|
No mostly we're saying that police are trigger happy cowards who misrepresent how dangerous their profession is. I'm certainly not going to dispute that the US military is pretty awful.
|
#
?
Apr 17, 2015 23:57
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 28, 2024 20:40 |
|
|
Jarmak posted:So we've reached the point where people are telling vets how they're wrong and the US Army was actually really restrained during the war just to avoid having to admit that maybe, just maybe, saying that cops are more trigger-happy then a bunch of infantryman in a war-zone was a bridge too far. But I love my dead gay talking point 
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2015 00:02
|
|
|
Dead Reckoning posted:Do you understand that saying, "Hey guys, we're not going to kick doors on this one because intel says this dude's house is basically one giant IED" is different than what people usually mean when they talk about "showing restraint," which typically refers to refraining from an action for principled or altruistic reasons, rather than fear of ending up in a CSH minus some of your important bits? That's pretty much the new excuse for no knock flash bang and shoot anything that moves warrants, because it's a drug dealer (hopefully) and all drug dealers are armed to the teeth so they have to storm trooper in and take them out first.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2015 00:26
|
|
|
Toasticle posted:That's pretty much the new excuse for no knock flash bang and shoot anything that moves warrants, because it's a drug dealer (hopefully) and all drug dealers are armed to the teeth so they have to storm trooper in and take them out first. Did you miss all the other posts pointing out the other potential military responses to these situations? Dead Reckoning posted:the military is allowed to shoot anti-tank missiles at occupied buildings to get one guy.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2015 00:37
|
|
|
Well "excited delirium" is getting a (very) small bit of attention again. Somehow this story never really pierces the public attention. http://www.alternet.org/news-amp-politics/heres-walter-scott-outrage-nobodys-talking-about quote:Here's the Walter Scott Outrage That Nobody's Talking About
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2015 02:43
|
|
|
I don't know about raids, but judging from photos taken during the Ferguson demonstrations, U.S. armed forces do have better trigger discipline.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2015 17:18
|
|
|
For once, some good news... FBI goons in Las Vegas devised a plan to gather evidence on an illegal gambling ring running out of an expensive hotel suite. They shut off internet to the suite, posed as technicians, and entered the suite wired up with cameras to conduct a search. The 4th amendment is supposed to protect against unlawful search and seizure, but the FBI claimed that since they had been "invited" into the hotel suite, the search was lawful. Happily, the SCOTUS has put the smackdown on the FBI's buffoonery, finding that non-essential services cannot be interrupted in order to gain access to conduct a search. Copy of the decision is here. I was concerned about this case because of the nature of interrupting the internet service - it's not an "essential" service like electricity or water.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2015 18:36
|
|
|
My Rhythmic Crotch posted:For once, some good news... If this is the case I'm thinking of the judge that first struck it down said something like "What the hell why didn't you get a warrant, it'd have taken like 5 minutes because you had some evidence"
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2015 18:38
|
|
|
This was in the local paper today: Black Man gets 80 years in jail for non-violent Burglary, he may not have even commited. He's 20 years into the sentence, but holy crap.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2015 18:39
|
|
|
hobbesmaster posted:If this is the case I'm thinking of the judge that first struck it down said something like "What the hell why didn't you get a warrant, it'd have taken like 5 minutes because you had some evidence"
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2015 18:48
|
|
|
Anora posted:This was in the local paper today: That's loving insane. Like, how is it possible for that kind of sentence not to get slapped down on appeal.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2015 19:53
|
|
|
Patrick Spens posted:That's loving insane. Like, how is it possible for that kind of sentence not to get slapped down on appeal. The first two words are why.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2015 20:13
|
|
|
That's loving?
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2015 20:24
|
|
|
repeating posted:That's loving? "Black man"
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2015 20:29
|
|
|
http://www.nbcnews.com/news/crime-courts/officer-refuses-resort-deadly-force-i-wanted-be-absolutely-sure-n344011quote:A rookie Ohio cop is being praised for "great restraint and maturity" after he held off using deadly force against a double murder suspect who charged at him, his police chief said. Aaaaand another: https://gma.yahoo.com/homeless-man-florida-discovers-forgotten-bank-account-collecting-215310136.html quote:A homeless man who has been living in a cardboard box in downtown Tampa, Florida, for over three years may soon have a modest-sized apartment and a pension check coming in every month, police said. Vahakyla fucked around with this message at 22:25 on Apr 18, 2015 |
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2015 22:22
|
|
|
Vahakyla posted:http://www.nbcnews.com/news/crime-courts/officer-refuses-resort-deadly-force-i-wanted-be-absolutely-sure-n344011 Better footage here. Also that officer has done two tours and has a purple heart, so he's a true badass.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2015 22:42
|
|
|
My Rhythmic Crotch posted:Better footage here. Also that officer has done two tours and has a purple heart, so he's a true badass. Its as if hes received more training on dealing with stressful situations than the average officer.
