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Fojar38 posted:Collapse? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yuan_Shikai
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Apr 3, 2015 00:09
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sincx fucked around with this message at 05:42 on Mar 23, 2021 |
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Apr 3, 2015 00:29
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Even then, I don't think Deng actually retired retired until he died.
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Apr 3, 2015 00:42
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sincx posted:If you think about it, the Deng to Jiang transition is the first time in Chinese history that top level power was transferred without someone dying and/or a coup. Emperor Qianlong abdicated because he didn't want to rule longer than his grandfather (60 years), however this: Pastrymancy posted:Even then, I don't think Deng actually retired retired until he died. was still true for him.
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Apr 3, 2015 01:38
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To be fair, even in places with frequent peaceful transfers of power, you often get former holders of the highest offices not quite retiring. I mean, Taft came back to become a Supreme Court judge.
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Apr 3, 2015 01:58
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The next election in the US could very well be Clinton vs. Bush again.
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Apr 3, 2015 02:01
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Mao killed two of his designated successors (Liu in Cultural Resolution, Lin in plane crash), Deng only put his two designed successors in house arrest for life. Deng threatened to get rip of his last successor in '92 if Jiang didn't changed his economic policy though.
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Apr 3, 2015 02:07
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Stringent posted:The next election in the US could very well be Clinton vs. Bush again. Good.
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Apr 3, 2015 02:45
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whatever7 posted:Mao killed two of his designated successors (Liu in Cultural Resolution, Lin in plane crash), Deng only put his two designed successors in house arrest for life. Deng threatened to get rip of his last successor in '92 if Jiang didn't changed his economic policy though. Hu Yaobang  I can't even imagine how things would be now if Hu or Zhao were given the reigns of power instead of Jiang. For one thing there'd be a lot less anti-Japanese propaganda.
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Apr 3, 2015 06:48
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Long live Zhao Ji Yang  In other news, http://www.ejinsight.com/20150413-china-rejects-taiwan-bid-to-be-founding-member-of-aiib/ quote:China on Monday rejected Taiwan’s application to become a founding member of the Asia Infrastructure Investment Bank. Poor Taiwan
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Apr 14, 2015 02:39
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I don't quite get what's wrong with "Chinese Taipei". I'm assuming until corrected that this is just China negging Taiwan as a dominance thing - if Taiwan had put the name down as "Province of Taipei under the jurisdiction of the People's Republic of China" then China would insist on "the GLORIOUS People's Republic of China".
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Apr 14, 2015 02:44
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Freudian posted:I don't quite get what's wrong with "Chinese Taipei". I'm assuming until corrected that this is just China negging Taiwan as a dominance thing - if Taiwan had put the name down as "Province of Taipei under the jurisdiction of the People's Republic of China" then China would insist on "the GLORIOUS People's Republic of China". Because the nationality of individuals from Taiwan is Taiwanese, not Chinese Taipeinese, and the permanent existance of that nationality is backed by the full faith and credit of an American nuclear red-line.
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Apr 14, 2015 02:54
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Reapply as the Rightful, God-Fearing, Commie-Hating Republic of China
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Apr 14, 2015 03:06
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They probably applied under the name The Motherfuckers and China found it offensive.
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Apr 14, 2015 03:09
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caberham posted:Long live Zhao Ji Yang The AIIB is shaping up to be a credible and professional institution.
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Apr 14, 2015 03:42
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Fojar38 posted:The AIIB is shaping up to be a credible and professional institution. Now wouldn't it be a pity if Taiwan proposed a APIIB with much friendlier terms than China could ever dream to offer, backed by direct access to the Fed's overnight window? Pity, what with Xi shaping up to be both an emperor without a bureaucracy and a bureaucrat without an empire, rather than focusing on only one like his predicessors.
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Apr 14, 2015 05:29
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I must rise high enough in government all so that one day I can surreptitiously submit a document asking for the US to be added to an international organization under the name "United States of my dick!" What are they going to do, turn it down?
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Apr 14, 2015 05:31
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wrong thread
V for Vegas fucked around with this message at 04:44 on Apr 15, 2015 |
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Apr 15, 2015 04:35
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sincx fucked around with this message at 05:42 on Mar 23, 2021 |
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Apr 15, 2015 07:46
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Why?
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Apr 15, 2015 11:49
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They consider Taiwan as part of china. A wayward province, as it were. If you have one wayward province declaring independents then it might catch on and suddenly you're missing half of china. That may not be all of it, but to my understanding that is a big part of it. China was poo poo scared at the speed of which the USSR collapse, to most people without warning. They really don't want the same thing to happen to them. Also general dickish'ness.
