruising and technically out of control Learjet. I really shouldn’t have to bring this up: quote:About 1650Z, two F-16s from the 119th Wing of the North Dakota ANG with the identification "NODAK 32 flight" were directed to intercept N47BA. TULSA 13 flight also returned from refueling, and all four fighters maneuvered close to the Lear. The TULSA 13 lead pilot reported, "We've got two visuals on it. It's looking like the cockpit window is iced over and there's no displacement in any of the control surfaces as far as the ailerons or trims." About 1701Z, TULSA 13 flight returned to the tanker again, while NODAK 32 remained with N47BA.[1] Yes, the best way to avert a giant metal fireball-maker landing in a heavily populated area is to shoot it and turn it into a fireball that hurdles a giant spread of metal shrapnel at the ground at high speed. Which is still probably a pretty well populated area. Or, I dunno, we could just plot its course over the last few hours and calculate how much farther it could go based on the fuel it had when it left Orlando. Whoa, day was saved with high school level math, wooo! And that’s probably what they ended up doing to get a rough idea where it was going to come down, and since that area pointed towards ‘probably a corn field in South Dakota’, all they could do was have the jets babysit the Learjet until it ran out. The grim truth was told by the iced over windows and unmoving ailerons - if anyone was still alive and hadn’t woken up by now, it would soon be certain that they never would. The last 30 minutes of ghost flight of the Learjet 35, registration N47BA are all we have on audio. The plane did not have a flight recorder, so precise flight and mechanical data are unknown. If you listen to the voice recorder, though, you get strong evidence what happened. This is from an article outside wikipedia: quote:The dominant sounds as the tape starts are what appears to be the drone of the plane's two turbofan engines running at high speed and the cabin altitude warning, which alerts the flight crew of the need to begin using supplemental oxygen masks when the cabin loses pressure at high altitudes. (Without supplemental oxygen, the crew and passengers would be expected to lose consciousness quickly at the altitude the Learjet was flying at when it was intercepted by that first F-16.) Anna Cushman aided the investigation by sound spectrum analysis. Noticeably absent are any sounds of breathing. I mean, at least that the CVR could pick up.  This is what the sound of one engine spinning down looks like, while the other briefly continues to run, btw Here’s the crash from the jet pilots POV: quote:At 1711:01Z, the Lear began a right turn and descent. One NODAK 32 airplane remained to the west, while one TULSA 13 airplane broke away from the tanker and followed N47BA down. At 1211:26 CDT, the NODAK 32 lead pilot reported, "The target is descending and he is doing multiple aileron rolls, looks like he's out of control...in a severe descent, request an emergency descent to follow target." No survivors, gentle goon readers, but take heart: it did, in fact, land in a corn field. And, thankfully, not a golf course because I just couldn't deal with that. Now comes the big mystery! What the hell happened? No one knoowwwwwssss  Actually it was incapacitation due to hypoxia. Which we will cover on PART 2: NO, REALLY, WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED?
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Apr 7, 2015 19:54
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Please tell me you're going to do Helios too, such a fascinating incident
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Apr 7, 2015 20:11
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Gibfender posted:Please tell me you're going to do Helios too, such a fascinating incident There was another similar incident in Australia as well, so I will do all three. The second part of this one will cover the same basics of the other two.
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Apr 7, 2015 20:22
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blunt for century posted:Honestly, that would be a good OP for a PYF weird weapons or whatever thread, which we probably need anyway. IT LIVES!!!  Literally Kermit posted:a plane of the dead is pretty loving metal, is what I am saying. Yeah, no loving kidding man! Excellent post as always, keen to see the next one(s). DPM has a new favorite as of 00:48 on Apr 8, 2015 |
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Apr 8, 2015 00:45
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Good post Kermit. I have a strange interest in flights like that (and some strange desire to get a my pilots license).
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Apr 8, 2015 01:17
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I would take one Kermit spooky plane post over 10 pages of nukeposts
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Apr 8, 2015 01:18
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I was working for the Golf Channel (which is based in Orlando) while they were putting together that big tribute to Payne Stewart and did some incidental work on some of the interview footage and such. It was pretty tough to watch at times, especially the stuff with his widow. Such a weird freak accident.
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Apr 8, 2015 02:24
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blunt for century posted:
A giant fuckoff bacon mother loving railgun for the clit/brown/taintarea-pwning mother loving WIN.
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Apr 8, 2015 03:08
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inkwell posted:A giant fuckoff bacon mother loving railgun for the clit/brown/taintarea-pwning mother loving WIN. ...what? 
