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zoux posted:Also Steven DeKnight looks like a gay porn star. You have just explained everything about Spartacus: Blood & Sand. Jessica Jones chat: I agree with whoever said she'll probably be an Agents of SHIELD power-set character, like Mockingbird or Melinda May. It wouldn't make sense for a Supergirl-esque character to exist in the MCU, but also somehow nobody has ever heard of her. Re-conceiving her as a Black Widow-like figure is way more feasible. And would fit with the stakes established in Daredevil; Matt Murdock is "powered," but not dramatically. He's still mostly dealing with mooks and they're still providing a challenge.
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# ? Apr 21, 2015 22:05 |
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# ? May 16, 2024 18:38 |
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zoux posted:How the hell is there not a digital collection of Alias? I don't know, but it vexes me. It vexes me so bad!
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# ? Apr 21, 2015 22:05 |
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Xealot posted:You have just explained everything about Spartacus: Blood & Sand. I don't think anyone said that. They said she could be mind controlled and forced to fight Agents of Shield people, rather than fight the Avengers who are not going to appear in the show. I think it will probably be neither of those options and they will just refer to her getting her rear end kicked by the Avengers. Or its just dropped completely and they roll only with the sexual assault angle. Also, why does this show have to fit the stakes of Daredevil? You can also easily write a scenario where people don't know about her powers. For instance, she gets her powers, tries to start superheroing and the first bad guy she encounters is Purple Man, and she's done. mikeraskol fucked around with this message at 22:23 on Apr 21, 2015 |
# ? Apr 21, 2015 22:14 |
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As much as I like Daredevil I think Jessica Jones has the best source material available of any of the Netlfix shows (especially when adapting to a TV series) and for that reason it's the one I'm most excited and most worried about. I just want it to be a good representation of a great book. Obviously many things will need to be changed but as long as it keeps the spirit of the series that's all that matters.
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# ? Apr 21, 2015 22:21 |
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Alias is the only one of the series I hadn't read (It came out during a period where I had basically stopped buying comics due to unemployment.) at launch, so it's the character I know the least about. I just finished the collection and I really don't like it. The concept is cool and the character is interesting, I just don't enjoy the plot. As usual, it's probably just me and my screwed up tastes in media.
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# ? Apr 21, 2015 22:30 |
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mikeraskol posted:I don't think anyone said that. They said she could be mind controlled and forced to fight Agents of Shield people, rather than fight the Avengers who are not going to appear in the show. Yeah, that's what I was reiterating: it seems more realistic to me that she'd be an Agents of SHIELD-level figure than an Avengers-level one. Someone like Black Widow or Mockingbird would be a challenge for the former and an absolute joke for the latter; I'm talking about the character's possible power-set and limitations. They obviously could make her as arbitrarily powerful as they want, but isn't the idea for all the Defenders characters to be smaller and lower-stakes? Kind of hard to do if one of them is effectively Superman; they're going to need to team up eventually, presumably because they're all outmatched individually. Though I guess Hawkeye is an Avenger alongside a god and an invincible rage monster, so I guess that doesn't matter. Xealot fucked around with this message at 23:05 on Apr 21, 2015 |
# ? Apr 21, 2015 23:01 |
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The Sharmat posted:Dang, you got defensive when everyone didn't instantly pat you on the back for spotting the trope real quick. Not especially? That quote is me snarkily pointing out that they were saying I said a thing which I didn't say, I'm not sure how else you're reading it. XboxPants posted:It did seem like DeKnight's comments basically translated to "Marvel wanted to kill him off 100% because it would be shocking to comic fans" which is like, not exactly the most artistically valid reason. DeKnight & the writers kinda made it work in the show; it made sense that Fisk's decision to kill him was irrational and emotionally-driven, that's the core of who he is. But it felt so telegraphed to me that it didn't have any impact and overall just felt forced. Which, big surprise, it was. bobkatt013 posted:Yeah but Fisk was never shown to be rational when it comes to people he thinks can hurt his family/girlfriend. He does not care that Ben is not writing about his family, he visited her when he worked so hard to hide her. They were also told that he was going to die, so it did not matter what race he was he was going to die no matter what. They killed him to show that characters you think are safe are not. Who knows what they plan to do with Karen, but they did give one of his defining attributes to Foggy. Remember Foggy did not figure it out until around issue 350, Ben knew in the 100s. For me it didn't fit with his other irrational outbursts because there had been a consistency even with his outbursts outside of this where they needed to have basically actually taken an action which effected him negatively, and frankly it betrays a level of dishonesty with himself that Fisk doesn't show at any other point, because the reason Fisk gives in the scene is that Ben isn't keeping his mother out of it, but he has every reason based on what we've been told and shown in the show so far, to believe that Ben would actually go out of his way to ensure Fisk's mother didn't get hit in the article. It was pretty much one of like, 2 or 3 points in the show where I felt like they hadn't done everything perfectly, and it seems like such a key moment, and I don't even get why would you even do that from a future story perspective. We already get that the kingpin is a killer capable of terrible poo poo, I wasn't shocked just mildly annoyed. All the stuff with the funeral seemed kind of weirdly tacked on too. Also I can't even read all the Jessica Jones talk, I am so excited for it I'm gonna try and go in as blind as possible on it.