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2015 23:20
|
|
|
hobbesmaster posted:Its as if hes received more training on dealing with stressful situations than the average officer. Some very bad quality bodycam footage is also popping up right now of a guy wielding a samurai sword getting shot by St Lous PD. Anyone have good footage?
|
|
#
?
Apr 18, 2015 23:26
|
|
|
Vahakyla posted:http://www.nbcnews.com/news/crime-courts/officer-refuses-resort-deadly-force-i-wanted-be-absolutely-sure-n344011
|
|
#
?
Apr 19, 2015 00:00
|
|
|
Jarmak posted:So we've reached the point where people are telling vets how they're wrong and the US Army was actually really restrained during the war just to avoid having to admit that maybe, just maybe, saying that cops are more trigger-happy then a bunch of infantryman in a war-zone was a bridge too far. To be fair, non military types telling vets how it really is is kind of a something awful intramural sport.
|
|
#
?
Apr 19, 2015 00:01
|
|
|
ActusRhesus posted:To be fair, non military types telling vets how it really is is kind of a something awful intramural sport. Don't worry kids, you can both be lovely for your own reasons 
|
|
#
?
Apr 19, 2015 01:47
|
|
|
tezcat posted:It's more getting vets to say how lovely they are just to spite the "leftist" & "liberals" mentioning the fact that the police are may be worse. That is comedy in itself. I never said lovely, war calls for a different level of restraint then law enforcement. People lacking any sort of conceptual grounding of what a war is actually like and instead using law enforcement as their framework for understanding an issue is one of the most aggravating things about discussing that topic here. This is just people making that mistake from the other direction.
|
|
#
?
Apr 19, 2015 02:32
|
|
|
Vahakyla posted:http://www.nbcnews.com/news/crime-courts/officer-refuses-resort-deadly-force-i-wanted-be-absolutely-sure-n344011 Hey, everybody guess the race of the suspect.
|
|
#
?
Apr 19, 2015 15:07
|
|
|
Amish?
|
|
#
?
Apr 19, 2015 15:14
|
|
|
Wow that is quite a video. Seriously, loving great job. There is a guy who has a lot of experience and training in assessing threats. I don't know what kind of training he received but it looks like he has put it to good use. He could sense that the man was just a shitkicker who had snapped and committed murder, and that his murderous impulse was played out. So, he was intent on bringing him in rather than killing him. This is the sort of person who we need in the police. Now, I'm sure a lot of police will come out and say "oh well these are the sort of decisions I make every day." OK then, put on a body camera and show us. If you assess threats and make decisions like this guy, you'll earn all manner of plaudits from me.
|
|
#
?
Apr 19, 2015 15:45
|
|
|
SedanChair posted:Wow that is quite a video. I suppose the main point, aside from the discipline and training of this policeman, is his willingness to increase the risk to his own life in order to decrease the chance that he'll have to take the other man's life.
|
|
#
?
Apr 19, 2015 16:01
|
|
|
That's an understatement, I've seen early 2000s russian webcam feeds with better quality and framerates than that.
|
|
#
?
Apr 19, 2015 18:10
|
|
|
Zwabu posted:I suppose the main point, aside from the discipline and training of this policeman, is his willingness to increase the risk to his own life in order to decrease the chance that he'll have to take the other man's life. If you watch what happens and how he made his decision, you can see that he made the exact opposite choice that many officers would make. The man simply had his hand in his pocket, which a great many officers have been documented as taking to mean "Drawing a weapon" and immediately opened fire. He took the chance to wait until he could see a gun or knife come out before potentially shooting an unarmed man making a bluff. I think he could also tell by the behavior that the guy was committing a typical suicide by cop, and thus was trying to get himself killed more than he was trying to kill someone.
|
|
#
?
Apr 19, 2015 21:40
|
|
|
Zwabu posted:I suppose the main point, aside from the discipline and training of this policeman, is his willingness to increase the risk to his own life in order to decrease the chance that he'll have to take the other man's life. He didn't really increase his risk. Walking backwards is a viable tactic.
|
|
#
?