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Apr 8, 2015 03:13
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inkwell posted:A giant fuckoff bacon mother loving railgun for the clit/brown/taintarea-pwning mother loving WIN. Are...are you having a stroke? 
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Apr 8, 2015 03:16
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inkwell posted:A giant fuckoff bacon mother loving railgun for the clit/brown/taintarea-pwning mother loving WIN. I got the reference, buddy. It's ok.
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Apr 8, 2015 03:20
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Maybe he was just imitating the top military big-wigs getting a hard-on when they get to allocate money to the latest high-tech mud-person annihilator.
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Apr 8, 2015 05:34
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ful posted:I find this fairly unnerving: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Willie_MacRae
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Apr 8, 2015 10:39
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Bloody Hedgehog posted:Maybe he was just imitating the top military big-wigs getting a hard-on when they get to allocate money to the latest high-tech mud-person annihilator. I think he was probably imitating the OP whose every post is full of edgy mother loving swears
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Apr 8, 2015 21:37
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A CRUNK BIRD posted:I think he was probably imitating the OP whose every post is full of edgy mother loving swears Well, I am made of felt, so I am probably over-compensating for being mostly edgeless.  Edit: you win, I couldn't keep my gooniness in check. I went back and counted six swears in my last effort post. I must have been really, really saucy when I talked about Super Volcanoes. Literally Kermit has a new favorite as of 22:13 on Apr 8, 2015 |
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Apr 8, 2015 22:09
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Literally Kermit posted:Well, I am made of felt, so I am probably over-compensating for being mostly edgeless. He meant blunt for a century's post. You're okay, now post the conclusion of that plane story cause I wanna know wtf happened.
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Apr 8, 2015 23:23
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ranbo das posted:World war things Thanks a bundle! I really enjoyed the lesson!
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Apr 8, 2015 23:37
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Hijo Del Helmsley posted:What makes this worse is that Turkey still entirely deny it happened. It's one thing to kill 1.5 million people, and to do it in such a way that it necessitates the creation of the word "genocide", but to then basically play dumb when accused of it is another thing entirely. They didn't at first: the story behind Turkey's denial of the Armenian Genocide is a sad one that unfortunately has a lot to do with its "Westernization," for lack of a better term, as well as the legal ramifications and origins of the term "Genocide." I think this section of the Wikipedia article is best, but it's really a bit more complicated than it makes it out to be.
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Apr 9, 2015 00:22
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Anoia posted:You're okay, now post the conclusion of that plane story cause I wanna know wtf happened. Okay, you are in luck because Part two is so entitled: GHOST FLIGHTS - PART 2: NO, REALLY, WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED? Well, technically it’s part two of part two. Part one concerned the Lady Be Good, a WWII bomber that was named after a movie, and is an example of ghost flight via crew abandonment. When an airplane is headed for disaster - running out of fuel, mechanical failure, etc - the crew quickly has to decide to either poo poo or get off the pot. These kinds of ghost flights are short lived, because the plane was either in bad shape to begin with or had Indiana Jones as a passenger. In part two (part 1!  ), we visited the tragic Learjet accident that claimed the life of Payne Stewart and 5 others. Unlike cases of abandonment, crew incapacitation involves an almost fully-functioning aircraft., and most modern aircraft (especially commercial flights) have a magic wizard-box that will maintain a set altitude and heading until it runs out of fuel. And with the high speeds and altitudes involved these days, these types of ghost flights can last a significantly long time.In the case of Stewart’s charter Learjet 35, the last contact with the cockpit happened 8 minutes after take-off. The next attempt came six minutes, 20 seconds later (14 minutes after departure, for those keeping score). In that short time both pilots and the rest of the passengers became incapacitated. The plane flew on for well over the next 1400 miles, for a total time of 3 hours and 54 minutes. That’s enough time to watch the music video for Pearl Jam’s “Do the Evolution” 58 and a half times in a row!  