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# ? Apr 21, 2015 23:01 |
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Xealot posted:Yeah, that's what I was reiterating: it seems more realistic to me that she'd be an Agents of SHIELD-level figure than an Avengers-level one. Someone like Black Widow or Mockingbird would be a challenge for the former and an absolute joke for the latter; I'm talking about the character's possible power-set and limitations. Oh ok I didn't understand what you were saying. Also I don't think that's the idea for the Defenders, unless they are going to limit every single one of them other than Daredevil. They didn't limit Thor because of Black Widow, I see no indication that they will do so here.
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# ? Apr 21, 2015 23:04 |
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I liked the realism of the show. The less magic ninja poo poo the better, because that crap is totally not tonally consistent with this version of daredevil. Great season, hope we can get more.
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# ? Apr 21, 2015 23:09 |
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effectual posted:I liked the realism of the show. The less magic ninja poo poo the better, because that crap is totally not tonally consistent with this version of daredevil. Great season, hope we can get more. Pretty sure based on the Gao/Nobu/Stick/That-dude-from-the-hand-stick-reported-to stuff that it is going to take a very sharp turn in that direction at some point.
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# ? Apr 21, 2015 23:13 |
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surc posted:Not especially? That quote is me snarkily pointing out that they were saying I said a thing which I didn't say, I'm not sure how else you're reading it. Did everyone miss that Fisk thought Ben had either killed, or had something to do with Wesley's death? They don't come right out and say it, but Fisk finds the phone, calls his mother on it and kind of has an epiphany. His mother only remembers Ben, not Karen, so it's not a stretch that he put that together that way. It would have been ample reason for Fisk to lose his mind as Wesley was the only friend he had, Vanessa not withstanding. He was going to kill Ben for that, regardless. Ben dies protecting Karen, for all intents and purposes. It's the perfect cap to his character arc, who gives a poo poo about future series? I also completely disagree about the funeral scene, it was well done.
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# ? Apr 21, 2015 23:15 |
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surc posted:For me it didn't fit with his other irrational outbursts because there had been a consistency even with his outbursts outside of this where they needed to have basically actually taken an action which effected him negatively, and frankly it betrays a level of dishonesty with himself that Fisk doesn't show at any other point, because the reason Fisk gives in the scene is that Ben isn't keeping his mother out of it, but he has every reason based on what we've been told and shown in the show so far, to believe that Ben would actually go out of his way to ensure Fisk's mother didn't get hit in the article. It was pretty much one of like, 2 or 3 points in the show where I felt like they hadn't done everything perfectly, and it seems like such a key moment, and I don't even get why would you even do that from a future story perspective. We already get that the kingpin is a killer capable of terrible poo poo, I wasn't shocked just mildly annoyed. All the stuff with the funeral seemed kind of weirdly tacked on too. Well it does effect him negatively because one way or another he's got to move his mom out or else she's going to be contacted by other journalists. I'm sure he would prefer to have her just upstate than all the way over in Italy or wherever.
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# ? Apr 21, 2015 23:15 |
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Daredevil is happening partially because a magic hammer wielder trashed some poo poo while fighting aliens. It's already part of the world it takes place in. Like, spy stuff and hacking and occultism exist in certain forms in the real world, but your personal life probably doesn't interact with them very often, if ever. Or even say like, different flavors of chips that are exclusive to a country you don't live in. Just because it doesn't exist near you doesn't mean it doesn't exist at all? But they could become a part of your everyday life in the future. tl;dr bring on the magic ninjas
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# ? Apr 21, 2015 23:17 |
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Killing Urich was a pretty sweet moment to be honest. He was such a trite boring character who cares how much of a role he played in the comics. He just seemed like another "hard nosed journalist looking to get at the truth!" social justice token. There are legit criticism of the characterization of Fisk but that moment was very well done. It was also unexpected because I really did not think they would push it that far but they did and it was impressive. The sudden and violent non trope deaths in DD is what sets it apart from other Marvel universe shows. Watching agents of shield is almost painful at times for how sitcom like the characters are with nary a single believable personality. Everyone is a carefully crafted t.v. archetype. You just know which characters will die and who will do what because it's all obvious poo poo we've seen before. Modus Operandi fucked around with this message at 23:36 on Apr 21, 2015 |
# ? Apr 21, 2015 23:32 |
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Light Gun Man posted:Daredevil is happening partially because a magic hammer wielder trashed some poo poo while fighting aliens. It's already part of the world it takes place in. It's consistent with the comic too, a lot of his runs have DD start out mopping alleys with mugger blood and teeth and eventually he's fighting/leading a demonic ninja army, he wraps it up and goes back to punching in purse snatches' mouths.