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Apr 15, 2015 12:04
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Yeah so imagine for one second what happens to the CCP if it loses that war. I know that might be a lot to ask but just give it a shot. One second of thinking. Before you post, not after! Common mistake.
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Apr 15, 2015 12:13
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Arglebargle III posted:Yeah so imagine for one second what happens to the CCP if it loses that war. Ah I though you were just asking why in general China has such an issue with the Taiwanese independence thing. But yeah China must know that as soon as America got involved in it they would be proper hosed, so a hot war with Taiwan/America ain't going to happen.
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Apr 15, 2015 12:30
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The good old "use 'ain't' to sound more informed and confident fallacy"
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Apr 15, 2015 12:55
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i have read about this scenario in The Tiger and the Fly by esteemed author Tom Clancy, and my opinion is
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Apr 15, 2015 12:55
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I don't know much about the Israel/Palestine conflict, but let's just say Hamantaschen ain't gonna be made of taboon bread anytime soon
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Apr 15, 2015 12:56
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angel opportunity posted:The good old "use 'ain\'t' to sound more informed and confident fallacy" That was triggering me.
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Apr 15, 2015 13:12
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I think the US government could afford to lose a war with China but I don't think the Chinese government could afford to lose a war with the US.
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Apr 15, 2015 13:29
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Could it even afford to start one?
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Apr 15, 2015 14:15
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It depends on the cost and the willingness to pay imo.
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Apr 15, 2015 14:31
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maybe the truth is in the middle
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Apr 15, 2015 14:38
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The US isn't going to give up its [trade deal with China that I looked up on wikipedia just now] just so that it can earn points with the loving [pro Taiwan organization with some minor political pull that I googled but know nothing about]. It ain't gonna happen.
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Apr 15, 2015 14:47
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It would be cool if there was a war and we could have a good old fashioned straight up fight with another country for once.
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Apr 15, 2015 15:54
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Even DPP is positioning to adopt the "statue quo" policy. I don't know why would China need to go to hot war to keep Taiwan in check. Just check DPP president hopeful Ko Pee's comments. TW as an economic entity doesn't matter, its GDP doesn't even rank in top 10 of the mainland provinces. Taiwan has more strategic and political value to BJ than economic value.
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Apr 15, 2015 15:59
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Arglebargle III posted:Yeah so imagine for one second what happens to the CCP if it loses that war. Read Susan L Shirk's "China: Fragile Superpower" and also read I think its her TED Talk on the subject? CCP losing a war with the US could very well be lethal to their governance, but so to would allowing Taiwanese independence to do so unchallenged (in their view). The Chinese government has a lot of think-tanks working for them that ponder this question every day of how to respond without having to fight a shooting war while also maintaining their legitimacy. This is because in the past, Mao could have let it slide because the military's loyalty to him was unquestionable; the current leadership since 1989 has to routinely raise the military budget to maintain their political loyalty to the party.
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Apr 15, 2015 16:12
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Allowing Taiwanese independence to lose a war with the US would probably reflect badly on the CCP, yes.
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Apr 15, 2015 16:30
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Arglebargle III posted:Allowing Taiwanese independence to lose a war with the US would probably reflect badly on the CCP, yes. More importantly, Taiwanese sovreignty is a red line for America in the same sense that Polish sovreignty is a red line. If you allow PRC to eliminate Taiwanese independence without a response, you've essentially abolished NATO.
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Apr 15, 2015 16:43
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Arglebargle III posted:Allowing Taiwanese independence to lose a war with the US would probably reflect badly on the CCP, yes. This doesn't make sense. What's your question again? I was under the impression it was "Why would China risk a war with the US it may very well lose (Knowing that losing would result in Bad Things?)"; the gist of it is that not going to war would also result in Bad Things. Whether either result is true or isn't relevant when the issue is considering their perceptions.
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Apr 15, 2015 19:27
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As long as we're fantasizing about the CCP being humiliated remember that Taiwan has been preparing to fight this war for 65 years and counting. America might barely have to intervene.
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Apr 15, 2015 19:40
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Fojar38 posted:As long as we're fantasizing about the CCP being humiliated remember that Taiwan has been preparing to fight this war for 65 years and counting. America might barely have to intervene. I'm sure the famously effective PLA navy and air force will have no problem recreating D-Day against an opponent that has spent many decades digging in and practising how to shoot marines. 
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Apr 15, 2015 19:59
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