Oh, so you like GHOST FLIGHTS, do ya? All kidding aside, I think while we can all agree plane crashes are metal as gently caress, it’s important to remember actual, not-pretend lives were lost in this tragic accident. I know it is hard, but empathy is important and we should try and visit the topic with sincere and utmost respect. Anyway, when we last left off THE MOTHERFUCKING LEARJET WAS OUT OF GAS, OUT OF TIME, AND SPINNING OUT OF CONTROL ABOUT TO CRASH INTO THE EARTH AT SUPERSONIC SPEEDS. And then it hit. *paf*  If I wasn’t laughing all the time, I’d be crying. Outside Mina, South Dakota, an unlucky landowner had a brand-new smoking crater on their property, and a sizable crew arriving on scene to figure out what the heck happened. They had their work cut out - most of the plane had vaporized on impact because I wasn’t kidding about the ‘supersonic speed’ part. Here in America, the investigation of this kind of thing ultimately falls to the National Transportation Safety Board, and they are good at their job. They had to be in this case, because while plenty of bits and pieces survived, and the Cockpit Voice Recorder was recovered, they had their work cut out for them. For starters, the CVR was an older model that only captured the last 30 minutes of audio. With everyone aboard dead or disabled, the only thing to listen to was the sound of the engines and any audio alarms blaring in the cockpit. For two, this particular Learjet did not have a Flight Data Recorder installed (while the CVR is a kind of FDR, I’m referring to a device that records specific aircraft performance data, which is extremely useful for narrowing down what was happening before and during a crash. For three, a crew conking out 10 minutes after take off and sending an out-of-control jet across the United States is kind of a major concern for the NTSB - which appropriately enough is their highest level of investigation: Major. Between the evidence collected, the eyewitness testimony from the 4 jet pilots who had escorted the Learjet until it met its fate, and sound spectrum analysis from the CVR, the NTSB were able to piece together what had happened. And it turned out to be pretty simple! That was a lot of words! What happened already!? The NTSB summed up their findings as thus: "The probable cause of this accident was incapacitation of the flight crew members as a result of their failure to receive supplemental oxygen following a loss of cabin pressurization, for undetermined reasons." In other words, crew incapacitation by hypoxia. Oxygen starvation. What? Hypoxia can be explained best by taking a couple hours and checking out the Mt. Everest thread. Besides it being fun to read about rich people dying and having their corpses exposed to the elements, it also will give you an idea what happens to the human body when it is forced to endure at that altitude, where the air is extremely thin. Spoilers: At that altitude our brains start to shut down and die. There’s thousands of tons of garbage on Everest, and a major portion of that is discarded oxygen bottles. Climbers are supposed to use them conservatively, give them just enough air to function at a bare minimum. Use too little and you begin getting slower and stupid. Use too much and you ultimately run out of air, which is the reason many die on the way back down from the summit.  "Only 6 dead? Well isn't that cute!" The summit of Everest is 8,848 meters (29,029 feet). Now let’s revisit the time between the last known contact from and first unreplied call to the doomed Learjet: quote:At 1327:13Z, the controller from the JacksonvilleARTCC instructed the pilot to climb and maintain flight level (FL) 390 (39,000 feet (11,900 m) above sea level). The aircraft reached a maximum altitude of 48,900 feet (9.3 mi; 14.9 km). Miles and kilometers, folks. That’s about 20,000 feet above Mt. Everest. Without proper oxygen supply, you’d be hard pressed to survive long, let alone function. Told you that number was important! Ultimately, the NTSB found, the cabin of the Learjet depressurized: quote:Following the depressurization, the pilots did not receive supplemental oxygen in sufficient time and/or adequate concentration to avoid hypoxia and incapacitation. The wreckage indicated that the oxygen bottle pressure regulator/shutoff valve was open on the accident flight. Further, although one flight crew mask hose connector was found in the wreckage disconnected from its valve receptacle (the other connector was not recovered), damage to the recovered connector and both receptacles was consistent with both flight crew masks having been connected to the airplane's oxygen supply lines at the time of impact. In addition, both flight crew mask microphones were found plugged into their respective crew microphone jacks. Therefore, assuming the oxygen bottle contained an adequate supply of oxygen, supplemental oxygen should have been available to both pilots' oxygen masks. There’s no way to know what the pilots did or even to fault them for it - they weren’t getting enough air to think about getting more air, and they lost consciousness. Simple as that.  quote:The NTSB report showed that the plane had several instances of maintenance work related to cabin pressure in the months leading up to the accident. The NTSB was unable to determine whether they stemmed from a common problem – replacements and repairs were documented, but not the pilot discrepancy reports that prompted them or the frequency of such reports. The report gently chides Sunjet Aviation for the possibility that this would have made the problem harder to identify, track, and resolve; as well as the fact that in at least one instance the plane was flown with an unauthorized maintenance deferral for cabin pressure problems. “Gently chides” is NTSB for “yeah, because you were too general with your paperwork and procedures, six people are dead”. We’ll get back to Sunjet in a minute. Let’s start wrapping up.  gently caress you guys, I wasn't effort-posting THAT long. AFTERMATH The loss of Payne Stewart was felt throughout the professional golf community and golf fans alike: quote:Stewart was ultimately headed to Houston for the 1999 Tour Championship, but planned a stop in Dallas for discussions with the athletic department of his alma mater, Southern Methodist University, about building a new home course for the school's golf program.