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# ? Apr 21, 2015 23:36 |
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AbsolutelySane posted:Did everyone miss that Fisk thought Ben had either killed, or had something to do with Wesley's death? They don't come right out and say it, but Fisk finds the phone, calls his mother on it and kind of has an epiphany. His mother only remembers Ben, not Karen, so it's not a stretch that he put that together that way. It would have been ample reason for Fisk to lose his mind as Wesley was the only friend he had, Vanessa not withstanding. He was going to kill Ben for that, regardless. Ben dies protecting Karen, for all intents and purposes. It's the perfect cap to his character arc, who gives a poo poo about future series? I also completely disagree about the funeral scene, it was well done. They do come out and say the opposite of that, when Fisk asks him and accepts his shock and says"Yeah, you're a man of principal, I didn't think it was you" or something equivalent to that in the scene in Ben's house. Skeesix posted:Well it does effect him negatively because one way or another he's got to move his mom out or else she's going to be contacted by other journalists. I'm sure he would prefer to have her just upstate than all the way over in Italy or wherever. I guess, but I didn't think Ben was likely to go "oh yeah btw Fisk's mom lives here everybody go say hi" to the world. I feel like "You had a conversation with my mom and she thought you were nice" just doesn't line up with the rest of his outbursts. It could have worked as part of Fisk's descent into more full-on evil/control slipping, but it wasn't really done with the same "here's some throw-away line or something to tie it in" as all the other things indicating that, so I didn't take it as part of that either. surc fucked around with this message at 23:46 on Apr 21, 2015 |
# ? Apr 21, 2015 23:43 |
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Modus Operandi posted:Killing Urich was a pretty sweet moment to be honest. He was such a trite boring character who cares how much of a role he played in the comics. He just seemed like another "hard nosed journalist looking to get at the truth!" social justice token. Another "hard nosed journalist looking to get at the truth!" social justice token? What the gently caress are you talking about. Please tell me more.
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# ? Apr 21, 2015 23:44 |
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mr.capps posted:Another "hard nosed journalist looking to get at the truth!" social justice token? What the gently caress are you talking about. Please tell me more. In the end the truth that got him killed was some unverifiable gossip about Fisk's father's death that he couldn't print because of lack of corroboration (and other tiny details about ethics in journalism) and so he just went to randomly post poo poo on the internet to get people upset. Ulrich's life/career didn't exactly end on a high note. It was all Karen's fault, really. And I blame her for it.
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# ? Apr 21, 2015 23:51 |
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dj_clawson posted:In the end the truth that got him killed was some unverifiable gossip about Fisk's father's death that he couldn't print because of lack of corroboration (and other tiny details about ethics in journalism) and so he just went to randomly post poo poo on the internet to get people upset. Ulrich's life/career didn't exactly end on a high note. Ultimately I think the most healthy and honest person to blame for Ben Urich's death is the guy that killed him. But yeah Ben broke every rule established early on as part of his character arc and it got him killed. This is part of it. It's just, he broke the rules for good reasons, like trying to help his wife, and covering for Karen.