Apr 19, 2015 21:45
|
|
|
chitoryu12 posted:If you watch what happens and how he made his decision, you can see that he made the exact opposite choice that many officers would make. The man simply had his hand in his pocket, which a great many officers have been documented as taking to mean "Drawing a weapon" and immediately opened fire. He took the chance to wait until he could see a gun or knife come out before potentially shooting an unarmed man making a bluff. I think he could also tell by the behavior that the guy was committing a typical suicide by cop, and thus was trying to get himself killed more than he was trying to kill someone. And when he loses his footing and falls backwards, that's when the suspect realizes his suicide attempt hasn't worked and he immediately complies with the officer's demands. Oh and this officer is wearing a body camera of his own accord. Some police have good conduct, even exemplary conduct. I wonder if he will still be on the force in five years?
|
|
#
?
Apr 19, 2015 22:20
|
|
|
From his own statements, it sounds like he felt like he was in control of the situation. He had the draw on the suspect and was prepared to use lethal force if necessary, but was also confident enough inside such a situation that he could wait for the suspect to make an overtly hostile move before firing. Maybe that comes from having actual combat experience. He was also briefed with regards to the suspect being likely to attempt suicide by cop, which was probably confirmed when the suspect charged him demanding to be shot.
|
|
#
?
Apr 20, 2015 00:35
|
|
|
Vahakyla posted:He didn't really increase his risk. Walking backwards is a viable tactic. Technically he "increased his risk" by failing to immediately kill the guy. Technically, the only way to truly avoid being murdered by everyone you meet is to kill them first. He was just brave enough to wait for confirmation of a threat instead of opening fire as soon as he had an excuse.
|
|
#
?
Apr 20, 2015 00:49
|
|
|
chitoryu12 posted:Technically he "increased his risk" by failing to immediately kill the guy. Technically, the only way to truly avoid being murdered by everyone you meet is to kill them first. He was just brave enough to wait for confirmation of a threat instead of opening fire as soon as he had an excuse. Yeah this was what I meant by exposing himself to increased risk. Obviously he didn't feel the threat was credible, but he left an opening where if he'd read it wrong the guy could have killed him, or his window to stop the guy killing him would have been a lot smaller.
|
|
#
?
Apr 20, 2015 01:13
|
|
|
http://www.rawstory.com/2015/04/80-percent-of-police-force-resigns-after-missouri-town-elects-first-african-american-mayor/quote:Following the election of the town’s first African-American mayor, five of the six officers on a small Missouri town police force resigned en masse, reports KFVS. To be fair, the place has 740 residents. One or two cops should be plenty.
|
|
#
?
Apr 20, 2015 01:59
|
|
|
Vahakyla posted:http://www.rawstory.com/2015/04/80-percent-of-police-force-resigns-after-missouri-town-elects-first-african-american-mayor/
|
|
#
?
Apr 20, 2015 02:10
|
|
|
Vahakyla posted:http://www.rawstory.com/2015/04/80-percent-of-police-force-resigns-after-missouri-town-elects-first-african-american-mayor/ I hope those people are hounded at every public place by journalists, every day. Instead they'll be greeted with smug leers of approval from their neighbors.
|
|
#
?
Apr 20, 2015 02:26
|
|
|
The man who was recently believed to have been given a "nickel ride" by Baltimore PD has passed away due to complications from his injuries and/or surgery (I'm not a doctor). Link to story. This one is loving heartbreaking. They gave this guy some savage, horrible injuries in an especially cruel way 
|
|
#
?
Apr 20, 2015 04:32
|
|
|
My Rhythmic Crotch posted:The man who was recently believed to have been given a "nickel ride" by Baltimore PD has passed away due to complications from his injuries and/or surgery (I'm not a doctor). Link to story. This one is loving heartbreaking. They gave this guy some savage, horrible injuries in an especially cruel way
|
|
#
?
Apr 20, 2015 07:17
|
|
|
My Rhythmic Crotch posted:The man who was recently believed to have been given a "nickel ride" by Baltimore PD has passed away due to complications from his injuries and/or surgery (I'm not a doctor). Link to story. This one is loving heartbreaking. They gave this guy some savage, horrible injuries in an especially cruel way quote:Police haven't said what crime Gray was suspected of or how he sustained his injuries. A brief witness video of the end of the arrest, obtained by the Baltimore Sun, showed officers carrying Gray toward a police van as his legs dragged on the ground. In another witness video that aired on the local CBS affiliate, WJZ-TV, he could be heard screaming. How can the police not have any statement about what happened for a week afterward? Aren't they required to make a report about any arrest right away? In the absence of such a statement or report, how could anyone conclude anything other than that they're getting their story straight?
|
|
#
?
Apr 20, 2015 11:58
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 28, 2024 20:40 |
|
|
http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/tulsa-sheriff-stanley-glanz-fbi-closed-investigation tulsa sheriff claims FBI exonerated his department in the reserve deputy shooting
|
|
#
?
Apr 20, 2015 16:42
|
|