[6]Stewart was memorialized at the Tour Championship with a lone bagpipe player playing at the first hole at Champions Golf Club prior to the beginning of the first day of play.  quote:The owner of the crash site, after consulting the wives of Stewart and several other victims, created a memorial on about 1 acre (4,000 m2) of the site. At its center is a rock pulled from the site inscribed with the names of the victims and a Bible passage.[6] x 2quote:The 2000 U.S. Open, held at Pebble Beach Golf Links, began with a golf version of a 21-gun salute when 21 of Stewart's fellow players simultaneously hit balls into the Pacific Ocean. x 3 new level unlocked See you, Space Cowboy quote:In 2001, Stewart was posthumously inducted into the World Golf Hall of Fame. Not a happy ending, of course, but perhaps it could be called a satisfying one. Meanwhile, the wheels of justice and revamped procedures continued to turn: quote:On June 8, 2005, a Florida state court jury in Orlando found that Learjet was not liable for the deaths of Stewart and his agents Robert Fraley and Van Ardan, who had also been aboard the plane.[7] And ultimately they weren’t. It was almost certainly bad maintenance that caused the depressurization, rather than a manufacturing defect. Sunjet’s documentation hosed them going and coming back, because it showed there WAS a problem with cabin pressure and that SOMETHING was fixed, but not exactly what. Oh well! So the government decided to let bygones be- quote:WASHINGTON, April 11 — Federal agents Tuesday raided the offices of the company that owned the doomed jet that killed golf champion Payne Stewart last fall, trying to get to the bottom of the bizarre jet crash. Yeah, someone was going down, and it wasn’t going to be Learjet. quote:As for the charges that the plane that crashed had pressurization problems, months before the accident, former SunJet pilot Cole Webb, said last year, “There was a problem, there definitely was a problem.” There’s a whole side story here about allegations of Sunjet lying about training their pilots, the main trainer in question being, no poo poo, the owner’s dad: He's on the right, photo-bombing the crowd cheering for me to shut the gently caress up already quote:Raymond Veatch told a federal administrative judge that James Watkins Sr. filed false records about the amount of time he had spent training pilot Michael Kling and co-pilot Stephanie Bellegarrigue. We’ll never know for sure. Remember, the depressurization may have been too gradual for either pilot to register as an emergency - if they ever did, it came too late. There was no sign of a problem until the plane was ordered to ascend, perhaps causing a sudden decompression that caught them off guard. Mr. Veatch has the right idea; they aren’t here to defend themselves, and as I mentioned before, both their flight careers pre-Sunjet seem pretty solid. Sometimes, poo poo just happens. Regardless, Sunjet went out of business - having all the paperwork and records you need to run an airline seized will do that. Ultimately, the justice department dropped the investigation in 2002, possibly because shutting Sunjet down was now moot. And so ended the ballad of the 1999 South Dakota Learjet Crash. It peaked early and then rambled on for 4 hours Let us pray. Next up on GHOST FLIGHTS we’ll visit a similar case of crew incapacitation - Helios Airways Flight 522. This one has a little more action, and regrettably, a much higher loss of life. Literally Heavy Metal Literally Kermit has a new favorite as of 02:07 on Apr 9, 2015 |
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Apr 9, 2015 02:02
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Not to steal Kermit's thunder, but I have a weird obsession with plane crashes too. Actually, one happened near me this past week: http://www.pantagraph.com/news/local/more-expected-today-on-cause-of-fatal-plane-crash/article_11a046fd-ceee-58a2-92e0-d73d45d4c22b.html A plane carrying a group of people, including 2 from Illinois State University's athletic department and a bunch of local business owners, was on the way home from the NCAA tournament in one guy's dad's cessna, when they crashed while trying to land in heavy fog. The NTSB is still investigating, of course, but so far we know it was on track to make a fairly routine ILS landing, but suddenly turned left and crashed into a field, killing everyone on board. (Notice how the flight status is "result unknown"  ) The last radar data we have shows them suddenly climbing before suddenly descending (into the ground); my guess (I am not an NTSB investigator) is the pilot decided at the last minute to either go around or divert to another airport because of the fog, tried to climb but stalled out and crashed. It really was insanely foggy that morning; I remember looking out my kitchen window as I went to make coffee and not being able to see the house across the street, and wondering how I was going to get to work on time. Then I turned on the TV and saw this. I couldn't say why car crashes and shootings on the local news don't disturb me, but this does; maybe just because it's so unusual. Peoria and Bloomington-Normal are far from rural, but we're still small enough stuff like this doesn't happen here. Plane crashes happen at O'Hare, not CIRA.  