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# ? Apr 22, 2015 00:03 |
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Gaz-L posted:If you haven't read the book, you really should. Yes, Kilgrave is SUPER creepy, but the story is very easy to interpret as a recovery narrative. It's not 'girl is abused by Mr Rape and is traumatised, The End', it's about her facing up to that experience and moving on with her life, in the best way of all comic books: The power of really blatant symbolic rear end-kickings. With more swearing than your average Marvel book. Because Tennant is signed on for like eight episodes and these series tend to be origin stories I'm more afraid it will be about the bad poo poo as it is happening. greatn fucked around with this message at 00:18 on Apr 22, 2015 |
# ? Apr 22, 2015 00:14 |
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surc posted:For me it didn't fit with his other irrational outbursts because there had been a consistency even with his outbursts outside of this where they needed to have basically actually taken an action which effected him negatively, and frankly it betrays a level of dishonesty with himself that Fisk doesn't show at any other point, because the reason Fisk gives in the scene is that Ben isn't keeping his mother out of it, but he has every reason based on what we've been told and shown in the show so far, to believe that Ben would actually go out of his way to ensure Fisk's mother didn't get hit in the article. That's all he needs though. Fisk is every bit the momma's boy in this series. Witness his relationship with Vanessa. Doesn't matter what Ben does or doesn't write. You don't gently caress with the women in his life. Look what Fisk did to his Dad when he hosed with the woman in his life. It's spelled out pretty clearly. AbsolutelySane posted:Did everyone miss that Fisk thought Ben had either killed, or had something to do with Wesley's death? They don't come right out and say it, but Fisk finds the phone, calls his mother on it and kind of has an epiphany. His mother only remembers Ben, not Karen, so it's not a stretch that he put that together that way. It would have been ample reason for Fisk to lose his mind as Wesley was the only friend he had, Vanessa not withstanding. He was going to kill Ben for that, regardless. Ben dies protecting Karen, for all intents and purposes. It's the perfect cap to his character arc, who gives a poo poo about future series? I also completely disagree about the funeral scene, it was well done. That too.
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# ? Apr 22, 2015 00:30 |
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greatn posted:Because Tennant is signed on for like eight episodes and these series tend to be origin stories I'm more afraid it will be about the bad poo poo as it is happening. The OP kinda makes it sound like it'll be in the past but there's a ton of flashbacks, but I have no idea if that's actually true.
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# ? Apr 22, 2015 00:30 |
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Vag Assault Weapon posted:The whole point was that he wasn't at the top, he lived in fear of fortune cookie mystic speaking woman and she was the true kingpin. The whole season is just about Fisk trying to become more than just a small cog by taking over the roles of his partner's and failing spectacularly at it. Even if the old Chinese woman gave him the criminal underworld equivalent of a booster seat at the adult's table his social ineptness is still pretty incongruent with his relative accomplishments. His behavior is that of a person who has a severe mental handicap the acting is a bit over the top in some ways. Shageletic posted:Capone was a syphillitic halfwit. Capone was not the smartest guy but everything I read about him said that he had above average social skills and was very crafty at manipulating people. Not quite the halfwit you paint him out to be. Social skills and intellect don't always go hand in hand obviously.
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# ? Apr 22, 2015 00:38 |
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Modus Operandi posted:His behavior is that of a person who has a severe mental handicap the acting is a bit over the top in some ways. You've never actually met anyone with a severe mental handicap have you?
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# ? Apr 22, 2015 00:40 |
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AbsolutelySane posted:Did everyone miss that Fisk thought Ben had either killed, or had something to do with Wesley's death? They don't come right out and say it, but Fisk finds the phone, calls his mother on it and kind of has an epiphany. His mother only remembers Ben, not Karen, so it's not a stretch that he put that together that way. It would have been ample reason for Fisk to lose his mind as Wesley was the only friend he had, Vanessa not withstanding. He was going to kill Ben for that, regardless. Ben dies protecting Karen, for all intents and purposes. It's the perfect cap to his character arc, who gives a poo poo about future series? I also completely disagree about the funeral scene, it was well done. I thought his mom remembered Karen, it's how Fisk made the connection back to Ben.
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# ? Apr 22, 2015 00:41 |
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etalian posted:I thought his mom remembered Karen, it's how Fisk made the connection back to Ben. The lady at the newspaper who was working for Fisk told Fisk it was Ben. Fisk has totally no idea that Karen or any woman at all was involved, and his mother was totally useless as far as information about "who she met" goes. This is all pretty explicitly shown on screen.
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# ? Apr 22, 2015 00:44 |
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NecroMonster posted:You've never actually met anyone with a severe mental handicap have you? Aside from you?
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# ? Apr 22, 2015 00:46 |
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Modus Operandi posted:Aside from you? Wait, Necromonster is Vincent D'Onofrio???
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# ? Apr 22, 2015 00:48 |
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Modus Operandi posted:Aside from you? Wait who are you and how do you know me?
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# ? Apr 22, 2015 00:49 |
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The Sharmat posted:Ultimately I think the most healthy and honest person to blame for Ben Urich's death is the guy that killed him. If we read the show on the themes of who loses their way, Matt is really the only one who comes out clean in this season, in that he eventually makes the right decision not to murder Fisk. We've really been looking at it as the story of Matt and Fisk, and what they're capable of, but Ben Urich is no hero because of Karen's influence. The show writes him as a crusading journalist, and he sticks to that until about the end, but it's Karen who pushes him over to the world of gossip and slander, and doing immoral things to get stories (again, like breaking into senior homes, something I am really sensitive about because my grandmother just moved into one and people do try to take advantage of the people living in them), and those things get him killed.