But whatever happened to them, at least it happened fairly quickly. What really creeps me out is how long a plane can stay in the air after something catastrophic happens before it lands. The archetypical example being Japan Airlines Flight 123. Wikipedia posted:About 12 minutes after takeoff, at near cruising altitude over Sagami Bay, the aircraft's aft pressure bulkhead tore open due to a preexisting defect, stemming from a panel that had been incorrectly repaired after a tailstrike accident years earlier. This caused an explosive decompression, causing pressurized air to rush out of the cabin and bring down the ceiling around the rear lavatories. The air then blew the vertical stabilizer off the aircraft, severing all four hydraulic lines. A photograph taken from the ground some time later confirmed that the vertical stabilizer was missing.[18] Loss of cabin pressure at high altitude caused a lack of oxygen throughout; emergency oxygen masks for passengers were deployed. Flight attendants, including one off-duty, administered oxygen to various passengers using hand-held tanks.[7] So far so good; plane's still in the air, and not yet full of ghosts. Unfortunately, it's almost impossible to control: quote:Hydraulic fluid completely drained away through the rupture. With total loss of hydraulic control and non-functional control surfaces, plus the lack of stabilizing influence from the vertical stabilizer, the aircraft began up and down oscillation in a phugoid cycle. In response, pilots exerted efforts to establish stability using differential engine thrust. Further measures to exert control, such as lowering the landing gear and flaps, interfered with control by throttle; the aircrew's ability to control the aircraft deteriorated. [...] The elapsed time from the bulkhead explosion to when the plane hit the mountain was estimated at 32 minutes – long enough for some passengers to write farewells to their families. Subsequent simulator re-enactments with the mechanical failures suffered by the crashed plane failed to produce a better solution, or outcome; despite best efforts, none of the four flight crews in the simulations kept the plane aloft for as long as the 32 minutes achieved by the actual crew. Imagine that. Imagine being on a plane for half an hour, knowing something really loving serious had happened, but not knowing if you would live or die. Of course, even if you survived the crash, you had to be rescued... quote:After losing track on radar, a U.S. Air Force C-130 from the 345 TAS was asked to search for the missing plane. The C-130 crew was the first to spot the crash site 20 minutes after impact, while it was still daylight. The crew sent the location to Japanese authorities and radioed Yokota Air Base to alert them and directed a Huey helicopter from Yokota to the crash site. Rescue teams were assembled in preparation to lower Marines down for rescues by helicopter tow line. Despite American offers of assistance in locating and recovering the crashed plane, an order arrived, saying that U.S. personnel were to stand down and announcing that the Japan Self-Defense Forces were going to take care of it themselves and outside help was not necessary. Well, gently caress. But for sheer, pants-making GBS threads terror, I think Alaska Air 261 is still my worst nightmare: Wikipedia again posted:Approximately two hours into the flight, the flight crew contacted the airline's dispatch and maintenance control facilities in SeaTac, Washington, and on a shared company radio with operations and maintenance facilities at Los Angeles International Airport (LAX) discussed a jammed horizontal stabilizer and a possible diversion to LAX.[9] The jammed stabilizer prevented operation of the trim system, which would normally make slight adjustments to the flight control surfaces to keep the plane stable in flight. At their cruising altitude and speed, the position of the jammed stabilizer required the pilots to pull on their controls with approximately 10 pounds (44N) of force to keep level. You spend the next 10 minutes wondering what the hell is happening, if you're going to die, what shape the plane's in, and then... quote:Beginning at 4:19 p.m., the CVR recorded the sounds of at least four distinct "thumps" followed 17 seconds later by an "extremely loud noise" as the jackscrew failed and completely separated from the nut holding it in place. The aircraft rapidly pitched over into a dive.[9] The crippled aircraft had been given a block altitude, and several aircraft in the vicinity had been alerted by ATC to maintain visual contact with the stricken jet and they immediately contacted the controller.[12] One pilot radioed "that plane has just started to do a big huge plunge"; another reported, "Yes sir, ah, I concur he is, uh, definitely in a nose down, uh, position descending quite rapidly."[12] ATC then tried to contact the plane. The crew of a Skywest airliner reported "He's, uh, definitely out of control." [12] Although the CVR captured the co-pilot saying "Mayday," no radio communications were received from the flight crew during the final event.[10][12] quote:At one point, unable to raise the nose, they attempted to fly the aircraft "upside-down".
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Apr 9, 2015 02:13
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A sincere thank you and gently caress you to you both for the posts. Thank gosh I don't have to fly as often as I used to.
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Apr 9, 2015 03:59
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Man, the rational part of my brain knows you take more of a risk driving to work every morning than flying on a plane, but then there's the little paranoid part going "Nope nope nope nope nope" and calculating how much more vacation time I'd need to take the train cross-country rather than fly.
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Apr 9, 2015 04:39
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Now everyone needs to watch Charlie Victor Romeo
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Apr 9, 2015 05:02
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Thanks Kermit. This thread needed a good dose of effort posting. You do us all a great service.
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Apr 9, 2015 05:03
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The flying upside down part is what always gets me about that one. Flight crews who make stupid decisions you can kinda understand, but these guys were pulling out all the stops and trying poo poo you should never do to a commercial jet to try to stay alive. If they had pulled it off they would be heroes, but even that wasn't enough.
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Apr 9, 2015 05:08
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Parasol Prophet posted:Man, the rational part of my brain knows you take more of a risk driving to work every morning than flying on a plane, but then there's the little paranoid part going "Nope nope nope nope nope" and calculating how much more vacation time I'd need to take the train cross-country rather than fly. Flying is very safe, but in the few cases where it goes bad, it goes very bad.
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Apr 9, 2015 06:59
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Literally Kermit posted:A whoooole lotta words. I remember when that happened. The minute you started talking about ghost flights, that was the one that came to mind. I remember following the story as it unfolded. "Authorities say they have lost contact with the Learjet that was transporting golfer Payne Stewart and three companions from..." I remember when the chase planes started reporting frost on the windows of the jet. It was pretty creepy. Literally Kermit posted:Next up on That ought to be good. A Pinball Wizard posted:Not to steal Kermit's thunder, but I have a weird obsession with plane crashes too. Actually, one happened near me this past week: http://www.pantagraph.com/news/local/more-expected-today-on-cause-of-fatal-plane-crash/article_11a046fd-ceee-58a2-92e0-d73d45d4c22b.html Not possible. I am pretty sure that's the most effort I have ever seen go into the "scary or unnerving article" thread. I mean, it's a two-parter, with quotes and everything. It's at least tied with any other posts in this thread. I think it's things like that post which keep sperg genes in the pool.
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Apr 9, 2015 07:56
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Receptive_aphasia https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aVhYN7NTIKU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dKTdMV6cOZw quote:Two cortical areas central for the understanding and production of language are Wernicke’s area, and Broca’s area. Wernicke’s Area is located posterior to the lateral sulcus, typically in the left hemisphere, between the visual, auditory, and somesthetic areas of the cerebral cortex. A person with this aphasia speaks with normal prosody and intonation but uses random or invented words; leaves out key words; substitutes words or verb tenses, pronouns, or prepositions; and utters sentences that do not make sense. Therefore, their expressive language is devoid of any meaning. This is referred to as empty speech. Other symptoms can include a loss of verbal pragmatic skills and conversational turn-taking. As a result, these individuals often display logorrhea, a nonstop output of speech. [3] A person with this aphasia cannot understand the spoken words of others or read written words. Speech is preserved, but language content is incorrect. Substitutions of one word for another (paraphasias, e.g. “telephone” for “television”) are common. Comprehension and repetition are poor. 
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Apr 9, 2015 09:30
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A Pinball Wizard posted:But for sheer, pants-making GBS threads terror, I think Alaska Air 261 is still my worst nightmare: Pants-making GBS threads terror is absolutely correct. Like the Learjet flight earlier, this one had it's root in poor maintenance programs. This flight was the inspiration for this scene from 2012's Flight https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=36U8qJPGCdA Also the pilot's were commended for their decision to keep their plane over the ocean rather than keep flying over SF. quote:For their actions during the emergency, Captain Ted Thompson and First Officer Bill Tansky were awarded the Airline Pilots Association Gold Medal for Heroism, the only time the award has been given posthumously.
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Apr 9, 2015 09:52
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