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# ? Apr 22, 2015 00:50 |
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dj_clawson posted:If we read the show on the themes of who loses their way, Matt is really the only one who comes out clean in this season, in that he eventually makes the right decision not to murder Fisk. We've really been looking at it as the story of Matt and Fisk, and what they're capable of, but Ben Urich is no hero because of Karen's influence. The show writes him as a crusading journalist, and he sticks to that until about the end, but it's Karen who pushes him over to the world of gossip and slander, and doing immoral things to get stories (again, like breaking into senior homes, something I am really sensitive about because my grandmother just moved into one and people do try to take advantage of the people living in them), and those things get him killed. Actually that's a pretty good point. I wonder what other characters that might work for.
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# ? Apr 22, 2015 00:58 |
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dj_clawson posted:The show writes him as a crusading journalist, and he sticks to that until about the end, but it's Karen who pushes him over to the world of gossip and slander, and doing immoral things to get stories (again, like breaking into senior homes, something I am really sensitive about because my grandmother just moved into one and people do try to take advantage of the people living in them), and those things get him killed. He also tries to basically dox Fisk online which is what social justice types do in real life and It backfires and gets him killed. It also reveals the hypocrisy of his position as a journalist. I agree he's not a hero. He represents the everyman going out of his way to fight crime through snooping family members and people surrounding the man they are going after. I'm not saying murder is appropriate but Fisk's reaction is understandable.
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# ? Apr 22, 2015 01:01 |
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http://marvel.com/news/tv/24478/netflix_orders_a_second_season_of_marvels_daredevil Good news everybody
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# ? Apr 22, 2015 01:05 |
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Modus Operandi posted:He also tries to basically dox Fisk online which is what social justice types do in real life and It backfires and gets him killed. It also reveals the hypocrisy of his position as a journalist. What. achillesforever6 posted:http://marvel.com/news/tv/24478/netflix_orders_a_second_season_of_marvels_daredevil Awesome. I can't wait for Stilt-Man
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# ? Apr 22, 2015 01:05 |
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THE RIDE NEVER ENDS BUT I AM HESISTANT BECAUSE A NEW CREW OF SHOWRUNNERS.
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# ? Apr 22, 2015 01:06 |
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Modus Operandi posted:The sudden and violent non trope deaths in DD is what sets it apart from other Marvel universe shows. Does anyone else want to punch their monitor whenever someone posts the word trope at this point? Normal deaths are tropes, avoiding normal deaths with abnormal ones are tropes. Normal plotlines are tropes, and doing something to avoid a normal plotline is a trope.
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# ? Apr 22, 2015 01:11 |
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NecroMonster posted:The lady at the newspaper who was working for Fisk told Fisk it was Ben. Fisk has totally no idea that Karen or any woman at all was involved, and his mother was totally useless as far as information about "who she met" goes. Nope in a previous episode Fisk's mom in one of few lucid moments remembers getting visitors such as pretty blonde woman.
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# ? Apr 22, 2015 01:14 |
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etalian posted:Nope in a previous episode Fisk's mom in one of few lucid moments remembers getting visitors such as pretty blonde woman. To Wesley. Not to Fisk. He finds out from his source at the newspaper that Urich wrote an article about him killing his dad, with the primary source as his mother. If his mom told him about the "pretty blonde woman" he would have known there was someone else there seeing his mom other than Urich. People legit can't watch TV shows.
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# ? Apr 22, 2015 01:16 |
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etalian posted:Nope in a previous episode Fisk's mom in one of few lucid moments remembers getting visitors such as pretty blonde woman. Wasn't that what she told Wesley? I could swear she utterly failed to give Fisk any information at all.
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# ? Apr 22, 2015 01:16 |
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# ? May 16, 2024 18:38 |
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Modus Operandi posted:Even if the old Chinese woman gave him the criminal underworld equivalent of a booster seat at the adult's table his social ineptness is still pretty incongruent with his relative accomplishments. His behavior is that of a person who has a severe mental handicap the acting is a bit over the top in some ways. I didn't actually think any of his behavior was full manbaby except when he went on an actual tantrum and beat people to death. This description of him as a lol fat autist goon is really overblown. I'd like to see more on how he actually got started on this path though, yeah. Maybe next season? mikeraskol posted:Does anyone else want to punch their monitor whenever someone posts the word trope at this point? Also literally everything put to text is composed of memes but this is the language of the world we live in now.
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# ? Apr 22, 2015 01:23 |